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  #1  
Old 09-29-2007, 07:32 AM
reddrummer90 reddrummer90 is offline
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Default why no cymbal felts?

lately ive seen alot of people not using top cymbal felts and no wing nut, any reason for this? more convientient?
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  #2  
Old 09-29-2007, 11:14 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I use no felts so I get the absolute most ring out of my cymbals. I've seen some people who tighten them down as much as they can. But I don't want to restrict them at all.

It'd probably make no difference with the top felts on and the wingnut on loose, but now I guess it's one less thing to have to screw on and off my set.
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  #3  
Old 09-29-2007, 11:24 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I have not felt and screw on my ride so I can get the full potential from the bell.
I don't think there are people that don't put felts on their crashes and splashes, because those would probably fall from the stand if they aren't restricted in some way...
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Old 09-29-2007, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

The plastic wingnuts I use keep the cymbals safe and I get enough movement. For cymbals I want to tighten down (china) I use two or more felts.
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  #5  
Old 09-29-2007, 07:18 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I use felt, just because im worried about damaging the cymbal. Some of the cymbals at school dont use felt, and so far no cracks, but i feel someday they might.
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  #6  
Old 09-30-2007, 01:17 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

You won't damage the cymbal if you don't have a top felt. The felt doesn't actually protect the cymbal from anything. The cymbal is protected by the bottom felt and the nylon sleeve. The felt is just there to help you adjust the movement of the cymbal and very slightly, the ring of the cymbal.

Most people who don't use them do it for the old school look, more access to the bell and what small difference it makes it how much the cymbal rings.
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  #7  
Old 09-30-2007, 05:01 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I cut my top felts down very thin, to give them room to move and have a pure sound, I did not remove the felts because I don't want the wing nut to damage the cymbal when crashing.
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  #8  
Old 09-30-2007, 04:48 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickk View Post
I cut my top felts down very thin, to give them room to move and have a pure sound, I did not remove the felts because I don't want the wing nut to damage the cymbal when crashing.
That's pretty unlikely. The wing nuts are 1/2" to an 1" above the bell of the cymbal on most stands. Even if the cymbal did hit the wing nut, it's not a hard enough blow to do any damage compared to the force you're putting on the cymbals with the sticks.
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  #9  
Old 10-01-2007, 12:58 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Fourstringdrums, your right. I just took a close look at them and they don't touch except for my inverted China, but they are too close for comfort, plus I like the way felts look so I'm sticking with it.
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  #10  
Old 10-01-2007, 01:52 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

For bigger, lighter trash cymbals, it just gives a lot more ring and freedom to vibrate.
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  #11  
Old 10-02-2007, 04:34 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Well the cymbal isn't going to fly away, so why put it there. I like to use the big felts on rides as you can have control over the sound. Tighten the felt and you get a drier ride. My kit at home has those stands with the Mapex rubber things that take the place of felts. These work the same essentially and they will never wear out, great idea.
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  #12  
Old 10-15-2007, 12:09 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cymbalrider View Post
Well the cymbal isn't going to fly away, so why put it there.
I disagree. While most cymbals probably won't "fly away" without a felt and wingnut, a splash cymbal just might. Whenever I experiment with my 8" splash and don't use a top felt and wingnut, it indeed does fly like a bird. I think it really depends on the cymbal and playing style (and no, i am not a basher).
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  #13  
Old 10-15-2007, 12:13 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

i don't use them on my ride so i can get access to myentire bell

j
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  #14  
Old 10-15-2007, 03:30 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NUTHA JASON View Post
i don't use them on my ride so i can get access to myentire bell

j
Same hear just on the ride cym.
for that reason
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  #15  
Old 10-17-2007, 12:10 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LayinDown View Post
I disagree. While most cymbals probably won't "fly away" without a felt and wingnut, a splash cymbal just might. Whenever I experiment with my 8" splash and don't use a top felt and wingnut, it indeed does fly like a bird. I think it really depends on the cymbal and playing style (and no, i am not a basher).
You might be able to get away with no felts and wingnut for a ride cymbal, but for any type of splash or crash, it will surely fly away when hit.

I use www.slicknut.com on all my cymbals. After you fine-tune them, they stay put just as strongly as a wing nut, except you can back them off the cymbal like 1/8 of an inch to give the cymbal plenty of play, yet the Slicknut will stay put and won't loosen any more. Plus, they're a breeze to put on and off.
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  #16  
Old 10-17-2007, 08:11 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I use no felt on top of my ride cymbal. I saw Manu Katche do this and he is my favorite drummer - so there.

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  #17  
Old 10-30-2007, 04:08 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

i dont use felts on top of my cymbals but i use them on the bottoms. i noticed that with out them on the tops that they move around a whole lot better. i always use top felts especially with thin cymbals
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  #18  
Old 10-30-2007, 04:59 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I actually just took my top felts off for no reason other than the old school look. I still have the wing nuts on though.
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  #19  
Old 10-30-2007, 05:51 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

for more ring.Less damping.
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  #20  
Old 10-30-2007, 04:25 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Those Mapex cymbal accentuators are pretty cool and a great idea. In fact, they patented the concept. It's basically a plastic washer and sleeve (as one piece) and then you have essentially 2 rubber balls that slide over the sleeve. The rubber balls don't wear out or flatten on any one side like a standard felt does.

We had one school come in and buy about a dozen of them for their marching equipment (percussion pit). What they did was glued the washer and bottom washer-ball to the stand itself so it would never fall off. This allowed them to very quickly set up the cym stands in the pit and place the cymbals on the stands in seconds flat. They didn't need to mess with taking off top felts or wing nuts. And when they broke down, the washers/sleeve and bottom ball never fell off and got lost.

http://www.justdrumsonline.com/store...entuators.aspx
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  #21  
Old 10-30-2007, 09:14 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by reddrummer90 View Post
lately ive seen alot of people not using top cymbal felts and no wing nut, any reason for this? more convientient?
because i lost mine....
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  #22  
Old 11-07-2007, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I use top felts, but about 15-16 years ago I didn't.

Here's what I did, & it gets rid of the wing nut situation too.

I took threaded cymbal sleeves, and cut the base off and screwed them on top of the other one.
That way, there's no metal threads above the sleeve/felt the cymbal sits on.

It looks beter, and you can pop the cymbal on and off super quick & easy.

And, since it's treaded on, and you can tighten it down & it isn't going anywhere.

This also solves the splash cymbal flying off problem. Had one then, used this, it works.

I got the idea from those old Zildjian silver cymbal stand tops Buddy Rich and those guy's used to have.
They haven't made them in many years, so I just used the cymbal sleeves to do the same thing.

I haven't seen anyone else do this, but it's a good idea & works great.

....no charge. :)
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  #23  
Old 12-05-2007, 04:12 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I prefer my cymbals to give more when I hit them. I play pretty hard and i'm hard on my cymbals so its cheap breakage insurance. I never really liked cymbal felts because they do not have a strong rebound of the cymbal, meaning the cymbal doesnt quickly return to its original position. The best solution I have found is using Mapex cymbal accentuators. They are rubber and do not effect the sustain of your cymbals at all and keep them where you want em. Good, cheap product.

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  #24  
Old 12-05-2007, 07:41 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

The Mapex cymbal accentuators look very similar to my favorite solution...Cymbal Crowns. Basically, it is a screw-on sleeve with a rubber base. The "sleeve" section includes a split mushroom-cap top that will keep a cymbal from coming off until the drummer pinches the pieces together.

Very fast setup/teardown, very little (no) cymbal dampening/restriction and a guarantee of no keyholing, as the cymbal crown is "sacrificial"...wearing away instead of damaging the cymbal.
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  #25  
Old 09-16-2012, 01:01 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlCrafton View Post
I use top felts, but about 15-16 years ago I didn't.

Here's what I did, & it gets rid of the wing nut situation too.

I took threaded cymbal sleeves, and cut the base off and screwed them on top of the other one.
That way, there's no metal threads above the sleeve/felt the cymbal sits on.

It looks beter, and you can pop the cymbal on and off super quick & easy.

And, since it's treaded on, and you can tighten it down & it isn't going anywhere.

This also solves the splash cymbal flying off problem. Had one then, used this, it works.

I got the idea from those old Zildjian silver cymbal stand tops Buddy Rich and those guy's used to have.
They haven't made them in many years, so I just used the cymbal sleeves to do the same thing.

I haven't seen anyone else do this, but it's a good idea & works great.

....no charge. :)
Carl - Sorry to revive an old thread, but this is really interesting for me... But I don't really get your description. Could you provide a pic of how this looks like in real? Thanks. (I have 25 DIY bells and am looking for which felts (thickness), sleeves and wingnuts (if any) to use)
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  #26  
Old 09-19-2012, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I don't have any pics, but it's just a cymbal sleeve, like a Yamaha, or Gibraltar that has the threads inside.
You just chop off the flanged base, and screw it on where the wing nut would go.

So, the original sleeve and bottom felt are still there, the "threaded tube" screws on top.
I call it a threaded tube, because that's what it is after the base part is chopped off.

I shortened mine to sit just above the threaded sections of the tilter, but they can be left long.

If you need, if I can find one, I'll snap a pic and post.

Holy crap! I just saw this was from '07!! Wow!
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  #27  
Old 09-19-2012, 09:39 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Karl, thanks for your reply! (Sorry for that spelling 'Carl', haha - I must have been blind.)
I think I got you this time.
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  #28  
Old 09-20-2012, 11:54 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Im using this:



It doesnt need a top felt because of the rubber used all around. And getting cymbals on and off stand has never been so easy. Love them!
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  #29  
Old 09-21-2012, 12:06 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NUTHA JASON View Post
myentire bell

j
what manner of bell is this?
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  #30  
Old 09-21-2012, 12:09 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

top cymbal felts and wing nuts are completely useless and serve absolutely no purpose whats so ever

you can shell out your arguments all you want

but they have zero functional purpose

the only exception would be a splash cymbal because of its light weight and possibility of flying off the stand....but I don't use a splash so have no use at all for top felts or wing nuts

absolutely no practical function other than that they come with the stand and you use them because they are there
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  #31  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:05 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I'm with Anthony. I haven't used mine in about five years!
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  #32  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:39 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gvdadrummasum View Post
top cymbal felts and wing nuts are completely useless and serve absolutely no purpose whats so ever
They hold the sleeve and bottom felt on in transit :) While playing, if you're not angling and slamming, they just reduce the amount of bell to aim for.
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  #33  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:10 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

top cymbal felts and wing nuts are completely useless and serve absolutely no purpose whats so ever

That depends on how you set up your cymbals. One of the main functions of a cymbal felt is its ability to mute/cut some ring and shorten the sustain of a cymbal.
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  #34  
Old 09-22-2012, 02:06 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I actually like being able to adjust the amount of pressure and swing in my cymbals with the top felts. I use DW stands, or the DW tilter on my Ludwig stands.
Sometimes I like them freer, and sometimes I like them to not move very much.

If I use just 2 cymbals, then they are lower, and I am riding and crashing both, so the looser adjustment is better.

I've also not used top felt and wing nuts. It does save a little time. Either way works, and my cymbals sound the same, I just like the feel of top felts better most of the time.
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  #35  
Old 09-22-2012, 06:24 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anon La Ply View Post
They hold the sleeve and bottom felt on in transit :) While playing, if you're not angling and slamming, they just reduce the amount of bell to aim for.
Actually, a little glob of silicone glue will hold washer to post, sleeve to post, and felt to washer very nicely. I only use wing nuts on the splashes now, and will quit once I cut down a couple of those plastic Tama nuts with the threaded sleeves to extend the postva bit more.
I've already changed over to the extended 1-piece seat and sleeve, like the Yamahas. One less thing to glue. I hate wingnuts...
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Old 09-22-2012, 06:52 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore View Post
That depends on how you set up your cymbals. One of the main functions of a cymbal felt is its ability to mute/cut some ring and shorten the sustain of a cymbal.

True. I've clamped cymbals down before to get the sound I wanted.


Quote:
Originally Posted by skod View Post
Actually, a little glob of silicone glue will hold washer to post, sleeve to post, and felt to washer very nicely.
I always figured that those materials wouldn't stick too well, but they're very light so I guess they don't have to stick brilliantly to stay in place.
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  #37  
Old 09-22-2012, 03:17 PM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

I use t-tops so they are not necessary.
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  #38  
Old 09-22-2012, 11:57 PM
Anthony Amodeo
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore View Post
top cymbal felts and wing nuts are completely useless and serve absolutely no purpose whats so ever

That depends on how you set up your cymbals. One of the main functions of a cymbal felt is its ability to mute/cut some ring and shorten the sustain of a cymbal.
that is in no way shape or form any reason for top felts.....whoever told you that should be tarred and feathered

..hey let me put this top felt on to cut some sustain from my cymbals........

that is ridiculously silly

oddly enough top felts were originally put on stands to stop the cymbal from contacting the wing nut.......which has no purpose in the first place

that is unless you have some ridiculously pointless kit like the gentlemen in the picture
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  #39  
Old 09-23-2012, 12:28 AM
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

oddly enough top felts were originally put on stands to stop the cymbal from contacting the wing nut.......which has no purpose in the first place



Unless you can somehow prove this, it'll be taken as just your opinion. One can only assume that was the intention, much like assuming you're posts are trying to be slightly humorous.


If you do some recording in a studio, you'll discover it can at times prove very useful to dial-out a bit of sustain/overtones on the cymbals just by tightening the felts.

Works great in live situations too, it can dramatically change the character of the cymbal.

Is that what felts were originally intended to do? Who cares, its another thing they 'can' do, all options are a welcome good.
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  #40  
Old 09-23-2012, 12:34 AM
Anthony Amodeo
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Default Re: why no cymbal felts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore View Post
oddly enough top felts were originally put on stands to stop the cymbal from contacting the wing nut.......which has no purpose in the first place



Unless you can somehow prove this, it'll be taken as just your opinion. One can only assume that was the intention, much like assuming you're posts are trying to be slightly humorous.


If you do some recording in a studio, you'll discover it can at times prove very useful to dial-out a bit of sustain/overtones on the cymbals just by tightening the felts.

Works great in live situations too, it can dramatically change the character of the cymbal.

Is that what felts were originally intended to do? Who cares, its another thing they 'can' do, all options are a welcome good.


it's a fact brother......same for sleeves......created to avoid metal on metal situations



....and been working in recording studios for 20 years

been working live even longer

never said....hey I wish I had a top felt to cut this sustain and maybe change the character of my cymbal


I know people do this...I am speaking for no one but myself obviously .......and I see no need for them

no point.....no need..... completely useless to me

Last edited by Anthony Amodeo; 09-23-2012 at 01:03 AM.
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