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  #1  
Old 07-31-2007, 11:36 PM
Suntower Suntower is offline
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Default Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

Hi, this is my first post.

I am not a drummer by trade, though I do have a set of Ludwigs and 2 MIDI Drumkat percussion controllers which I use a lot for my own projects. I don't try to play out, but I can play well enough to know I want something better than what I've got. Which is.........

A few decent electronic pads which I can use to trigger some very nice sampler libs I've got.

As I said, I've got 2 Drumkats and they are fine for some things. But the thing is, and the thing about most e-drums I tried over the years is that they have only one sound per pad which is, as you know, ludicrous, for capturing the nuances of any drum.

Now I see that Roland and Yamaha have kits with 2 and 3 'zones'. Great. But it seems like you have to buy the entire -kit- and the 'brain', which I don't need.

So here's my question:

Are there any multi-zone e-drum pads one can buy which don't require a complete kit? Where you can buy just the pads you want/need?

I saw Korg had something like a conga pad a few years ago and there was an ad for something called 'Mandala', but these look like they are for hand drummers.

Any ideas?

(Sorry for rambling)

THANKS!

----JC
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  #2  
Old 08-01-2007, 12:50 AM
sshu sshu is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

JC,

You can buy Roland gear a la carte. For example, I have bought Roland cymbals and mesh drums from Midwest Percussion. That said, for some of the gear you may need either a trigger to MIDI interface (e.g., TMI for triggering sampler sounds in your library) or a drum brain (which has the TMI plus sound set built-in). That is a different situation than your DrumKAT gear which has the TMI built into the pad.

In any case, once you start buying a la carte, it can get more expensive as compared to buying a kit and then selling off what you don't need.

Steve
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  #3  
Old 08-01-2007, 03:56 AM
Suntower Suntower is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

Thanks.

At the Guitar Center web site I saw that you can get a 3 zone rubber Yamaha pad for $99, but then you have to pay $499 for the 'brain'.

I see you can get Roland pads (which I've tried---they feel great) but I don't see that they will sell you a 'pad to MIDI converter' gizmo.

THAT'S what I need: a 'Pad to MIDI converter' gizmo. I saw something from Alesis for $150 but it doesn't look like it's shipping yet. Also, I see nothing about supporting multi-zone drums.

Any other ideas?

THANKS!

---JC



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Originally Posted by sshu View Post
JC,

You can buy Roland gear a la carte. For example, I have bought Roland cymbals and mesh drums from Midwest Percussion. That said, for some of the gear you may need either a trigger to MIDI interface (e.g., TMI for triggering sampler sounds in your library) or a drum brain (which has the TMI plus sound set built-in). That is a different situation than your DrumKAT gear which has the TMI built into the pad.

In any case, once you start buying a la carte, it can get more expensive as compared to buying a kit and then selling off what you don't need.

Steve
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Old 08-01-2007, 04:04 AM
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hawk9290 hawk9290 is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suntower View Post
I saw Korg had something like a conga pad a few years ago and there was an ad for something called 'Mandala', but these look like they are for hand drummers.
The Mandala pad is not for hand drumming, it as amazing piece of technology.
http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbas...deo/444995.mov
I don't think its really what you're looking for, but they are awesome nonetheless.

You can buy just the pads from most good websites (musicians friend has them i know), but good luck converting that from 1/4" to midi.
Perhaps something like this will better suit you- http://www.musiciansfriend.com/produ...Pad?sku=449910
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Old 08-01-2007, 04:44 AM
Suntower Suntower is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk9290 View Post
The Mandala pad is not for hand drumming, it as amazing piece of technology.
http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbas...deo/444995.mov
I don't think its really what you're looking for, but they are awesome nonetheless.]
---I agree. If price were no object I'd be all over it. But $1k for 1 pad? Oy veh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk9290 View Post
You can buy just the pads from most good websites (musicians friend has them i know), but good luck converting that from 1/4" to midi.
---EXACTLY! I need a converter gizmo. I'm surprised no one's come up with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk9290 View Post
Perhaps something like this will better suit you- http://www.musiciansfriend.com/produ...Pad?sku=449910
\
--Sorry, no. Even my ancient Drumkat's are -much- better than that. If I can't find a way to do it with multiple zones per drum and position sensing, I have no interest.

Thanks,

Any other ideas?

----JC
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  #6  
Old 08-01-2007, 05:01 PM
sshu sshu is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

If you go the Alesis trigger I/O route, make sure you do some due diligence on compatibility and other ... see this thread on it ... http://www.vdrums.com/forum/showthre...ghlight=alesis

For multizone Roland pads, there is a trigger to MIDI converter ... the TMC-6.
http://www.roland.com/products/en/TMC-6/index.html

There are many other devices out there, some of them single zone, e.g., Roland PM-16, DrumKAT, Aphex Impulse (I have this rack mount unit).

There are also those that use drum brains (new and/or old for trigger to MIDI conversion), e.g., Roland TD-7, Roland TD-8, Roland TD-3, Roland TD-10

I have used the Roland TD-8 as a TMI. Works pretty well (I think I would prefer over TD-7 and/or TD-3 because of ease of use and flexibility). Coming from the KAT world, you may be a pretty sophisticated user of MIDI, so you should try to do some due diligence on what type of TMI.

Good luck!

Steve
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  #7  
Old 08-01-2007, 06:12 PM
Suntower Suntower is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

Thanks. Yeah, I'd consider keeping the DrumKat's to act as a TMI for these new pads but it can't handle 2 or 3 zone drums.

QUESTION: Are 2-3 zone interfaces proprietary? IOW: will the rim shot on a roland e-pad only work with a -Roland- TMC? Or are these multi-zone drums supported by all TMC makers?

Thanks,

---JC


Quote:
Originally Posted by sshu View Post
If you go the Alesis trigger I/O route, make sure you do some due diligence on compatibility and other ... see this thread on it ... http://www.vdrums.com/forum/showthre...ghlight=alesis

For multizone Roland pads, there is a trigger to MIDI converter ... the TMC-6.
http://www.roland.com/products/en/TMC-6/index.html

There are many other devices out there, some of them single zone, e.g., Roland PM-16, DrumKAT, Aphex Impulse (I have this rack mount unit).

There are also those that use drum brains (new and/or old for trigger to MIDI conversion), e.g., Roland TD-7, Roland TD-8, Roland TD-3, Roland TD-10

I have used the Roland TD-8 as a TMI. Works pretty well (I think I would prefer over TD-7 and/or TD-3 because of ease of use and flexibility). Coming from the KAT world, you may be a pretty sophisticated user of MIDI, so you should try to do some due diligence on what type of TMI.

Good luck!

Steve
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  #8  
Old 08-01-2007, 10:16 PM
sshu sshu is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

JC,

I wish I had a clear cut answer for you, but I do not, and I do not profess to be a compatibility effort for all the different types of brands and types of devices. That said, I know people that use some of the Yamaha cymbals with Roland brains. I also know people that have used Hart Dynamics, SmartTrigger, and do-it-yourself (DIY) cymbals with Roland brains (I have used Hart). Compatibility often has to do with whether the trigger device is dual-piezo sensor, trigger and rim/switch, etc. and to a lesser extent on brand, but brand can have an impact on the settings you need to configure the module for (e.g., I have found with Hart cymbals that I need to increase sensitivity and crosstalk cancellation settings more on my Roland module).

So I would say that compatibility is possible is some cases, but needs to be checked, moreso for the multizone devices. Switching between Yamaha and Roland especially (or anyone that manufactures both brains and trigger devices).

What I would suggest is trying to zero in on a brain or TMI and then trying to determine whether that piece of gear will support the form factor and brand of trigger pad(s) you are looking for.

Good luck!

Edit: If you are to mix and match brands, as a general rule I would say that the level of compatibility from easy to more difficult goes from bass drum, single-zone pad, crash cymbal, drum pads, ride cymbal, and hi-hat. Basically, you need to due more due diligence as you move from bass drum to hi-hat compatibility (there's basically more mechanics that need to work together).

Steve
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  #9  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:00 AM
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xush xush is offline
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Default Re: Multi-Zone E-Drums A La Carte?

For a year or two I used Roland pads connected to a TMC-6, which was midi'd to an EMU hardware sampler for some tuned notes and cymbal samples. The TMC-6/EMU combo worked well with various 2-zone mesh pads and cymbal triggers. I tried other TMI's, but the TMC-6 really seemed to be the most intuitive and the least painful to program.

lot's of info available here: www.vdrums.com

sorry if I missed it, but when you say you want to trigger some sample libraries you have, would that be on a laptop/softsampler?
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