Official Rugby World CUp (and the lead up tests) Thread

[Ozzy Biz]

I thought this might be a good way to stop Katman, Redevouz, MFB and myself from hijacking threads and turning them into rugby ones... ;)

So to start it up....

I was fairly upset for a few days after France were smashed by NZ in Auckland the other night. My confidence in their ability has recently been restored after discovering that France chose to play a 3rd grade team and not their top squad. They're doing the same for tonight's test in Wellington; only 5 players from the 38 who starred in their 6-Nations campaign will be there, three of which are on the bench I think. Wht's everyone's thoughts on this 'hide your best away' tactics that a lot of the European teams seem to be doing?

Secondly, has anyone seen Jonah Lomu play since his comeback last year? I kow he hasn't received any S14 contracts as he was planning. Sure, he's probably only good for 4 years at best, but really, no interest?!

And with that I'll leave. I've want to get 4-5 hours of study in before the games tonight (France vs NZ followed by Aus vs Fiji)

Cam

[nate]

61-10 abs over the french...



muhahahahaha..


yeah i know i know 3rd rate them, but come on, it's a new record...

[rendezvous_drummer]

Haha yeah we did Hijack a few threads eh. As we all know, I'm supporting the Canadian and Irish squad. The Canadian side....don't expect much from them. Canadians feel that Rugby isn't a top priority to focus on...it's a shame really. At least they beat USA.

Ireland on the other hand, despite losing to Argentina, have played very well and am expecting big things from them this world cup.

As for the France-NZ game.......what did ye expect haha. Third line against 1st line was it?

Oh just don't get me started on Rugby. I did play for eleven years after all.

England aren't going to do this well this time around, it's a shame but they really did lose an entire generation of players at the end of the last World Cup. I'm glad to see Mike Catt back in the squad, our backline is the most predictable backline half the time, but add Mike Catt into the backline and we immediately become alive. He's a talisman. Wilkinson is excellent, but only on his day and he's too fragile to be a realistic opportunity for the duration of the next few months.

As for Jonah Lomu? It's a pity. There's a guy I have a LOT of time for. Really the prototype for the fast and physically huge wingers and centres that have come to dominate the bigger teams of both hemispheres. I really would like to see him playing again.

[Ozzy Biz]

I'm not sure how fast Lomu is these days, he's put on a couple of kilos (weighs in at 125 now I think) so I doubt he's near his old 10.8s 100m time. He might not have the pace to keep up with the faster style of game many teams are favouring these days.

As for MFBs 11 years; I can't quite top that. I'm having this year off as my shoulder's are in pretty bad shape, I more dislocation and it's reco's... I'm building up the muscles around my shoulders so I can play again next year, also have to lift my fitness to try and lose the number 1 and get the 6, 7, or 8 jumper.

I watched most of the three games in a row last night (NZ v France, Aus vs Fiji, RSA vs Samoa) and I don't think any were real indications of actual team strength. We played scrappily and as a result only won by 49 pts; the same margain as the Junior All Blacks the week before. I think we missed about 6 or so conversions and had one try denied by the video ref so I guess it's not too bad. RSA I wasn't paying too much attention too but they looked as if they would have definately beaten us had we played. Same goes for NZ and (unfortunately) I think we might have struggled a bit against the French reserves had we played them.

Lastly, where's the 2011 RWC?

Cam

[Vinnysimmo]

I know next to nothing about rugby but are the all blacks and the aussies favorites as usual?

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by Vinnysimmo

I know next to nothing about rugby but are the all blacks and the aussies favorites as usual?

The Aussies?.... Hardly. I forsee our next four matches could possibly be quite embarrassing; NZ, RSA, NZ, and RSA in that order.

NZ are the premier favourite, RSA have recently moved to a very close 2nd favourite. France is a bit of a dark horse, their top players are all hidden away in the lead up to september. Ireland stands to do quite well, but after that recent loss to Argentina I'm a little more sceptical of their chances. Speaking of Argentina, they seem to have risen the ranks and are now a very respectable team. I haven't seen them play so I can't really verify this however. I do know that when they beat Ireland, their flyhalf scored 17 or so points out of their 22; meaning they may be relying on a couple of star players to carry the team, but I don't really know. The great thing about rugby, especially World Cup football, is that any of the top-tier teams could come out on top or be eliminated prematurely. Just look at what happened to NZ last time, and the time before that, and.... ...well basically every year since '87!

Also, I'm pretty pumped for the this wednesday night: the IRB Sevens comp is on and followed by State of Origin. Yeah, I know Origin is league, but it's the best three league games in the year and the only ones I'll watch. Go NSW! And as Reg Regan would say: "BRING BACK THE BIFF!"

Cam

[nate]

Originally Posted by Ozzy Biz

The great thing about rugby, especially World Cup football, is that any of the top-tier teams could come out on top or be eliminated prematurely. Just look at what happened to NZ last time, and the time before that, and.... ...well basically every year since '87!

i think the rugby world cup has become a lot like the football world cup, in that there are about 6 teams (more for football) who could win it at any time, all form outside the world cup, doesn't count, i know that seems strange, but it's it own beast, players react differently under the pressure of world cup games. this is a good thing...

whlist nz is top at the moment unfortunately i think it means nothing.

[Vinnysimmo]

Well, as i said, I know nothing about rugby.

See this is the thing. Nate's got it on the nail.

Last World Cup, England did go in favourites, and we were basically unbeatable in the run up; but WE DID NOT PLAY WELL. If we'd played like we played in the autumn internationals before the World Cup, we'd have wiped the floor with every single team we'd come across, and that includes Australia. And that's not disrespect to the other teams, it's just the plain truth. Come the World Cup, Wilkinson first showed his first signs of weakness (poor kicking performance) and our backs were awful until Catt was re-instated. The forwards were fairly reliable, but we relied on the backs to score most of our points.

I think this is true of most teams. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Australia put in a great performance this time, despite a poor start.

[drumbandit]

What do you lot think about Andy Farrell playing Union? Apparently he got payed £1 million to play for England and is he even on the squad anymore? I have a weird feeling that France will take it this World Cup, but we have lost so many key players. Bringing back old faces does seem to be working I have to say but to improve, new players must get experience.

I wanna see Dawson play one last time, even though Ellis has been playing so well, there's something about Dawson's confidence and cheek that makes him so fun to watch.

Tom

To be honest, whatever works. At the moment I'm open to almost any suggestions, we need to try experimenting and see what happens and then solidify the team. We've still got a couple of months to decide and it's not like the players are playing at the moment.

[drumbandit]

True, I'm so up for the World Cup !! Got me in the Rugby mood.

God I miss playing.

It's funny. My old coach (alcoholic lunatic, but one Hell of a guy) started up a youth womens' team in Gravesend. Nine players from that team made it into the Kent side and eight of those now represent the South-East of England ladies' youth team. I was surprised when I heard THAT news. I wish I'd carried on coaching. In my last year of school, I coached some of the first years and I had a great time doing it. I really miss it.

[drumbandit]

Yeah I helped coach one of my uncle's teams and it was great fun. I said to the whole team ' run out to the cone then sprint back' and instead of them running out so they were inline with the cone and then back in some sort of flat line. They all sprinted at the actual cone and all made sure they touched it, then ran back !! So funny.

My cousin played for her regions' ladies team, and her brother played for England U16's and for Worcester (my cousin) . Then he quit playing all together! I'd love to be at that level !!

Tom

[Ozzy Biz]

MFB, out of curiosity, why'd you stop playing?


When I was in yr 11 playing 1st grade for school (in Melbourne, mind you. Not anything impressive at all) we had GAP student called James Cooper who was our assistant coach and had played half-back for the England U19s the season before coming out here. What a hard-nut he was, he used to full-contact train with us. That hurt a bit. Great fun, until he breaks your nose...

Full contact train? That was nearly every session from when I was nine upwards!

As for me stopping? No big story there. Basically I stopped playing because I was travelling miles to school each day and come the weekend I was too tired to play. Plus I wasn't dedicated enough to train on weekdays as the rest of my team were starting to do, going down to the gym etc. Now, that's all fine and I'm not bitter. Then they started losing team members due to work commitments and the like as we got older, so I started playing again. End of the season and there wasn't a youth team for me to really go to, except for some Saturdays when I had to work. I started playing when I was five, in fact I started playing a year earlier than I was allowed. I was never really fit enough to play at any decent level, but I was a decent second row and back row player (6'2" and 180Ibs at 14 gets you there by default!) but never massively skilled and greatly inconsistent. When I played well, I was as good as anybody on my team, on a bad day, I was terrible.

No matter. Maybe I'll train up and find a team who want me.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by Mediocrefunkybeat

Full contact train? That was nearly every session from when I was nine upwards!

haha... Yeah, we never trained without tackling/etc in the drills. What's the point, really? I meant he would train with us, like one of the team members, and beat the absolute crap out of some of the guys. Buff guy, body-builder in the off-season. First time I popped a shoulder he was responsible. That hurt a bit.

I went back to watch my old team play the other week as they're doing really well this season, on top of the table I think. They've got this kid who's just turned 16, and he'd be maybe 6'4" and 125-130kg. Seriously big boy.

Ayone watching the IRB Sevens tomorrow on Fox? (Fox in Aus at least)

[katman]

Did someone say Rugby World Cup?

I have a very good feeling about this one. We weren't completely up to scratch against England and Samoa in recent weeks, but we were trying combinations. The real test will be the Tri-Nations. I have a ticket for Saturday's game vs Oz at Newlands (Cape Town).

I think we have the forwards to dominate most teams this year. And we have a few stars in the backline, but possibly also a few weaknesses (flyhalf, right wing).

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Did someone say Rugby World Cup?

I have a very good feeling about this one. We weren't completely up to scratch against England and Samoa in recent weeks, but we were trying combinations. The real test will be the Tri-Nations. I have a ticket for Saturday's game vs Oz at Newlands (Cape Town).

I think we have the forwards to dominate most teams this year. And we have a few stars in the backline, but possibly also a few weaknesses (flyhalf, right wing).

About time you showed up!... ;)

Yeah, I'm pretty confident in the abilities of the RSA boys at the moment, especially the forwards and whatever wing Habana plays on. Something funny about our upcoming game; they dropped Lote Tuquiri from the squad for the Welsh games as an incentive for him to work harded, but also to really work on his speed to make him more of a match for Brian Habana. The press has been eagerly anticipating this game for that match up, and Habana now isn't playing! It's interesting though, when they play on each other. I was at the Aus vs RSA game last year where we flogged you around the park. I think the highlight was the Habana Tuquiri matchup; Tuquiri has him more than covered in strength but if he gave Habana too much space, he'd fly straight past him. It was very interesting to watch, and there was a lot of ball on that wing. I rate Habana as my favourite winger playing the international circut at the moment, and probably third all-time favourite (Ben Tune second and Lomu first, when they were in their prime of course).

[katman]

Originally Posted by Ozzy Biz

About time you showed up!... ;)

Yeah, I'm pretty confident in the abilities of the RSA boys at the moment, especially the forwards and whatever wing Habana plays on. Something funny about our upcoming game; they dropped Lote Tuquiri from the squad for the Welsh games as an incentive for him to work harded, but also to really work on his speed to make him more of a match for Brian Habana. The press has been eagerly anticipating this game for that match up, and Habana now isn't playing! It's interesting though, when they play on each other. I was at the Aus vs RSA game last year where we flogged you around the park. I think the highlight was the Habana Tuquiri matchup; Tuquiri has him more than covered in strength but if he gave Habana too much space, he'd fly straight past him. It was very interesting to watch, and there was a lot of ball on that wing. I rate Habana as my favourite winger playing the international circut at the moment, and probably third all-time favourite (Ben Tune second and Lomu first, when they were in their prime of course).

Yep, Habana took a knock to the knee near the end of the second England test and they're still debating whether he'll be in Saturday's squad or not. And I agree, he's just about the most exciting thing to emerge in SA rugby in recent years. His match-up with Tuquiri would be worth the admission price alone. If he's left out he'll most likely be replaced by JP Pietersen - tall, young wing from the Sharks who ended up top try scorer in the Super14. But still a little raw around the edges and not quite in Habana's league yet.

What's the Oz team like for Saturday? Is Drew Mitchel there? And Cameron Shepard? And will Giteau be playing at 12? You guys still have one of the most lethal backlines in the world - just need a couple of props to replace Dunning, Rodzilla and Baxter.

Also, I wouldn't read too much into the results of the past few weeks' internationals. Ireland, England, France and even Wales didn't send full strength teams on tour. These away test were all about resting players involved in club and regional finals as well as testing possible depth in several positions. Come WC time, I'd say anyone of SA, OZ, France, Ireland and even England have a fair chance at upsetting the Kiwis.

Honestly hope it's us though.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Yep, Habana took a knock to the knee near the end of the second England test and they're still debating whether he'll be in Saturday's squad or not. And I agree, he's just about the most exciting thing to emerge in SA rugby in recent years. His match-up with Tuquiri would be worth the admission price alone. If he's left out he'll most likely be replaced by JP Pietersen - tall, young wing from the Sharks who ended up top try scorer in the Super14. But still a little raw around the edges and not quite in Habana's league yet.

What's the Oz team like for Saturday? Is Drew Mitchel there? And Cameron Shepard? And will Giteau be playing at 12? You guys still have one of the most lethal backlines in the world - just need a couple of props to replace Dunning, Rodzilla and Baxter.

Also, I wouldn't read too much into the results of the past few weeks' internationals. Ireland, England, France and even Wales didn't send full strength teams on tour. These away test were all about resting players involved in club and regional finals as well as testing possible depth in several positions. Come WC time, I'd say anyone of SA, OZ, France, Ireland and even England have a fair chance at upsetting the Kiwis.

Honestly hope it's us though.

The tuquiri-Habana match up was exceptional, especially as they are such different players in most aspects. As far as our scrum goes, it's probably better than it has been for a couple of years. Rodney Blake is still injured I think, and wose still he's slimmed down a bit by the looks of things. I still think the best bit of every game or rugby played last year was Rodzilla somehow ending up on the wing in general play against England and receiving a pass, I think he got a run up from about halfway and he was flying along. The only player between him and the try line was a guy who looked about 80kg, and he was stationary on the try line. Blake absolutely smashed him; it was brilliant!

I'm not sure about the team for the weekend, I'll look it up on rugby.com.au now and see if I can find something. Although, I'm almost certain it will be the 9, 10, 12, 13 combo of gregan, larkin, giteau and mortlock. Drew Mitchel has some competition for the wing now tht Digby Ione is in the side; he is seriously talented.

[Ozzy Biz]

After looking at the list, I'd say it wil be:
Dunning, Moore, Baxter
Sharpe, Vickerman
Elsom, Palu, Smith
Gregan
Larkham
Mitchell
Giteau
Motlock
Tuquiri
? <-- I'm not sure...

The other guys are:
Adam Ashley-Cooper, Mark Chisholm, Sam Cordingley, Adam Freier, Mark Gerrard, Stephen Hoiles, Julian Huxley, Benn Robinson, Guy Shepherdson, Scott Staniforth, Phil Waugh (c).

Huxley has played the last three games at fullback, but they are his only international caps, so I don't think he'd play there. The forwards seem to be doing quite well. Watch Moore, Palu, and Robinson. All new kids on the block, big fellas too. Palu is one of my favourite Wallabies at the moment; 120kg and 195cm hard running number 8. Played a year of League; started for the Cowboys half a dozen times maybe four years ago. Moore tackled a guy in the first test against Wales and dislocated the guys knee and broke his femur simultaeously. The mic at the sideline picked up the crack loud and clear.

Hopefully we don't play as horribly as last week and it's a good match.

[katman]

I must say, I was impressed with Huxley in the Super14. But there can be quite a step up to test match level. Possibly Mark Gerard on the other wing? What's happened to Clyde Rathbone? And Chris Latham?

And I agree, Palu is quite a monster. Wouldn't want to tackle that for all the money in the world. We have our own super-athlete, Pierre Spies, who might start at 8 on Saturday. Played wing less than two years ago (yet to turn 21, I think), but gew to about 1.95m and 106kg and made the move to the back row. Destructive runner in a bit of space. But no one knows whether it will be him, Bobby Skinstad, Danie Rossouw, Joe van Niekerk or AJ Venter. And that's a pretty handy choice dilemma to be stuck with.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

I must say, I was impressed with Huxley in the Super14. But there can be quite a step up to test match level. Possibly Mark Gerard on the other wing? What's happened to Clyde Rathbone? And Chris Latham?

And I agree, Palu is quite a monster. Wouldn't want to tackle that for all the money in the world. We have our own super-athlete, Pierre Spies, who might start at 8 on Saturday. Played wing less than two years ago (yet to turn 21, I think), but gew to about 1.95m and 106kg and made the move to the back row. Destructive runner in a bit of space. But no one knows whether it will be him, Bobby Skinstad, Danie Rossouw, Joe van Niekerk or AJ Venter. And that's a pretty handy choice dilemma to be stuck with.

Rathbone is injured (can't remember what he did), Latham is recovereing from a knee reco I think. Gerard may very well play the other wing. He's a great winger; doesn't have the speed of habana, rococoko, etc but probably has better skills else where. He's actually first cousin of Wycleff Palu. My exact thoughts about Huxley, although he's a great kick during play. He's not too flash at all with conversions and penalties, but boy can he launch a torpedo a long way down the line. I'm really looking forward to the game to get a better indication of where both Australia and South Africa are standing at the moment.

[katman]

Just got the teams for Saturday. I see Drew Mitchell made it into the starting line-up for you guys with Mark Gerrard on the bench. Tough choice - both are class.

Personally I would have started with Freier at hooker. Good team and pretty evenly matched, except for the front row and our jumpers possibly compete a little better in the line-outs. Should be close. I'm calling it 34-22. To the Boks, of course!

Springboks - 15 Percy Montgomery, 14 Ashwin Willemse, 13 Jaque Fourie, 12 Jean de Villiers, 11 JP Pietersen, 10 Butch James, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Pierre Spies, 7 Juan Smith, 6 Schalk Burger, 5 Victor Matfield, 4 Bakkies Botha, 3 BJ Botha, 2 John Smit (c), 1 Gurthro Steenkamp.

Subs: 16 Gary Botha, 17 CJ van der Linde, 18 Johann Muller, 19 Danie Rossouw, 20 Michael Claassens, 21 Wynand Olivier, 22 Frans Steyn.

Wallabies - 15 Julian Huxley, 14 Drew Mitchell, 13 Stirling Mortlock (c), 12 Matt Giteau, 11 Lote Tuqiri, 10 Stephen Larkham, 9 George Gregan, 8 Wycliff Palu, 7 George Smith, 6 Rocky Elsom, 5 Dan Vickerman, 4 Nathan Sharpe, 3 Guy Shepherdson, 2 Stephen Moore, 1 Matt Dunning.

Subs: 16 Adam Freier, 17 Al Baxter, 18 Mark Chisholm, 19 Stephen Hoiles, 20 Phil Waugh (vc), 21 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 22 Mark Gerrard.

And here's the 81st minute of the Super14 final. Classic Habana.

[katman]

And thus it ended...

[Ozzy Biz]

Yeah, it was 2003 all over again...
Great game however. We played really well, especially in defence. South Africa were strong and unrelentful in attack the whole game. Katman, were you getting worried for a while when it was 10-19 our way and we seemed to be in control of the game? Hell, I was feeling pretty damn good until that guy came off the bench and kicked the best drop goal I've seen since Matt Dunning in the S12 a few years ago. Then decided to have another go and put the the South Africans up by 3 with a couple of minute to go.

[katman]

Originally Posted by Ozzy Biz

Yeah, it was 2003 all over again...
Great game however. We played really well, especially in defence. South Africa were strong and unrelentful in attack the whole game. Katman, were you getting worried for a while when it was 10-19 our way and we seemed to be in control of the game? Hell, I was feeling pretty damn good until that guy came off the bench and kicked the best drop goal I've seen since Matt Dunning in the S12 a few years ago. Then decided to have another go and put the the South Africans up by 3 with a couple of minute to go.

Was I worried? Are you kidding me? I was soiling myself right until the end. I was standing behind the posts where the two drop goals went over - what an atmosphere! Awesome game. I thought Oz were brilliant in defense. Basically the whole first half they were just throwing themselves into tackles, and the 2 or 3 times they made it into our 22, they scored. When Giteau went over next to the posts - right in front of us - everyone went very, very quiet. Kind of sorry that one team had to lose.

I think we really missed a game-breaker like Habana. And losing the captain after 10 minutes didn't help much either. For Oz, I thought Tiquiri had a very ordinary game. And Huxley was fairly annonymous. George Smith was back to his best form at the breakdown, Giteau is sheer class and Dunning played as well as I've ever seen him play.

Ha ha - yes, I'd put Steyn's drop kicks right up there with Larkham's wobbly and Dunning's classic strike.

I think you guys should really fancy your chances against the Kiwis. If your forwards can play as confrontational and in-your-face as they did on Saturday, they're certainly in with a shout.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Was I worried? Are you kidding me? I was soiling myself right until the end. I was standing behind the posts where the two drop goals went over - what an atmosphere! Awesome game. I thought Oz were brilliant in defense. Basically the whole first half they were just throwing themselves into tackles, and the 2 or 3 times they made it into our 22, they scored. When Giteau went over next to the posts - right in front of us - everyone went very, very quiet. Kind of sorry that one team had to lose.

I think we really missed a game-breaker like Habana. And losing the captain after 10 minutes didn't help much either. For Oz, I thought Tiquiri had a very ordinary game. And Huxley was fairly annonymous. George Smith was back to his best form at the breakdown, Giteau is sheer class and Dunning played as well as I've ever seen him play.

Ha ha - yes, I'd put Steyn's drop kicks right up there with Larkham's wobbly and Dunning's classic strike.

I think you guys should really fancy your chances against the Kiwis. If your forwards can play as confrontational and in-your-face as they did on Saturday, they're certainly in with a shout.

Haha. Good stuff. Tuquiri played well, but not by his standards if that makes sense. I'd say everyone else on the field played brilliantly; with the very notable exception of an unexperienced Huxley. To play fullback against this South African team in SA after 4 international caps is a lot of pressure.
I was especially impressed by all of our forwards; Shepardson, Moore, Dunning, Elsom, Smith, Vickerman, Sharpe, Palu, Waugh, Hoiles, Frier, Robinson, and Chisolm. Love those boys.
The tried-and-true Gregan-Larkham-Giteau-Mortlock combination certainly works, and I pressume will continue in the lead up and throughout the world cup. Tuquri and Mitchel are dangerous on the wing, and geez I can't wait for Latham to return.

Things are looking a little brighter for Australian rugby.

[rendezvous_drummer]

What a match the SA AUS match was!! Australia really had that game in hand, but those Boks man.....whoever scored those drop kicks, unbelievable. Now I read that the Aussie Squad are accusing the front row of the Boks of illegal performance enhancers.

On another note, Canada was killed by the ABS. Don't know if ye gys care, but i'm a bit pissed off. 64-16 I think it was. Scored more against the ABS than other teams usually do and I didn't expect them to win, but more effort at least damnit!

[katman]

Originally Posted by rendezvous_drummer

What a match the SA AUS match was!! Australia really had that game in hand, but those Boks man.....whoever scored those drop kicks, unbelievable. Now I read that the Aussie Squad are accusing the front row of the Boks of illegal performance enhancers.

On another note, Canada was killed by the ABS. Don't know if ye gys care, but i'm a bit pissed off. 64-16 I think it was. Scored more against the ABS than other teams usually do and I didn't expect them to win, but more effort at least damnit!

Illegal performance enhancers? I seriously doubt they'd make such allegations. Where did you read this? They were probably speaking of "illegal" scrummaging technique, as they had before the match. These days there always seem to be issues raised pre and post games, hoping to influence referees. The SA scrum is a pretty solid unit and I guess people will try anything to gain some kind of advantage. If you want to see a monstrous tight-5 match-up, watch Saturday's game between the Boks and the All Blacks in Durban. Os du Randt packing down against Carl Hayman - now there are two man-mountains. Also, the Kiwis have drafted Anton Oliver back in at hooker, which means they are pretty serious about their scrum. Can't wait.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Illegal performance enhancers? I seriously doubt they'd make such allegations. Where did you read this? They were probably speaking of "illegal" scrummaging technique, as they had before the match. These days there always seem to be issues raised pre and post games, hoping to influence referees. The SA scrum is a pretty solid unit and I guess people will try anything to gain some kind of advantage. If you want to see a monstrous tight-5 match-up, watch Saturday's game between the Boks and the All Blacks in Durban. Os du Randt packing down against Carl Hayman - now there are two man-mountains. Also, the Kiwis have drafted Anton Oliver back in at hooker, which means they are pretty serious about their scrum. Can't wait.

The SA loosehead was dropping the scrum and engaging early quite a bit during that game. And BJ Botha does angle in rather than engaging straight and square.

I'm looking forward to the NZ RSA game

[katman]

Originally Posted by Ozzy Biz

The SA loosehead was dropping the scrum and engaging early quite a bit during that game. And BJ Botha does angle in rather than engaging straight and square.

I'm looking forward to the NZ RSA game

Don't really want to get involved in a scrum technique discussion as these things can get ugly. But BJ Botha is probably one of the most technically-correct tightheads in world rugby today. Stories of him scrumming in are simply fed to the media to counter similar allegations of the past few years about the Oz front row (and paticularly Bill Young). It's a classic tit-for-tat business. And as for engaging early - I think the young English ref had a very good game except for this part. His pauses between the "crouch... pause... touch... engage" commands were way too long and were a recipe for disaster. Plus the Oz front row seem to shift laterally - particularly on defensive scrums underr pressure - just before engagement, making a square hit very difficult. Just my 2c worth.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Don't really want to get involved in a scrum technique discussion as these things can get ugly. But BJ Botha is probably one of the most technically-correct tightheads in world rugby today. Stories of him scrumming in are simply fed to the media to counter similar allegations of the past few years about the Oz front row (and paticularly Bill Young). It's a classic tit-for-tat business. And as for engaging early - I think the young English ref had a very good game except for this part. His pauses between the "crouch... pause... touch... engage" commands were way too long and were a recipe for disaster. Plus the Oz front row seem to shift laterally - particularly on defensive scrums underr pressure - just before engagement, making a square hit very difficult. Just my 2c worth.

Yeah, that's cool. I don't mind avoiding an in-depth front row technique discussion. I played loose-head through school rugby so I 've had a few conversations about it in my time; it's not the most riveting stuff to talk about.
And being technically proficient doesn't mean he chooses to work around the laws a bit. There are plenty of guys that will break the rules for as long as they can; until they get pulled up at least. I also did notice the length of space in his scrum calls, but really, you're talking about the world's best scrummagers and they should be able to hold their postition for and extra half a second before the engage. Don't you think?
Just my 2c worth...

[rendezvous_drummer]

Crap, I don't want to open a can of worms on the scrummage techniques. I read this off of Planetrugby.com which is where I read most of my Rugby news.

[katman]

Originally Posted by rendezvous_drummer

Crap, I don't want to open a can of worms on the scrummage techniques. I read this off of Planetrugby.com which is where I read most of my Rugby news.

Just trawled planetrugby and the only seemingly related piece I could find was this:

http://www.planetrugby.com/Story/0,1...359392,00.html

which, as I mentioned, is the usual pre-match media banter that all international teams seeem to get involved in these days. In this case it's about a tighthead scrumming in at an agle. No mention of banned substances though. They would never make such allegations - there are enough measures in place to keep test rugby clean and slanderous accusations like that would ruin relations between countries.

[Ozzy Biz]

Originally Posted by katman

Just trawled planetrugby and the only seemingly related piece I could find was this:

http://www.planetrugby.com/Story/0,1...359392,00.html

which, as I mentioned, is the usual pre-match media banter that all international teams seeem to get involved in these days. In this case it's about a tighthead scrumming in at an agle. No mention of banned substances though. They would never make such allegations - there are enough measures in place to keep test rugby clean and slanderous accusations like that would ruin relations between countries.

Rugby's probably one of the cleanest sports going around. One reason I think for this being the case is the sizeable punishments. Andrew Walker and Wendel Sailor got 2 years apiece for doing a little coke on the side.
Speaking of Wendel, I heard on the grape vine that he was thinking about going back to league, and then today one of the clubs (i forgot which one) announced that they had been talking to him. Probably a good move on his part; I can't see him making it back into the team now with Tuquiri, Ione, Mitchell, and Gerrard playing.

[rendezvous_drummer]

Originally Posted by katman

Just trawled planetrugby and the only seemingly related piece I could find was this:

http://www.planetrugby.com/Story/0,1...359392,00.html

which, as I mentioned, is the usual pre-match media banter that all international teams seeem to get involved in these days. In this case it's about a tighthead scrumming in at an agle. No mention of banned substances though. They would never make such allegations - there are enough measures in place to keep test rugby clean and slanderous accusations like that would ruin relations between countries.

I don't know why I said illegal substances. My mistake, but yes that's the article. I know that the SA front line is one of the most difficult lines to break, I think they were just too powerful for the Aussies.

[nate]

Do. Not. Relax. When. Playing. The All. Blacks.


Ever.

any questions?


what a game, huh? SA played quite dirty i thought, i saw more than one punch been thrown, i'm sur NZ did as well, but didn't see any.

SA must be gutted. Both teams made a LOT of mistakes.....discuss