Samba Drummers

[NotoriousDRUM]

Who are some drummers that I can listen to to give me a good expample of authentic samba beats and patterns and stuff like that?

And, what are the names of the albums I can hear them on?

[Jeroen aka aksie]

hey this is my samba... check it out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYxJLKvKBB4

[hawk9290]

Alan Dawson has a good excercise where it was a steady samba beat on the bass drum and hihats while playing through the rudiments around the kit, which really helps build up versatility and independence in a samba beat. Ndugu Chancler (Santana, Miles Davis, etc) has some good samba beats, though I don't recall the albums right now.

[KCDrummer]

Paulo Braga, Doug Auwarter. Google them, I'm sure you'll find some recordings.

[Pete Stoltman]

Here are a few with at least one example of recordings. These guys all can be found on a number of albums so maybe try a little more research beyond the recordings I've suggested.

Duduka da Fonseca: Ana Caram "Bossa Nova"

Airto Moreira: Airto "Fingers" plus lots of others look for "Light As A Feather" by Chick Corea and most anything by Flora Purim

Portinho: Manfredo Fest "Braziliana"

Paulo Braga: Joe Henderson "Double Rainbow" or Eliane Elias "Sings Jobim" Jack DeJohnette also appears on the Henderson album and does some very nice samba and bossa work

Mark Walker: The Carribean Jazz project (Mark has a very exciting contemporary style.)

Mike Shapiro is probably one of the best. He played drums for Airto Moreira and still plays with Sergio Mendes.

If you want "authentic" samba, you should google the word "batucada" or search for that at youtube. Batucada is the word for the brasilian style samba that is played by 40-400 people.

Check it out, it sure is fun.

Also see if you can find clips of these two samba schools, they are among the best in europe:

querschläger

blocco x


Good luck!

[LinearDrummer]

Originally Posted by Pete Stoltman

Here are a few with at least one example of recordings. These guys all can be found on a number of albums so maybe try a little more research beyond the recordings I've suggested.

Duduka da Fonseca: Ana Caram "Bossa Nova"

Airto Moreira: Airto "Fingers" plus lots of others look for "Light As A Feather" by Chick Corea and most anything by Flora Purim

Portinho: Manfredo Fest "Braziliana"

Paulo Braga: Joe Henderson "Double Rainbow" or Eliane Elias "Sings Jobim" Jack DeJohnette also appears on the Henderson album and does some very nice samba and bossa work

Mark Walker: The Carribean Jazz project (Mark has a very exciting contemporary style.)

I have the two Collective Afro/Brazilian books and I had really wished the would have put some of the examples in a musical setting....

Do you know who else Duduka da Fonseca has played with....
I'm gonna check out some of your recomendations....

[Class A Drummer]

Check out All of Steve Gadd's Videos if you have not done so yet. Alot have sambas and stuff, the rest are just good to watch :D

[d.c.drummer]

Originally Posted by Jeroen aka aksie

hey this is my samba... check it out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYxJLKvKBB4

Lol, thats a great samba if you ask me. (Dont tell my gf that) If that was your playing that was really really good.

[Pete Stoltman]

Originally Posted by LinearDrummer

I have the two Collective Afro/Brazilian books and I had really wished the would have put some of the examples in a musical setting....

Do you know who else Duduka da Fonseca has played with....
I'm gonna check out some of your recomendations....

If you can, get your hands on the August 2006 issue of Modern Drummer. They did an excellent feature article with Duduka. Lots of good insight on Brazilian music. Anyhow, here are a few of the recordings they suggested to listen to. I haven't heard all of them but would heartily agree with the ones I've heard.

Trio de Paz: Black Orpheus
Somewhere
Partido Out

Antonio Carlos Jobim: Antonio Brasilero

Claudio Roditti: Samba Manhattan Style

Phil Woods: Astor & Ellis

Kenny Barron: Canta Brasil

Duduka Da Fonseca: Samba Jazz In Black & White
Samba Jazz Fantasia

Several others listed but those will give you a good start.

[PBW]

Originally Posted by NotoriousDRUM

Who are some drummers that I can listen to to give me a good expample of authentic samba beats and patterns and stuff like that?

Here's some REAL samba drumming:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VTHHQo8xC0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYYSpirBffc

Also check out Sergio Mendes "Brasileiro" album.

[LinearDrummer]

Originally Posted by Pete Stoltman

If you can, get your hands on the August 2006 issue of Modern Drummer. They did an excellent feature article with Duduka. Lots of good insight on Brazilian music. Anyhow, here are a few of the recordings they suggested to listen to. I haven't heard all of them but would heartily agree with the ones I've heard.

Trio de Paz: Black Orpheus
Somewhere
Partido Out

Antonio Carlos Jobim: Antonio Brasilero

Claudio Roditti: Samba Manhattan Style

Phil Woods: Astor & Ellis

Kenny Barron: Canta Brasil

Duduka Da Fonseca: Samba Jazz In Black & White
Samba Jazz Fantasia

Several others listed but those will give you a good start.

Thanks man...preciate it!
I will definitely check that stuff out.....

this is one of the best batucadas in Europe. Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AuM9WOrZ_M

[LinearDrummer]

Originally Posted by SickRick

this is one of the best batucadas in Europe.

SickRick I don't have access to you-tube....
Can you explain what a Batucada is....

Is that where you alternate between the ride and floor tom with your right hand and play synchopated figures with your left hand on snare?

Originally Posted by LinearDrummer

SickRick I don't have access to you-tube....
Can you explain what a Batucada is....

Is that where you alternate between the ride and floor tom with your right hand and play synchopated figures with your left hand on snare?

Nope..... you couldn't be more wrong (sorry ;)).

Batucada is a large group of drummers playing samba. It consists of various instruments like Surdos, Caixas, Tamborims, Bells, Shakers and other. In Brasil a batucada is usually playing along with large groups of singers and dancers - alltogether this is called a Samba-school. There is a big fight in between all the samba-schools about which one is the best, people there live their lifes just for the samba. It is huge.

Samba is mainly played at carneval, so that is what all the batucadas rehearse for. Of course it is also a large part of brazilian lifestyle...


Now, if you want to play samba on your drums, you really have to understand where it is coming from and the only way to learn that is by listening to batucadas and better by playing in batucadas. You can only get the correct feel for samba if you know all the instruments and know how to play them and which parts they play. If you don't know that all the samba that you play will sound like a big piece of bull. I never realized that until I started playing in a batucada - that really tought me that everything I had thought I knew about samba was wrong. Just plain wrong. It also has something to do with the lifestyle - another thing you can learn by playing batucada because you usually meet some guys from brazil there - and other guys who have adapted that way of living.

A great way to listen to batucada is youtube because there is a lot of stuff. try to get acces. There is also some good batucada stuff on the Sergio Mendes record "Brasilero" which has been recommended here before. Get that one, its great.

[Pete Stoltman]

Batucada is the essence of samba and thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience. One of the interesting things you brought up is the "feel" of samba. I did a little work with a brilliant Brazilian drummer a few years ago and asked him to share some of his patterns with me. He was generous with his time and seemed to recognize my genuine love for the music. When I asked him to suggest some books he looked at me, shook his head, and said "samba doesn't come from books, it comes from here!" as he pounded me in the chest. Of course that's not to say that you can't learn something from some of the very fine books out there but his meaning was obvious. Ever since that conversation I've tried to apply that notion into any kind of music I play. Some is easier than others but a genuine love and respect for whatever you play will not just make you a better drummer but also a better musician.

[MEL]

This batucada recording is of one of the oldest and best samba schools in Rio:

http://www.amazon.com/Batucada-Brasi...6865721&sr=8-1

Great licks on repinique.

[PBW]

Originally Posted by SickRick

Nope..... you couldn't be more wrong (sorry ;)).

Batucada is a large group of drummers playing samba.

The name for the group of drummers is "bateria", not batucada". A bateria can play all sorts of different rhythms, one family of which is "batucada". Other types include "samba reggae" "samba dura" "maracatu" "ijexa" etc. So batucada is the name of the rhythm, not the group.

Originally Posted by PBW

The name for the group of drummers is "bateria", not batucada". A bateria can play all sorts of different rhythms, one family of which is "batucada". Other types include "samba reggae" "samba dura" "maracatu" "ijexa" etc. So batucada is the name of the rhythm, not the group.

Sorry, that is right of course. I am so used to the term batucada, because the bataria I play in only plays batucada that I started to say: "I go to the batucada" instead of "I go to the bateria"....

Actually, we don't use the term Bateria in Germany because we have a different word for that, so I mixed it up (plus I was drunk last night when I posted, so I didn't really think about it...)

Thanks for putting this right.

[Raymond Bloom]

Originally Posted by Jeroen aka aksie

hey this is my samba... check it out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYxJLKvKBB4

damn...

what, there was music on the background, too? hehe

pretty cool!

[LinearDrummer]

Originally Posted by SickRick

There is also some good batucada stuff on the Sergio Mendes record "Brasilero" which has been recommended here before. Get that one, its great.

Thanks for the Batucada breakdown.....

I just put an order in for Brasilero at Amazon :D

[WhiskeyGoddess]

I have been listening to the Sergio Mendes cd "Brasilero" since childhood because that drumming has always mesmerized me. Can anyone recommend any other artists, songs, cd's, etc that sounds similar to the "Brasilero" cd?? I would greatly appreciate any suggestions. Thanks :D

[superbatmat]

Go here...

That's my drum teacher with one of his group !!!!

links

[aydee]

Is there a basic samba pattern ( like a basic bossa ) ? I thought the samba was a amalgamation of many afro-cuban/brazilian rhythms....

what is the difference between 'american' samba and brazilian?

could anyone write down a basic samba groove for drumset ?

[Deathmetalconga]

Originally Posted by aydee

Is there a basic samba pattern ( like a basic bossa ) ? I thought the samba was a amalgamation of many afro-cuban/brazilian rhythms....

what is the difference between 'american' samba and brazilian?

could anyone write down a basic samba groove for drumset ?

Here is one interpretation of samba that works for me. H=hats, S=snare and B=bass drum. At first, play just quarter notes on the hats, then move to eighths once you have the feel, then try shuffles, etc. As your familiarity grows, you can put ghost notes on the snare, hats and bass and play different parts on different drums, the ride cymbals, etc. Listen to different recordings and you'll hear different ways of interpreting it.

1__&__2__&__3__&__4__&__1__&__2__&__3__&__4__&__1_ _&__2__&__3__&__4__&__1__&__2__&__3__&__4
H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_ ____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H_____H
_____________S________________________S___________ ____________S________________________S______
B________B_______________B________B______________B ________B____________B_____B_____B________

If you wanted to say it:

Boom, ba ta
Boom, ba ta
Boom, ba ta
Boom boom ba ta

[aydee]

Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga

Here is one interpretation of samba that works for me. H=hats, S=snare and B=bass drum. At first, play just quarter notes on the hats, then move to eighths once you have the feel. Listen to different recordings and you'll hear different ways of interpreting it.

1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 1 & 2 & 3 & 4
H H H H H H H H H H H H H H H H
S S S S
B B B B B B B B B

If you wanted to say it:

Boom, ba ta
Boom, ba ta
Boom, ba ta
Boom boom ba ta

Thanks a lot, DMC.! Will get to this right away.

I'm thinking going back to a teacher soon for the latin stuff and he's asking me to have a game plan ( I'm reasonably advanced ).... what type samba, what drummers, etc, and suggested I really delve into the genre.

I come from rock, jazz, fusion. I've got a lot of fake sambas in my repertoire, since I never studied it, so I wanted a sense of where to begin.

[Jeremy Bender]

Aydee, here is a good samba pattern for drum set played by Steve Gadd-about 2:20 into the video you can see him playing . http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=9

[aydee]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Bender

Aydee, here is a good samba pattern for drum set played by Steve Gadd-about 2:20 into the video you can see him playing . http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=9

Thanks a lot for the link, Jermy, that was great.

That does feel like a basic samba groove.

Funny, I just saw Jarreau, with George Duke and Ravi Coltrane 5 months back. They are older now but ,man, there's a lot of fire still.

My teacher-to- be, kind of hinted to me that Gadd was not the real samba.I quote" You want to learn the real samba, and If that what style? what genre?, ...or the gadd type american samba'?

The way he said that was kind of dismissive, as though that was'nt the real stuff, so therefore what do I want to do? He's posing the question to me.

I'm not a formally trained drummer though I've take lessons off and on through out my playing years.

Though it is obvious that there are many ways and feels for the samba, I want to go to him and say" HERE, THIS IS WERE I WANT TO BEGIN"

Maybe I can tell him Gadd IS where I want to begin,because its basic.... before I get into the real hard core stuff...

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by aydee

Thanks a lot for the link, Jermy, that was great.


My teacher-to- be, kind of hinted to me that Gadd was not the real samba.I quote" You want to learn the real samba, and If that what style? what genre?, ...or the gadd type american samba'?

Maybe I can tell him Gadd IS where I want to begin,because its basic.... before I get into the real hard core stuff...

It's kind of a strange statement to make since any samba on a drum set is not a "real samba." The drum set tries to imitate what the pandeiro, guica and surdo (bass drum) are doing. Airto can play a pandeiro, so that might make his samba more authentic.

[aydee]

Originally Posted by Deltadrummer

It's kind of a strange statement to make since any samba on a drum set is not a "real samba." The drum set tries to imitate what the pandeiro, guica and bass drum are doing. Airto can play a pandeiro, so that might make his samba more authentic.

Thanks, would you know of any clips of Airto playing it on the drumset? I'm sure I've heard it.

[elpol]

.02

lots of great suggestions here! i wanted to add (what i hope) is one.

exposure to the style in it's traditional form is really valuable. unfortunately, many of us can't just go hang out at an 'Escola de Samba' up in Pernamabuco, or Rio, or whereever.

depending on where you live, look for Capoeira academies in your local directory.

often you'll find live percussion accompanying the Capoeiristas. it's not a bad place to get a first-hand introductory exposure to Brazilian drumming, and hear it in a folkloric style.

it's not 'samba', but it is a window into the very, very rich and diverse Brazilian drumming culture.

and speaking of great recordings (movies): has anybody seen City of God? or, better yet, heard the soundtrack? the opening sequence will blow your mind. it's a small 'street' bateria with a cavoquinho (small 'ukulele-like' brazilian guitar, common to samba) playing in the background of a 'chicken chase'.

[aydee]

[quote=

and speaking of great recordings (movies): has anybody seen City of God? or, better yet, heard the soundtrack? the opening sequence will blow your mind. it's a small 'street' bateria with a cavoquinho (small 'ukulele-like' brazilian guitar, common to samba) playing in the background of a 'chicken chase'.[/QUOTE]

Awesome movie!!!! the opening sequence mesmeric, musically and cinematically. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by aydee

Thanks, would you know of any clips of Airto playing it on the drumset? I'm sure I've heard it.

I don't; but here is a clip, I think a bunch of French guys, playing samba.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1dzr1_samba_music

The pandeiro player is Paul Mindy and here's another:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1c...pandeiro_music

Originally Posted by wy yung

Bateria,batucada....where to begin?

You should go here....http://www.worldsamba.org/main/


From my experience, the best thing to do is go to the source. Forget drumset players. Most have, as I am sure I did, an attitude that looks down upon a player who specializes in surdo. (As can be clearly seen in the Tommy Igoe DVD). "All this guy does is this!" so on and so forth. It's all a big ignorant wank. The fact is samba is HUGE beyond the comprehension of most drummers. Oh, and check out the new CD be Aline De Lima. Paulo Braga, is on drums. Cool.

I'm sorry, but Tommy Igoe does NOT say "All he does is this" in the Groove Essentials DVD. He says, and I'm actually watching it right now, "That's his gig, all night long". It's obvious he doesn't mean it disrespectfully, he was trying to explain how important it is even though the part is simple. I mean, the guy studied with Portinho for crissakes, how much more Brazilian can you get than that? To me, it's clear that Tommy has put in a lot of time learning to play Brazilian music with authenticity from real Brazilian drummers and you can hear it in the way he plays and teaches the music.

[Deathmetalconga]

Originally Posted by wy yung

The fact is samba is HUGE beyond the comprehension of most drummers. Not saying this with disrespect here. It's just that the magnitude is beyond what many drummers understand.

That is true about a great many drumming things. The Western trap set is a very young instrument, barely 100 years ago, while people have been drumming for tens of thousands of years. Yet many Western trap set drummers have little comprehension of the rich tradition of world drumming that predates their instrument.

At the same time, I do believe music evolves and changes. One culture will take and adapt another culture's instruments and music, sometimes in unexpected ways (like how the Middle Eastern santoor became the European hammered dulcimer, then the Chinese yang chin, or how African slaves absorbed and syncretized European music with their own in the New World). African music begat jazz, which begat R and B, which begat rap, which is being interpreted in many different ways worldwide and being sent back to us (Aisha Kandisha is one of many good examples). Whose music is it now? So much been passed around, re-interpreted and cross-pollinated with folkloric and pop styles that I'm amazed anyone still clings to the idea that "you can't play authentic samba on the drumset." Maybe not folklorically, but that's only one part of samba and other fusions are continuing to evolve.

That's what's going one when a Western trap set drummer adapts Middle Eastern, Latin or African rhythms for his set. Would you say the trap drummer for Batacumbele was a wanker? No, he was steeped in Afro-Cuban traditions and applied those to a different instrument.