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  #1  
Old 03-22-2007, 05:38 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Resonant heads

Drummers usually concentrate on batters and don't experiment with different resos. Resos are responsible for the majority of sustain. People will ducktape their batters and go for the thickest heads just to kill those overtones, without considering the reso head.

I'd like to know what impact which type of reso has on the overall sound. For ex, a thinner head, a two ply, a head with ring as reso... Especially on bigger toms which tend to resonate too long. A thick batter isn't always the solution since it drastically changes the feel and stick attack, making the head duller to play without actually shortening sustain much.
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  #2  
Old 03-22-2007, 05:44 PM
fusssion
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Default Re: Resonant heads

I've said this before but.......I recently put a G2 clear as a reso over my EC2 on a birch 14x16 floor tom ......WOW.....nice boominess , controlled sustain and nice growl! It works!
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  #3  
Old 03-22-2007, 06:33 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Yeah I thought of having clear G2 as reso for floor toms to shorten sustain. I wanna keep coated single plies on top because they feel less dull than two plies. They do all right on small toms but floor toms resonate way too long. Is it more difficult to tune two ply reso's?
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  #4  
Old 03-27-2007, 01:02 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Noone cares about resos?

What about the kick. I'm thinking of pairing the emad batter with a coated EQ3 to further dry out the ring so I don't need to leave the heads (too) loose. Anyone tried the remad instead? How's it doing with an emad batter; not too dead?
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  #5  
Old 03-27-2007, 03:42 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

From heads manufacturer it seem thinner reso shorten the sustain and brighten the sound...

EVANS
: the thin 7mil Resonants shorten the sustain and brighten the tone for enhanced projection during live performances.

AQUARIAN: A clear, single ply, thin weight head. It produces a sensitive, bright response when used as a resonant head for the bottom of tom toms.

REMO: most open sounding head due to its single layer of 7.5-mil Mylar® film. They’re known for their bright tones, resonance, and sustain and as resonant (bottom) heads opening up the sound of tom-toms.

Now, everyone has its opinion on these statements which some says thinner is more resonant and thicker is more dead etc... with this in mind I eventually may try every combo possible but for now I'm happy with medium weight single ply clear head as reso. Aquarian Classic clear is easy to tune and moreover they stay tuned for a long period of time which is great when using them as reso. They produce an excellent tone, resonance, sustain and have good projection.
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  #6  
Old 03-27-2007, 03:57 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by mind_drummer View Post
From heads manufacturer it seem thinner reso shorten the sustain and brighten the sound...

EVANS
: the thin 7mil Resonants shorten the sustain and brighten the tone for enhanced projection during live performances.

AQUARIAN: A clear, single ply, thin weight head. It produces a sensitive, bright response when used as a resonant head for the bottom of tom toms.

REMO: most open sounding head due to its single layer of 7.5-mil Mylar® film. They’re known for their bright tones, resonance, and sustain and as resonant (bottom) heads opening up the sound of tom-toms.

Now, everyone has its opinion on these statements which some says thinner is more resonant and thicker is more dead etc... with this in mind I eventually may try every combo possible but for now I'm happy with medium weight single ply clear head as reso. Aquarian Classic clear is easy to tune and moreover they stay tuned for a long period of time which is great when using them as reso. They produce an excellent tone, resonance, sustain and have good projection.
haha, i was waiting for that aquarian plug : )

mind_drummer: how many mil is the classic clear?

(my drums sound great as with their classic clear resos too by the way)
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  #7  
Old 03-27-2007, 04:57 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

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Originally Posted by radiofriendlyunitshifter View Post
haha, i was waiting for that aquarian plug : )

mind_drummer: how many mil is the classic clear?

(my drums sound great as with their classic clear resos too by the way)
Classic clear are 10 mil weight heads. I got it confirmed by Chris Brady at Aquarian three weeks ago. Somes peoples swore they were 12 mil head.
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Old 03-27-2007, 06:56 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by mind_drummer View Post
Classic clear are 10 mil weight heads. I got it confirmed by Chris Brady at Aquarian three weeks ago. Somes peoples swore they were 12 mil head.
since the consensus is that thinner heads shorten sustain, do you think that is the reason why aquarian doesn't put that in the description?
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  #9  
Old 03-27-2007, 07:36 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Thinner heads do not always shorten sustain and if they do, they'll usually brighten up the tone. A brighter tone just projects better than a low freq.

Check evans chart for ex. You'll notice that 2 ply heads shorten sustain drastically and preserve a warm tone. Coated heads shorten sustain a bit less drastically but also warm up overtones.
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  #10  
Old 03-27-2007, 07:46 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by radiofriendlyunitshifter View Post
since the consensus is that thinner heads shorten sustain, do you think that is the reason why aquarian doesn't put that in the description?
I really dont know why they dont even say a single word about it. Even Remo dont say anything about sustain...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadJazz View Post
Thinner heads do not always shorten sustain and if they do, they'll usually brighten up the tone. A brighter tone just projects better than a low freq.

Check evans chart for ex. You'll notice that 2 ply heads shorten sustain drastically and preserve a warm tone. Coated heads shorten sustain a bit less drastically but also warm up overtones.

That's exactly what Evans are saying in their web site.

EVANS: the thin 7mil Resonants shorten the sustain and brighten the tone for enhanced projection during live performances.
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  #11  
Old 03-27-2007, 09:23 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

I have found it's the total opposite of what Evans says about their thin resonant heads such as Resonant Glass or Resonant Black. Even using Remo Diplomats the sound is much more resonant, not much more bright compared to an Ambassador, but the sound is so much more full, especially out front. I can still get nice and deep tones out of Diplomats on resonants.
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  #12  
Old 03-31-2007, 04:29 AM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Im thinking of putting G2sson all toms for resonants on my sonor 3001. Im getting awful overtones from it. What do you guys think?
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  #13  
Old 03-31-2007, 08:28 AM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

2 ply heads resonanate longer than their single ply counterparts due to having a larger mass. However, due to their larger weight, they are harder to get excited into vibrations. Once excited, they vibrate slower than single-ply heads, creating a lower pitch which is perceived as being warm.
Conversely, light single-ply heads are excited much more easily, and vibrate for a shorter amount of time. But as the frequency of vibration is higher (the period becoming shorter), the resultant pitch is slightly higher, being perceived as bright.

Using this basic physics, theoretically thin single-ply heads with muffle rings at the edge will resonate for the shortest time, even more so when combined with the same model head on batter side tuned to the same note value.
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  #14  
Old 03-31-2007, 12:34 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzy Biz View Post
2 ply heads resonanate longer than their single ply counterparts due to having a larger mass. However, due to their larger weight, they are harder to get excited into vibrations. Once excited, they vibrate slower than single-ply heads, creating a lower pitch which is perceived as being warm.
Conversely, light single-ply heads are excited much more easily, and vibrate for a shorter amount of time. But as the frequency of vibration is higher (the period becoming shorter), the resultant pitch is slightly higher, being perceived as bright.

Using this basic physics, theoretically thin single-ply heads with muffle rings at the edge will resonate for the shortest time, even more so when combined with the same model head on batter side tuned to the same note value.
Bottom line: thicker heads eliminate high ring and that's exactly what they're used for, for a fatter tone.

You must be missing something cos your theory does not correspond to reality. The same head will have a different effect as batter or reso. Take a 2 ply clear batter: bright and semi-focused. The same 2 ply clear but as reso = semi-warm and focused. Then you have to make the distinction between attack and sustain. I'm talking sustain here. A 2 ply clear will have bright sustain but warm/wet attack. Coated heads have the opposite effect: dry and sharp attack, warm sustain.

If you read the tuning bible, written from a scientific point of view, it says that a one ply coated and unmuffled batter will offer the warmest sound. Where does your theory fit here into?
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  #15  
Old 03-31-2007, 01:38 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by me
2 ply heads resonanate longer than their single ply counterparts due to having a larger mass. However, due to their larger weight, they are harder to get excited into vibrations. Once excited, they vibrate slower than single-ply heads, creating a lower pitch which is perceived as being warm.
Conversely, light single-ply heads are excited much more easily, and vibrate for a shorter amount of time. But as the frequency of vibration is higher (the period becoming shorter), the resultant pitch is slightly higher, being perceived as bright.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadJazz
You must be missing something cos your theory does not correspond to reality.

If you read the tuning bible, written from a scientific point of view...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drum Tuning Bible
* Thin resonant heads: These accentuate the higher registered overtones of the drum and shell that thicker or 2-ply head take away from the sound. It adds back an edge to the sound to compensate for the tone a thicker 2-ply or muted head from Category 2, 3 or 4 may have lessened or eliminated. These are easier to excite, and do not make the tone linger on or add low end warmth. This is because they are thin and have less mass. Things of less mass stop quicker once set into motion. So if you want a bright attack and less low end resonance, these are good choices.


* Medium or Standard Weigh Heads: These will have less high frequency sustain than the thin counterparts such as the REMO Diplomat™ or Evans Glass™. They are thicker and as such stay in motion a bit longer and add warmth or depth to the tone. As a reminder, coating adds even more thickness (depending upon manufacturer and style of coating) and can further enhance low end resonance while keeping high-frequencies in check. Moreover, ebony colored heads because of their inherent properties take the low end response and make it right in between clear and texture coated heads. They are ideal where you want a great attack yet decent low end depth.
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  #16  
Old 03-31-2007, 02:12 PM
MadJazz MadJazz is offline
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Default Re: Resonant heads

So the perfect set would be 1 ply clear (or coated) batter and 1 ply coated reso. Why isn't anyone playing that??
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  #17  
Old 03-31-2007, 02:32 PM
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Default Re: Resonant heads

A lot of people use a clear G1/Classic Clear/clear Ambassador as resonant heads paired with the same head (in coated or clear) on top; i.e. colaiuta, weckl, stanton moore, etc....

Not as many use coated resos, and I've never seen them used with a clear batter.

Also, you have to remember that there are smooth white and ebony single ply heads too, which are kind of middle ground between coated and clear. They play like clears, but are a little darker/warmer.
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