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  #41  
Old 07-27-2005, 06:02 AM
Milo
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Default Re: bonham fill

Well hopefully he didn't plan to just rip off the fill so I guess you could do it anyway we've suggested. That's beauty of that fill. It's fast enough that you can put your strokes in any order to achieve the result you want.
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  #42  
Old 07-27-2005, 06:04 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: bonham fill

the part on stairway

16th note triplet Snare, 16th note triplet high tom, 16th note low tom, 8th note kick, repeat three times, then the last one just backwards.

The pattern isn't hard, it the 5 against 4 part that might be throwing you, you put 5 of those patterns into the space of 4 beats.

Its not hard, but its REALLY hard to make your kit sound like Bonham's.
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  #43  
Old 07-27-2005, 07:42 AM
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theduke86 theduke86 is offline
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Default Re: bonham fill

I always played it as a "six" in sixteenth notes... RLRL RF RF and so on. I could be wrong, i'll have to check it out again.
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  #44  
Old 07-27-2005, 02:39 PM
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NUTHA JASON NUTHA JASON is offline
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Default Re: bonham fill

stu's got it right guys. i have the led zep drum transcripts book and also the dvd.

its triplets in 16ths with some cross sticking. although he also sometimes throws in a double bass hit like a castanet but the bassic fill pattern is (triplets)


high tom....I ... .L. .R. .L.
floor tom...I ... ..R ..L ..R
snare.......I .LR ... ... ...
bass........I x.. x.. x.. x..
------------I -3- -3- -3- -3-

Notice the cross sticking in the third triplet...looks really cool on the video when he does it.
j
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  #45  
Old 07-27-2005, 10:13 PM
hypecast
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Default Re: bonham fill

Transcriptions here:

http://rdeneau.free.fr/en/index.php3

and here:

http://ledzeppelin.alexreisner.com/d...criptions.html

I don't know for sure whether either one is spot-on (I haven't even listened to the song since I found them), but I sure had fun with them.

p.s. I found the first one through a link on DW, so thanks to the original poster (NuthaJason, maybe, if not please forgive)
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  #46  
Old 07-28-2005, 12:57 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: bonham fill

looking at those transcripts, I guess it could be played as 32nds with 16ths instead of 16thnote triplets and and 8th on the bass.

I was way wrong on the last one though....I thought it was just another of the same pattern just starting on the kick and going backwards..I see now its actually a sixtuplet pattern.
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  #47  
Old 07-28-2005, 09:42 AM
cactusman cactusman is offline
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Default Re: bonham fill

thanks for all the input guys. now i just need to work on the chops and the dynamics.
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  #48  
Old 07-28-2005, 05:15 PM
Mcot2 Mcot2 is offline
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Default Re: bonham fill

Ok, bonham has a LOT of fills.

But it doesnt matter how you transcribe them really.

There is a point where reading music becomes useless, and listening is the best way to learn something. I would say just listen to what he is doing, and try to get the dvd so you can see it.

Once you get the basic concept of using your foot in a linear mannor its not hard.

It really doesnt matter if it is a triplet or a sixteenth.
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  #49  
Old 07-28-2005, 08:26 PM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: bonham fill

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mcot2
Ok, bonham has a LOT of fills.

But it doesnt matter how you transcribe them really.

There is a point where reading music becomes useless, and listening is the best way to learn something. I would say just listen to what he is doing, and try to get the dvd so you can see it.

Once you get the basic concept of using your foot in a linear mannor its not hard.

It really doesnt matter if it is a triplet or a sixteenth.
Of course it matters if its a 16th note or a triplet, because they are different notes and different patterns. Unless you don't care if you are playing it accurately or not.
And reading is invaluable. At what point does it become 'useless'?
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  #50  
Old 07-28-2005, 09:35 PM
fusssion
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Default Re: bonham fill

Doesn't Neil Peart's instructional video (on this site) show that basic fill, but Neil is referring to Steve Gadd doing the fill....it's the basic fill......yes?
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  #51  
Old 08-02-2005, 09:49 PM
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Default Bonham Drum Tracks

Hi Everyone,

This just got posted over on Drumzilla's Lair, but I thought it was educational and worth posting here. Here are 23 drum tracks (isolated) from the album "In Through The Out Door" Apparently these were floating around the web awhile ago and then disapeared. Here they are again. These have been collected and put up on the web by the drummer from Neal & The Vipers.
I especially like tracks 22 & 23. Get 'em while their hot!

The Bonham Tracks: http://www.saladrecords.com/bonhamfiles.htm


Young Neal & The Vipers: http://www.saladrecords.com/
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  #52  
Old 08-02-2005, 10:31 PM
HardRockDrummer HardRockDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

thanks a lot. im a huge fan of john bonham!
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  #53  
Old 08-02-2005, 10:32 PM
MunsieMan MunsieMan is offline
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

thank you so much...your a good man i hope this are good tell me is there the fool in the rain snare outtake in the middle of Fool In The Rain where he does the rudiments
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  #54  
Old 08-03-2005, 01:15 AM
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DogBreath DogBreath is offline
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

Holy moly, those drums sound HUGE! Too bad the clips are so short.
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  #55  
Old 08-03-2005, 02:02 AM
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finnhiggins finnhiggins is offline
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

There was some degree of disagreement over whether these are actually Bonham, but I enjoyed them either way and tend towards thinking they probably are.

The guy who was hosting them originally got pissed off with people constantly emailing him demanding to know what they were, how he got them, details of recording dates etc when in reality he knew nothing and quite clearly stated on his page that he wasn't 100% these were Bonham at all... I got them back when they were up, anyway. There was a link to them off Matt Chamberlain's website.
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  #56  
Old 08-03-2005, 05:09 PM
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

Quote:
Originally Posted by finnhiggins
There was some degree of disagreement over whether these are actually Bonham, but I enjoyed them either way and tend towards thinking they probably are..
To my ear, I have no doubt that it is him. Some of the count offs and other vocal sputterings sound familiar too, like I've heard them on other Zep albums. Anyway, thanks for the fill in of information about these tracks. I never saw or heard them before yesterday, so I figured some of the people here hadn't seen them either. Like everybody else, I wonder what other audio and video is out there waiting to be discovered. ...Matt
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  #57  
Old 08-04-2005, 01:41 AM
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Default Re: Bonham Drum Tracks

Those drums are just thundering.
John Bonham has amazed me from beyond the grave once again!
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  #58  
Old 08-07-2005, 06:44 PM
PearlDrummer014 PearlDrummer014 is offline
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Default BONHAM Great Drummer

Mr. Bonzo is to date my all time favorite drummer. not necissarly the most skilled drummer when it came to rudiments but it was all about the feel of listenin to his music. he puts u in the drivers seat. and his legendary right foot is amazing all of his work is done on a single bass drum witch was astounding back in the day and still today he inspires many kids to pick up sticks
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  #59  
Old 08-07-2005, 07:03 PM
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Default Re: BONHAM Great Drummer

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlDrummer014
not necissarly the most skilled drummer when it came to rudiments but it was all about the feel of listenin to his music.
Even even though he may not have been good at rudiments, what does it really matter? Look past the technical mumbo-jumbo and look to see how natural and raw his playing was. Even Bonham said himself that it doesn't matter whether you can pull off a triple parradiddle during a show or not because no ones going to know but you.

And in the wise words of Jon Theodore of The Mars Volta, "There's no reason to study a rudiment unles
s you have a concept on how it can be applied to your life."
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Last edited by Dill X; 08-07-2005 at 07:20 PM.
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  #60  
Old 08-07-2005, 10:56 PM
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NUTHA JASON NUTHA JASON is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

it is a mistake to use the words 'not' and 'skilled' in a sentence about john henry bonham. it reveals a lot about your ears and approach to drumming and nothing about the truth. john bonham is above negative comment here please.

like ringo and to some extent charlie...
don't bash bonzo.

no way, no how.

i have avoided describing my love for the guy but here goes:




John henry bonham.

probably the greatest rock drummer in history. his sound and approach are often shadowed by the sheer intensity of his choices. each song is a gem of drumming. you can listen to them over and over again and eventually you see how this genious drove the band...chose the unobvious and subtley made it obvious. everybody cites the moby dick, whole lotta love, levi breaks examples. but i have the complete boxed set and let me tell you there are those rarer songs where you see what an enormously creative guy he was.
listen to:

fool in the rain - one of the most beautiful purdy shuffles (better that roseanna IMO) that hi hat accent is perfectly placed and a bastard to mimick.

gallows pole - drumming only at the end of the song is an exciting blue grass (or is it motown?) that comes in on the off and then shifts back and forth like breathing.

stairway to heaven - also only near the end of the song some beautiful open grooving so orchestrated that no 30 seconds is the same. the figure he throws in at the end of that solo illuded me for years.

dazed and confused - the song that taught me blues drumming and also alerted me to the usefulness of triplets, starting huge fills in very odd places and riding on a crash cymbal.

good time bad times - the first song on the first record and look at how bonzo introduces himself to the world. a drummer's song. the broken one footed triplets, the power. the choice of groove.

black dog - did kieth moon ever do something so un-obvious? bonzo starts each phrase so off it is like a hiccup. then he releases the tension the third time around and goes on his ride. and then there those thunder crack like fills near the end of the song.

rock n' roll - a song with a hook of a start. and an ending that blisters the ear with enviable hand speed. best to watch it on disc two of the DVD. when robert plant grins and looks around at the end of the song it is becuase he knew his mate was about to do something awesome on a drum kit...

bonzo's montreaux - a more musical solo than moby dick. an everest for single bass-drum drummers to climb for sure.

four sticks - can anyone actually play this song? i heard even bonzo avoided it after he got it down on tape. its a monster.

heartbreaker - listen to the bass drum work in the fill at 2:00. wha? unfortunately badly recorded but listen carefully to how much is there.

celebration day - at 1:52 bonzo shows some masterful snare flams at incredible speed. the man was a master at rudiments.

rain song - for bonzos beautiful brushwork. a dynamics genious not just a basher. he uses brushes for the whole song even the parts where it sounds like sticks.

lemon song - beautiful gong start but LISTEN TO THE FILLS BETWEEN 5:13 AND 5:27 ... IF YOU ARE NOT YET A CONVINCED BONZO FAN, YOU WILL BE!!! According to the legend this was all done in one take and BEFORE 1970!

over the hills and far away - hi-hat foot work is exceptional. he holds it open for an unusual amount of time. and there in comes the groove. in this song his bass drum sound is wonderful. this is what i want my bassdrum to sound like. at 3:10ish you even hear his speedking squeak.

living loving maid - what a cool beat! i love the way the whole groove changes at 00:20, 00:54 and 1:27. this is a cool snare sound.

the crunge - odd times. 9/8 this is a terrible beat to try and copy.

and

the ocean - 17/8 (we've done for already but now we're steady and thyen they went one...two...three...four... what a count in.)

poor tom - i love this snare work and that bass drum punches it out undeniably. perfect control almost as if he looped it.

i could go on

and on...

he's my hero.
what can i say.

i don't model my drumming on bonzo (well not much). i model my creativity on him. when confronting a new song i think how bonzo would do it. i like to imagine he is watching me and that usually makes me kick up my drumming a notch.

j
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Last edited by NUTHA JASON; 08-07-2005 at 11:52 PM.
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  #61  
Old 08-07-2005, 11:58 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

John Bonham, I'm sure, was the greatest drummer in rock history. He wasn't the best in all history, but definately the best in Rock history. What he comes up with was great, his technical skill was great, and Moby Dick was great. He was probably the 3rd most influential drummer to me today, and I love John Bonham, and I love Led Zeppelin. John Bonham will always remain a legend in rock history, and always will Influence people. There weren't many people at the time, who played Rock n' Roll, and could do what he did. Maybe Neil Peart, but that's for another forum. His timing was pretty solid, and he could play in really crazy time signatures. So I close this saying, Bonzo was the greatest drummer in Rock history.
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  #62  
Old 08-08-2005, 12:05 AM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

except that neil peart joined rush in 1974 when bonzo had already released five albums.

j
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  #63  
Old 08-08-2005, 12:09 AM
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finnhiggins finnhiggins is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Just to put a cat among the pigeons, I once met a guy in London who used to do session work back in the late '60s, and his take on Bonham was that he got the credit for a movement that he wasn't entirely the innovator of - that there were a bunch of guys around London at the time working to bring the solidity and huge sound that Bonham had going into rock music, rather than the previous Mitch Mitchell-esque jazzy approach. Bonham was just the first of them to get really big, while the rest remained relatively unknown.

Of course, this is all anecdotal and I can't vouch for any of it.

Personally, I think Bonham is a great drummer. If you want to play rock music there's rarely an occasion where you actually need to use anything more than he did, and he did it all so well!
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  #64  
Old 08-08-2005, 12:25 AM
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NUTHA JASON NUTHA JASON is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

bonzo was from birmingham. besides there is plenty of historical evidence rather than anecdotal evidence to support the popular view. the cat discoveres that the pigeons are eagles.

see

the biography by chris welch and geoff nicholls
the rhythm magazine interview with jeff ocheltree
the various authorized and unauthorized biogs of zep.

j
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  #65  
Old 08-08-2005, 02:40 AM
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finnhiggins finnhiggins is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NUTHA JASON
bonzo was from birmingham. besides there is plenty of historical evidence rather than anecdotal evidence to support the popular view. the cat discoveres that the pigeons are eagles.
j
Sorry, poor phrasing. Wasn't attempting to imply Bonzo was from London, just that there were (possibly) London players doing the same thing prior to Zep getting big. Also not suggesting I know this to be true, just something I heard. You're obviously a man that knows more than me on the subject - I'd love to have my source here to hold the opposing POV, but I'd have no idea how to get hold of him so I'm hardly going to argue :)
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  #66  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:00 PM
bigbang bigbang is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

hey nutha ..either charlie gets complete immunity from bashing or i spill the beans on bonham and the great led zepplin!
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  #67  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:03 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

charlie does get immunity from bashing? but what beans were you going to spill?
j
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  #68  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:05 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Quote:
Originally Posted by finnhiggins
Just to put a cat among the pigeons, I once met a guy in London who used to do session work back in the late '60s, and his take on Bonham was that he got the credit for a movement that he wasn't entirely the innovator of - that there were a bunch of guys around London at the time working to bring the solidity and huge sound that Bonham had going into rock music, rather than the previous Mitch Mitchell-esque jazzy approach. Bonham was just the first of them to get really big, while the rest remained relatively unknown.
Matt replies: On "Hurdy Gurdy Man" by Donovan from 1967, John Paul Jones was on bass. Listening to that record I'd swear it was Bonham on drums, although I don't know for sure. One thing is certain that style of drumming was there on that record.
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  #69  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:13 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

A few points to ponder.

1) For me personally, Black Dog has the toughest timing to get right. One hell of a odd thing.

2) Bonzo's kit was like Buddy Rich's kit on steroids. Back in 1965, young drummers bought a kit to look and play like Buddy or Gene. Then, it was the fab-4 Ludwig kit. Zep hit, and the kit to have was that big-kick Bonzo kit. In the here and now, virtually all companies make a configuration to emulate this. Bonzo made vista-lite and green sparkle cool.

3)In an era of single-head toms, cardboard-box sounds, Bonzo lowered the boom. It was his time to move techtonic plates with that cavernous 26" kick drum, and his tom-punishing style. It was a far cry from the tippy-tap 4/4 rock and roll style of the 60's that so many Brit-invasion bands had, and American wannabe's did to. Imagine Zep with a drummer like Densmore from the doors, or the cat from Dave Clark 5. Ok, nevermind...I can't handle that image right now...

"Make me sound like John Bonham" Don Henley Eagles, 1976
"But you don't play like John Bonham" sound tech
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  #70  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

I just did a little research on "Hurdy Gurdy Man" and found this on a song facts page. The drummer was a guy named Clem Catinni and John Paul Jones is quoted as saying he recorded "Hurdy Gurdy Man" 2 years before he even met John Bonham. I guess that answers my question. Still the track is worth listening to, the drums are great.
Here's the site I found:
http://www.songfacts.com/detail.lasso?id=1097

Clem Catinni played drums on "Telstar" by The Tornados produced by Joe Meek. Many people say it is the first British Invasion record of the rock n roll era.

Matt

Last edited by onemat; 08-11-2005 at 09:28 PM. Reason: Spelling
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  #71  
Old 08-12-2005, 02:44 PM
bigbang bigbang is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

heh heh just kidding man just wanted to make sure that a pioneer like charlie gets the respect he deserves...
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  #72  
Old 08-13-2005, 02:32 AM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Bonhams amazing deffinatley one of my favorite drummers. I found this thing one time of him playing and there just short little tracks, i didn't c it posted before so here ya go.

http://www.saladrecords.com/bonhamfiles.htm

Check it out its awesome.
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  #73  
Old 08-14-2005, 06:10 AM
Thunder Of Drums Thunder Of Drums is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Didnt make me start drumming, but he keeps me drumming. my biggest influence and favorite drummer of all time, John Henry Bonham (which is why i talk about him so much)
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  #74  
Old 08-15-2005, 12:03 AM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

"No Quarter" has some great ghost-note work. It has a very odd-time feel to it and switches into a funky ass sixteenth-note pattern for the outro. I practice to this track constantly.

BTW, Tool's cover is equally stunning. I love the fact that Danny decided not to just ape the beat.
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  #75  
Old 08-20-2005, 08:04 PM
bigbang bigbang is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

sorry guys but i've held back long enough : don't get me wrong i love jb as much as the next person but the truth must come out 1) led zepplin was totally hated by the critics thru most of their career and the record buying community(remember i'm 43 years old so i have some memory left that the scotch wiskey did'nt kill)2) the most popular bands at the time where deep purple ,alice cooper ,black sabbath, sweet , the osmonds (ahhhh) , jackson 5 , grand funk ,sly stone, etc... remember i'm not putting them down.3) it really was'nt till the advent of f.m. radio and the classic rock format that things started happening for them (by this time jb had passed. sidenote : kiss was the most popular band in the world by then.Carmine appiece(i think i spelled his name wrong)was considered the far better drummer at the time.led zepplin was considered underground hippie music then and only appreciated by the sub culture.And we all know the story of jimmy page being the biggest thief of american black music. sorry to piss anybody off but that's the way it was in the 70's.....wayne
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  #76  
Old 08-20-2005, 08:44 PM
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbang
sorry guys but i've held back long enough : don't get me wrong i love jb as much as the next person but the truth must come out 1) led zepplin was totally hated by the critics thru most of their career and the record buying community(remember i'm 43 years old so i have some memory left that the scotch wiskey did'nt kill)2) the most popular bands at the time where deep purple ,alice cooper ,black sabbath, sweet , the osmonds (ahhhh) , jackson 5 , grand funk ,sly stone, etc... remember i'm not putting them down.3) it really was'nt till the advent of f.m. radio and the classic rock format that things started happening for them (by this time jb had passed. sidenote : kiss was the most popular band in the world by then.Carmine appiece(i think i spelled his name wrong)was considered the far better drummer at the time.led zepplin was considered underground hippie music then and only appreciated by the sub culture.And we all know the story of jimmy page being the biggest thief of american black music. sorry to piss anybody off but that's the way it was in the 70's.....wayne
I think you did kill some brain cells.
Led zeppelin outsold the Beatles for a number of years. How in the hell were they hated by the record buying public with huge record sales and world-record setting arena attendence???

And most critics are talentless hacks with an axe to grind and poor taste. If we went by thier opinions, all rock bands suck.

Last edited by Thinshells; 08-20-2005 at 09:11 PM.
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  #77  
Old 08-20-2005, 08:51 PM
Kevlar Kevlar is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbang
sorry guys but i've held back long enough : don't get me wrong i love jb as much as the next person but the truth must come out 1) led zepplin was totally hated by the critics thru most of their career and the record buying community(remember i'm 43 years old so i have some memory left that the scotch wiskey did'nt kill)2) the most popular bands at the time where deep purple ,alice cooper ,black sabbath, sweet , the osmonds (ahhhh) , jackson 5 , grand funk ,sly stone, etc... remember i'm not putting them down.3) it really was'nt till the advent of f.m. radio and the classic rock format that things started happening for them (by this time jb had passed. sidenote : kiss was the most popular band in the world by then.Carmine appiece(i think i spelled his name wrong)was considered the far better drummer at the time.led zepplin was considered underground hippie music then and only appreciated by the sub culture.And we all know the story of jimmy page being the biggest thief of american black music. sorry to piss anybody off but that's the way it was in the 70's.....wayne
True or not, I don't know, but it all does nothing to affect my love for the band's music and Bonham's skills.
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  #78  
Old 08-20-2005, 10:52 PM
bigbang bigbang is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

lol yes i don't have many brain cells left in fact i could probably count them on one hand .but the facts are facts, i still love zepplin to so i won't bring up the fact jb was a raging alcoholic......ooops
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  #79  
Old 08-21-2005, 03:51 AM
MunsieMan MunsieMan is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbang
lol yes i don't have many brain cells left in fact i could probably count them on one hand .but the facts are facts, i still love zepplin to so i won't bring up the fact jb was a raging alcoholic......ooops
lmao ya he was an alcoholic which resulted in his death but i was thinking all preformances Bonzo did he did drunk and after moby dick hed gulp down a pint of beer and a few shots of Vodka before playing the next song if bonham can play the drums that well and get that sound drunk imanige him playing sober it would be either terribly bad or amazing


Quote:
Originally Posted by Thinshells
Bonzo's kit was like Buddy Rich's kit on steroids.
lmao thats a good one
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  #80  
Old 08-21-2005, 04:42 AM
bigbang bigbang is offline
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Default Re: John Bonham (Bonzo)

it's truely sad that he was taken away so early,the actual cause of death was an overdose of anti-buse (which is to combat alcohol) and drinking while on them, A very lethal combination.I'd like to think that his playing would be much better(if that's possible) while stone sober.He was a great pioneer and a HUGE influence on many drummers.
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