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  #41  
Old 08-06-2006, 03:29 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD
How sturdy is this head? Is it a regular speaker cone? If I bump something up against my current head it wont break it, but if this is a regular speaker cone, by its deisgn of moving air it must be quite fragile!!!!
actually... the Thunderhead is quite sturdy.. it is made from a paper/kevlar so just bumbing a mic or foot into it wont hurt it at all... in fact we are designing it to be very sturdy and weather proof...
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  #42  
Old 08-07-2006, 09:09 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

How much louder is this than a traditional setup?? Would it possibly be too overpowering? I like the balance and proportion of a traditional kit, overmicking the bass or having some system that makes my kit all bass sound wouldn't appeal to me. Have to hear the sound files i guess
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  #43  
Old 08-07-2006, 09:26 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

From what I can gather, and please correct me if I'm wrong...

It won't necessarily make your bass drum that much louder, it will mainly enhance the real low frequencies that maybe don't get heard that much, the simplest way of putting this would be like adding a subwoofer to a speaker setup, if you have ever tapped a sub speaker cone and heard the tone that eminates from it you will know what I mean, it's not a sound you get from tapping a bass drum head, tuned or untuned... awaits correction...
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  #44  
Old 08-08-2006, 03:24 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay.B.
From what I can gather, and please correct me if I'm wrong...

It won't necessarily make your bass drum that much louder, it will mainly enhance the real low frequencies that maybe don't get heard that much, the simplest way of putting this would be like adding a subwoofer to a speaker setup, if you have ever tapped a sub speaker cone and heard the tone that eminates from it you will know what I mean, it's not a sound you get from tapping a bass drum head, tuned or untuned... awaits correction...
Right on Jay... I think somebody may get a job...
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  #45  
Old 08-08-2006, 03:46 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

i understand completly what the sound is going to sound like etc.. my only confusion is that the thunderhead.. is a speaker cone correct.. with out the magnet and acutal amplifiing device right ? b/c i thought you meant that you could just plug it in and it will be self amplified i.e. its already a functioning speaker.. that is where i was confused... b/c i remember at one point you said it is just the cone and that would make sense, but then i got the impression of something else... so what is the speaker adaptor thing you were talking about that would allow for micing. ?
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  #46  
Old 08-08-2006, 04:24 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

As far as I see it's the membrane and cone, powered by the normal column of air in the bass drum. But a powered one would be sweet.
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  #47  
Old 08-08-2006, 08:26 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by beatsMcGee
i understand completly what the sound is going to sound like etc.. my only confusion is that the thunderhead.. is a speaker cone correct.. with out the magnet and acutal amplifiing device right ? b/c i thought you meant that you could just plug it in and it will be self amplified i.e. its already a functioning speaker.. that is where i was confused... b/c i remember at one point you said it is just the cone and that would make sense, but then i got the impression of something else... so what is the speaker adaptor thing you were talking about that would allow for micing. ?
The adaptor ring allows you to mount the speaker to the drum... you mic the Thunderhead like you were micing a speaker or guitar amp...

However we are constantly working to make this into one piece so it would eventually be the weight and structure of a reagular bass drum head but with the membrane made of a speaker cone...
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  #48  
Old 08-09-2006, 08:58 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

That's a pretty interesting and cool invention....wish i thought about it!
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  #49  
Old 08-11-2006, 09:08 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Keep your Eyes peeled... we are getting close...
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  #50  
Old 08-16-2006, 01:06 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay.B.
From what I can gather, and please correct me if I'm wrong...

It won't necessarily make your bass drum that much louder, it will mainly enhance the real low frequencies that maybe don't get heard that much, the simplest way of putting this would be like adding a subwoofer to a speaker setup, if you have ever tapped a sub speaker cone and heard the tone that eminates from it you will know what I mean, it's not a sound you get from tapping a bass drum head, tuned or untuned... awaits correction...
Sounds like what a bass drum woofer might do (those skinner bass drums that go out in front of the main bass drums).

www.terrasonus.com
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  #51  
Old 08-18-2006, 09:42 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

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Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga
Sounds like what a bass drum woofer might do (those skinner bass drums that go out in front of the main bass drums).

www.terrasonus.com
except you dont need to lug around another bass drum
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  #52  
Old 08-21-2006, 11:48 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

apsolutly..like a passive radiator..however, it also acts as a drumhead... we have talked about making it powered, but one thing at a time...

I messed with a similar idea a few years back. 15" speaker mounted into the front of an 18" drum, powered by an amp. I tried it without a baffle first (amp off) and got the effect you have going. It had an ear catching low freq thump, but thump wasn't loud enough to cut through music/band sounds at any volume other than real quite. My cone was quite heavy though. The other drag about this system is, your stuck at the cones frequency, its not tunable. Hopefully you can make yours acoustically loud enough that drummers will want to buy it. I would think that a flatter cone would produce more volume, as the air hitting the cone 'head on' gets 'pierced' by the pointed edge of the cone. The cone shape is cool looking, but too areodynamic for max volume potential. Maybe a flat panel attached to the cone tip to catch more air off the batter head, that way you could keep the cool looking cone shape.

The problem I ran ito with the amplification of it all was, even with a baffle, acceptable gain wasn't possible before feedback. I came to the conclusion (before exhausting some other possibilities, different amp, diff speaker etc.) that the system would operate best with a trigger and sound module. With the trigger (a whole nother prob) no feedback. With the sound generator, limitless bass drum sounds! The ultimate for a cover band, hit a button, have a bonham kit, hit it again an 808 sound. An instant 'must have' item.
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  #53  
Old 08-21-2006, 09:13 PM
ZDrums24 ZDrums24 is offline
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

is there room for a reso head infront of the thunderhead?

no offense, but as cool as it looks, i would like to be able to put an evan retro screen infront of it on days id rather have a solid black look.
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  #54  
Old 08-22-2006, 12:52 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDrums24
is there room for a reso head infront of the thunderhead?

no offense, but as cool as it looks, i would like to be able to put an evan retro screen infront of it on days id rather have a solid black look.
we tried to put a retro screen head on and you just cant get it tight enough.. however, we are working on a speaker grill ( made of mesh or metal or whatever) that would cover the speaker to give you that solid color look..or some kind of graphic. just think of the possibilities
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  #55  
Old 09-18-2006, 03:23 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

ahhh .nice and easy to find..
also TorZel LLC(the company putting the TH ) is up and going. not long now before we have some product..
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  #56  
Old 09-25-2006, 11:59 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Cool. Keep us posted. I have an 18-inch bass drum and would be interested in one. Do you have a model to fit an 18 inch drum?
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  #57  
Old 09-26-2006, 01:39 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Hey RT, hows the dev going? are we any closer to getting our hands on one to test it out ;-)
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  #58  
Old 10-03-2006, 06:08 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

here is an update... We are working (talking, pushing ideas around) with Peavey Electronics... I am very excited.. We are redeveloping the head to be one structure... basicly it will be a regular drum head formed like a speaker but made out of speaker material..

It is a long hard road but to do it right takes time... hopefully we will have something out by early spring 07....also we are working on the web site... look for www.torzel.com soon..
ciao
RT
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  #59  
Old 10-04-2006, 12:30 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RTDRUMS
here is an update... We are working (talking, pushing ideas around) with Peavey Electronics... I am very excited.. We are redeveloping the head to be one structure... basicly it will be a regular drum head formed like a speaker but made out of speaker material..

It is a long hard road but to do it right takes time... hopefully we will have something out by early spring 07....also we are working on the web site... look for www.torzel.com soon..
ciao
RT
Great, your teamed up with Pee Pee, I mean Peavey. Bad choice IMO. Peavey is synonyms with some 'out there' ideas which panned out to be losers for them.

The problem with your 'idea' like I mentioned in my experiment above is the cone is not 'tunable' and its not loud enough for live situations. Sure ... mic it, but you can just as easily mic 'any' front head and dial in a great sound. Not many drummer have trouble getting a good sound with a mic on the front of their kick. The note/tone your cone is 'stuck at' will not be the best sound for all applications, you'll be selling a 'one trick pony' when it comes to sound, were not looking for that. I agree with you, the sound of a speaker cone (and mine had a magnet on it) on the front of your kick sounds cool, for about 10 minutes Wow, a bass drum with only one sound, who would buy that???? Head graphics co's already have pictures of speaker cones that we can get on the front of your bass head if we want the look of a speaker.

Honestly, and don't think Im trying to shoot you down here but, the best thing you could do is develop a powered system. The people are already asking for it. Its the step that makes the most sense. Take your cone and turn it back into a speaker, amplify it, trigger the batter head, get a bitchin sound module, integrate it all into a real bass drum and have Peavey build a set around it. The ultimate would be to sell unfinished, undrilled, powered kicks. A volume knob on the top of you bass drum, right next to it a knob that changes the sound of your bass drum from a Johnny Bonzo 26" to a be bop 18" to a classic 22". Who wouldn't buy this?????
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  #60  
Old 10-05-2006, 04:12 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore
Great, your teamed up with Pee Pee, I mean Peavey. Bad choice IMO. Peavey is synonyms with some 'out there' ideas which panned out to be losers for them.

The problem with your 'idea' like I mentioned in my experiment above is the cone is not 'tunable' and its not loud enough for live situations. Sure ... mic it, but you can just as easily mic 'any' front head and dial in a great sound. Not many drummer have trouble getting a good sound with a mic on the front of their kick. The note/tone your cone is 'stuck at' will not be the best sound for all applications, you'll be selling a 'one trick pony' when it comes to sound, were not looking for that. I agree with you, the sound of a speaker cone (and mine had a magnet on it) on the front of your kick sounds cool, for about 10 minutes Wow, a bass drum with only one sound, who would buy that???? Head graphics co's already have pictures of speaker cones that we can get on the front of your bass head if we want the look of a speaker.

Honestly, and don't think Im trying to shoot you down here but, the best thing you could do is develop a powered system. The people are already asking for it. Its the step that makes the most sense. Take your cone and turn it back into a speaker, amplify it, trigger the batter head, get a bitchin sound module, integrate it all into a real bass drum and have Peavey build a set around it. The ultimate would be to sell unfinished, undrilled, powered kicks. A volume knob on the top of you bass drum, right next to it a knob that changes the sound of your bass drum from a Johnny Bonzo 26" to a be bop 18" to a classic 22". Who wouldn't buy this?????
Holy Cow I wish I could type fast...
The Thing about the head not being tunable is we are designing it to be tuned to the "sweet" spot hertz-wise.. so it makes it easy to get a great bass drum sound with out messing around and it is 100 x better then a regular solid front head with no hole miced.
We though about the Powered thing but for right now its one thing at a time... and I think someone already has a patent for that..
Finally the deal with Peavey or pee pee is not final... and with proper marketing I am not worried about this not selling..
lets take a poll... who would use a Thunderhead!

and when you say "who would want a bass drum with only one sound"?
a. If its a killer sound, who would'nt
b. who changes the sound of thier kick drum every night? oh yeah! the sound guy because he cant get a good kick drum sound with all that muffling.
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  #61  
Old 10-07-2006, 07:00 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Hell yeah! I'd buy one. It looks amazingly cool. Once I've found a bass drum sound I like, I stick with it for years.

I have called a repair shop and they get rid of old speakers cones every day. They are saving an 18 inch for me for my bass drum. I can't wait to get one of yours, sorry.

Still, the powered idea is great. There's probably a market for both of them!

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  #62  
Old 10-07-2006, 07:12 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Different woods, number of ply, drum depth all will give you a different sweet spot. You are trying to make all kicks sound the same. That sir, is un American. Your a drum terrorist, aren't you?????
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  #63  
Old 10-08-2006, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmrakich
Different woods, number of ply, drum depth all will give you a different sweet spot. You are trying to make all kicks sound the same. That sir, is un American. Your a drum terrorist, aren't you?????
drum terrorist??????????
more like drum ambassador... I am a good guy...

I assure you it will not make every drum sound the same... just awesome.
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  #64  
Old 10-08-2006, 07:29 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Basically, you are using a drone (passive radiator) to resonate along with the frequencies the batter head/shell give off. The drone cone will reinforce a certain range (like say 40hz) depending on how it's tuned and made up.

Eminence are very efficient drivers. There is a company called VMPS audio that makes cones of carbon fiber, and they are tuned via mass on the center of the cone. This concept could easily be adapted to what you are after.
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  #65  
Old 10-09-2006, 07:57 AM
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Cones, drones, stuck at certain tones ... DANGER Will Robinson! DANGER! Every room is different and the unruly shall prove to be the 'Achilles Heel' of your contraption.

The drum needs to be tuned to the sweet spot of the room. You can't expect to introduce a 'sweet spot' into a non-compliant structure, diabetic frequencies will result and in certain situations 'Thunder Head' will be forced into low blood sugar output mode, thereby earning the new moniker ... 'Blunder Head.'

So you may sell your 200,000 though I doubt it. The drumming community isn't quick to swallow radical new ideas they can't understand. They 'get' rings built in drum head, but a cone that can only be tuned by the creator? Not happening. People want to be in control. Once Johnny tells Jimmy it sucks unless its mic'd in loud situations, your fried.

I would say "NO' to Blunder Head. Also, IMO Peavey doesn't have the track record you need to jump start this thing.
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  #66  
Old 10-09-2006, 04:33 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore
Cones, drones, stuck at certain tones ... DANGER Will Robinson! DANGER! Every room is different and the unruly shall prove to be the 'Achilles Heel' of your contraption.

The drum needs to be tuned to the sweet spot of the room. You can't expect to introduce a 'sweet spot' into a non-compliant structure, diabetic frequencies will result and in certain situations 'Thunder Head' will be forced into low blood sugar output mode, thereby earning the new moniker ... 'Blunder Head.'
Yep, it's like setting a sound system EQ to match a 100x50 wood room, then moving to a 20x30 concrete room. oops! Different nodes, different acoustics....
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  #67  
Old 10-10-2006, 12:22 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore
Cones, drones, stuck at certain tones ... DANGER Will Robinson! DANGER! Every room is different and the unruly shall prove to be the 'Achilles Heel' of your contraption.

The drum needs to be tuned to the sweet spot of the room. You can't expect to introduce a 'sweet spot' into a non-compliant structure, diabetic frequencies will result and in certain situations 'Thunder Head' will be forced into low blood sugar output mode, thereby earning the new moniker ... 'Blunder Head.'

So you may sell your 200,000 though I doubt it. The drumming community isn't quick to swallow radical new ideas they can't understand. They 'get' rings built in drum head, but a cone that can only be tuned by the creator? Not happening. People want to be in control. Once Johnny tells Jimmy it sucks unless its mic'd in loud situations, your fried.

I would say "NO' to Blunder Head. Also, IMO Peavey doesn't have the track record you need to jump start this thing.
I have never, ever "tuned" my bass drum, toms, snare, congas, ashikos, tablas or cowbells to the sound of a room. How is one supposed to do such a thing in a coffeeshop or street corner, anyway? Break out the sound measurement mics? I've never heard of such fussiness and I've never had a sound man ask me to make any such tuning changes - that's their job. Once I get the sound out of a drum I want, I go with it.

I'm getting an old 18 inch cone just for the hell of it, to see what it sounds like on my bass drum, because I'm in a constant never-ending state of trying stuf out. I already know it will add just what I want in terms of stage presence.

I hope this fellow does really well with the Thunderhead!

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  #68  
Old 10-10-2006, 09:21 AM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmrakich
Different woods, number of ply, drum depth all will give you a different sweet spot. You are trying to make all kicks sound the same. That sir, is un American. Your a drum terrorist, aren't you?????
Actually it will do exactly that. You can set up 10 different 22x16 kicks with thunderhead's and they'll all sound the same. What will our world become?
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  #69  
Old 10-10-2006, 04:04 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore
You can set up 10 different 22x16 kicks with thunderhead's and they'll all sound the same.
even with varying woods, shells, and plies?
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  #70  
Old 10-10-2006, 04:14 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Ismore
Actually it will do exactly that. You can set up 10 different 22x16 kicks with thunderhead's and they'll all sound the same. What will our world become?
Actually, we set up multipule drums with Thunderheads and they all sounded different.. we are making different size heads 15" and 18" hopefully 20".. and with different drums,batter heads,muffling,ect.. you get a different sound...

Anyway, do you think I am a 15 year old moron? I am a drum fanatic and I wouldnt put something out if it wasnt good... so if you dont like it you dont have to buy one...
Finally insted of telling me how bad it is and how terrible it will make your drums sound why dont you say something positive. I thought we were here to help eacgh other.
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  #71  
Old 10-10-2006, 06:43 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RTDRUMS
Anyway, do you think I am a 15 year old moron? I am a drum fanatic and I wouldnt put something out if it wasnt good... so if you dont like it you dont have to buy one...
Finally insted of telling me how bad it is and how terrible it will make your drums sound why dont you say something positive. I thought we were here to help eacgh other.
Success is the best revenge. This is new and untested and for many people, that's a bad thing. But right now, there aren't many people who have played your bass drum thingamabob.

It may be good and it may be bad. I'm willing to have an open mind until I hear it from more people. But the idea is extremely cool and I want to build my own just to see.

www.terrasonus.com
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  #72  
Old 10-10-2006, 09:38 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

How will Thunder head react to moisture? What if you live in the jungle, is it mold resistant? Is it prone to cracking when frozen? Will extreme temperature changes effect thunderhead? What if beer gets spilled on it, how do you clean Thunderhead? What will be the warranty on thunderhead and what will be covered under the warranty? Repair kit in the works?
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  #73  
Old 10-10-2006, 09:44 PM
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Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RTDRUMS
Actually, we set up multipule drums with Thunderheads and they all sounded different.. we are making different size heads 15" and 18" hopefully 20".. and with different drums,batter heads,muffling,ect.. you get a different sound...

Anyway, do you think I am a 15 year old moron? I am a drum fanatic and I wouldnt put something out if it wasnt good... so if you dont like it you dont have to buy one...
Finally insted of telling me how bad it is and how terrible it will make your drums sound why dont you say something positive. I thought we were here to help eacgh other.
If you really believe in your product, carry on mate. We don't think your a 15 yr old moron, why would you assume something like that? We are here to help each other and that help comes in many shades. Think of our viewpoints as thoughts people have about your product (kinda like the evening news, bad stuff, but heed the warnings behind the stories, its a different kind of information).

Our thoughts are valid even though they may not be what you want to hear, they're still real and there is some truth behind what we say because WE (may) believe it ourselves. Your after our money, use our opinions for your gain, filter what will work for you and ignore the rest. Prior post: I agree with you, the sound of a speaker cone (and mine had a magnet on it) on the front of your kick sounds cool,

Use perceived negativity to sharpen the blade of your positivity. Here's some more... I still say Peavey would be a poor choice as a partner. Think about labeling one of your offerings with the word 'Studio' in one form or another, example. 'Studio QX' The studio market looks like it could be fat for the thunderhead. Also colored versions would be cool, or a paintable one. As an accessory, a (thin tough) cap or hard cover would sell to the 'have to have it all'rs'. Everyone knows what its like having an exposed speaker cone at floor level, cap would provide security and piece of mind.

....you should be welcoming our comments, companies pay money for what were doing here, we're your target market, listen and be thankfull.
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  #74  
Old 02-25-2007, 11:04 AM
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Afrolicious Afrolicious is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Frankfurt a. M. / Germany
Posts: 315
Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

So how's it goin with the thunderhead? Any chance we'll be able to see and hear one over here in Germany?
I just found an interesting thing, quite the opposite of what you're doing. Subtoms!
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  #75  
Old 03-17-2008, 10:15 PM
dea dea is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Everett
Posts: 351
Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

You may have already solved this problem, but I would suspect a simple passive filter circuit ( LRC configuration ) could be useful to filter out the higher frequency noise caused by shell vibration. The parts are easily acquired and the circuits are trivial to build.
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  #76  
Old 03-18-2008, 04:17 PM
DingerJunkie DingerJunkie is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 81
Default Re: THUNDERHEAD is finally here!!!!

Hey there...hope all is going well with R&D.

I know there has been a good amount of reply regarding making this a powered system, and I can see why this would not be worth pursuing for a first step...in fact, I can see where it misses the point of the original design.

There is one question/request related that I'm curious about though. Would it be possible to put in a light-duty voice coil with a low-gauss magnet, wired to an XLR port on the cone's mounting frame? I'd love to turn my bass drum into it's own, pre-wired subkick.

This would potentially do away with the need for any additional micing, internal or external, depenant upont cone response to play.

Has this been played with during the design process?
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