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  #41  
Old 04-21-2017, 07:34 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

I think it's great that you're out there gigging Yolanda Larry.
I would do the same, but not in all the places I play - only a select few.
I'm almost afraid to ask - please...tell me you have bags or cases for them ?
I know you played your DW's with nothing for years...but Gurus ...with no cases...the mere thought of it makes me uneasy.
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  #42  
Old 04-21-2017, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by evilg99 View Post
I think it's great that you're out there gigging Yolanda Larry.
I would do the same, but not in all the places I play - only a select few.
I'm almost afraid to ask - please...tell me you have bags or cases for them ?
I know you played your DW's with nothing for years...but Gurus ...with no cases...the mere thought of it makes me uneasy.
Yea, no cases Neal. I do wrap them in packing blankets though where they sit. And they are bungeed in. I can't stand drum cases, I find them unnecessary. Slows me down, more work. Looking at my DW's now...you would never know. And the dark DW lacquered finish over light colored maple is a lot less forgiving than unpainted solid wood where the color is all the way through. I didn't wrap the DW's in blankets either, I didn't think to do that. They were protected well enough. Gear serves me not the other way around. I've had drums in my van since 2009, with zero problems. There's no reason for me to think that anything would change just because I paid more for these drums. The DW's weren't much less than the Gurus, they were 6400 for a bass, 2 floors, 2 racks, no snare, full hardshell cases. If you removed the snare from Yolanda, it would have been like 7000 with some cases not all because I asked for them to be nested. So not a huge jump in price over exotic DWs.
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  #43  
Old 04-21-2017, 08:27 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

Chronic craigslist guy but yes I've pretty much painted/traded myself into a corner, I now have a decent sized pile of great things that I want to keep.

Trial and error, yes it should have a point right....

So for me at this stage it's about opportunities.....like for instance got a very sweet-sounding 60's avedis zildjian riveted ride the other day, whopping price of $50. No way I'm gonna pass gas on that....who could??

If I get another kit it would be for my son. Now my money goes towards lessons and my time goes towards playing with others
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  #44  
Old 04-21-2017, 10:59 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
I definitely subscribe to the notion that gear that ticks all the boxes has a positive impact on what I play.

Like my 12" tom on my walnut kit sounds so full and rich, that I now use it in places that I wouldn't before....It's because the solid shell walnut sound is so much better than my ply maple PDP's...to the point where the tom sound definitely adds to what I do. It's just so damn pleasing when the drum sound is KILLER! Which affects my mood for the better of course. Which comes out in my playing. I'm smiling more too. It feels so right.

Making the decision to gig Yolanda is the big reason I have no GAS anymore. When you have a world class set of drums at home....but you gig kinda cheap PDP's....there's a disconnect, which I finally realized doesn't sit right with me. I feel completely at home now at gigs. I mean I did before, but it was like living in an efficiency apartment. Now it's like I'm in a big 5 bedroom house, with a pool and lots of land...I can stretch out. It made that big of a difference. Now that I am way beyond being COMPLETELY satisfied with my gig kit....closer to ecstatic...I know now that the right thing to do is to use Yolanda....not allow her to atrophy in my basement. It's just wrong to buy a set like that and keep it locked away. It really is. It's almost a waste of money. I don't need a great kit to practice on. I do however need/want a great kit to gig on. Best decision I made recently, to use Yolanda. The payoff in personal satisfaction really can't be quantified.

Great sounding drums that have round, pure, perfectly tuned, unmuffled notes that sing out with nice sustain...affect what I play. The tone of the toms are just as vital as the notes I choose. When I do tom work, I rely on sustain and a note. That's what I'm hearing in my head. I love it, I want it, lots of it, and need it. If I play a kit with no sustain, like the typical done to death dead splat...my tom ideas...don't work at all IMO. So I use the toms as little as possible on a kit that sounds like that.

Now the PDP aren't bad drums. It's just that they cannot compare to a solid shell walnut drum, period. Different class, totally. It's like comparing an Impala to a Countach.

Amazing sounding gear (not necessarily high dollar gear) is the finishing touch that really puts it over the top for me. It's the sheen on top, and the creamy center.
Too bad they look like a Butcher's Block.
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  #45  
Old 04-22-2017, 03:16 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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Yea, no cases Neal. I do wrap them in packing blankets though where they sit. And they are bungeed in. I can't stand drum cases, I find them unnecessary. Slows me down, more work. Looking at my DW's now...you would never know. And the dark DW lacquered finish over light colored maple is a lot less forgiving than unpainted solid wood where the color is all the way through. I didn't wrap the DW's in blankets either, I didn't think to do that. They were protected well enough. Gear serves me not the other way around. I've had drums in my van since 2009, with zero problems. There's no reason for me to think that anything would change just because I paid more for these drums. The DW's weren't much less than the Gurus, they were 6400 for a bass, 2 floors, 2 racks, no snare, full hardshell cases. If you removed the snare from Yolanda, it would have been like 7000 with some cases not all because I asked for them to be nested. So not a huge jump in price over exotic DWs.
Wow, well I respect that.
My direct experience(s) with not using cases does not allow me to do this.

And not just drums, I have cases and bags for everything. PA gear, recording gear, guitar stuff, etc etc. When I don't use bags, my stuff not only gets banged up (finish), but also broken.

But I don't mind using bags and cases, at all. In fact , I like it.
Anyway, sorry for the thread derail - I don't think I'm anywhere near out of GAS yet. Maybe someday.
You've been playing guitar lately, huh? If you want to maintain your empty GAS syndrome, do NOT visit the Strymon pedals website. :p
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  #46  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:49 AM
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Yea, no cases Neal. I do wrap them in packing blankets though where they sit. And they are bungeed in. I can't stand drum cases, I find them unnecessary. Slows me down, more work. Looking at my DW's now...you would never know. And the dark DW lacquered finish over light colored maple is a lot less forgiving than unpainted solid wood where the color is all the way through. I didn't wrap the DW's in blankets either, I didn't think to do that. They were protected well enough. Gear serves me not the other way around. I've had drums in my van since 2009, with zero problems. There's no reason for me to think that anything would change just because I paid more for these drums. The DW's weren't much less than the Gurus, they were 6400 for a bass, 2 floors, 2 racks, no snare, full hardshell cases. If you removed the snare from Yolanda, it would have been like 7000 with some cases not all because I asked for them to be nested. So not a huge jump in price over exotic DWs.
This is a total side note and unrelated to this thread, but now that I have an actual automobile to move my stuff around in (a Ford Flex), as opposed to an open-bed truck, I've not used cases either. Life was very different when the drums are in the open air, and people helped me move stuff. Nowadays if it's only me, no cases in the car is perfect. And although my stuff isn't super exotic, it's still expensive.
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  #47  
Old 04-22-2017, 09:27 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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Maye you should better phrase it: I THINK I play better on a Kerope. If you actually do play better on a Kerope, that should be decided by e.g. an impartial teacher.
Maybe, maybe not. I bet there is someone out there who will play better with some 402 hats. And someone out there, who will play well on both hats.

You know what? I do like my HHX Evolution Hihats. But I also love my "cheaper" Masterwork Custom hats. Do I play better with the one or the other? Nope. I play identically on both hig-end Hihats. But the sound is different.
The presumptuous notion that i need an Impartial Teacher is Laughable. The Keropes are on the stand and 402's left long ago. Your experience isn't mine. I still maintain that if you sound better you play better. Get a sound tech to mic you up then put only kick through the fold back and see how good you hang in there with the rest of the band. hmm! not sounding too good hey? Keep bash'n those PDP's boys..
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  #48  
Old 04-22-2017, 09:48 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

And while i'm on the soap box, throw out all your old socks. Wear clean underwear to well paying gigs. And Guitarists should wear Cool Boots , not Sneakers.
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  #49  
Old 04-22-2017, 01:27 PM
Wave Deckel Wave Deckel is offline
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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The presumptuous notion that i need an Impartial Teacher is Laughable.
No, it is not. ;-) This does not only apply to you but to anyone. Our self-perception is usually quite different from what others perceive. If I think "Wow, that fill was great", some listener will probably come to the conclusion that the fill was not really clean, did not fit the song, whatever.

Of course, certain gear can result in us feeling better, more comfy. Maybe even more confident (and the opposite is just as possible. A newbie sitting in front of Simon Phillips drumset will probably be intimidated). But that does not make us technically better in any way. You are as good with your technique as you are. But some gear will inspire you to play differently. Your drumming will sound different then - not particularly better.

Feel free to disagree. :-)
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  #50  
Old 04-22-2017, 04:14 PM
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I stated earlier that gear wouldn't make me play any better. While I still hold to that statement because I'm limited by my own capabilities, I do have to agree that gear does at least inspire you to play better. When I cut the bearing edges on my PDPs, they sounded 10x better and were far more fun to play. Then I added a new snare. had no idea snares were that sensitive. The less mud factor was definitely inspiring and being able to hear ghost notes, made me feel better about my playing. Adding another snare changed things again. I absolutely love the sound of my Starphonic Bubinga, so my second favorite snare has been sitting.

Even though recutting the bearing edges on my PDPs made them sound 10x better, there's still something missing. I hear mud for the most part. They have sustain and sound full, but nothing exciting. I wasn't picking up any stick definitions either. Doubles sounded like mud. Changing the heads to single ply took them to another level entirely. I can now hear doubles, but there's still something missing. I have no complaints about the bass drum. It roars as much as I'd like it to, and my Starphonic has a warmth and depth to it, I can't imagine ever tiring of. The toms though....Maybe that's why I'm not happy stripping down my kit. I play outside edges and hear chocked drums and center creates a nice (yet something's missing) tone. I do remember my Premier toms sounding full even on the outside edges. Those were power toms and had a totally different personality, so it may have been a factor.

If I can love the sound of the rest of my kit like I do my kick and snare, I'd have no need for GAS. Haven't looked at another snare since I picked up the Starphonic....although, if I see one in the store for a good price and I just happen to be there.....Not much of a chance. No one here seems to have any good used gear for some reason.

I don't have junk in my basement and never concerned about buying the next thing. I have very few hobbies, with drums being the primary, but time is usually my enemy for practice. So it goes back to a killer set wouldn't make me sound better, but hopefully when I play my toms, I'll go from :-| to :-D. Even if I never get another gig outside of church and never take them out of the house, hearing this :-D vs. :-| would make a huge difference to me.
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  #51  
Old 04-22-2017, 04:29 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

If you still detect some mud, did you try changing hoops to triple flange? I'm gonna guess that you have a die cast hoop. If you already have TF, and a different pair of TF sounds like mud too (you have to rule out a wonky hoop) then my next stop would be the reso head, make sure that bitch is tight as a snare drum just like the saying goes. You like definition, and a Buddy Rich tuning really brings out the definition. Tight heads and tight wires. Also tighten the lug screws on the inside of the shell, heck you can shellac the insides to bring out more highs. Take the lug gaskets off and throw them in your recycle bin for real. They are tone sinks, especially soft ones. There should be nothing soft on a drum if you want all that it's capable of delivering JMO. Basic drum tune up/diagnostic stuff. I'm sorry if I'm stating the obvious here.

I have to relate a story, a few years ago I got a Carolina steambent birdseye maple snare from Jeff, with walnut re-rings, beautiful drum. I'll spare you the details but no matter what I did, I didn't like the drum. Long story short, it turned out that the die cast hoop... that was the one factor that I didn't think to change...that was the culprit. I was still in my die cast days then. I changed it to a TF on both sides and HELLO!

I wouldn't be too quick to rule out the drum.

Edit: Whoops you were referring to toms right. Oh well, some of it still applies.
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  #52  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:00 PM
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I pitched the soft gaskets a while back and put in nice hard lug sleeves. Definite improvement. The hoops are standard PDP hoops and straight. Didn't want to put on any thicker ones and risk chocking the toms. My resos are tuned higher, something like 88 on the drum dial with 74 on batters. That's after I tuned them by ear, till they sang. I usually do that with new heads. Tune till they sing, then right down what DD says, so I can tune faster the next time. It may just be what I hear from the pilots seat, but once I heard something I loved with my snares, I've been trying to love my toms, but still haven't found it. I do have to add one thing though and this is a different thread entirely, but if I strip my kit down to a 12 and 16 only and tune higher, I like them better, but the 10 and 14 don't follow.
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  #53  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:10 PM
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I pitched the soft gaskets a while back and put in nice hard lug sleeves. Definite improvement. The hoops are standard PDP hoops and straight. Didn't want to put on any thicker ones and risk chocking the toms. My resos are tuned higher, something like 88 on the drum dial with 74 on batters. That's after I tuned them by ear, till they sang. I usually do that with new heads. Tune till they sing, then right down what DD says, so I can tune faster the next time. It may just be what I hear from the pilots seat, but once I heard something I loved with my snares, I've been trying to love my toms, but still haven't found it. I do have to add one thing though and this is a different thread entirely, but if I strip my kit down to a 12 and 16 only and tune higher, I like them better, but the 10 and 14 don't follow.
If the drums have a wrap, remove the wrap.


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  #54  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:17 PM
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If the drums have a wrap, remove the wrap.


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  #55  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:53 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

There's so many variables. The room is a big one. Is this an at home set? Take it outside and try it there. Have someone else play it, just single rebounding hits, hopefully similar to the way you hit it.

I like tight resos on snares but 88 for a single ply head on a tom would tend to put some brakes on the drum IMO. A 2 ply head it's right in there though. FWIW I put 10 mil single ply resos at 83 on my toms, 10 mil single ply batters like 75. 2 ply is higher but I don't know the corresponding numbers. 75 and 83 gives me roughly an octave difference between 10 mil single ply heads.
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  #56  
Old 04-22-2017, 06:42 PM
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There's so many variables. The room is a big one. Is this an at home set? Take it outside and try it there. Have someone else play it, just single rebounding hits, hopefully similar to the way you hit it.

I like tight resos on snares but 88 for a single ply head on a tom would tend to put some brakes on the drum IMO. A 2 ply head it's right in there though. FWIW I put 10 mil single ply resos at 83 on my toms, 10 mil single ply batters like 75. 2 ply is higher but I don't know the corresponding numbers. 75 and 83 gives me roughly an octave difference between 10 mil single ply heads.
Room may be it, but kinda stuck in the corner at the moment, due to a beastly treadmill blocking the other side of the room. I was getting tons of sympathetic buzz with the lower reso, but will try it again. There's just something odd I haven't figured out yet. As mentioned above, I can drop the 10 and 14 and tune the 12 and 16 higher and theyvsound great, but tuning the 10 higher chocks it and the 14....it may be workable, but it doesn't really like the higher tuning. Maybe it's just me not liking the tone. I dropped my 8" a while back, because it won't tune low, so I had a super high tom, then a significant step down to the 10 and 12. 8, 12 and 16 seems to work better then adding the 10 in between. Shells are round. The edges are straight, just tough to get a higher tuning across all, which I would actually like more.

The 10 did open up more with a single ply, but still doesn't go higher. If I lower the reso, the snare buzz gets annoying. As you say though, it may be the room too. Would just love to get those to where I really like them, though I do like them more with the more sensitive single ply heads.
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  #57  
Old 04-22-2017, 08:52 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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No, it is not. ;-) This does not only apply to you but to anyone. Our self-perception is usually quite different from what others perceive. If I think "Wow, that fill was great", some listener will probably come to the conclusion that the fill was not really clean, did not fit the song, whatever.

Of course, certain gear can result in us feeling better, more comfy. Maybe even more confident (and the opposite is just as possible. A newbie sitting in front of Simon Phillips drumset will probably be intimidated). But that does not make us technically better in any way. You are as good with your technique as you are. But some gear will inspire you to play differently. Your drumming will sound different then - not particularly better.

Feel free to disagree. :-)
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  #58  
Old 04-22-2017, 11:18 PM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

You guys SHOULD listen to yourselves,the tapping feet and the trippers of the light fantastic out on the floor tell me everything.
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  #59  
Old 04-23-2017, 12:49 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

I was trading/buying constantly for a long time. Realized that the problem was that I kept getting another mediocre kit and ended up spending more than if I had just bought something really good.

Take a look at this video of Joe Ascione making a music stand sound great with brushes. He shoes up about half way through the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQnn7FWKO-A

I've settled on equipment that is very good quality, sounds great, and fits different needs for performance venues. I've thought about getting several different drums in one color/type, like Ludwig Classic Maples with and 18" and 20" bass drum and some different tom sizes. That would make sense, but I don't always make sense. I think I like so many different finishes, I like having a few kits. Other than the DW kit I just bought, the kits I have now I have had longer than any others and I don't feel like changing anything. At one point, I think I was changing gear so frequently that I never really got used to anything so I never settled in with what I had. That was a mistake.

Better to keep a few things a long time and become more comfortable with them.
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Old 04-23-2017, 02:50 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

I would say that having good pedals is one place where having better equipment certainly helps you play better. It sure does for me.
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Old 04-23-2017, 03:51 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

I had to laugh at some of the 4/20 comments. I think good sounding high quality gear inspires me to play better, and more often. I'm not finished chasing gear, but I think owning a large Yamaha BCAN kit for about 5 yrs. may have ended my desire for a top notch kit. While it was a great kit, it really wasn't any different than my 88 model power tour custom kit. Which was Yamaha's mid line kit then. Lately I'm wanting to buy a B52 kick mic, hardware bag, and some of my 88 model stands are showing some wear and tear. The inserted brass thread are coming out of the wing bolt holes. It seams like I'm always wanting more cyms. Right I'm wanting a 18" HH crash to complement my 16" HH and 20" HH ride. I'm also chasing a 16" Paiste full crash to complement my 18" full crash. Money is tight so I try to sell other cym. to help fund my gas. Sometimes I think about how many drummers would love to have half the cyms. I have, and are better players than I, but can't afford them. I think I should just be happy with what I have. It has taken me many yrs to collect my pies though. I bought my 18" full crash in 91 new for only $175. I think I have 15 cymbals counting 2 sets of hats as 2 cym. by some standards that's not many, but to others it's a lot. I'm also wanting to have my power toms cut down to shallower depths. So I still have quite a few things on my list. A Guru kit? Now that might be something. lol. I should win the lottery. I still want a 90's Star Classic BB kit. and and and and and and ljjj'jpojpojojpjjp0iup9uj'pju'p I should stop now.
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  #62  
Old 04-23-2017, 04:27 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

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Originally Posted by Midnite Zephyr View Post
I would say that having good pedals is one place where having better equipment certainly helps you play better. It sure does for me.
Yeah, hardware really can make a big difference. Same with hi hat stand. And then there is one piece of equipment that really makes a difference--the throne. A bad quality throne can cause back problems and other issues--even hemorrhoids.
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Old 04-23-2017, 07:09 AM
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Default Re: Ran out of GAS

I think this article has a good grasp on GAS dynamics.
It refers to recording gear, but IMO, applies to almost anything in a
market economy.
http://www.homestudiocorner.com/gear...tion-syndrome/

This article is good for severe cases of GAS:
https://petapixel.com/2015/11/25/10-...tion-syndrome/

(I had a 4/20 related pic up but pulled it. Wasn't sure how well it would go over on a forum.)
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