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  #1  
Old 04-18-2014, 06:28 AM
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Default Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Let me start this off by saying I work at a youth centre, and I deal with kids primarily between the ages of 7 to 12.
So when I arrived at the school yesterday to pick up the children, I found out that two grade 5 classes had gone on a filed trip. To the mall. To the Apple Store.

...What?

They even had shirts. They were bright yellow, with a picture of the Apple Store on the front, and "Field Trip to the Apple Store" written on it. Since they were given the shirts there, I assume this is becoming some sort of established and accepted "field trip". I asked the kids what they did at the store, and they told me they were spoken to about Apple products, and spent most of the time playing on iPods, iPads, and Macs. That's it. For 2 1/2 hours, that was their field trip.

This basically left me with an overwhelming sense of "What the actual fuck?"
Apologies for my french, but come on! You're telling me that schools are now going on trips to the Apple Store, when that time could be spent better on an actual educational field trip to, I don't know, a museum or something? That's what I did when I was their age. Hell, I help the children with their homework every day, and I'm growing more and more frustrated by the state of our (Canadian) education system and curriculum, since the kids can't even do basic stuff; they have to rely on tricks or tools that the teacher gave them, instead of using mental math/logic (although a problem, this isn't the focus of my post). As such, how the hell can they think that going to the Apple Store - thus playing into Apple's marketing - can be beneficial in any way?

The kids are gonna go home now and ask for whatever over-priced thing it was they spent an hour playing on. From a marketing standpoint, this is an absolutely brilliant idea. Get them when they're young to make lifelong customers. Maybe even throw in a few facts here and there, just to say that the field trip was "educational".
On the other hand, how the hell can schools justify this? I actually do not understand how they can pull kids out of class for the most noneducational field trip ever.

Now perhaps I'm overthinking this, and perhaps I'm a bit frustrated about it (read: angry), but for the love of god, you can't possibly tell me this is a good idea on the schools' part?

Thoughts? I'm just stunned...

For reference, I'm 21. How can things have gone so poorly in such a short time? It makes me genuinely sad to see.
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:42 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

I'm guessing this was an isolated thing... most field trips I hear about in Texas are to protest Planned Parenthood or something. /s

That is pretty crazy though. Has anybody lodged a complaint with the district?
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Apple has been doing stuff in all aspects of education for a very long time. It was always about education and technology, not marketing. I'd be surprised if that changed. I have not looked lately, but historically, all students of all ages get apple products at really steep discounts.

As for the trip, it really depends what they learned on the trip. if it was about innovation, great. If it was a marketing ploy and all they did was play games on ipads, shame on Apple.

Id be interested more about the trip.
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:50 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Apple has been doing stuff in all aspects of education for a very long time. It was always about education and technology, not marketing. I'd be surprised if that changed. I have not looked lately, but historically, all students of all ages get apple products at really steep discounts.

As for the trip, it really depends what they learned on the trip. if it was about innovation, great. If it was a marketing ploy and all they did was play games on ipads, shame on Apple.

Id be interested more about the trip.
I spoke to the kids, and they told me that they just played games pretty much the whole time.
Taken with a grain of salt, I know, but even so, I'm unimpressed to say the least.

Porter, I don't think there have been any complaints. Yet.
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Old 04-18-2014, 07:07 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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I spoke to the kids, and they told me that they just played games pretty much the whole time.
Taken with a grain of salt, I know, but even so, I'm unimpressed to say the least.

Porter, I don't think there have been any complaints. Yet.
Ask the chaperones and teachers that went to make sure. If in fact the kids just played games pretty much the whole time, you should bring this matter to Apple Corporate in Cupertino, CA and ask for some type of restitution and apology for the school. I cannot believe Apple has changed their education policy from learning technology to marketing to children.
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Old 04-18-2014, 07:22 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Ask the chaperones and teachers that went to make sure. If in fact the kids just played games pretty much the whole time, you should bring this matter to Apple Corporate in Cupertino, CA and ask for some type of restitution and apology for the school. I cannot believe Apple has changed their education policy from learning technology to marketing to children.
Sure thing. That'll be the next step.
I'll let you know the results. I for one would love to be proven wrong here.
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Old 04-18-2014, 10:22 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Well, as time wasting and stupid as it sounds, I think the trip was actually good for them. Even if they were just playing games they're also learning more about technology and how to use it. With the future constantly progressing and technology already apart of our daily lives it's a good idea to educate them about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple funded it so they'd turn into a "I buy apple and nothing but apple products" person.
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Old 04-18-2014, 02:03 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

If you Google Apple in Education you will see a lot of material on their contribution to high tech education and the future of technology in the classroom. Books are going by the way side. I just saw a Windows ad for their tablet in the school system. Not being there I can't say what the kids were doing, but you and I, a few years ago, may have called "playing with ipads" is far more than playing. I work in a hospital and almost every doctor I see in the hallways is using some sort of iPad or tablet to keep notes. The also uses COW's, computer on wheels, to track patient conditions and progress. I wouldn't be too quick to label their trip a waste of time with the world becoming smaller and technology at every turn. They were exposed to some very good products that down the road for them if not already will be just like wearing a watch.

Asking for restitution from Apple would be like asking Van Gough for reimbursement for time spent in an art gallery. You are kidding right? As for Apples learning policy what could be better than hands on. I doubt seriously if they were given any type of sales pitch. But if I'm wrong I would be very surprised. Much better than a trip to the fire station or some of the boring trips I went on as a kid. I think you are way too excited about this.
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Old 04-18-2014, 02:18 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

As usual, the story is presented one-sidedly (by the Apple staff)...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKnx2JWfNSM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj6ql27uKdI

I couldn't find another video that I watched via facebook a few weeks ago but it was about many Chinese workers getting cancer because of benzole being part of the production line. Experts calculated that to get benzole out of the production process (and thus, sparing the workers to get cancer) would result in the end price increasing by... _one_ dollar. Well, Apple decided to not change anything.

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Old 04-18-2014, 02:30 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

So now this will be another bash Apple thread. Many products are being made using the same materials and to single out Apple is just wrong. I thought it was about field trips.
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Old 04-18-2014, 02:35 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Not really. I just thought that those kids while being at that place weren't presented with some facts for even a second. They went home assuming that Apple make great products (which they make) and are a great company (well this can be viewed differently).

That's the problem with many things - there's some pros/cons to everything. It would be great if people were aware of that. Those kids weren't I guess.
The sad part is that those problems aren't easily remedied.

As I didn't want to start anything with my previous post I'll stop here.
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Old 04-18-2014, 02:49 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

I used to volunteer at a youth center myself in College. My experience was that these kids either came from poverty or were troubled kids with behavioral issues. The field trips taken were often to bowling alleys or just to parks. Anyway they were not necessarily "educational" as much as opportunities to do things in a group atmosphere with peers and responsible adults. I don't see an issue with going to an apple store to learn about technology and yes even play some games. The point of many youth centers is to simply serve as a distraction and break for whatever is going on at home.
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Old 04-18-2014, 02:58 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Exactly Southpaw. And taking kids on a trip to an Apple store and telling them that supposedly Apple refused to change their maunfacturing technique for a dollar and people are dying of cancer, would be like taking kids to a GM auto factory and telling them that for 10 years GM hid the fact that their ignitions were faulty and that 3 people have died so far because of it. All companies have oversights and problems. People die at construction sites and buildings are erected using shoddy techniques every day. That thinking is just absurd. It was a field trip for technology not a young lawyers endoctrination.

The kids got out of the normal setting for a few hours to learn a little about real life. Wow. The PC whiners strike again.
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Old 04-18-2014, 03:37 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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The kids got out of the normal setting for a few hours to learn a little about real life. Wow. The PC whiners strike again.
Geez (and at the risk of stepping on a flaming bag of dog doo), has there been vitriolic discourse about PC vs. Mac here too? Horses for courses folks!

Back in school days (60s), we toured a potato chip factory, a brewery, museums, and attended special symphony programs. I've also been a tour guide of our facility over the years for school kids. There are some elements of outreach / marketing that went on with all of these. Corporations / organizations like to be good "citizens". Also seeds can be planted in young minds: "Hey, this is something I might want to do some day" and careers follow.
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:32 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Ask the chaperones and teachers that went to make sure. If in fact the kids just played games pretty much the whole time, you should bring this matter to Apple Corporate in Cupertino, CA and ask for some type of restitution and apology for the school. I cannot believe Apple has changed their education policy from learning technology to marketing to children.
There's nothing to learn from apple products for children in a retail store. This is no different from how apple gives away macs to schools primarily to make sure that kids get used to a locked into their BS overpriced PC hardware and locked down environments designed specifically to keep money rolling into the apple accounts and control their users as much as possible.

This is disgusting. Not to mention, if I go to buy a computer, dealing with 30 rug rats roaming around the store and I'm sure being quiet and reserved would really not be on my wish list.

Next up, Apple will have a cartoon camel mascot with white ear-buds in all the time.
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:38 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Many products are being made using the same materials and to single out Apple is just wrong.
Right, most of them just don't cost as much as apple products do, adding just a bit more sting to the lowly conditions and pay for the people making those products for apple.

Hey! Maybe apple should foot the bill for the kids to go to china and see the actual production process! They'd learn a hell of a lot more from that than playing angry birds! Of course, since we know the motivation here is brainwashing children with branding, I don't think a trip to the factory would work in their favor.
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Old 04-18-2014, 06:43 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Well, as time wasting and stupid as it sounds, I think the trip was actually good for them. Even if they were just playing games they're also learning more about technology and how to use it. With the future constantly progressing and technology already apart of our daily lives it's a good idea to educate them about it. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple funded it so they'd turn into a "I buy apple and nothing but apple products" person.
Right. "Learning" about apple's locked down proprietary technologies in their retail store is just as beneficial as a non-branded actual technology or computer class in the f'n school.

Apple can do anything they want. Their marketing is too good and their fanboys will always defend them.
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Old 04-18-2014, 11:58 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

I definitely don't mean for this to turn into a bashing Apple thread, I was just curious on people's thoughts.

I spoke with one of my colleagues, and she made what I thought to be a good point: even if there was some actual educational aspect to the trip, ultimately it's about how the kids interpreted it.
The kids tell me they spent the day playing on iPads/pods, and to me, that speaks volumes about what they got from the trip.

Now yes, I see some valid points, it's a distraction, life experience, etc., but at the end of the day, they went to a retail store in the mall. I'm sure they've been out to malls before with their family before. As for the technological aspect and how it relates to school, let me say that these kids all have iPods, iPads, or whatever, and use them daily. They know how useful they can be; hell, the youngest kid at our centre is 7. He takes notes on an iPad; I won't deny their usefulness.

But to me, seeing as this trip was done by the school itself... I just don't see it. The point, I mean. It appears to be a marketing ploy designed to keep or make Apple customers. Again, nothing wrong with the product, but it's how they go about doing things that bothers me.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:26 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

As the owner of three Macs, I am stepping away from this potential flame war in 3...2...1...
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:12 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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locked into their BS overpriced PC hardware...
As a Mac owner... they're not locked in.
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:58 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

As a parent, I will weigh in. First, I think it is very commendable that the OP is giving his time to work with kids. Job or not, this is definitely not for everybody, especially for a 21 year old when most people his age would be more than happy to let someone else do it. Kids by themselves are a handful, let alone in groups.

I find this field trip pointless. Kids already know how to use these devices. They don't care about RAM, processor speed, blah blah blah. If I was paying my hard earned money to enroll my kid in an after school program, and this was their field trip I would be dumbfounded. Might as well just give them some crayons. A field trip should be educational, informative, fun, and engaging (this is what gets me). Kids burying themselves in modern devices is already a problem. This is what they do now. Are they really learning and being engaged when they do this crap on their own anyhow?

When I was a kid we went to museums, the planetarium, took a ride on a train after learning the history of railroads, and went to see plays. Going to the mall to play games on a tablet is nonsense. Might as well have an XBOX at the youth center.
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:03 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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As a Mac owner... they're not locked in.
Maybe I missed it. Apple condones installing their OS on hardware they didn't produce now?
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:30 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

You said "locked in to the PC hardware", but there's nothing physical about the hardware locking one in- only the software, in that many apps are Mac-exclusive, but alternatives always exist on Windows. Furthermore, practically any file created on a Mac can be opened on a Windows PC (and to a lesser extent, Linux)- anyone is free to switch at any time.

Sure, Apple would like to keep Mac OS on Macs, but, uh... they can't.
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Old 04-19-2014, 05:35 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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As a parent, I will weigh in. First, I think it is very commendable that the OP is giving his time to work with kids. Job or not, this is definitely not for everybody, especially for a 21 year old when most people his age would be more than happy to let someone else do it. Kids by themselves are a handful, let alone in groups.

I find this field trip pointless. Kids already know how to use these devices. They don't care about RAM, processor speed, blah blah blah. If I was paying my hard earned money to enroll my kid in an after school program, and this was their field trip I would be dumbfounded. Might as well just give them some crayons. A field trip should be educational, informative, fun, and engaging (this is what gets me). Kids burying themselves in modern devices is already a problem. This is what they do now. Are they really learning and being engaged when they do this crap on their own anyhow?

When I was a kid we went to museums, the planetarium, took a ride on a train after learning the history of railroads, and went to see plays. Going to the mall to play games on a tablet is nonsense. Might as well have an XBOX at the youth center.
Thanks for the insight. I'm just trying to get a feel for what others think about this, not for any ultimate purpose or anything, but just because it irks me. I'm glad to see I'm not alone.

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You said "locked in to the PC hardware", but there's nothing physical about the hardware locking one in- only the software, in that many apps are Mac-exclusive, but alternatives always exist on Windows. Furthermore, practically any file created on a Mac can be opened on a Windows PC (and to a lesser extent, Linux)- anyone is free to switch at any time.

Sure, Apple would like to keep Mac OS on Macs, but, uh... they can't.
This is true. I always get a chuckle when I see a Mac running Windows, or a PC running IOS. Interfaces aside, my interpretation of what Watso said was that Apple wishes to lock them in as customers, making them believe that they have the superior product, or at the very least, to make them so familiar with their product that they don't consider any alternatives. Just my observation.
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:20 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

See, but they kind of do have a superior product IMO. They've been matched and surpassed in the mobile space, but no other manufacturer has been able to match them in the PC space. Samsung, Sony, and Google have come close but ultimately failed on their software. Asus is getting there, though.

Of course, this is only my opinion, as someone who spends too much time on tech news sites.
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:36 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Thanks for the insight. I'm just trying to get a feel for what others think about this, not for any ultimate purpose or anything, but just because it irks me. I'm glad to see I'm not alone.
The half arsed approach to a field trip irks me more than anything Apple may have said and done. The fact that the very best idea that someone could come up with was to take the kids to a shopping mall is the real failure here......regardless of whether or not Apple tried to "lock them in" once they had their attention or not.

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.................. Apple wishes to lock them in as customers, making them believe that they have the superior product, or at the very least, to make them so familiar with their product that they don't consider any alternatives. .
Which pretty much brings them into line with every other business (both big and small) out there, no?

I'm yet to hear a company whose marketing campaign involves sending customers out the door, straight into the waiting arms of the competition.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:00 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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See, but they kind of do have a superior product IMO. They've been matched and surpassed in the mobile space, but no other manufacturer has been able to match them in the PC space. Samsung, Sony, and Google have come close but ultimately failed on their software. Asus is getting there, though.

Of course, this is only my opinion, as someone who spends too much time on tech news sites.
Oh I don't mean to compare Apple products to others', I just meant that statement in relation to what their marketing is trying to achieve, which leads me to PFOG's statement.

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The half arsed approach to a field trip irks me more than anything Apple may have said and done. The fact that the very best idea that someone could come up with was to take the kids to a shopping mall is the real failure here......regardless of whether or not Apple tried to "lock them in" once they had their attention or not.



Which pretty much brings them into line with every other business (both big and small) out there, no?

I'm yet to hear a company whose marketing campaign involves sending customers out the door, straight into the waiting arms of the competition.
I agree with you on both counts, actually. I think the school should know better than to go along with it, however. That's part of my concern. I think the marketing is definitely brilliant, but I'm disappointed with the school.
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:57 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Oh, okay- makes sense.
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Old 04-19-2014, 05:59 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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You said "locked in to the PC hardware", but there's nothing physical about the hardware locking one in- only the software, in that many apps are Mac-exclusive, but alternatives always exist on Windows. Furthermore, practically any file created on a Mac can be opened on a Windows PC (and to a lesser extent, Linux)- anyone is free to switch at any time.

Sure, Apple would like to keep Mac OS on Macs, but, uh... they can't.
Actually, I said "locked into their overpriced PC hardware". Ever since macs made the switch away from actually being different in terms of hardware, now they're essentially just selling expensive x86-based computers. There's literally no reason why people wouldn't be able to install mac os on their own hardware, except that apple says no, and intentionally makes it hard.

It's how their entire system works. They're trying to make sure that every technology dollar you spend is spent at their store, on their products, and at whatever high price they dream up.

I can't really think of any other OS that's designed not to work on hardware not put together by the authors of that software. There's both positive and negative sides to this, but that's what I meant by locked in.
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:03 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
Right, most of them just don't cost as much as apple products do, adding just a bit more sting to the lowly conditions and pay for the people making those products for apple.

Hey! Maybe apple should foot the bill for the kids to go to china and see the actual production process! They'd learn a hell of a lot more from that than playing angry birds! Of course, since we know the motivation here is brainwashing children with branding, I don't think a trip to the factory would work in their favor.
For the record, the last time the manufacturer had a job call for employees, thousands of locals showed up for the jobs. I'm not sure what computer you are using but if you think the Chinese folks that made you computer or the parts to such are paid any more that the folks at this plant that also make HP et.al. then you are dreaming. But leave it to an Apple "hater" to turn a discussion on field trips to another bashing of Apple. Learn your facts before making yourself look silly. A field trip to the ballpark, the pizza shop, and others are done for the same reason and have no other purpose than to sell product. Welcome to the big bad world of the 2000's.

And as far as being locked in, when my computer doesn't work I call Apple. I don't spend an hour on the phone with HP only to be told it is a Windows issue only to spend an hour on the phone with them to hear it is an HP problem. That is worth a few bucks to me. I know Macs are expensive,and wish they were less, but pay for their excellent function and customer service. And this thread is not the place to air out your laundry.
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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For the record, the last time the manufacturer had a job call for employees, thousands of locals showed up for the jobs.
Well, duh. Why on earth would anybody work those conditions unless they had no choice to feed themselves?

Quote:
I'm not sure what computer you are using but if you think the Chinese folks that made you computer or the parts to such are paid any more that the folks at this plant that also make HP et.al. then you are dreaming.
I think you're missing my point. I'm saying that since apple is able to charge more because of their locked down system, marketing and loyal fanbase, they should in turn focus on how they make the product. It's a broken system all around, but apple is able to profit the most from it.

Quote:
But leave it to an Apple "hater" to turn a discussion on field trips to another bashing of Apple.
I don't hate apple per-say. I grew up using apple computers. It didn't take me long to figure out all the disadvantages on the apple system for someone like myself, though... And more and more I just see things that disgust me from a company that claims to care and be "different". I literally see cult-like behavior from supporters. Frankly, I enjoy correcting apple fanboys much more than I actually hate apple.

Quote:
Learn your facts before making yourself look silly.
Oh, please. I've worked in tech all my life since the age of 14 and am respected in my local fields. I think the "facts" you believe I'm wrong on are actually more relate-able to your lack of catching my point.

Quote:
A field trip to the ballpark,
Sounds like a much, much, much better idea than a class trip to the apple retail store.

Quote:
the pizza shop,
I doubt the pizza shop will do a showcase on their product line for the kids, or start planting seeds that their pizza is better than other pizza. I also doubt that the methods they show the kids for making pizza will only apply to that shops pizza oven and equipment, which naturally costs more than the competition.

Quote:
and others are done for the same reason and have no other purpose than to sell product. Welcome to the big bad world of the 2000's.
Maybe the kids will buy a pendant, but a day at the ballpark could be plenty educational if the teacher takes responsibility and gives the kids an understanding of the science and physics behind the game. Huge difference from handing the kids off to apple employees for a pre-cooked presentation and "learning" show where they learn to use expensive/exclusive products they don't necessarily need. It's not an introduction to programming or development, it's not learning how the stuff is made, it's a apple showcase where they try to get kids exited about their product and the related apps. This is not appropriate for public school children in my opinion.

Quote:
And as far as being locked in, when my computer doesn't work I call Apple. I don't spend an hour on the phone with HP only to be told it is a Windows issue only to spend an hour on the phone with them to hear it is an HP problem. That is worth a few bucks to me. I know Macs are expensive,and wish they were less, but pay for their excellent function and customer service.
Awesome. That's great. The benefits of a locked in system as I mentioned existed. I'm not going to argue that some people are better off in a controlled locked down system. I would never give my mother anything but a mac, she needs her hand held and paying more than the hardware is worth is an okay trade off in her case. At least she's not one of those apple users who stands in lines for days, or constantly tells me how much better her computer is than mine.

Quote:
And this thread is not the place to air out your laundry.
I don't think it's your place to tell me that. This is the off-topic lounge, my responses were related to the thread, centered around the main issue, and yes, included some of my related opinion. There's nothing wrong with it here, and I highly doubt that the thread author complained to you about my conduct. If you don't like what I have to say, don't respond to it and it's not your problem anymore.
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Old 04-20-2014, 02:36 AM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

I think that it is important to remember that Apple was once the loser to Microsoft in the computer game. Apple has overcome many odds to be a contender today. Their manufacturing process is no different than any other manufacturer throughout the world.
They do what they have to in order to survive in the real world of taxes, stockholders, and balance sheets.
Exploiting the Chinese labor force, and advertising to children is all just part of the game.
The cereal companies, beer companies, and cigarette companies did the same to us as we were coming up.
I would rather have Apple courting children on field trips than cigarette and beer companies.
Every kid on the planet knows what an iPhone is. They also know all about the iPad, etc.
Do you really think that they were swindled into thinking about Apple products from the field trip?
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Old 04-20-2014, 12:14 PM
Nour Ayasso Nour Ayasso is offline
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
Right. "Learning" about apple's locked down proprietary technologies in their retail store is just as beneficial as a non-branded actual technology or computer class in the f'n school.

Apple can do anything they want. Their marketing is too good and their fanboys will always defend them.
My point wasn't really about whether the brand was Apple or not. My point was that they're actually learning.
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Old 04-20-2014, 02:50 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

I am not a fan of Apple and I'm not a fan of Microsoft. I don't think the deeper element of this thread has anything to do with either company.

What this field trip speaks to, IMHO, is the casual, indeed even welcoming, view we take toward corporate influence in our lives. It has gotten to the point where marketing has wormed its way into nearly every corner of the public space, and corporations don't do this for your good, they do it for theirs. In this case, for example, the social psychologists know all about the effects of early imprinting. It's the long term soft sell. Apple is by no means alone in this. They are like virtually every other corporate entity trying to increase market share and profits.

I am old enough to remember when our civic institutions were supported by their communities. Any and every town had a Veterans Field or a Memorial Auditorium or a City Stadium. Today, those structures still exist but now instead they're called Pepsi Arena or AT&T Auditorium or Citi Stadium. Our communities are "brought to you by" any number of companies simply because they bought naming rights to a marquee on a structure that was built and financed by the community for the community's benefit. The very infrastructure of our society is being pilfered from us to be used as a vehicle to increase someone's bottom line. Our buildings have become billboards. Our clothes have become advertisements. We send our children to stores and call them field trips.

And we don't seem to mind.
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Old 04-20-2014, 04:14 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Excellent post Jim. This trend bothers me too.
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  #36  
Old 04-20-2014, 05:11 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

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Originally Posted by JimFiore View Post
I am not a fan of Apple and I'm not a fan of Microsoft. I don't think the deeper element of this thread has anything to do with either company.

What this field trip speaks to, IMHO, is the casual, indeed even welcoming, view we take toward corporate influence in our lives. It has gotten to the point where marketing has wormed its way into nearly every corner of the public space, and corporations don't do this for your good, they do it for theirs. In this case, for example, the social psychologists know all about the effects of early imprinting. It's the long term soft sell. Apple is by no means alone in this. They are like virtually every other corporate entity trying to increase market share and profits.

I am old enough to remember when our civic institutions were supported by their communities. Any and every town had a Veterans Field or a Memorial Auditorium or a City Stadium. Today, those structures still exist but now instead they're called Pepsi Arena or AT&T Auditorium or Citi Stadium. Our communities are "brought to you by" any number of companies simply because they bought naming rights to a marquee on a structure that was built and financed by the community for the community's benefit. The very infrastructure of our society is being pilfered from us to be used as a vehicle to increase someone's bottom line. Our buildings have become billboards. Our clothes have become advertisements. We send our children to stores and call them field trips.

And we don't seem to mind.
A major part of this arena naming is revenue opportunity
because of the salaries demanded by athletes . We as a community
allowed this to happen by continuing to go to games. All companies
are in business to make money and will use any
means available . And we don't seem to mind.
Do we really think a field trip to the zoo or art gallery or museum
is done just for education . Or is it done so that the kids can talk mom
and dad to go back with the whole family at 10 dollars per?
Who knows ? But I think to espouse that Apple does it purely
to " indoctrinate " young minds into its "cult like" company is childish at best.
When I was in school any field trip required a permission slip signed by a parent,
These parents must not have minded.
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Old 04-20-2014, 06:05 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
A major part of this arena naming is revenue opportunity
because of the salaries demanded by athletes . We as a community
allowed this to happen by continuing to go to games. All companies
are in business to make money and will use any
means available . And we don't seem to mind.
Do we really think a field trip to the zoo or art gallery or museum
is done just for education . Or is it done so that the kids can talk mom
and dad to go back with the whole family at 10 dollars per?
Who knows ? But I think to espouse that Apple does it purely
to " indoctrinate " young minds into its "cult like" company is childish at best.
When I was in school any field trip required a permission slip signed by a parent,
These parents must not have minded.
There is a difference though, between the zoo and the apple store. Getting to see exotic animals up close is a new experience for children who have not been to a zoo before. It isn't like giraffes just wander the plains here. Penguins do not inhabit our coastlines. Monkeys are not in our forests. Apple products, on the other hand, are everywhere.

As far as these outfits doing so in order to get the kids to convince the parents to go back at $10 a ticket, I just signed a permission slip on Friday that allows my daughter to take a field trip to a local art museum. We have been once already, and oh yeah, it is free to the public. Alice Walton donated the money for the museum, and the general admission is sponsored by, wait for it, Walmart. Obviously every company is not just out to make a buck off of imprinting to our children. Unless you live here, you would have no idea that Walmart even has anything to do with the museum.

http://crystalbridges.org/
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Old 04-20-2014, 06:35 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
A major part of this arena naming is revenue opportunity because of the salaries demanded by athletes . We as a community
allowed this to happen by continuing to go to games.
Partly. Some of this happened because team owners threatened to leave and the politicians thought it would give them a black eye so they either dropped the taxes, built them a new stadium or did something similar. The loss of revenue had to come from somewhere. As ridiculous as I think it is to pay people tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars to chase after a ball, never forget that the owners are the ones operating a monopoly and pulling down the real cash.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
All companies are in business to make money and will use any means available . And we don't seem to mind.
No, I disagree. Many people mind quite a bit! In spite of the constant supportive drumbeat from CNBC, Fox Business, etc., there are a lot of people who do not buy the line that Laissez-faire capitalism is a panacea for the world's ills. In fact I would argue that it is only the most hard core Randist who wouldn't mind if a company used "any means available to make money".

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
Do we really think a field trip to the zoo or art gallery or museum is done just for education . Or is it done so that the kids can talk mom and dad to go back with the whole family at 10 dollars per?
One quick example. Our local zoo is a community supported non-profit. Kids go there and are taught about animals, habitat, ecology, etc. The kids are being exposed to things face to face that they wouldn't be otherwise. They learn about some real science, science that is not "of the moment" like technology. Sure, iPads are nice. I have one, my wife has one. We also have some TVs and a microwave. They're nice, too. We have no allegiance to any of them though. They're just tools and tomorrow will bring better tools. Learning how to use a tool is useful but let's not conflate the tool with the thing we're actually trying to do.

Yes, there is an admission fee at the local zoo (during the winter it's free) but what do they do with the proceeds? They pay the operational costs and fund the process of education. So even if the field trip does lure the kid and family back, the ticket goes to sustain the educational mission for the next round of kids.
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Old 04-20-2014, 07:57 PM
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
There is a difference though, between the zoo and the apple store. Getting to see exotic animals up close is a new experience for children who have not been to a zoo before. It isn't like giraffes just wander the plains here. Penguins do not inhabit our coastlines. Monkeys are not in our forests. Apple products, on the other hand, are everywhere.

As far as these outfits doing so in order to get the kids to convince the parents to go back at $10 a ticket, I just signed a permission slip on Friday that allows my daughter to take a field trip to a local art museum. We have been once already, and oh yeah, it is free to the public. Alice Walton donated the money for the museum, and the general admission is sponsored by, wait for it, Walmart. Obviously every company is not just out to make a buck off of imprinting to our children. Unless you live here, you would have no idea that Walmart even has anything to do with the museum.

http://crystalbridges.org/
And of course Walmart is not out to make money and the money used for the museum
isn't a tax wrote off ..
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Old 04-20-2014, 08:24 PM
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larryace larryace is online now
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Default Re: Field Trip to the... Apple Store?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimFiore View Post
I am not a fan of Apple and I'm not a fan of Microsoft. I don't think the deeper element of this thread has anything to do with either company.

What this field trip speaks to, IMHO, is the casual, indeed even welcoming, view we take toward corporate influence in our lives. It has gotten to the point where marketing has wormed its way into nearly every corner of the public space, and corporations don't do this for your good, they do it for theirs. In this case, for example, the social psychologists know all about the effects of early imprinting. It's the long term soft sell. Apple is by no means alone in this. They are like virtually every other corporate entity trying to increase market share and profits.

I am old enough to remember when our civic institutions were supported by their communities. Any and every town had a Veterans Field or a Memorial Auditorium or a City Stadium. Today, those structures still exist but now instead they're called Pepsi Arena or AT&T Auditorium or Citi Stadium. Our communities are "brought to you by" any number of companies simply because they bought naming rights to a marquee on a structure that was built and financed by the community for the community's benefit. The very infrastructure of our society is being pilfered from us to be used as a vehicle to increase someone's bottom line. Our buildings have become billboards. Our clothes have become advertisements. We send our children to stores and call them field trips.

And we don't seem to mind.
Epic post Jim. The corporate brainwashing that's SO apparent in this thread.... completely sickens and saddens me. A field trip to a retail store is so irresponsible from an educational standpoint. The people who allow and condone these kinds of "field trips"..... What's the opposite of respect? That's how I feel towards them.
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