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  #1  
Old 01-30-2014, 07:15 PM
arsalanxaidi arsalanxaidi is offline
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Default Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

hi all,

I have an urgent question (since I have a gig tomorrow and i'm playing live after a LONGGGGGGG wait)

So first off, I have never played a beat before where the only cymbal that is being used is the hi hat chic (basically no time keeping with the sticks, its only the left foot that is keeping 8th notes on the hi hat); alhthough i'm using my crash alot.

BEAT: constant hi hat foot 8ths; bass drum on 1 and 2 snare on "&" of 2;
bass drum on "&" of 3 and snare on 4.

two quick questions:

1. i tried to play the hats with HEEL DOWN but its too fast for me right now and since the front of my leg, my shins, begin to hurt, the time is hurt and i the beat gets screwed up when my leg gives up. SO, what i'm playing NOW is ALMOST bouncing my left foot on the hi hat pedal (i wanted to keep it as clean of a technique as possible, i dont know how wrong i am if i'm taking my foot off the pedal for that micro second; maybe i'm just doing it to get a better chic sound)

2. VERY IMPORTANT: how much does a chic sound in a LIVE situation; as i'v only tried it in my room and i knw the stage sound is very different as there is less echo. would the CHIC be enough or heard enough? or as good as the stick on the closed hats??

I hope i can get some answers soon !! thanks all :)
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  #2  
Old 01-30-2014, 07:19 PM
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BillRayDrums BillRayDrums is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Well for starters I don't think I'd be "whipping out" anything I was not real solid with on a performance!

The hi-hat openings you're asking about take a little time to develop and the best way to develop them is to gain a better understanding of your left foot; when you're playing a simple beat allow your left foot to keep quarter notes, or even 8th notes. So it seem that you're doing that already but have not really gotten fluent with it.

It will probably feel mighty clunky for a while but eventually you'll loosen up and get with the program.

Best of luck to you, and when you're doing a live gig it's best to become "no one, doing nothing, going nowhere." Clear your mind and let the music carry you. From what you told the class it would seem you get stuck on a thought and that's always gonna be a brainfart. And they do happen to us experienced players too! You're always gonna make mistakes, but as you get better and more fluent on the instrument you'll make smaller, less noticeable mistakes.
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Last edited by BillRayDrums; 01-30-2014 at 07:21 PM. Reason: clarity
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  #3  
Old 01-30-2014, 07:20 PM
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Dr_Watso Dr_Watso is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Bouncing on the hat pedal is something I do quite a bit. Don't see any issue there, maybe someone else will. No matter what, don't tense up. It may fee like you have to in order to go fast, but don't, it's detrimental.

As for how loud a hat chick is when playing live, you might have a concern there. Generally in a bigger space, it can get lost in the music. This is when most folks turn to the old microphone route.
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Old 01-30-2014, 07:28 PM
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GRUNTERSDAD GRUNTERSDAD is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Bouncing is fine as long as the out come is the 8th note sound. The burning sensation of your shin is from not doing that a lot. It's the same as shin splints runners get. Try starting out slower and building up speed. You may sound better doing quarter note chicks until you develope the 8th note speed.
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  #5  
Old 01-30-2014, 07:29 PM
arsalanxaidi arsalanxaidi is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillRayDrums View Post
Well for starters I don't think I'd be "whipping out" anything I was not real solid with on a performance!

The hi-hat openings you're asking about take a little time to develop and the best way to develop them is to gain a better understanding of your left foot; when you're playing a simple beat allow your left foot to keep quarter notes, or even 8th notes. So it seem that you're doing that already but have not really gotten fluent with it.

It will probably feel mighty clunky for a while but eventually you'll loosen up and get with the program.

Best of luck to you, and when you're doing a live gig it's best to become "no one, doing nothing, going nowhere." Clear your mind and let the music carry you. From what you told the class it would seem you get stuck on a thought and that's always gonna be a brainfart. And they do happen to us experienced players too! You're always gonna make mistakes, but as you get better and more fluent on the instrument you'll make smaller, less noticeable mistakes.
well we've actually practice quite alot with it, so it is all fine when i play with the foot bounce.
and yes, the slower tempos are normally not a problem to keep with the beat, its just that i don't practice it ALOT and my left foot speed and endurance need work, especially heel down as thats what i prefer playing anyways, THANKS ALOT for that advice in the end. :)
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Old 01-30-2014, 07:30 PM
arsalanxaidi arsalanxaidi is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Watso View Post
Bouncing on the hat pedal is something I do quite a bit. Don't see any issue there, maybe someone else will. No matter what, don't tense up. It may fee like you have to in order to go fast, but don't, it's detrimental.

As for how loud a hat chick is when playing live, you might have a concern there. Generally in a bigger space, it can get lost in the music. This is when most folks turn to the old microphone route.
means i tell the sound guy to turn the volume UP for the hi hat for that one particular song?????? ://
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Old 01-30-2014, 07:36 PM
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larryace larryace is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Most guys play heel up hi hat, it works great, so that's all good. It's hard doing fast 8ths heel down. Learning heel down hi hat is a challenge, but well worth the effort. Even guys who play heel down mainly, play fast 8ths heel up because it's easier. So bounce away. Don't worry about it not cutting through. Drummers don't always have to cut through, they are still felt. Just play it normally...if you try to play it too loud....it might sound out of balance and you run the risk of focusing on that instead of the more important flow.
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Old 01-30-2014, 09:01 PM
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alparrott alparrott is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

When I play eighths on the hi-hat pedal, it's usually during mid-tempo or slower songs where my left foot is mirroring what my right hand is doing on the ride. In those cases I'm playing with the whole leg and flexing at the hip. The foot is bouncing on the ball and the heel is raised. This feels most natural to me and can create a fairly loud chick. Of course, if you're not miked up and the band is amplified, the chick can get lost in the sound.

I agree with BillRay, if you're not 100% confident on a part when you're going live, you might want to "cheat" to make it through the gig. In this case, you might keep time with the stick on the hats instead... Or if you feel comfortable playing them heel up, just do it heel up.
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Old 01-31-2014, 11:47 AM
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Diet Kirk Diet Kirk is offline
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Default Re: Hi Hat Chic: URGENT question

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryace View Post
Most guys play heel up hi hat, it works great, so that's all good. It's hard doing fast 8ths heel down. Learning heel down hi hat is a challenge, but well worth the effort. Even guys who play heel down mainly, play fast 8ths heel up because it's easier. So bounce away. Don't worry about it not cutting through. Drummers don't always have to cut through, they are still felt. Just play it normally...if you try to play it too loud....it might sound out of balance and you run the risk of focusing on that instead of the more important flow.
This ^ Leave the sound to the engineer, I know it can be tricky to do and you want your drums heard the way you wrote the part to be, but the best thing to do is concentrate on your playing and leave how it sounds out front to the engineer.

Now if you notice after a few gigs its really not cutting, then perhaps its time to re-think how you orchestrate that part.

Definately don't worry yourself about having to slam down your hats to make them loud, you will definately affect your feel and timing then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by alparrott View Post
When I play eighths on the hi-hat pedal, it's usually during mid-tempo or slower songs where my left foot is mirroring what my right hand is doing on the ride. In those cases I'm playing with the whole leg and flexing at the hip. The foot is bouncing on the ball and the heel is raised. This feels most natural to me and can create a fairly loud chick. Of course, if you're not miked up and the band is amplified, the chick can get lost in the sound.

I agree with BillRay, if you're not 100% confident on a part when you're going live, you might want to "cheat" to make it through the gig. In this case, you might keep time with the stick on the hats instead... Or if you feel comfortable playing them heel up, just do it heel up.
A second way to cheat too. If your right hand isn't doing anything, then keep time with it on your leg. Just subtly and noone out front will notice.

Then if you have cymbal accents and stuff where you need to use your right hand to hit cymbals, then if it helps, you can stop the hi-hats whilst you hit cymbals, then get your right hand on your leg and hats peddling back in unison. In the context of the song nobody is going to notice that the hats are not still being stepped due to the cymbal volume. This is obviously a cheat you will probably want to rectify later as it is a total independance cheat lol, but thats what practice is for when you are rehearsing your set.
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