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  #1  
Old 09-26-2014, 09:41 AM
RobertM RobertM is offline
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Default Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

I've decided to refit my Tama Silverstar birch kit with some new heads. I'm using this kit for rock, fusion, or funk playing (with the occasional punk gig thrown in). The heads I'm considering are the following:
  1. Remo Clear Emperor
  2. Remo Black Suede Emperor
  3. Evans Onyx (black coated)

As far as I can tell, the Black Suede Emperors and Evans Onyx seem fairly identical--i.e., two plies of 7.5 film, black coated. I've heard a lot of folks vouch for Evans' consistency in manufacturing, but Remo still seem to be favored by a lot of players (including two of my rock favorites, Stewart Copeland and Will Calhoun).

Any feedback or recommendations? Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 09-26-2014, 01:08 PM
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belairien belairien is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

Personally I'm a Remo fan. With what you would be playing I would say go for the Emperors.

Or I do suggest the Vintage Emperors. Clear has good tone and an amazing attack, without sounding dead or boxy. Coated has a nice deep and well rounded tone on the Vintage, slight bit mellow on the regular coated ones.

The black suedes I haven't used, but I think they would be either between the coated and clear. Maybe a little darker. Perhaps darker like a coated, but with more attack than the coated.

I find Evans heads to be a pain to tune, thin sounding and not open enough. Even G2s sounded that way to me.
At least after their "Level 360" baloney.

But hey to each their own right?

TL;DR
Clear Remo Emperor/Vintage Emperor = Yes

Hope that helps!
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Last edited by belairien; 09-26-2014 at 01:57 PM.
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  #3  
Old 09-26-2014, 03:31 PM
EvansSpecialist EvansSpecialist is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by belairien View Post
P

I find Evans heads to be a pain to tune, thin sounding and not open enough. Even G2s sounded that way to me.
At least after their "Level 360" baloney.
I'd like to address this directly. Have you used Evans and had this experience recently? I'd also be willing to send you replacements if you had an issue with the heads.

Regarding Level 360 Technology, while I understand that many people saw it as 100%, that couldn't be further from the truth. A major technological advancement was made after over a decade of R&D. Yes, we had to market it- we'd taken the time and money to make an improvement and would be remiss not to tell the world about it. I've only had a few people (literally less than 5) that have not had a better tuning experience with the new collar design. In those instances of exception, choice of the specific head had more to do with the experience than the collar design.
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Old 09-26-2014, 04:50 PM
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porter porter is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

To me, the sound difference behind the kit is that Evans sound more 'studio ready'- a little more refined than the Remos I've tried. (Could just be my kit.)

I'd recommend G2s or perhaps even G12s for your purpose if you are looking at Emperors: they may take a little more work to get right than the black coated heads, which are generally quite dry in sustain & pretty easy to tune, but will provide you a generally more full & open sound than the slightly muffled black heads. (That goes for the clear Emperor too.) Plus, if you need a more muffled sound or don't like the openness of the unmuffled head, you can just throw on some Moongel or a Drumclip and control how much muffling you want.

I used G14s as batter heads on my former Tama Superstar (the 12" & 14"), which has the same shells as the Silverstar but with heavier hardware & die-cast hoops, and loved it to pieces. The G12s are 2mil thinner but still one ply and gorgeously full. G14s respond a little slower but have a thicker tone to my ear.

Oh, and my Level 360 experience is that they are indeed easier to tune than Remo. So are my Aquarians which have similar technology in the collar.
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  #5  
Old 09-26-2014, 10:41 PM
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belairien belairien is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvansSpecialist View Post
I'd like to address this directly. Have you used Evans and had this experience recently? I'd also be willing to send you replacements if you had an issue with the heads.

Regarding Level 360 Technology, while I understand that many people saw it as 100%, that couldn't be further from the truth. A major technological advancement was made after over a decade of R&D. Yes, we had to market it- we'd taken the time and money to make an improvement and would be remiss not to tell the world about it. I've only had a few people (literally less than 5) that have not had a better tuning experience with the new collar design. In those instances of exception, choice of the specific head had more to do with the experience than the collar design.
I actually just took the heads off my kit. With G2s, both clear and coated, only my 10 inch tom sounded good. But would choke before getting it a high as I wanted. The 12 had one spot that was usable only with dampening. (mind you, it was barely within tolerance). Same with my floor tom. With EC2s, only my 14 sounded good. Down in 16 inch territory. The 12 and 10 either flappy or ringy.
EMads were another story. Sounded like a tennis ball more than a kick no matter the tuning.
This happened on every kit I tried them on. My last kit was a cheaper set, and I found the rims where rather thin. Everything was harder to tune on it. So I decided to give you guys a try with a better set. same problems. My bearing edges are good, hoops were heavy and perfectly in round.
It has nothing to do with experience. I will spend hours at a time perfecting and changing the sound of my drums. The sound I prefer most I can get with Remo emporers or aquarian's equivalent in a matter of a couple minutes. I also get a lot of people begging me to help them get my sound.

Before the level 360, I enjoyed the ec reverse dot and HD dry on my Tama metal works. After the level 360, the dry is anything but, three ec just have awful tone. And the hazy 300, at least the newer one, chokes before I reach the tension that gives me my snare sound. A cranked hydraulic on the snare still sounds good.
Its nothing against you guys as a company. I think what you guys do is great, just not for me. You have great innovations, I just can't get the sound I desire.
I also love the fact that we have you on here for support.I have given plenty of time and money to try you guys thoroughly.

Sorry for thread jacking.
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  #6  
Old 10-01-2014, 11:44 AM
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belairien belairien is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

Update to last post.

After much experimentation, I have got the toms to sound good. It could just be the resonant heads, But I found a sound a like with the G2s by tuning top and bottom to JAW.
That isn't normal for me. But its enough to play the heads till they are dead. The 10 is still thin sounding when tuned to fit with the 12 and 14

The HD dry, though, The plies are separating, which explains why it was never dry like it should have been.

EMAD still sounds like a tennis ball/over inflated basket ball slamming against the ground.
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  #7  
Old 10-09-2014, 04:38 AM
RobertM RobertM is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

Well, I ran out of time and am going to stay with my current head choice for the punk/rock gig I have this week: Evans EC2 frosted. Not super keen on these heads, but for a two-ply, lighted coated head with stenciled sound-control ring, the tom tom sustain is still pretty good (kit is a Tama Silverstar birch). They tune nice and mid-lowish to get that meatier rock sound.

What do folks think of Aquarian Response 2 black coated?
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  #8  
Old 10-12-2014, 05:31 PM
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Dre25 Dre25 is online now
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

I've never heard a drum sound good with the onyx heads.
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  #9  
Old 10-13-2014, 06:27 PM
Yoshinya Yoshinya is offline
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Default Re: Evans Onyx or Remo Black Suede Emperor?

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Originally Posted by Dre25 View Post
I've never heard a drum sound good with the onyx heads.
Then either they're not to your taste, or you've not heard enough drums with Onyx heads on them. Or perhaps they were not tuned very well.

I've heard them make a kit that I thought was absolute garbage finally sound good, and they're great for metal and/or hard rock. Like a slightly thicker/darker coated G2, but with a comparable amount of resonance.

However, I've seen some drummers re-head their kits with Onyx batters and think they can not spend time on tuning them, because you can kind of get away with that with something like a Hydraulic. The Onyx heads are still far more resonant than people think.

Now, the Black Chrome heads on the other hand... that's a different story.
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