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Old 04-08-2014, 07:37 AM
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Default Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Wikipedia defines ideology as (I sectioned it up): [1] An ideology is a set of conscious and unconscious ideas that constitute one's goals, expectations, and actions. [2] An ideology is a comprehensive vision, a way of looking at things (compare worldview) as in several philosophical tendencies (see political ideologies), or [3] a set of ideas proposed by the dominant class of a society to all members of this society (a "received consciousness" or product of socialization).

As drummers I felt this applied to us as soon as I read it. I was looking for political stuff, but this just kind of spoke to me. Here's why by section:

1. This to me feels like our need to practice, our route to get to where we want to go. We intentionally practice, some even get very specific about how their time is spent. This is the conscious side. Unconsciously we start to become what we want to be, it shows in our growth and enjoyment of the instrument, our actions, how we hear things, and many others. The one place I don't think it fits is how we look. There really is no drummer look I don't think.

2. Political ideology looks something like this: Socialism on the far left and Fascism on the far right. Everything else is somewhere in between. What is the scale of drumming ideology? Would it be Blues on the far left and Metal on the right?

3. All I really have for this one is "(insert drummer, gear, band, really whatever) is the best ever". Seems to me that certain people/things have a much more ravenous following than others. In contrast, there are just as many dissidents. I just think this is human nature though, and can be applied to just about anything.

Anyhow I can't talk about this with my wife, so here you go. Thoughts?


Blues<----------Everything else---------->Metal
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Old 04-08-2014, 07:51 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Nice topic, but I can't get into your suggestions for extremes. I'm a metal drummer who plays mostly blues these days, and I don't see them as truly opposite sides of the drumming spectrum. I would consider something like traditional jazz (as opposed to acid jazz), bossa nova, samba or afro-cuban further to to your theoretical left where metal still resides on the right. Maybe this is due to the time feel differences.
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Old 04-08-2014, 07:57 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Yeah I really don't know either. I had to pick something so blues it was. Some form of jazz might be good. Reggae? Disco? Cave man beating a log?
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Old 04-08-2014, 08:08 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

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Cave man beating a log?
Isn't this metal? Oops, did I say that out loud?
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Old 04-08-2014, 08:54 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

I think we need a three axis model, based on the predominant drumming patterns.

I'd put the money beat, played on a standard 5 piece kit at the centre, because it's as good a starting point as any.

Use the three axes to categorise by:

Time signature (I'm pretty sure I'm not a pro)
Complexity of groove (Must research this further)
Size of kit (Just guessing here)
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Old 04-08-2014, 09:06 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

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I think we need a three axis model, based on the predominant drumming patterns.

I'd put the money beat, played on a standard 5 piece kit at the centre, because it's as good a starting point as any.

Use the three axes to categorise by:

Time signature (I'm pretty sure I'm not a pro)
Complexity of groove (Must research this further)
Size of kit (Just guessing here)
Predominant drumming patterns limits what is included. Everything is to be included. Its genre based, not necessarily drumming difficulty based. All genres have their difficult and their easy, but the identity is what is important. No matter the skill level of the song, you can always tell where it fits. No one has ever confused Slayer for Abba.
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Old 04-08-2014, 09:33 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Hello? Did I hear "nerd content"? :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
1. This to me feels like our need to practice, our route to get to where we want to go. We intentionally practice, some even get very specific about how their time is spent. This is the conscious side. Unconsciously we start to become what we want to be, it shows in our growth and enjoyment of the instrument, our actions, how we hear things, and many others. The one place I don't think it fits is how we look. There really is no drummer look I don't think.
An ideal? I mostly see it as the need to keep my hand in, but I'm no pro.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
2. Political ideology looks something like this: Socialism on the far left and Fascism on the far right. Everything else is somewhere in between. What is the scale of drumming ideology? Would it be Blues on the far left and Metal on the right?
Left and right were once clear but have gone a bit strange of late. There seem to be two schisms, not all fitting neatly into party platforms. One one hand you have the traditional capital v worker conflicts of interest. On the other you have the progressive vs reactionary schism.

The most extreme progressives in music are experimental artists and the most conservative would be traditional forms like classical, old jazz forms, blues, country, early rock 'n' roll etc.

The most "capitalist" artists are obviously those in the Top 40. The most aligned with workers are experimental, blues, old country, jazz - basically music that makes bugger all money.

Metal can be progressive or conservative, and is usually aligned with the working class. The technical forms tend to be centrist.

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3. All I really have for this one is "(insert drummer, gear, band, really whatever) is the best ever". Seems to me that certain people/things have a much more ravenous following than others. In contrast, there are just as many dissidents. I just think this is human nature though, and can be applied to just about anything.
A lot of it is plain old visceral appeal.
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Old 04-08-2014, 09:56 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

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Originally Posted by Anon La Ply View Post
The most extreme progressives in music are experimental artists and the most conservative would be traditional forms like classical, old jazz forms, blues, country, early rock 'n' roll etc.

The most "capitalist" artists are obviously those in the Top 40. The most aligned with workers are experimental, blues, old country, jazz - basically music that makes bugger all money.

Metal can be progressive or conservative, and is usually aligned with the working class. The technical forms tend to be centrist.
That is an interesting way to look at it, I like the analogy. I think the blues should be in working class though. Not all workers are angry, some are bummed out to have to do the daily grind.
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Old 04-08-2014, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

I suppose another way to approach this subject would be in a socio-economic context. For example, when attending a artist opening or other high-faluting type shindig one rarely hears anything but classical music or light jazz. Rarely would one hear Slayer or ABBA in those circumstances. Conversely one rarely hears classical at a Friday night piss-up in the 'burbs.
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Old 04-08-2014, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
No one has ever confused Slayer for Abba.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ixa1kXjMhAU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0JwF1xAQdc
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Old 04-08-2014, 03:50 PM
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Default Re: Drumming Ideology: Warning, Nerd Content

Always be wary of the false dichotomy (if it's not this then it must be that). I don't think that many things we place along a one dimensional line are accurately described that way. Politics is a prime example. I think left/right is overly simplistic. For example, someone can be a socialist and have libertarian leanings just like someone who's a laissez-faire capitalist can have libertarian leanings. But some socialists and capitalists are authoritarian. I think the same is true of music (or drumming if you prefer) so I don't look at it as a line from this to that.

I will say that I do make a distinction between art and entertainment (and a mix thereof). Maybe that's a little more in line with the original thesis. For me, the artist does what they do basically because they have no other choice. It is what they are compelled to express, as if they are the messenger or the vehicle of the art. How that art is received by others is entirely secondary. The entertainer OTOH is primarily interested in how said artifact is received and they shape it for a specific purpose. Consequently, I would not necessarily say that someone who played, say, progressive rock, was more of an artist than a country music player. The prog rocker might be making that music solely because he knows he can nail a certain market segment by playing a specific way. The country music person might be compelled to play what they play regardless of audience acceptance. So I look at it from the angle of intent, not some external metric of complexity or what-have-you. Some people might use the word authentic but I would quibble with that.

Mind you, no matter how heart-felt, honest or authentic those country music tunes are, I'll probably hate them all the same.
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