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  #1  
Old 04-04-2015, 06:28 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Electric dilemma

Hi everyone,I decided to register here because I've been having issues with electronic drums for quite a while now and need to sort them out.
About a year and a half ago I got a dm10 studio kit and I pretty much hate it.The reason I got it at the time was because I was moving and could no longer play acoustic but I also got it just as much for beginning to record through a daw with a vst software instrument so I could start getting full ideas finished further down the road.
I've never got into the kit whatsoever,I noticed over on the dm site just how much customisation people put into the kit and that's something I don't really want to get into,I'd rather have a kit that's a bit easier to just plug and play.The pads are the old pre-mesh ones that feel a bit cheap,I know the mesh conversion can be done easily enough but I'd rather spend time playing instead of tweaking and repairing different parts of the kit as I'm pretty hopeless at that stuff.
I've two questions.Should I try to actually get into tweaking the kit to make it work for my needs or cut my losses?I already intend on selling it but am just wondering whether I should give it another shot.For an example with the customising aspect of things,the kick drums legs on this model are too short,so too begin with trying to play it was a pain in the ass as the legs need to be replaced.Is this the kind of thing that exists on most e-kits?If I'll have to fix these kind of problems myself I might as well just stick with this model although the fact I've had it for this long and haven't found the urge means I pretty much know the answer and am just ranting.I think that this is a low to mid range kit that can do very good things if I put a lot of effort into it outside of the actual playing effort I want to put in.

I think I'll be looking at getting something else anyway which brings me to my last question.What e-kit should I be looking at?I want something that's texturally as close to an acoustic set as possible,something that's easy enough to plug in and play and doesn't require a lot of tweaking through the module and something that works well with a drum vst so that I can put ideas down in a daw seamlessly.I'm looking at a budget of around 2k give or take.I'd like to know what some of you think is the best quality piece of gear I could get around that ball park.

Thanks for reading
Stupidrumface
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  #2  
Old 04-04-2015, 07:04 AM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

My teachers advice: Buy a Roland. This is probably very good advice.

I personally went against his advice and picked up a DTX532K, as it was the only real-hi-hat-stand kit I could afford without saving another 6 months. It makes a nice practice kit. The DTX snare is small but comfortable. The rubber pad toms feel the same as rubber pads have for the last 20 years.

If I were going to use it full time, I would have saved for a DTX 562 or DTX700. Alternatively TD15kv Would have been my other choice.

There are a number of conversion fans on this site, and I would have given it consideration had I had the real-estate.
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Old 04-04-2015, 08:25 AM
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Matt Bo Eder Matt Bo Eder is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

For your range, Roland makes at least a couple of kits in that 1295-1595 range that would work out. Obviously, you're not in TD-20 (or 30) territory, so you'll just have to deal with the $$ you do have. I think Roland has one with "ok" mesh heads under 2K, just not sure which one.

As was said, you're only real choices are either Roland or Yamaha, and I'm from the Roland camp, having owned a top flight TD-10 back in the day. That was best practice kit I ever had at 6K ;)
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Old 04-04-2015, 01:03 PM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Right now I'm looking at the Roland 11 and 15,I'll need to look into a kit that works well with a double pedal too.There's a fairly big gap in the market between the Roland 15 and 30,about a grand or so.Shame the 20 has been discontinued,I presume it filled that gap.
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Old 04-04-2015, 04:05 PM
EssKayKay EssKayKay is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Actually, I think the TD-12 was that "gap filler", but that too has been discontinued. I also agree, I wish Roland would have included a replacement for the 12 but that's marketing.

I started with a TD-11KV, then through GAS, upgraded everything to a TD-15KV (mostly through eBay). I certainly enjoy the larger pads and true VH-11 hi-hat, but to be honest, I didn't really notice a "huge" improvement between the two modules. Yes, the TD-15 has more sounds, and I like the Quick Edit feature, but my TD-11 worked just fine. I'm sure at some time in the future I will see a TD-30 (or it's replacement) in this house but for now I am very pleased with what I have.

Again, just my 2-cents.....

Last edited by EssKayKay; 04-05-2015 at 12:10 AM.
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  #6  
Old 04-04-2015, 08:00 PM
New Tricks New Tricks is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

...............................Get used gear
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Old 04-05-2015, 02:06 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

I might but I'd rather get something new in case something goes wrong and I'm left soaked.There's not a lot to choose from where I am.There's actually a decent used Roland 20 near me but it doesn't have a usb port so I think that rules out working through a daw and recording with a software instrument.
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Old 04-05-2015, 02:24 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

http://www.thomann.de/gb/millenium_t...esh_bundle.htm

The brain looks good but I'm not so sure about the kit itself,it's a bit of a non-brand.

I'm thinking of going for either a Roland 11 or 15 now.KayKay do you use a double bass pedal with your kit?The kick pad looks a bit small.
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Old 04-05-2015, 02:31 AM
EssKayKay EssKayKay is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

I bought my kit with a TAMA double base (I thought I needed) but I'm only using one pedal. I may add the double but for now the single works fine. Please realize, I am somewhat of a novice drummer - played in high school but that was many many moons ago, so basically, I'm starting over.

Just for the record, I also bought all new equipment w/extended warranty from Guitar Center because I knew nothing about eDrums. My Roland equipment has worked fine - no problems. I did add a Yamaha PCY-135 that did act up - Yamaha replaced it free of charge (this was not covered under my GC contract). KUDOS to Yamaha - I can not say enough good about them. I do like the Roland cymbals better but for the price, Yammy is great. Since then, I have purchased most of my stuff used either from Musician's Friend (free shipping, matched price) or eBay.
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  #10  
Old 04-05-2015, 03:02 AM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stupidrumface View Post
I might but I'd rather get something new in case something goes wrong and I'm left soaked.There's not a lot to choose from where I am.There's actually a decent used Roland 20 near me but it doesn't have a usb port so I think that rules out working through a daw and recording with a software instrument.
It would probably be fair to say that if you're dissatisfied with the DM10, that the TD11 and DTX502 series aren't going to blow you away. I consider those to be roughly the same tier as the DM10 aims to be, but with Rol/Yam both having a quality and design advantage. DTX700 and TD15KV is where you probably should be looking, even if it delays the purchase for a few months due to a constrained budget.

If, like me, you simply cannot afford/justify the expense of the DTX700/TD15... well.. yeah. DTX532. It is what it is.
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Old 04-05-2015, 03:34 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Hmm,I haven't really considered Yamaha,I know Roland is considered the market leader so figured I'd go that way.

Now I'm thinking it might be more of a decision between the DTX700 and the Roland 15.
Does anyone have any experience with the 2box drum brain?The simple interface looks appealing.
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  #12  
Old 04-06-2015, 05:43 AM
rhysT rhysT is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

If you want some useful info about using your DM10 kit with VSTs and possibly converting the pads to mesh heads, check out the DMdrummer.com forum.

Also maybe consider triggering a 2box module from the DM10 (via midi) after a mesh conversion. It's worth exploring the 2box forum: http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php
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  #13  
Old 04-07-2015, 04:54 AM
EssKayKay EssKayKay is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Apparently Roland's releasing a new module/kit - the TD-25. Sounds like it will be based on their Flagship TD-30 -- no specifics yet.

http://www.vdrums.com/forum/general/...dule-the-td-25
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  #14  
Old 04-07-2015, 05:45 PM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhysT View Post
If you want some useful info about using your DM10 kit with VSTs and possibly converting the pads to mesh heads, check out the DMdrummer.com forum.

Also maybe consider triggering a 2box module from the DM10 (via midi) after a mesh conversion. It's worth exploring the 2box forum: http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php
I'm familiar with the forum,in fact it's one of the main reasons I bought the model.I'm really not bothered at this point in all those customisations though,it's too much effort for me outside of actually playing.
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  #15  
Old 04-07-2015, 08:01 PM
0sparky0 0sparky0 is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

I have a td15, 2box, and also a yammie module. The roland is definitely the easiest of the bunch to use. They all have good features. The Yamaha is my least favorite. I did convert an acoustic kit for full time electronic use, and also mix electronic with my acoustic kits love. Of the batch, the Roland , so far, triggers best, 2Box has the best "real" drum and cymbal sounds, and the Yamaha really is just a practice kit. I use roland cymbals and hh. I can't really tell you about any midi use, as I don't use that feature. I had a td11, but swapped to the 15 right away and VEX'd it.
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  #16  
Old 04-08-2015, 04:31 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Well this new Roland sounds like another option now anyway.
Thanks for that.

Thanks for that message too sparky.Going on your experience it sounds like the roland mod would suit best.I'd like the best sounds available but if choosing that over the 2box means I'm going to bypass some extra tech problems and lose 10-20% quality of the drum sound I'll be happy enough.

I might be a bit ignorant regarding midi,I thought it was as simple as plugging a kit in via usb to a pc and using it as a midi controller like a midi keyboard,I didn't know there'd be midi cables involved too.
Recording through a daw with midi is my main motivation here.I've used EZ drummer and done some programming in the past with preset loops and stuff from scratch,I play a bit of guitar too and have had loads of fun making rough demos in the past,but I've gotten to a point where I really want to lay drum tracks down by playing them and not having to create them from scratch through software,the amount of editing it takes to sound right at this stage just takes too long.I love playing so having an outlet like this to get ideas down would be awesome and would require me to improve musically which I'm not doing as much with programming,I'm really sick of creating that way and need a break from it.

With the sounds that come with these higher end kits,do you think I'd need a vst like EZ drummer,Addictive etc. or would the kit sounds themselves sound superior (no pun intended)?
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Old 04-12-2015, 12:29 AM
OleDrummer OleDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Hello Everyone, I've been playing Pearl, as well as Ludwig acoustic kits for many years now, and because of the versatility of the newer e-drums, I'm looking at the more affordable Yamaha 522K kit. I just like to be able to do all of my own tracks and studio work myself.

I want to be able to put drum tracks to my guitar players melodies and lyrics and basically get up to speed on all the bell and whistles associated with the Yamaha kit. I've heard a lot of good things about the 502 module and was wondering what kind of sound I could get out of the kit if I add, let's say, a Simmons DA 200S at a later date to possibly do some gigging, and for practice as well.

E-Drums are a whole new world for me, but I'm excited about the possibilites, because my Pearls are limited, especially when it comes to all these great sounds and the ability to modify at the touch of a button.

Also, has anyone had any major concerns, that have experience with the Yamaha kits ? Thanks....
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Old 04-12-2015, 01:13 AM
goughy goughy is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

I'm a hack so take this with a grain of salt! I love my 522 but in all honesty, if you can stretch it try and at least get the 532. The difference is the hihat, and it is well and truly worth the extra. I have in fact purchased the rhh135 hihat separately because the feel of the one with the 522 was crap. I also find the pcy135 cymbals much better than the pcy100 that you get with the 522. I'll be buying another of those in the future too (though probably the pcy155).

Also, with the rhh135, while with the 502 module you'll only get the close, half open and open sounds (you do get foot chick and splash sounds) I've read if you use it with something like a vst you'll get like infinite positions, or something like that! Don't hold me to it, just what I've read.
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Old 04-12-2015, 02:08 AM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by OleDrummer View Post
Also, has anyone had any major concerns, that have experience with the Yamaha kits ? Thanks....

I've owned a DTX532k for a hair over a week now and really like it. I bought it as a practice kit. The down sides...

1: You cannot cheat on the high-hat in the same manner you do on an acoustic. If you want to open the hat for a single 16th note, you need to open the hat 'before' the stick strike. Not during, not after, but unconditionally and clearly before the stick hits.

2: The rubber pads on the toms are very bouncy to the point where you think you have chops that you don't actually have.

3 The rubber cymbals take a bit of getting used to. Fast 16th's on the hat are problematic for me. Fast triplets on the ride take more work than on a real cymbal. If you've learned to crash with a glancing/sideways motion, you're going to have to re-learn to come straight in.

4: There is a definite loss of complexity with any eKit when compared to an acoustic.

5: Hat-open and outer zone needed remapping in Garageband.

6: The toms are smaller than real toms. The only issue for me has been the floor-tom. I've whiffed it quite a few times.

Aside from that, it's been wonderful. It seems nice and rugged. The sounds aren't offensive. It responds well with no noticeable latency. Some of the built in time-machine kits can be great fun.
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Old 04-12-2015, 03:31 PM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by KamaK View Post
I've owned a DTX532k for a hair over a week now and really like it.
4: There is a definite loss of complexity with any eKit when compared to an acoustic.
Is the 532 the best e-kit you've played?Because it doesn't seem to be a top of the range model judging by the price.The loss of quality might be less noticeable further up the field.A lot of those downsides (especially the hi-hat stuff) would put me off going near it.
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Old 04-12-2015, 06:27 PM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

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Originally Posted by Stupidrumface View Post
Is the 532 the best e-kit you've played?Because it doesn't seem to be a top of the range model judging by the price.
I've demo'ed all of Yamaha's lines. Only the Roland and Yamaha $5000 flagship models are even remotely sonically interesting to me. Even then, it's an apple/oranges comparison. You might as well compare ice skates to roller blades.

The 532K was the cheapest eKit I could find with a realistic hi-hat, with the the exception of the DM8 + add-on-hat, which was just trash. It's been a wonderful practice kit though.
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:10 AM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Cheers for that KamaK.

Not any closer to a decision anyway.That thread on the new Roland kit has opened my eyes a little to e-kits and the fact that they're really maybe not as advanced as I thought they were at this point.There seems to be some fundamental flaws even at the higher end of the spectrum.
There seems to be a lot of love for the 2box out there.Also a lot of people that use e-kits extensively seem to have some form of hybrid setup incorporating a few different pieces of gear from different brands.This has disheartened me a bit because it sounds like more technical work to reach something beyond a sub-standard result.
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  #23  
Old 04-13-2015, 01:33 AM
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scorch whammin scorch whammin is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

From a sound perspective the 2box module is probably as good as it gets...it's got 4GB of flash sample memory (i.e., more sample space means better potential for good sound) ...no other module comes even remotely close, at least from the roland and yamaha camps...
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:34 AM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

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Originally Posted by Stupidrumface View Post
This has disheartened me a bit because it sounds like more technical work to reach something beyond a sub-standard result.
It takes a change in philosophy to counter the disappointment. Inline roller skates/blades will never be iced skates, but within their domain a thriving ecosystem, rich new arts, and a pop-sub culture have emerged. Imagine trying to ice skate on a half pipe, or an ice-skate-park with ramps, a bowl, and inclined rails.

eKits are the same way. While they'll never be a acoustic kit, they don't need to be in order to succeed. Now if only they could get the price down to something reasonable... A TD 30 for $2000 for example.
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Old 04-13-2015, 06:10 AM
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BertTheDrummer BertTheDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

I had a DM10 and I liked the module, especially with the Blue Jay sounds. I like you didn't like the pads and stuff. Why not just keep that and replace the Alesis pads for something like the Pintech mesh pads. Like these http://pintechworld.com/shop/pintech...um-pad-bundle/

Or you could even pair it with like the DDrum Hybrid kit or something similar, basically a standard kit with triggers built in.
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Old 04-13-2015, 09:21 AM
OleDrummer OleDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

It's me again....Upon further review, and after looking at other e-kits and talking to some of you guys, I've decided the best avenue for me at this juncture is to break the bank and go for the 562K with the silicone heads and the better hh w/stand.....These forums really help an ole acoustic drummer with, what I hope is a sound financial decision...


P.S. If the truth be told, and I had $$$$$$$$$ falling from the inner most depths of my anal region, then I would definitely go with the DTX900, but that's just a dream. I believe I'll be happy with the 562K, I hope......

Last edited by OleDrummer; 04-13-2015 at 09:26 AM. Reason: Adding More Info...
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:36 PM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by OleDrummer View Post
P.S. If the truth be told, and I had $$$$$$$$$ falling from the inner most depths of my anal region, then I would definitely go with the DTX900, but that's just a dream. I believe I'll be happy with the 562K, I hope......
Congratulations! Make certain to pick up a comfortable throne and BD pedal. The only other thing I would recommend is picking up extra velcro cable-ties at your local retailer (Target). The kit comes with 6 which is a bit sparse IMHO.
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Old 04-13-2015, 02:22 PM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

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Originally Posted by KamaK View Post
It takes a change in philosophy to counter the disappointment.
This is something I'm trying to appreciate.
The problem I have with your analogy is that I can't identify what benefits an e-kit has over an acoustic set.All I can see is the con side of the e-kit (reduced playability etc.) whereas I don't really see the pros at this point.Being able to switch sounds means nothing to me if I can't play them fluidly,it'd be like having a full length midi keyboard with great sample packs but your controller is actually missing about 20 keys.
Funnily enough I started to think about the first kit I ever had earlier,it was a run of the mill substandard fame e-kit.I loved the thing at first,never looked up any lesson or drum tutorial for a couple of months and just beat the hell out of the thing.It was when I looked up how to play a simple beat that the kit suddenly became sluggish and unusable.I thought the Dm10 would be drastically better but it isn't.The two e-kits I've played have started to persuade me that the instrument is at best an expensive side ornament and not something that you can build your creative process around which is what I want.It does seems slightly possible with some strenuous effort,what annoys me the most is I know I'm going to go through it all and thinking about the time and effort I'd rather exert on something else pisses me off!

I'm amazed the 2box is considered better than the td-30 module at a grand less.
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Old 04-13-2015, 03:08 PM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stupidrumface View Post
The problem I have with your analogy is that I can't identify what benefits an e-kit has over an acoustic set.
As far as I can tell, the benefits would be:

1: Unlimited sonic diversity (can make any sound, including samples). Some of the built in sounds are quite entertaining.
2: Can be recorded as MIDI, making flex, quantization, and sample changes extremely simple. Record once, play back as any synthetic kit your DAW offers.
3: Quiet practice
4: Feature Integration (metronome, play-along, coaching)
5: Hybridization - You can combine your A and E kits

You other option is the A-Kit conversion + Gen16's. It's certainly the most realistic feeling, and may very well be a better fit for you.
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Old 04-13-2015, 05:14 PM
Stupidrumface Stupidrumface is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

An A-kit conversion sounds a bit much,I think I'd be happy enough with mesh heads,I've never even tried them out.My main worry would be dynamics on the cymbals I think.Something with the feel of the Gen16's look suitable.It's putting all the best components together that will really be tiresome I'd say,I imagine there's a lot of crosstalk problems.
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Old 04-13-2015, 10:11 PM
OleDrummer OleDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Can anyone here tell me if the DTX 502 module works with wireless headphones ?
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Old 04-13-2015, 10:34 PM
KamaK KamaK is online now
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by OleDrummer View Post
Can anyone here tell me if the DTX 502 module works with wireless headphones ?
The 502 does not appear to be bluetooth capable, so BT headphones are out. If you pick up a headphone/transmitter combo with analog inputs, that would work fine.
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Old 04-13-2015, 11:20 PM
goughy goughy is offline
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Default Re: Electric dilemma

For me the benefits are quite simple. I have a busy life, young family, and haven't had a kit set up in my house for over 10 years. Now, if I wake up at 4am I can go play and no one has a clue! Forget all the 'doesn't feel like a real kit, doesn't sound like one' blah blah blah. I'm practicing in ways I never have been able to before, learning things I never learned. It has a 100% benefit for me or someone like me. The benefit for my family is 150%.

And while mine is 'only' a 502 module, I would absolutely take this out and gig with it. It's not sheep stations, it's just a bit of fun. I'm not playing for the Stones. Where it's really a lot of fun is as a hybrid kit. Take the 3 zone snare, and a second pad, and have some fun! Maybe drumming is a serious job for some of you, but for all of us it should be a bucket load of fun!
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