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  #1  
Old 12-25-2012, 01:13 PM
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Roy E. Munson Roy E. Munson is offline
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Default Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

If you'd asked me 6 months ago I was the biggest ludwig fan ever. All my favorites are playing them.....Jack White, Steve Gorman, Patrick Keeler, Bonham, AVH, Fab Moretti, and that list goes on and on. Anyways, I had my 1st Classic Maple Kit about 10 years ago. It was an older one, and I loved it. I was not gigging, and just playing to have fun in my little drum room. I then got in a new band, and bought what I though was my dream kit. A set of DW Classic Series. Well first off the kit looked sweet, toms sounded amazing, bass drum sounded like a TKO special. Well Less than a year ago I then go back to the Ludwigs. I order a brand new set of 2012 Classic Maples. Well as expected the drums sounded amazing (After switching all the heads that is). So why is it about 7 months later that I have a bubble in my tom. Bass drum bearing edge flaking on one side, one stripped floor tom leg bracket, a bunch of snare lugs that Im pretty sure are going to strip at any moment, and after each gig I find a new screw and washer floating around in one or two drums. I wanted to love these drums and keep them forever, but I am going to just flat out say it. THEY ARE CHEAP! Why cant ludwig be like DW, TAMA, Craviotto, or Pearl and have awesome hardware on their drums? Or is that why they resonate so much because the hardware is so light, and cheaply made? Well anyways I was sick of the games and basically If I ever get back in the studio I am going to bring my ludwigs, but for playing out and about I just bought a XMAS set of Japan Starclassics. I know tama wont sing to my ears, but I dont have to worry about another floor tom falling over, or my snare drum falling apart. I know others have had this experience as well, and I was warned, but I thought I was buying something different this time around. Also one last question. Why does the tread on the Ludwig floor tom legs have to be so damn high? I dont thing I play the drums that low, but I cant even use Ludwig legs because there is no tread to set up the drum as the height I desire. Oh well. Like I said....sound beautiful, but in my opinion, a lot of entry level kits have better hardware. If they ever change that I'd be back in a second.

**oh and I only play out maybe 3-4 times a month.
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Last edited by Roy E. Munson; 12-25-2012 at 01:16 PM. Reason: added info
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Old 12-25-2012, 03:14 PM
audiotech
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

As the saying goes, "if it wouldn't be for bad luck, you wouldn't have any luck at all".

I've never seen any of the faults that you listed in any of the drums I own, including the DW Classic series, the bass drum will act, sound and tune exactly the way I want it to. My Tama Starclassic Bubinga drums do sing, a deaf person can hear it, or feel it, the same goes for their Maple and Bubinga/Birch kits. And so far I haven't had any issues with my Ludwig Classic Maple drums or their hardware, other than their heads. I guess if the Tama drums don't quite make the grade for you, there's always something else to try.

If you say that you have issues, then I guess that you have issues. I really hope this holiday season and the new year work out well for you.

Dennis
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Old 12-25-2012, 04:38 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

(Dare I ask) Isn't there a warranty on those?
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Old 12-25-2012, 05:18 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Sorry to hear that.
I got my Red Sparkles in 2011. Out of habit,I check the lugs whenever I change heads.. Nothing has loosened up, yet. The Keystone brackets on my floor toms don't seem cheap at all.
I just got a 2009 ,or so, CM Bonham kit.When I took it apart and cleaned it,it seemed solid as a rock.I don't like the Classic brackets as much as the Keystones,though.

All the negative Ludwig experiences on this board have me so paranoid that I constantly check everything. So far,I couldn't be happier.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:26 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Sorry to hear about your issues man.

I'll be the one (again) to say I really haven't had any probs with anything.

I did bust a swivel nut a few weeks ago--but, I was putting a drum back together from a new wrap being put on, and I was using a Tight-Screw that was a little too long, so it was my fault. I had another one in a bin, so I just changed it out.

I've changed the lugs on my snares from tubes, to Imp's, and back again when I've felt like it, so I can't comment on loosening snare shell screws.

I have the Elite leg brackets on my ft's, and the knurled area of the legs go down pretty far. I have my ft's set at 27 3/4-ish to top of the batter hoop. I've also had them down as low as 25 1/2.
The bracket always had knurled area to grip down at 25", but if it gets past to the smooth, then the bracket doesn't hold the leg tight.

Maybe the Keystone bracket has a different grip area?

On my brackets, I changed the wingnuts over to Gibraltar (6mm) nuts because they are nicer to grip than Ludwig's (Elite Bracket) wing nuts were. A nicer feel on a bunch of them (12) is very nice during late night breakdowns! Plus,Gibraltars wing nuts (all sizes) work very well and smoothly. I also added a nylon washer over the metal on on the brackets--which aids in smoothness for tightening and loosening. Just a little "souping up" of the Hot Rod :-)
The new ATLAS wing nuts are amazingly cool, SUPER SMOOTH and solid.

My last full kit (Red Sparkle) was in '07, and I added toms since (probably3-4 years ago). No probs.
I added a couple toms to my Sable Black kit in 2011. No problems with those either.

The shell/wrap issues are a warranty deal since they are new 2012's.
They can/would be replaced. I'd tell Ludwig about the screws loosening when you send the toms/bass drum back just for QC purposes.

When I get new stuff and change the heads, I go through and make sure everything is tight. It could have been tight when it was assembled, but after settling, shipping, playing, stuff can come loose.
Maybe DW puts lock-tite on their screws--wouldn't surprise me, the lock-tite the sh#t out of the pedals...
Sure, people can say "I shouldn't have to go over a drum with a socket", but why not just be satisfied that everything will stay put for your own piece of mind?
You're supposed to re-tighten the lug nuts on your car tires after some miles because vibration can loosen, so I figured I could go over the drums screws that take a lot of vibration.

If I bought ANY brand of kit, I'd do that. It should be done periodically anyway as part of instrument up keep IMO.

The shell split and a bubble is cause for being torqued off, but a few screws can be tightened up. It's kind of a pain, but if the drums sound great....

The only bad thing now is the timing. NAMM is coming up quick, so it might take a bit to get the situation resolved. Maybe not, but I'd be prepared in the event it takes a few weeks to work out.
Whatever you decide, I'd contact the dealer, or Ludwig as soon as the Holidays are over in January. Between now and the first is a good way to get the issue lost in the shuffle.

Good Luck, but I'm sure Ludwig will want to take care of it for you.
Happy Holidays!!
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  #6  
Old 12-25-2012, 07:43 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Haven't had any hardware issues with them, but I will say that the lug and mount screws/nuts inside the drums aren't always torqued down as much as I'd like. So part of the process for me when I get new drums is, when I change the heads, I tighten all interior screws. It's not that they're so loose that they'd actually fall off, but I like a nice, tight fit so the shell and its parts can resonate better (I also remove the lug gaskets at the same time.)

Never had an edge problem either, and my CM kits have all been natural or lacquer, so no wrap issues for me.

I'd absolutely have the dealer contact Ludwig on this. Ludwig has been on a major quality control improvement campaign starting late last year, and whether anything's slipped through, or you got a kit that was made prior to about 14 months ago, they will want to make good on it. Tell 'em I sent you. They know I'm their #1 fan, as well as their #1 critic when something isn't just right.

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  #7  
Old 12-25-2012, 09:25 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

There's a lot to be said about drum manufactures hiring actual drummers, or people with some experience with the instrument.

If the person assembling the drum is a drummer, they're going to make sure the lug screw is snug so to speak and maybe suggest the knurl on the fl tom legs be longer etc. little stuff that makes a difference.

Im not suggesting I know LUDWIGS hiring practices (b/c I don't), Im just saying little issues are less likely to happen when the people putting the stuff together are familiar with its usage.
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Old 12-25-2012, 10:13 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Oh yeah .... I remember now .......
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=91834
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=91396
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=90663
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Old 12-25-2012, 10:21 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

My thoughts exactly Harry. Some people cannot be satisfied. Dude should buy a Mydentity and zip his trap shut.
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Old 12-25-2012, 10:22 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Oh yeah .... I remember now .......
Hah! I thought that name looked familiar... I really do enjoy a little forum drama from time to time. Keeps the place lively.
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Last edited by Red Menace; 12-26-2012 at 12:18 AM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 12:10 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

I do have warranty...bought them from Forks, but its all good. Like I said I am keeping them. And as for never being satisfied. I love the black beauty I have had for 10+ years, and my paiste cymbals. I guess I just expect a lot out of my gear when I spend all that kind of money. sorry.
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Old 12-26-2012, 04:05 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

i don't understand how screws in a shell can come loose after they have been tightened.... how much abuse would it take to have things rattling right off your shells?
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:15 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by mikeo View Post
i don't understand how screws in a shell can come loose after they have been tightened.... how much abuse would it take to have things rattling right off your shells?
Never said I tightened them. I did however after a few fell off go around the kit and tighten everything up. The Ludwig Maple Classic quality is just not there. Other companies are blowing them away. However, maybe thats why they sound good to my ear. The light weight "cheap" hardware lets the drums sing i guess? For club gigging, and moving the drums in gig bags I need something more reliable.
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:25 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by Roy E. Munson View Post
Never said I tightened them. I did however after a few fell off go around the kit and tighten everything up. The Ludwig Maple Classic quality is just not there. Other companies are blowing them away. However, maybe thats why they sound good to my ear. The light weight "cheap" hardware lets the drums sing i guess? For club gigging, and moving the drums in gig bags I need something more reliable.
I've never seen this issue with Ludwigs from the 80s or earlier. I wonder if this would just be a quality-control issue with the newer stuff? Sometimes machine tolerances can be too exacting whereas back in the day, you had a lot of friction going on.
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:37 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

My roommate's 1991 Classics are built like a tank.
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:47 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

The Ludwig Maple Classic quality is just not there. Other companies are blowing them away.



This should not be happening, they're assembled in the USA.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:15 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

I beginning to think maybe you have a lemon?
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:28 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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I beginning to think maybe you have a lemon?
I'm beginning to think that Harry is closer to the mark.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:37 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by Les Ismore View Post
The Ludwig Maple Classic quality is just not there. Other companies are blowing them away.



This should not be happening, they're assembled in the USA.
That doesnt really mean anything. Look at Ford Motor Company.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:02 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by Roy E. Munson View Post
That doesnt really mean anything. Look at Ford Motor Company.

Hey now, Im originally from Detroit, don't be putting down FORD... wait, go ahead, my family all worked for GM and Chrysler.

Drum manufacturing is on a small scale comparatively.

You could've gotten the first kit made on a monday after a holiday weekend, or the last kit made at quitting time b/f a holiday break... both might qualify as a lemon.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:05 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by Les Ismore View Post
Hey now, Im originally from Detroit, don't be putting down FORD... wait, go ahead, my family all worked for GM and Chrysler.

Drum manufacturing is on a small scale comparatively.

You could've gotten the first kit made on a monday after a holiday weekend, or the last kit made at quitting time b/f a holiday break... both might qualify as a lemon.
Im from Detroit too. Go Wings....wait nevermind.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:41 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

I'm sorry you're having trouble - I would definitely contact Ludwig to discuss your problems. I'm suprised to read your complaints - I've been buying Ludwig drums and hardware since 1970 and have never had any quality issues or problems.

I have a 1963 kit that's in great shape, 2 Classic Maple kits (one red sparkle & one natural maple), a Bonham-reissue Vistalite kit, and 8 Ludwig snare drums of different sizes and ages. All are absolutely reliable and tune up easily. I could not be happier with Ludwig - the only reason I ever sold any Ludwig drums was to afford to buy other Ludwig drums :-)

(Edit: I have to say I remember having 2 problems with P-85 snare strainers on Ludwig snares - those tiny screws came loose, I lost the screws = strainer is useless, Ludwig doesn't have replacement screws...I just bought 2 P-86 instead. Much better quality, but I should not have had to replace the P-85s)

Call somebody in Monroe, NC - I'd be really suprised if they didn't stand behind their product quality.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:56 PM
RodneyZepa RodneyZepa is offline
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Sorry to hear about the problems as I find it awfully exciting to buy a new kit and then problems arise...Bummer man bummer...I bought set of Classic Maples (Power 4 Series) a couple of years ago and have gig'ed them about a dozen times while playing them daily and haven't had any problems what so ever...When I ordered this set, however, I asked for 24x16 instead of 24x18 (Power 4 includes 24x18...I should have just left it alone though as that 24x18 was killer..!!..24x16 is nice as well, but, 18 " depth really was a kick in chest...)...Ludwig sent me the 24x18 and I sent it back for the 24x16 and got it back in about 6 weeks...Not bad considering from Munroe, NC to Kelowna, BC...I was impressed with Ludwig and think maybe your set was one where someone else ordered same kit as you and had a problem and sent it back to Ludwig and you may have ended up with that kit..?..I've seen this happen not only with instruments but other items...You wouldn't expect this to happen, but, who knows...Best of Luck and I hope you are swinging on a solid set of CM's real soon...RZ...
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:37 AM
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Chunkaway Chunkaway is offline
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

I have had a Ludwig Classic Maple (2008) and Ludwig Legacy kits (2011, 2012) and I have never had a problem with any of my Ludwig drums.

Sorry to hear about your problems.
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:17 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Ludwig's continuing problems are the reasons I purchased another brand of drums. I know several drum department managers and store owners who have had a lot of problems that Ludwig's reps would not resolve. The Ludwig name seems to carry some sort of "bad vibe".

Even though the company is not perfect, I still love the sound of Ludwig drums (old and new). In fact, I still have my original kit from the 60's. and a kit from the 70's. When I was younger, I just accepted the fact that the drums were not perfectly manufactured.
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Old 12-28-2012, 04:55 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

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Originally Posted by KirbyM View Post
Ludwig's continuing problems...
This has been discussed before, and while Ludwig - and just about every company - has had its share of problems, they're on track and turning out excellent quality. The problems are not continuing, the drums in question were either made before the new policies in Monroe kicked-in late in 2011, or they're the kind of unfortunate anomaly that every company experiences. But they're not indicative of the quality that Ludwig is producing these days. If the problems were ongoing, I would have terminated my endorsement.

I've suggested that Dan contact the dealer about the drums. Ludwig should take care of things.

Bermuda
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:10 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

Sorry to hear of your issues with your Classic Maples, contacting Ludwig directly would be my first course of action to resolve these issues. My Legacy Classic has been percect no issues at ll.
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Old 12-28-2012, 10:19 PM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

While Ludwig/Conn-Selmer does have a customer service #, they may or may not handle problems directly. This is why they have a dealer network. After all, when you have a problem with your car, you don't call the manufacturer... you go to the dealer and they facilitate any repairs or replacement.

Of course drums are a more personal type of purchase, and Ludwig may choose to handle it with the customer. They are very keen on making sure drummers are happy with their purchases. I still say start with the dealer though, that's the correct protocol.

Bermuda
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  #29  
Old 12-29-2012, 02:16 AM
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Default Re: Ludwig Classic Maple.....Awesome Sound, but falling apart.

It took me years before I gained the confidence in owning Ludwig drums. Every time I was ready to pursue my purchase, someone was posting about problems that they were having with their Ludwig kits. I finally bought my drums about a year ago and haven't had any issues so far. I knew that if I did have issues, the Five Star shop where I purchased mine would go tooth and nail for me to get things resolved. They seem to be Very convincing to the manufacturers where customer service is concerned.

Dennis
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