Did speed come easily for any of you?

I think some people are born with the ability to play fast or get fast quickly and some aren't. I'm the latter. I have to work really hard for every BPM gained. It can be discouraging to watch Buddy Rich or guys like Jonathan Davis play insanely fast like it's nothing. I know there's more to drumming than playing fast but it seems like all the guys that say that can play fast!

So did speed come easily for any of you?

I'm currently at the process of gaining speed, and for 1 week I'm quite faster by following some youtube lessons (rudiments and rolls). I think focusing on gaining speed, will actually help you do so. Waiting for speed to come naturally might take longer.

Maybe you should take a break from speed training. Usually returns diminish as someone gets discouraged - one of the lessons I've learned in the last couple years is that my progress in a practice session is extremely, extremely mental. Give it a month and work on something else, maybe more precise coordination (that's what I'm doing).

I've never worked too much on speed, namely for the reason you said - there's other stuff to do, and depending on what kind of drumming you're into it may be a rather low priority anyway. But I'm usually able to play as fast as I want to when I want to. The reason I say that is to say working on other things may help you in your speed quest anyway.

All in all, it's not a race, regardless of how fast you get, Buddy will always be faster than all of us lol. Just focus on getting where you want to be in a way that's healthy for your body and for your love of drumming. If that takes a month, great, if it takes 10 years great. Just enjoy the journey.

I think you're right. I've been playing drums since I was around 11 or 12, and at 22 years old, I'm still not as quick as a lot of drummers in my area who have been playing half the time I have. That being said, I am the better time keeper (not gloating.) So I don't mind too terribly much.

drumdevil9 said:

So did speed come easily for any of you?

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No, it wasn't easy, but speed alone, as per bpm value, and playing fast is only part of the concept, in order to play fast with the right feel, dynamics, groove and consitency, you have to be able to hear fast, think fast, react fast, read fast, see fast, feel fast, otherwise it's very likely to encounter some struggle at extreme tempo.

The key to the start of speed development for me was getting my hand technique right which meant going back on a year of playing with bad hand technique.

Are your hands holding you back?

Otherwise I think you need daily work on speed excercises.

1+2+3+4e+a repeat about a thousand million times. Speed up as you go then play 16ths for the 3 then add the 2 then all 4.

"Easily" might be a bit overexaggerated in my case as I've been investing much time into practice, but there have been some big speed jumps. Plus I had a pretty good start with double bass speed (4th day having a double pedal - and no pedal prior to that - I hit 200-210 bpm), but hitting a certain speed and having full/good control over that speed range and be capable of applying various patterns (keeping an eye on dynamics) and implementing that stuff into "real music" is a big difference. I'm still doing exercises only, no implementation into real music yet.

As to footwork... Usually that's a few hours per day (practicing footwork while working at the PC). Heel-up max speed is 240 bpm, but while I hit that speed after some 6-7 months being into drumming, I'm still stuck at that max speed (although it feels easier now, with more control). "Now" = still under 2 years of drumming.

I'm keeping a practice log on the Derek Roddy forum - in the 1st post you'll find some speed values (max speed w/ feet) I'ev been hitting.

What I'm Practicing / Arky
http://www.derekroddy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=20250

Well the downside if you're hitting good speed in a relatively short amount of time is there won't be any major progress or bpm explosions any more. It might even feel a bit frustrating to be still in the same speed range as months ago. The difference is I can do more stuff at those speeds than in the past. Another aspect is that you're "appreciating" speed differently - I have huge respect for higher speed ranges because having hit them, I see the "depth" there is... Tons of control to acquire to actually manage those speeds, not just hit them. Also, various techniques feel quite differently at the same speed so one of my goals is to work on the weak points - which isn't top speed any more, but control.

Interestingly, I can hit 240 w/ heel-up but have started practicing flams with my feet only recently. Now that was hard in the beginning (still working on it)! I can guarantee you, hitting 200+ bpm has close to nothing to do with having control in slower speed regions or with more challenging stuff like flams. So getting various rudiments/patterns etc. as balanced as possible is what I'll be working on in the future.

I see some parallels to a mixing board and working on a music mix: In my case some channel faders are up all the way (but maybe some EQ and compression missing, haha) while other channels are so low in the mix that you can't hear them. Now if you have the wrong faders up all the way with some important tracks being too soft or inaudible altogether that would make a crappy mix, wouldn't it?

I picked up the double kick alot faster than my peers but my hand technique just wasn't good enough to push beyond certain barriers. It would be a different story now that I'm learning to use my hands properly but my metal days are over for now.

Mad About Drums said:

No, it wasn't easy, but speed alone, as per bpm value, and playing fast is only part of the concept, in order to play fast with the right feel, dynamics, groove and consitency, you have to be able to hear fast, think fast, react fast, read fast, see fast, feel fast, otherwise it's very likely to encounter some struggle at extreme tempo.

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Perfectly stated..............

I'm not as fast as i would like to be yet, but since i got into jazz drumming a couple of weeks ago i am learning to approach speed differently. It is obvious that speed in jazz is different than metal, since there are so many old men playing jazz still at a crazy tempo that would probably get a heart attack if they tried that with metal.

Speed came easily...but did not come quickly..

Speed came easily - but evenness did not...

speed and control came suprisingly easy and fast for my feet, my hands are a way different story ive had to train them painstakingly and its been a very,very slow process.

Both hands and feet are fast and powerful with singles; slow and weak with doubles.

Does it surprise anyone that I've been practicing singles longer than doubles ?

In many ways for me speed did come easy, but it's due to technique. When you find the "right" or "best" way to play something, playing fast suddenly gets infinitely easier. Most people are blown away when they see someone play fast because they're imposing their technical approach on that speed (90% of the time the guy playing fast is playing differently than the amazed spectator word).

Playing fast requires 3 things: lower stick heights to make it easier, a lighter touch into the drum to make it easier, and a change in technique to make it easier. Playing fast actually is pretty easy once you know the technical approach which makes it easy. Many students are amazed at how quickly they get faster after I help them alter their technical approach. Of course at some point as you're reaching a high standard it gets harder and harder to get a little bit faster.

This clip has some pretty fast moments in it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61nCj2iz3QI

Yes, it did when I was young.
What I lacked in technique I made up for with youthful energy and tenacity, then the correct techniques pushed me further.

It's not like a riding a bike though, you have to keep at it everyday or you'll lose that top speed which I think is just unnatural for the human body hence, we can't keep it without major sacrifice. much like bodybuilding.

I'm not as fast as I used to be but, I haven't wanted for any more speed either. if I spend a week or two on speed I notice a difference straight away but you hit the wall pretty quick and I've rarely had the chance to use that speed. i used to be in a death metal band when I was a teenager so it was important to me then.

Sometimes now when I see guys like Dennis Chambers tearing around the kit or some nameless death metal drummer hitting drum machine speeds I kind of want to spend more time developing my speed so I go through a speed phase every once in a while.

I do believe every human has a physical limit, a natural cap that no amount of practise will push you past. we're all differwnt shapes and sizes, look at athletes, not everyone can get gold just because they run everyday so i think the whole 'I play on pillows' theory is rubbish. Play on a drum and find your limits, then, try to accept your natural cap.

Mad About Drums said:

... in order to play fast with the right feel, dynamics, groove and consistency, you have to be able to hear fast, think fast, react fast, read fast, see fast, feel fast...

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Good point, Henri. That's why I don't play fast. The thinking fast side really doesn't work for me. I can't even keep up with hip hop lyrics let alone deal with fast arrangements. I'm not a fast person; it's simply not how I operate.

Funnily enough, like Chunky I found speed fairly easy when I was young and made up for lack of technique with "youthful energy and tenacity" (nicely put, Chunky). Later, due to poor technique (well covered by Bill) I found it all a bit of a chore. Unlike Chunky, I never sorted out the technical side.

Fortunately, I didn't just slow down physically. I now love playing in a cruisy way, which is more natural for me. I don't even want to listen to fast music most of the time, let alone play it. I love lots of space and feel.

But if you are someone who needs that adrenaline rush then what Bill talked about is the best way to go. I guess some of us hope we might be Moonie #2 but while many have tried, few made it, though they no doubt had fun while it lasted.

I like the speed exercises in one of Virgil Donati's first videos (can't remember which). But you set the metronome and hit four hits on a particular drum or cymbal and then switch to another, while keeping time. Then when you are able to move around the kit in time at that tempo - while maybe increasing the space between the hit items - you kick the tempo up a bit.

It's a fun little exercise and if you add foot pattens to it, it isn't that un-musical. And it will build up speed. It's more of a challenge if you try to keep dynamics the same, NOT accenting the 1st hit of the grouping.

I still love seeing speed and sheer technique for its own sake sometimes. Seeing Rufus "Speedy" Jones or Buddy Rich shredding like maniacs... it's a blast.

Stil struggling to get a smooth 200 bpm with my hands and KEEP IT THERE for at least a few minutes.

Speed alone isn't my real problem - my issue is to have the endurance to keep up the speed, and that seems to be a bit arbitrary. When someone says they can play at 300+ - for how long can they keep that speed?

Also agree with post #5 - music is in the head and you need to hear it before you can play it.

Ask them and they will tell you.

If someone "can" do some specific speed - then they "can" do it. Be it for 2 seconds or 2 hours, they "can" do it, the max speed is just one parameter - as is the duration you can play at a certain tempo. Dynamic control (across all the speed ranges) is yet another one. Or having the ability to lead with your weaker hand/foot at that tempo. Etc etc. We're talking various parameters here, but max speed is max speed. And usually people can't hold their max speed for too long, physically that would be a strange phenomenon.

Sure there's a huge difference between max speed, endurance and the speed ranges which one has down well enough to actually use it in a song context.

That question "yes, but how long can they hold that speed?" seems so odd to me. There's a specific speed for certain techniques/stickings etc. which _everybody_ will be able to maintain for only a few seconds, from the world's worst to the world's best drummers. Because that's the way our body is working. The world's best weightlifters can handle x weight (and for setting records they need _1_ repetition) and nobody is asking them: "Great, ok, but how many times can you lift up that weight? Just one time? Man, that's lame!" Well reduce the resistance/weight/speed/difficulty level and you can do it for longer time. Some go for sprints, some go for running marathon, some find something in-between.

Just try for yourself and play at your MAX speed - how long can you hold that? My guess is 5-10 seconds. If more then you could go faster but for shorter durations - push yourself more and it will happen.