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  #41  
Old 12-27-2013, 10:41 PM
drumming sort of person drumming sort of person is offline
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Originally Posted by taiko View Post
I play jazz and I don't see Pearl as a jazz instrument.
What is it about Pearl's drums that say "not for jazz" to you?
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  #42  
Old 12-27-2013, 10:44 PM
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shemp shemp is offline
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Well, it seems to me that it is your opinion that opinions are useless. I'm not sure why there needs to be a thread police. If you don't think this is a useful thread, don't post to it and don't read it.
I like your gumption....and I like the fact that you don't care what others think of your opinion...and you should be able to say as much. I condone it 100%.

I think sometimes it is more respected if when disagreeing with someone, you recognize and pay due respect to whom you are disagreeing with. In this case, there was constructive criticism of your topic....and your retort was a bit emotional and a bit disrespectful. I think the content of what you said is ok but the admin did not deserve to have it handed to him. Just say the same thing, but with a bit more tact and deference.

Disagreement is ok...even violent disagreement as long as it is framed calmly and objectively with due respect.
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  #43  
Old 12-27-2013, 11:30 PM
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Originally Posted by shemp View Post
I like your gumption....and I like the fact that you don't care what others think of your opinion...and you should be able to say as much. I condone it 100%.

I think sometimes it is more respected if when disagreeing with someone, you recognize and pay due respect to whom you are disagreeing with. In this case, there was constructive criticism of your topic....and your retort was a bit emotional and a bit disrespectful. I think the content of what you said is ok but the admin did not deserve to have it handed to him. Just say the same thing, but with a bit more tact and deference.

Disagreement is ok...even violent disagreement as long as it is framed calmly and objectively with due respect.
Well, actually, I wasn't intending (or feeling) any emotion when I wrote it, so if that's how it came off, sorry about that. I simply was indicating my opinion on this. And, my opinion is simply that if people are going to be shut down for their opinions, then this isn't the place for me. That's fine. I have this rather strange and increasingly unAmerican notion that free speech is a good thing.

There have been some really interesting posts on this thread and I've found it useful to learn what others think about the comparison idea. I'm still not clear on what useful criteria are for comparing drums, but I also think it is simply a fact that we end up doing it.

Anyway, this has probably been milked for all it can get on this thread. I actually don't think the original thread that was closed down was all that bad an idea. It all depends upon how one ranks best, worst, whatever. I agree with many points here that you can't do much in terms of sound because it is very personal. But I do think build quality is something that can be compared.
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  #44  
Old 12-27-2013, 11:33 PM
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Originally Posted by drumming sort of person View Post
What is it about Pearl's drums that say "not for jazz" to you?
That's a good question. And I'm not entirely sure what it is. It may be simply that none of my jazz hero drummers play Pearl. As I said, this isn't rational in this case. But I think a lot of what drummers base their opinions about what is good/bad, right for this music or that, isn't very rational. That shouldn't justify it, but there it is.
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  #45  
Old 12-27-2013, 11:39 PM
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MrInsanePolack MrInsanePolack is offline
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Originally Posted by taiko View Post
My contention is that the only real basis on which one can compare companies is on craftsmanship. And even that is problematic since many companies these days have excellent production processes, at least among the companies that produce high end kits. DW, Gretsch, Yamaha, Canopus, Ludwig, etc. all produce great drums.

Individual drum sets are compared on the basis of sound and, thus, taste.

Maybe we can turn this around another way. Are there any products that you would not purchase on the basis of either actual quality or the image of the quality that the drum company has? By this, I don't mean sound, I mean build quality of the product. Another way to ask this is which companies have positive vs. negative images and why?

The above mentioned DW, Gretsch, Yamaha, Canopus, Ludwig all have positive images in my mind. Trixon, Dixon, Rogers (the recent ones), and Pearl don't have positive images in my mind. For me, drums made in China have a negative image, but this probably is not fair, as I think companies like Yamaha are making very good instruments in China. Also, China and Taiwan should not be confused. Taiwan makes some great drums. Anything made in Japan I see as having very high quality. US is mixed. Germany is high quality.
This post is about as skewed as a curved straight line. You continually knock Pearl, yet they are made in both China AND Taiwan AND Japan for their Latin line of products. You say US is mixed, yet continue to afford the position that DW, Gretsch, and Ludwig are the top end makers. Yamaha is now made in China. Are they going to lose some street cred for that?

You say we should base the ranking on craftsmanship. There are posts all over this site with QC issues coming from Ludwig. Should they still be on the top? Pearl, who you don't seem to like for some reason, offers a lifetime guarantee on their drums, and even have an ad where they park a Hummer on top of one of their drums. That in itself shows that they care about how their drums are crafted and are well built. Would you park a Hummer on top of some DW's? So why are they still crap? Because they are Asian?

Ranking companies seems a bit ridiculous to me. If they sound and look good to you, play them. Who cares where they are from.
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  #46  
Old 12-28-2013, 05:34 AM
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Default Re: Comparing Drum Companies

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
This post is about as skewed as a curved straight line. You continually knock Pearl, yet they are made in both China AND Taiwan AND Japan for their Latin line of products. You say US is mixed, yet continue to afford the position that DW, Gretsch, and Ludwig are the top end makers. Yamaha is now made in China. Are they going to lose some street cred for that?

You say we should base the ranking on craftsmanship. There are posts all over this site with QC issues coming from Ludwig. Should they still be on the top? Pearl, who you don't seem to like for some reason, offers a lifetime guarantee on their drums, and even have an ad where they park a Hummer on top of one of their drums. That in itself shows that they care about how their drums are crafted and are well built. Would you park a Hummer on top of some DW's? So why are they still crap? Because they are Asian?

Ranking companies seems a bit ridiculous to me. If they sound and look good to you, play them. Who cares where they are from.
You didn't read my post very carefully. I said I do not have a positive image of Pearl. I did not say they are crap. I also said that my perspective is not particularly rational. I have absolutely nothing against Asian drums. Great drums are made in Japan and Taiwan. I've spent many years in Japan and have a pretty good sense of what quality is like there. I'm less convinced about China, but also noted that Yamaha builds some very good instruments in their China plant.
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