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  #41  
Old 05-22-2011, 02:17 AM
DeanOdgers DeanOdgers is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

Im not sure why you are still replying or even made this post, obviously your mind is made up or your just to egotistical to listen to some very sensible suggestions.

To say having lessons will limit your personal expression and style is just wrong, simply wrong. Like mentioned Steve Jordon and Keith Carlock really have there own unique sound and they have both studied and STILL study and surprise surprise they STILL have there own sound.
Lessons give you the facility to express yourself without having the issue of technique holding you back.
If you want to develop your sound by bad technique and just hacking away at your kit, sit in your room along and bang away

And music isnt a career? Seriously? you think all the musicians you listen to just get together on the weekends and play for an hour or so?
Put your ego aside maybe then you will develop as a musician
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  #42  
Old 05-22-2011, 02:57 AM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by skreg View Post
I skipped the flame war, but here's my perspective as a 22 yr old non-music college student (computer science and mathematics).
A team of qualified posters attempting to correct the confused logic of an obstinate poster does not constitute a flame war. Respectfully Sheldon, I wish the larger number would skip this broad generalization when more often than not it's just a condescending flame in of itself thrown out there to elevate the lecturer. I agree with your perspective that college degrees in music are unnecessary, and had you not in your words skipped the flame war you would have gleaned the detail that would have substantiated both our perspectives. AS MFB correctly pointed out, Chris began with your correct music degree generalization then in his same paragraph expanded the point to include all formal teachers.

And yeah I understand the stress a great deal. I'm a year younger than you trying to do it right now. But then there are those times when that same stress elevates my creative process while musicians and artists have recounted similar experiences for centuries. What I am saying is that none of this is cut and dry. However, without some kind of formal training, by this time the negative personal outcomes would have been a certainty.
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  #43  
Old 05-22-2011, 07:27 AM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

As the OP, it was disappointing to see folks argue about which advice was best. I wanted all different perspectives and advice and then sift through it myself. It's fine to disagree, and with a topic like this it is expected, but taking up the whole thread with a back and forth about who has the best advice was like trying to use a broken pencil - there's no point. (Pardon the pun, trying to lighten the mood)

Thanks to all who have given their opinion regarding my questions/ situation, and keep it coming.
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Old 05-22-2011, 09:25 AM
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  #44  
Old 05-22-2011, 09:39 AM
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Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by PreppieNerd View Post
As the OP, it was disappointing to see folks argue about which advice was best.
Ask, and ye shall receive mate. What ye shall receive is up for grabs on a public forum.

In this case, I personally didn't see anything disappointing. I saw a broad statement agreed with in part.....but one solitary point made was quite rightly questioned and from that, a viable and factual alternative was provided.

The way I see it, this thread is everything a forum should be. With some damn good food for thought provided. I know it's your thread, but in the long run everyone can take something away from it. Me? I reckon it's been a great thread. But of course, YMMV. :-)
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  #45  
Old 05-22-2011, 09:45 AM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by PreppieNerd View Post
As the OP, it was disappointing to see folks argue about which advice was best. I wanted all different perspectives and advice and then sift through it myself. It's fine to disagree, and with a topic like this it is expected, but taking up the whole thread with a back and forth about who has the best advice was like trying to use a broken pencil - there's no point. (Pardon the pun, trying to lighten the mood)

Thanks to all who have given their opinion regarding my questions/ situation, and keep it coming.
It is far, far more disappointing to see the OP enforce a character lecture on the very people from whom he enlisted assistance, then watch him try to wedge in that broken pencil crack to be clever at the expense of his benafactors. Moreover, when you post one of these threads it becomes public...meaning the information dispensed is not entirely yours alone, with the secondary correct assumption being there is someone out there actually paying attention who appreciates the trouble you just saved him. Had you wanted a more personal channel then a pm might have been the logical route.

Frankly, some of us believed this so called contrary viewpoint to be no viewpoint at all. In fact I believed it damaging enough to cause harm to an inexperienced reader...meaning that a more serious rebuttal was in order regardless of how that fit within the OPs undefined decorum standards. This was after all career advice and not the hobby kind..right?...because if that's the case then the lighter mood might not be what you're looking for. In my short but varied experiences the only guys I'm seeing out here in this real world place have their game faces on.

I think this will be the last time I offer anything unless specifically asked. It is far too obvious that most who ask this kind of advice merely glean a mood as opposed to actually synthesizing the information. IMO This parallel reality thinking is a big waste of time that deters the actual progress some of us make by actually doing it as opposed to talking about it or pretending to have done it in some unverifiable past life. In fact encouraging such behavior only opens the door for one of these other guys to (as bigd said in another thread) accidentally take a gig that was supposed to go to a more more serious person anyway.

Good luck.
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  #46  
Old 05-22-2011, 12:39 PM
bigd bigd is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

I'd like to address the "music degree is unneccessary for a career in music posts". You people have too little a scope of the music industry. You only think about popular/jazz music and playing in a band. At this time there are several upper level positions in military bands holding auditions for percussion/drumset players. The people who get these jobs won't be people who went through the military music system. They are looking for qualified pros with actual music degrees masters and docorate level. The requirements to auditon include many mallet, snare drum, accessory excerpts as well as 8-10 jazz charts you are required to auditon on. If you only play the drumset you can't even get an audition. Also you can't even walk through the door at an audition for an orchestra or a college teaching position without a college degree. There are also people who I graduated from music school with who work for major drum companies. They got the job because of school. All of the above mentioned jobs come with an actual payroll check and benefits. The music business has a lot of opportunities for people who take the actual time to get a degree.
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  #47  
Old 05-22-2011, 03:26 PM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by mattsmith View Post
It is far, far more disappointing to see the OP enforce a character lecture on the very people from whom he enlisted assistance
Yep, just realized that was kinda dumb. I was just trying to coax it back on topic, but enough people are doing that anyway. I constantly forget that what's in my brain doesn't always get exactly communicated the way I think it will when typed onto the internet. I'll just sit back and not worry about it. Thanks again to everyone for the insights. Carry on.
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  #48  
Old 05-22-2011, 03:51 PM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by mattsmith View Post
A team of qualified posters attempting to correct the confused logic of an obstinate poster does not constitute a flame war. Respectfully Sheldon, I wish the larger number would skip this broad generalization when more often than not it's just a condescending flame in of itself thrown out there to elevate the lecturer.
Apologies. No disrespect intended. I'm just surprised to see people here arguing. I know everybody here is trying to give their best advice.

-sheldon
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  #49  
Old 05-22-2011, 03:56 PM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigd View Post
I'd like to address the "music degree is unneccessary for a career in music posts". You people have too little a scope of the music industry. You only think about popular/jazz music and playing in a band. At this time there are several upper level positions in military bands holding auditions for percussion/drumset players. The people who get these jobs won't be people who went through the military music system. They are looking for qualified pros with actual music degrees masters and docorate level. The requirements to auditon include many mallet, snare drum, accessory excerpts as well as 8-10 jazz charts you are required to auditon on. If you only play the drumset you can't even get an audition. Also you can't even walk through the door at an audition for an orchestra or a college teaching position without a college degree. There are also people who I graduated from music school with who work for major drum companies. They got the job because of school. All of the above mentioned jobs come with an actual payroll check and benefits. The music business has a lot of opportunities for people who take the actual time to get a degree.
This +1

I don't have any real scope of the music industry as a whole, but I can see that serious positions in academia require degrees. There are certainly good jobs available, but the competition is intense - even for those with degrees.

-sheldon
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  #50  
Old 05-22-2011, 08:28 PM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

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Originally Posted by skreg View Post
Apologies. No disrespect intended. I'm just surprised to see people here arguing. I know everybody here is trying to give their best advice.

-sheldon
Eh... it's all plain text though.

I don't argue. I discuss. No different than if we were sitting around having a beer having a good time. But sadly, just plain text and a poor word choice or two can make it appear as if there is anger or an argument. Although I admit, I don't care for people trying to claim my point of if view is invalid for no particular reason, but whatever. It's not worth being upset about. .


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  #51  
Old 05-22-2011, 10:22 PM
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rogue_drummer rogue_drummer is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

I don't have any real scope of the music industry as a whole, but I can see that serious positions in academia require degrees. There are certainly good jobs available, but the competition is intense - even for those with degrees.

I can relate to that. My soon-to-be step-daughter plays clarinet and is working on her second masters in music. This time in music theory. What amazes me is that she can't get a job with a symphony orchestra in a decent sized city UNLESS she has either a masters or doctorate in music, much less academia. The competition is severly tough and only those with the right credentials can make a decent living at that level. Before you can even get an audition, you have to have the right tickets punched. For those who spend the years and effort getting the degrees, the job and benefits far outweigh the costs.

It's unfortunate that today's "pop" music scene is littered with those who have no musical abilty whatsoever, yet make millions doing it. This only causes the younger generations to falsly believe or dream that they too can make a fortune by just learning a few songs and wearing fancy costums. My humble opinion....
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  #52  
Old 05-23-2011, 01:51 AM
DeanOdgers DeanOdgers is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

It's unfortunate that today's "pop" music scene is littered with those who have no musical abilty whatsoever, yet make millions doing it. rogue_drummer

I agree that it sucks all the pretty boy and girls with no talent (keisha) are making money, but most of time the the session guys get work making there music sound half decent, I know a pretty well known Australian band that had there whole album recorded by session guys. And look at all the records the wrecking crew did, such as the monkeys.
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  #53  
Old 05-23-2011, 07:56 AM
Ian Ian is offline
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

You wanna be a musician? Get your MBA, 'cause you'll need it.

I got a degree and I sell advertising, which supports my music habit, mortgage, wife, and child.

The question is, as I see it, what do YOU want? Do you want freedom from loans, nice vacations, and retirement? Do you want to slug it out in the trenches with other musicians (some of whom have freedom from debt, nice vacations, and retirement)?

You've got great advice and encouragement here. Every pro musician I know works harder than I do and their passion is their job. That is both admirable and a nightmare to me, but you may be different.

If I were you I'd get a teacher and study AND stay in school.
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  #54  
Old 05-23-2011, 08:50 PM
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Default Re: Looking for college/career/life advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by PreppieNerd View Post
As the OP, it was disappointing to see folks argue about which advice was best. I wanted all different perspectives and advice and then sift through it myself. It's fine to disagree, and with a topic like this it is expected, but taking up the whole thread with a back and forth about who has the best advice was like trying to use a broken pencil - there's no point. (Pardon the pun, trying to lighten the mood)
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