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  #1  
Old 08-21-2013, 09:11 PM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Why are antique snares worth so little?

So I am a huge lover of vintage and antique drums and one of my all time fav snares is my 1920s Boosey & Hawkes snare, but I am DESPERATELY after an acrolite and so asked how much I could get for my snare. Now admitantly the snares are new and it has 2 small holes in it for some reason, and because of that they said it could only be sold for parts and that in perfect condition could only be worth 30. But this is a brass snare with brass hardware and the shell is either seamless or invisible seam.... so why is it worth so little :/
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Maybe they're trying to pull a fast one on you?

Or maybe they don't know any better?

Unless it's a truly horrible snare and that is what it is actually worth ;)
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:20 PM
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gretsch-o-rama gretsch-o-rama is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

As drummer, Ive traded a lot of stuff in to shops..Guitar Center, etc. I regret all of it. Trade ins are every shops biggest profit margin because of how little they give you...Im willing to guess it's a nice snare and worth more than that...possibly much more than that...You've got to find the market, which for vintage, for me, is online...some collector out there is probably looking for one of these and is willing to pay more...
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:32 PM
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leanneislearningtodrum leanneislearningtodrum is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Hi StaggerLee,

I hear you on this one! I have a 1920's set that was appraised for only 400$. (poor quality photo attached). The bass drum has a couple of tears from 40 years stored in an attic, but aside from being out of tune the snare is in ok shape. The fellow who came said that there just isn't a market for drums from the 20's - they're more 'collectors pieces'/'decorative pieces' than 'playable'. I'm fortunate to know someone who was interested in the cymbals and the snare for their unusual sound so I sold them separately and plan to sell the rest online on kijiji or ebay at some point. The snare sold for 100$ Cdn and 100$ for both cymbals together.

:)Leanne
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:31 PM
mandrew mandrew is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

I have heard a number of drums online that were vintage that had been refurbished and were still very playable. In fact, some of the old 15" brass snares still sound awesome with new heads and snares.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdbEpUffvYs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTmuMNamL1M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gpffNpDwfk

These drums are still killers and still very playable!
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:01 AM
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harryconway harryconway is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Some drums are worth a lot ..... and some aren't. Just 'cause something is old doesn't mean it's desirable. And desirable translates into dollar value. That said, you mentioned extra holes, and a new (and I'll assume non-stock) snares. And in the "vintage" game ..... factory original counts. So I'm not surprised that $50 is all a shop would offer you. Also, a shop is only gonna give you a fraction of what they think they can sell it for.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:11 AM
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Have you got any pictures mate? I might be interested in making you an offer.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:36 AM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

As soon as a drum is altered ffrom factory original,with extra holes,non original hardware ect..it loses value to the tune of 35 to 50%.

There is some Boosey & Hawks stuff out there that's collectable,but not much.Their drums just aren't desireable.It dosen't mean they aren't good drums.Most of the time,collectability,has little to do with build quality....but not always.

It's not generally known that Boosey & Hawks,and for a short time,Ajax,made English Rogers,under license of Rogers USA.The drums look almost identical.

The US versions are much more desireable than their UK cousins however.

As Harry pointed out,old does not translate to valuable,as you can buy a 20's Ludwig Universal NOB snare for 200US ,in excellent condition or less,everyday of the week.

Location also plays into the price of vintage as well as modern drums.In the US,you can buy acrolites for under 100US in the pacific northwest every day.In NY City,they go for almost twice that.

The bottom line is,that Boosey&Hawks,probably made and sold thousands of models of your snare.Hence...the low resale price.

I would take Duncan up on his offer......he'll no doubt give you a fair price.

Steve B
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Old 08-22-2013, 09:50 AM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Here is snare, and then history:



The snare was purchased in the 1930s by the anglian regiment in colchester. It came originally in bare brass, and the Boosey & Hawkes logo is stamped on, no badges. At some point during it's life as a military drum 2 holes were drilled into it most likely as an attempt to mount it as a marching snare. Then around the 60s it was given a coat of white enamel (which you can see inside the snare against the brass inside). A new muffler was added (as you can tell it's a newer model) at some point, likely 90s when it was painted in a black enamel. During it's history it changed a few heads. It's resonant when I got it was a brown coloured head master plastic head, and the batter was calfskin (which I believe is more expensive than the snare as I have been given offers of 60 just for the calfskin head which is in perfect condition still and now sits on my pearl masters snare. The snare was given some new snare wires and at one point a tuning rod got replaced with a screw and then passed onto me for 30. So that is all I know of it, and it is a lovely snare. It currently has the headmaster reso still and either has a coated ambassador or a control dot coated batter head (though I had to butcher this to get it to fit and so now is only useful on this snare haha. I personally love it, very deep tone for it's size, almost tom like. Also amazing is the snare mechanism still works. VERY stiff but it still goes up and down, though this is rarely enough to actually turn off the snares so I have never had the snares off. Also Leanne, that looks like a dream kit to me :P
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Old 08-22-2013, 03:32 PM
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larryz larryz is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

As times goes by and people get older these names mean nothing to drummers. Boosey & Hawkes? Never heard of them and I consider myself at least of decent knowledge of vintage drums. Also playability. The drum might be 100 years old but drummers want to play the thing. Some old drums are just too delicate to withstand any amt of playing. I had a Leedy early 1930s snare and sold it because the throwoff was just too delicate and a pain the a**. Who wants to have a snare collecting dust? Good question.
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Old 08-22-2013, 05:46 PM
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Quote:
Originally Posted by StaggerLee View Post

The snare was purchased in the 1930s by the anglian regiment in colchester. It came originally in bare brass, and the Boosey & Hawkes logo is stamped on, no badges. ...... 2 holes were drilled into it ........ Then around the 60s it was given a coat of white enamel ..... A new muffler was added ....... it was painted in a black enamel. ........ new snare wires and at one point a tuning rod got replaced with a screw
Wow, there's a lot more that has been done to this drum, than first mentioned. Like the shell being refinished ..... twice. To a collector, being this drum is about as far from factory as they come, it's pretty much a parts drum.
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:00 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Your drum is what collectors call,a frankendrum.Like I said before,once you alter a drum,by drilling holes,refinishing,or changing out hardware,you devalue that drum by al least 35-50%.

On a scale of 1-10,your drum is a solid 3.It's in bad condition,and condition is almst everything,in drum resale value.

You're already in a bad position,because very little Boosey&Hawk stuff ,is collectable to begin with.Even to European collectors,who would rather collect Sonor,Priemer,Ludwig,Gretsch, American Rogers,Camco and Slingerland.

That's just the way it is.Old, dosen't translate to value.It's a very common misconseption.

There has to be other factors involved,to make an item collectable,and valuable.

Steve B
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:17 PM
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryz View Post
As times goes by and people get older these names mean nothing to drummers. Boosey & Hawkes? Never heard of them and I consider myself at least of decent knowledge of vintage drums. Also playability. The drum might be 100 years old but drummers want to play the thing. Some old drums are just too delicate to withstand any amt of playing. .
^ this

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
.Old, dosen't translate to value.It's a very common misconseption.

There has to be other factors involved,to make an item collectable,and valuable.
and ^ this.

To have value, there has to be demand. Many old drums are simply not in demand.
Brand name, playability and condition are all factors in establishing demand.

While some old drums play great many drums from the 20's and 30's simply no longer hold up to modern playing demands. They are, as mentioned, essentially decorative pieces, and the market for decorative pieces drums is very small.
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  #14  
Old 08-22-2013, 06:45 PM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Ah well thats a shame, i am more than happy to keep hold of this beaut. Not afraid to gig it (in fact i have done a festival with it), So I shall keep it and see if I can get a trade for my PDP/DW 20ply bubinga maple that im not happy with. Keep on trying to get a 15" supralite or an acro, happy with either. But sad to know that just because a company has very little brand recognition means it is worth a lot less... makes you wonder if we mostly pay for the brand name on our drums....
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:46 PM
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BacteriumFendYoke BacteriumFendYoke is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

I'll send you a PM.

Looks like it might be a project.
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Old 08-22-2013, 08:05 PM
Brian Brian is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrumEatDrum View Post
To have value, there has to be demand. Many old drums are simply not in demand.
Brand name, playability and condition are all factors in establishing demand.

While some old drums play great many drums from the 20's and 30's simply no longer hold up to modern playing demands. They are, as mentioned, essentially decorative pieces, and the market for decorative pieces drums is very small.
Correct, marginalism and marginal utility can be brought up. Why are diamonds more valuable than water? Why a first-year Black Beauty snare drum is more valuable than a new one, .isn't much different than why diamonds are valued more than drinking water.
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  #17  
Old 08-25-2013, 09:31 PM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Tis a great shame as a lot of older drums more than stand up to the drums of today. I am in talks (well hopefully, not heard anything back from them for a long time so not sure if its still on...) to trade the snare for a 1980s remo encore, always wanted one. Beefy 14x8 sound and I love the acousticon sound :) So here is to hoping!
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Old 08-25-2013, 11:25 PM
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BacteriumFendYoke BacteriumFendYoke is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

I'm just getting on it mate! PM sent.
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Old 08-26-2013, 02:07 AM
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Anon La Ply Anon La Ply is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

I love that rusty old B&H snare - tons of character!

Here's a vintage Drouyn snare that came with my first drum kit - a $100 Frankenstein. It was an old drum with a vintage vibe to it even back in the mid 70s when I got it.

Not that I'd sell it but in its condition (and it came without a badge) it wouldn't fetch anywhere near as much as this one - $500): http://www.muamat.com/classifieds/75...nare_Drum.html

Not sure why this thread isn't in the gear section but whattheheck
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Old 08-26-2013, 04:41 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Those are cool and really nice sounding drums.

A drummer in a Jazz club here in NYC had a kit,and I thought it sounded great.I can't remember his name ,but the guy had great touch and dynamics.

A member of another drum forum,who is an Oz resident has Drouyn COB 5x14 snare,and it sounded great on a few recordings he posted.

Very nice drums.

Steve B
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Old 08-30-2013, 07:45 PM
JackoDrummer JackoDrummer is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Pretty simple actually. People pay what it's worth to them. You're a vintage collector, so you might be inclined to pay more (or want more if selling).

The other side though is, not every sees the value in vintage instruments. They're just old, unserviceable, unattractive, not good sounding, etc. It's always about finding the right seller/buyer who sees the value in vintage stuff.
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Old 08-31-2013, 05:33 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JackoDrummer View Post
Pretty simple actually. People pay what it's worth to them. You're a vintage collector, so you might be inclined to pay more (or want more if selling).

The other side though is, not every sees the value in vintage instruments. They're just old, unserviceable, unattractive, not good sounding, etc. It's always about finding the right seller/buyer who sees the value in vintage stuff.
You're saying ALL vintage instruments are JUST old,unnattractive and not good sounding?

Have you ever heard a Conn Chu berry 1927 tenor sax?

A 57 Gibson Les Paul gold top,or a 68 Fender Stratocaster?

Have you ever played a 34 Ludwig Black Beauty,or a 47 Slingerland Super Gene Krupa Radio King,in WMP

How about a set of 64 Ludwig super Classics,in Black Oyster Pearl?

I believe your ascessment of vintage instruments as a whole,is questionable at best.

Steve B
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Old 08-31-2013, 06:54 PM
Brian Brian is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamadrm View Post
You're saying ALL vintage instruments are JUST old,unnattractive and not good sounding?

Have you ever heard a Conn Chu berry 1927 tenor sax?

A 57 Gibson Les Paul gold top,or a 68 Fender Stratocaster?

Have you ever played a 34 Ludwig Black Beauty,or a 47 Slingerland Super Gene Krupa Radio King,in WMP

How about a set of 64 Ludwig super Classics,in Black Oyster Pearl?

I believe your ascessment of vintage instruments as a whole,is questionable at best.

Steve B
JackODrummer was speaking in general, I believe. Stigmas will exist. There are people who believe that vintage gear "lacks", even if it doesn't
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Old 08-31-2013, 07:27 PM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Congratulations to Bacterium who picked up the snare today. We sat about talking drums for a fair amount of time (with me being very jealous of his relationship with Andy from Guru) and looked at the snare and found many a great unusual things about it. Such as why was the shell brass but the welded on bearing edges steel? Why are the bearing edges so flat? Why is there no sign of a seam on a student drum? Why does a student drum have brass hoops and lugs? It is a real mystery and I am glad it has passed on to someone who will likely uncover those secrets whilst restoring her to her original glory and beauty. Thanks Bacterium, and good luck in restoring her to her original glory!
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Old 09-01-2013, 10:47 PM
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

It really is a total mystery. I think we settled on a fair price given the condition, although obviously it's not classy to disclose it in a public thread.

So, I'm going to go over a few things and follow up soon when the light is better and take a few photographs of the drum.

My first impressions:

i) The guy that painted the shell did a really sloppy job. Parts of the bearing edges are painted over but I'm thinking that some Nitro-Mors will take care of most of it. The paint is old-fashioned and still slightly soft to the touch and very thick. Obviously no scraping with metal will be involved.

ii) It's non-magnetic. Almost certainly brass but it hasn't got the traditional brass colour. It's silvery. Very odd but it should polish up very well once all the grime, crud and paint comes off. As Oli says, no obvious seam and I shone a light in there and had a close look and couldn't find one.

iii) Very deep snare beds. Quite narrow but very deep.

iv) Pre-international. I'll be getting the tape measure out when I re-head it.

v) Throw-off requires some work. Stripping, re-assembling and greasing. Shouldn't be too bad.

vi) The bearing edges are rolled and welded. They're stainless steel.

vii) Some of the tension rods are worn and tarnished. One is missing. I'm going to do some investigating into possibly replacing them or seeing what I can do with the rods that are there.

viii) Some of the clips are magnetic, some aren't. They all look basically the same.

It's a very interesting drum. An enigma, wrapped in a mystery within a conundrum. I'm going to start by stripping the shell hardware and then working on getting the paint off. I'll go from there.

Thanks to Oli, I had a really good time talking drums. Very welcoming! You didn't see me at my best, I'd just finished work and scurried along the various motorways and A-roads! I'm going to enjoy working on this beast.
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Old 09-06-2013, 12:28 PM
StaggerLee StaggerLee is offline
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Default Re: Why are antique snares worth so little?

Hey, you were a lovely bloke and it was a pleasure to meet you :) Glad you liked the luddy too :P And yeah it is a total mystery and I cant wait to see what you can find out about it :D
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