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  #1  
Old 05-05-2009, 10:37 PM
mhanon13 mhanon13 is offline
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Default Pop Drumming!

Hello guys,

A friend of mine, who is also a drummer, just told me that he wants to specialize in pop.. He is a great drummer and I would say almost a professional drummer. He eats and supports his family by drumming.. that's his job.. now, the thing is he wants to go full in pop as his main genre..

He asked me to look for him videos or dvds and books/cds about POP...

so, any recommendations???

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 05-06-2009, 08:11 PM
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dairyairman dairyairman is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

pop? if i were looking to make a living by drumming, i don't think i'd want to specialize in top-40 "pop" drumming. have you listened to the radio lately? 99% of the hit songs use programmed electronic tracks for drums and percussion.
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Old 05-06-2009, 08:47 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

wait why does he wanna be a drum machine?
and what kind of procedure do you go through to make that change?!?
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  #4  
Old 05-06-2009, 09:33 PM
mhanon13 mhanon13 is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

ok, i dont know dude, he's been drumming for like 20 years actively...

and he plays about everything... he gigs around a lot.. he lives off drumming..

but what he likes most is POP and its similar forms... like Rock Pop...
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  #5  
Old 05-06-2009, 11:38 PM
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Drummer Karl Drummer Karl is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Okay I see.
Mostly there`s a lot of hiding and confusion going on when it comes to the "art of pop music". Indeed this confusion has its reasons for sure, asking how you can focus on "pop music" isn`t arbitrary.
It is the music we`re listening to all the time when turning on the car radio.

Now, the fact that most part of the people are listening to a lot of modern pop music might get them confused how to look at it as a style of music like everything else, how treat it. Very often this kind of music is considered the musical general case. There`s the social point then where the music loses it`s soul and individuality...but this is another topic I guess.

Speaking about the music itself I`d highly recommend to get conscious about this "musical general case". Get conscious about its history and its roots. Like every other style of music it developed from other styles (rock'n'roll, folk etc.).
This music is a social phenomenon, there`s been an intention as well as there`s a certain song structure.

Generally pop music is such a wide kind of area we`re moving on. Finding out the sounds (listening as an important tool!) will be useful to create a sound. According to a school I`d highly recommend Steve Jordan`s "The Groove Is Here". I think that the content and the ideas whch are presented will be helpful.

In the end I`d like to mention the very special psychological part. When it comes to pop music it also comes to a lot of behavioral psychology of the masses.

My thoughts...

Karl
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  #6  
Old 05-07-2009, 12:27 AM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mhanon13 View Post
Hello guys,

A friend of mine, who is also a drummer, just told me that he wants to specialize in pop.. He is a great drummer and I would say almost a professional drummer. He eats and supports his family by drumming.. that's his job.. now, the thing is he wants to go full in pop as his main genre..

He asked me to look for him videos or dvds and books/cds about POP...

so, any recommendations???

Thanks
www.youtube.com/deedlebag <-- that guy cobus does a whole bunch of different types of music, but all the songs are generally upbeat and pop-like, tell him to watch those videos, he is absolutley fantastic.

And you say he is 'almost' a professional drummer. You also say his job is drumming and that he supports his family like that...

Sounds to me like he is a professional drummer. In my eyes, being a professional has nothing to do with being at a certain level, but whether or not you make a living doing it.
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Old 05-07-2009, 01:01 AM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

"pop" is almost like saying "jazz" - a pretty vague term, genre-wise.

Learn a solid 2-4 backbeat and perfect your time. Play along to a lot of AC/DC and other straight-ahead music w/ few-to-no fills.
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  #8  
Old 05-07-2009, 08:02 AM
mhanon13 mhanon13 is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

yeah, let's say then he's a professional.. indeed... he's a greaaaaat drummer, amazing...

yeah, what his band most play is POP... and many fusions of pop like I said...

I asked him.. dude, what is ur style? and he just said... Pop is my thing, Pop is my style...

So, basically he wants to become a master on it I guess...
and at this point he feels he is stuck, and he wants to learn more about Pop on drums, so he asked me to get him a DVD or any kind of instructional book about Pop..

I think Pop is cool.. haha
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  #9  
Old 05-07-2009, 08:17 AM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

John Blackwell. He has quite a bit of stuff to look upon. He is righteous.
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  #10  
Old 05-07-2009, 08:17 AM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

I think it is confusing to even look at "pop" as a genre. At any given time, it may be somewhat definable - but it is a moving target. It is by definition - "that which is now, or has been, popular". But a musical genre? I don't think so.

Rock. Country. Reggae. Jazz. Blues. Bluegrass. Swing. Disco. Techno. House. These are genres... and at one time or another have all been a part of "Pop".

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  #11  
Old 05-07-2009, 01:54 PM
Toby_Jackson Toby_Jackson is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Considering that within the time it takes from the moment a book or DVD is conceived to the time it is released to the public, the dominant style of pop music will have likely changed, there will never be a definitive instructional piece on "pop" music. Your ears are really all you've got on this one.

Beyond using standard books to get your coordination and chops together, your friend will need to listen to the music he wants to play very intently and try to lift everything he can out of it. Perfect time, feel, and an authenticity to style will be his biggest assets in trying to get a job within the pop genre.

This following must also be understood: when referring to style, "pop" really isn't a genre so much as a social phenomenon - it has, at different points in history, referred to soul, rock, hip hop... the list goes on. To a professional player, pop is more of a philosophy than a specific style.
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  #12  
Old 05-07-2009, 02:55 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcrigger View Post
I think it is confusing to even look at "pop" as a genre. At any given time, it may be somewhat definable - but it is a moving target. It is by definition - "that which is now, or has been, popular". But a musical genre? I don't think so.

Rock. Country. Reggae. Jazz. Blues. Bluegrass. Swing. Disco. Techno. House. These are genres... and at one time or another have all been a part of "Pop".

David
this. Pop isn't a genre. Saying "I want to be a master of pop" is like saying "i want to be a master of purple". It just doesn't make sense
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  #13  
Old 05-07-2009, 03:14 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

The best resource for him would probably be to listen to the current pop music out there. Depending on what particular forms of pop he is into, he may want to check out Blackwell and Jordan (as mentioned above) as well as ?uestlove, JD Blair, and many others. Instead of focusing on specific drummers, he should probably listen more to just the artists out there, and see how the studio drummers they use are working with their tunes.

There is actually a LOT of cool drumming in pop music right now. KT Tunstall and Feist are two artists that come immediately to mind that have a lot of neat percussion/drumming in them. But honestly, even a lot of radio songs, if you really get into the meat of them, have cool drum parts. I recently learned 1000 Miles by Vanessa Carlton for a cover band I work with. That is a funky little drum part. Tons of rolls on the hi hats, accented upbeats on the ride's bell, etc. When you just mindlessly listen to it, you may think it's just silly pop, but in fact, there is a LOT going on behind the drums. Sara Bareilles is another straight up pop artist with a ton of cool drum parts in her music.
Heck, check out live versions of the Jonas Brothers "Burnin' Up." When they don't have "Big Rob" or whatever the guy who raps on it is called, they actually throw a drum solo in over where the silly rap part is. The solo, as well as a lot of the fills played live, are really cool, really unique, and funky.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ace76543 View Post
this. Pop isn't a genre. Saying "I want to be a master of pop" is like saying "i want to be a master of purple". It just doesn't make sense
Sure it makes sense. Saying you want to be a master of pop is no different than saying you want to be a rock god, or a jazz giant. All three are styles that are very broad, very vague, but still have a loose definition. You can argue that the definition of pop has changed over time, but the truth is, so has the definition of rock, so has the definition of jazz. When fusion first came out, it was not considered a form of jazz at all. Now it is, and is often known as "jazz fusion" (this is true to the point that when Miles released Bitches Brew, it was called a "rock" album, because it certainly didn't fit the definition of jazz at that time). Same with rock. What we now call oldies music was once rock...but very few people would listen to "That'll Be The Day" by Buddy Holly now and say that it is a rock song. Genre definitions change over time, but that doesn't mean you can't want to be a master of one, at the time that you are in.
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  #14  
Old 05-07-2009, 03:51 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrchattr View Post
...

Sure it makes sense. Saying you want to be a master of pop is no different than saying you want to be a rock god, or a jazz giant. All three are styles that are very broad, very vague, but still have a loose definition. You can argue that the definition of pop has changed over time, but the truth is, so has the definition of rock, so has the definition of jazz. When fusion first came out, it was not considered a form of jazz at all. Now it is, and is often known as "jazz fusion" (this is true to the point that when Miles released Bitches Brew, it was called a "rock" album, because it certainly didn't fit the definition of jazz at that time). Same with rock. What we now call oldies music was once rock...but very few people would listen to "That'll Be The Day" by Buddy Holly now and say that it is a rock song. Genre definitions change over time, but that doesn't mean you can't want to be a master of one, at the time that you are in.
Very well said! Interesting perspective!
Casper
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  #15  
Old 05-07-2009, 04:00 PM
aydee aydee is offline
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

I have a slightly different perspective on pop drumming.

Firstly, as someone said there's isn't that much work, given all the loops and electronic/editing software used.

Two, what you really need to have is a monster pocket of all the simple stuff with your unique special flavor..

Three, all the really well known, successful pop drummers come great technical knowledge & skills and can practically play anything well..

Keltner, Arnoff, Gadd, Porcaro, Marotta, Colauita,Teddy Campbell & all his gospel chops buddies... all these guys can do almost anything.. and bring their own mojo to the gig..

So I'd say you set out trying to be a good drummer period. Then you will naturally flow into the music that you like playing and hopefully your playing will shine in that genre, quite naturally.
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  #16  
Old 05-07-2009, 04:07 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

One of my definitions of pop music is that it is music targeted at a "generic" youth market from pre-teens to early adults. Stylistically it can be anything that the industry decides to serve to that market at a specific time. So to play pop, one has to 1) be capable of a playing a wide variety of styles very very well, 2) be aware of current popular trends, 3) play with a good amount of enthusiasm. 4) ditch being too jaded, dogmatic, or hardcore.

Playing pop can be, and should come over as fun. But it can also be very demanding. In the 80's, Madonna and Michael Jackson were the queen and king of pop. And their touring bands were made up of first-call musicians such as Jonathan Moffet. The same is true for today's Disney pop factory kids like Miley, who has accomplished musicians such as drummer, producer, and A&R executive Stacy Jones. Their job is not to hit people over the head with how well they can play, but to provide unobtrusive but solid accompaniment to the featured stars.

Last edited by makinao; 05-07-2009 at 04:23 PM.
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  #17  
Old 05-07-2009, 05:24 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

your friend would do well to watch american idol and listen to teddy campbell. that guy can play anything! if you want to talk about pop, american idol is the very definition of pop. it's the most popular show on tv today. they play all kinds of music and teddy plays on almost every song.
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  #18  
Old 05-07-2009, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

yea. listen teddy campbell!!!!
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Old 05-07-2009, 07:21 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mhanon13 View Post
Hello guys,

A friend of mine, who is also a drummer, just told me that he wants to specialize in pop.. He is a great drummer and I would say almost a professional drummer. He eats and supports his family by drumming.. that's his job.. now, the thing is he wants to go full in pop as his main genre..

He asked me to look for him videos or dvds and books/cds about POP...

so, any recommendations???

Thanks
Feeds? It's okay though. It cracked me up. :)


Quote:
Originally Posted by mhanon13 View Post
yeah, let's say then he's a professional.. indeed... he's a greaaaaat drummer, amazing...

yeah, what his band most play is POP... and many fusions of pop like I said...

I asked him.. dude, what is ur style? and he just said... Pop is my thing, Pop is my style...

So, basically he wants to become a master on it I guess...
and at this point he feels he is stuck, and he wants to learn more about Pop on drums, so he asked me to get him a DVD or any kind of instructional book about Pop..

I think Pop is cool.. haha
?????? That made me understand it even LESS.



But anyways, although some (and most) of the modern day 'pop' music is all electronic drum loops, they still play live shows and most of the live shows involve an actual drummer.

It may sound pretty queer, but take Katy Perry for instance. Almost all of her music is all done with electronic loops of drums that got transferred into the mix, but she still has a live drummer and a whole live band.
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  #20  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

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Originally Posted by Toza View Post
yea. listen teddy campbell!!!!
I've been watching him on Idol. Great drummer. He has a page here on drummerworld. I just watched the videos... He's got chops too. Sweet
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  #21  
Old 05-07-2009, 08:26 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aydee View Post
I have a slightly different perspective on pop drumming.

Firstly, as someone said there's isn't that much work, given all the loops and electronic/editing software used.

Two, what you really need to have is a monster pocket of all the simple stuff with your unique special flavor..

Three, all the really well known, successful pop drummers come great technical knowledge & skills and can practically play anything well..

Keltner, Arnoff, Gadd, Porcaro, Marotta, Colauita,Teddy Campbell & all his gospel chops buddies... all these guys can do almost anything.. and bring their own mojo to the gig..

So I'd say you set out trying to be a good drummer period. Then you will naturally flow into the music that you like playing and hopefully your playing will shine in that genre, quite naturally.
i agree with this. For the first years of my playing (a large amount of it) i basically only focused on rock drumming and snare drumming. Over the years i progressed but right as i started learning other types of music, all of the sudden my rock drumming became alot better too. Even if you are a metal drummer, if you learn jazz drumming, i can definitley see it helping with rhythm, dynamics, independence, and control.
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  #22  
Old 05-13-2009, 05:31 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

pop drumming is awesome whether it be r&b, rock, country or wut ever there is alot of work left in this broad genre still.

ive been workn on my double bass skills and eventually want to be able to play songs by bands such as origin, necrophagist, braindrill, etc but i still love to play to songs on the radio and other pop songs especially rap

i cant stand listening to the the "pop" genre but its fun to play and above all else its the only thing that can teach you how to play with feeling while having impeccable time and just being able to groove deep into the pocket

but to stay on topic i would recommend any book that has alot of grooves in it in this genre your only as good as your vocabulary
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  #23  
Old 05-13-2009, 05:53 PM
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Default Re: Pop Drumming!

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Originally Posted by austin412 View Post
i cant stand listening to the the "pop" genre but its fun to play and above all else its the only thing that can teach you how to play with feeling while having impeccable time and just being able to groove deep into the pocket
Huh? If playing to pop music is the only way to develop feeling, impeccable time, and a deep pocket, then myself and tens of thousands of other drummers are going about this thing all wrong...
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