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  #41  
Old 02-08-2010, 05:37 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

You all talking about the CSI theme song half time show??

Hate to reveal the "secret" but there were prerecorded tracks used for that performance. Pete milked that windmill thing for all it was worth and I could have done without him exposing his gut. Where's Janet when you need her? All around ANOTHER tired act.

The drums IMO were the clear winner of the show.
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  #42  
Old 02-08-2010, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Absolutely some was prerecorded, some was live. Lead vocal phrases were heard that didn't come out of singers' mouths, and drum fills were heard that the drummer wasn't playing. It wasn't a bad performance considering the short time they had to squeeze in a few bars of a medley of hits, although the transitions were weak. Some of the lead guitar licks were pretty lame and some chord chops were missed, but he's no spring chicken anymore. Visuals were pretty cool. I saw them at DC Verizon Center back in 2008 and it was a knockout show, great sound and performance.
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  #43  
Old 02-08-2010, 06:28 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Hi everyone.

I for one am always looking forward to any The Who performance, as bad as it may turn out. This performance was slightly above average for me (slightly). The fact that they still have a passion to play is inspiring in and of itself.

I liked the set list. If you're going to play to however many millions of people, more than ever in your career, you'd want to pick the songs that personify The Who, and in that regard, I think going with Roger's idea instead of Pete's worked out pretty good (as far as playing a medley instead of two whole songs).

It did seem at times that what I was hearing was not matching exactly what I was seeing, but I didn't make anything of it until I found this thread! At the end of the set, I did see Zak strike his snare drum (a final flam, I think), but there was no sound. I figured that they may have turned off the drums audio right at the end of playing, but man, that was fast! Again, didn't think much of it, but it was a little suspicious. :)

As far as Mr. Starkey goes, I'm really not a fan of his style. It looks amateurish to me. Now before you guys BLAST me, I'm not saying he's an amateur! I'm just saying that I don't like his style of play. My brother texted me during the performance saying 'the drummer doesn't look right'. Whether it was because his sound wasn't live or he also didn't like his style, I didn't ask him what he thought. But I answered back saying, "I can't stand his style, but he plays for The Who, so he can suck as much as he wants." Besides, no one will ever be Keith Moon, so I'm assuming Zak's not trying to be.

Bottom line for me is I liked The Who's performance in general. Who knows how many more times we'll see them. But I'll be watching!
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  #44  
Old 02-08-2010, 06:36 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I thought they were seriously godawful, Zak included. And I hate those silly ass 30sec clips. Why couldn't they just do two or three full songs instead of ten minutes of previews?
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  #45  
Old 02-09-2010, 12:13 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Hello guys, just to set the record straight that DW never used Goldentimes shells. They have always used RCI Starlite Shells exclusively for all of there DW & Pacific lines of snares and sets, Tommy Lee Rock Star Supernova set with the 32" & 40" red bass drums, Mars Volta Thomas Pridgen clear, Joey Castillo of Queens of the Stone Age Clear and many more clients large and small. When quality and dependability counts you can trust the heart of your drums sound to RCI Starlite International. Thanks, JohnnyC RCI Artist Relations Director
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  #46  
Old 02-09-2010, 02:15 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Hello guys, just to set the record straight that DW never used Goldentimes shells. They have always used RCI Starlite Shells exclusively for all of there DW & Pacific lines of snares and sets, Tommy Lee Rock Star Supernova set with the 32" & 40" red bass drums, Mars Volta Thomas Pridgen clear, Joey Castillo of Queens of the Stone Age Clear and many more clients large and small. When quality and dependability counts you can trust the heart of your drums sound to RCI Starlite International. Thanks, JohnnyC RCI Artist Relations Director
Thank's for clearing things up for my own info !

Regards :-)
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  #47  
Old 02-09-2010, 06:58 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

It seemed to me that Zak was trying to look like Moon with certain nuances of his style such as raising his stick in the air and such. Zak is one of my favorites and the performance that blew me away was the New York Fire Fighters and Police benefit in 2001 when Entswisle (spelling?) was still alive. Zak was playing a red sparkle dw (with the throne lower). My wife thought Robert looked like an old literature professor. The sound guy needed to be fired after that mix. Too bad. I think they performed well enough but the sound was terrible so everybody thinks they were terrible.
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  #48  
Old 02-09-2010, 10:27 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Who's Robert?????????
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  #49  
Old 02-09-2010, 10:36 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I'm thinking he meant Roger Daltry not Robert (which I'm guessing he's getting the lead singer from Led Zep confused with)
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  #50  
Old 02-10-2010, 12:39 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by Zumba_Zumba View Post
It seemed to me that Zak was trying to look like Moon with certain nuances of his style such as raising his stick in the air and such.
That was my impression also. He captured a lot of Moon's personality, facial expressions, and moves. I thought he did a good job.
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  #51  
Old 02-10-2010, 05:31 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

The drumming was pretty good, Pete and Roger were meh at best...but let's be honest here. Hands down, the best thing on that stage from the start to the end, was Pino Pallidino on the bass. Dude was just on fire.

And just to clarify since some people seem confused: those cymbals were custom made to be the Who logos. From everything I heard, they sounded pretty fantastic.
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  #52  
Old 02-10-2010, 05:57 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by konaboy View Post
Me neither, most half time shows are a joke. I really dug the stage/light setup it had, very unique and cool. I'll admit I've never been a big fan of the who but it was an o.k. performance, better than the past few years in my book.

Saw the DW badges right away and thought, since when did DW start making acrylic kits???

I keep hearing this about the acrylic kits by DW when I see the halftime posts and I was taken back @ the NAMM show this year when I saw this DW acrylic kit
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  #53  
Old 02-10-2010, 02:37 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I'm an old Who fan from way back and yes I'm old too. I thought they did a very good job and Zak I thought played great. Pete and Roger are getting up there but for their age let's give them some credit.
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  #54  
Old 02-10-2010, 03:49 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I'm just sick of hearing people talk about the NFL "dusting off the Who". Those guys still perform regularly. It's not like this was some one-off show that Roger and Pete were coming out of retirement to do. People have off-nights. I'm just questioning why Pete wears those open overshirts. Every video I see of him, they get in the way of his windmills, superbowl included.
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  #55  
Old 02-10-2010, 04:45 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by mrchattr View Post
The drumming was pretty good, Pete and Roger were meh at best...but let's be honest here. Hands down, the best thing on that stage from the start to the end, was Pino Pallidino on the bass. Dude was just on fire.
Ha ha! Oh man, too funny!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrchattr View Post
And just to clarify since some people seem confused: those cymbals were custom made to be the Who logos. From everything I heard, they sounded pretty fantastic.
And to just clarify one step further - Since it seems pretty clear, esp during "Won't Get Fooled Again", that Zak was drumming to prerecorded drum parts, you were probably not hearing painted cymbals or acrylic drums. I could be wrong, but that's my sense of it.
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  #56  
Old 02-10-2010, 05:05 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I watched and studied/slowmotioned some fills - great by the way - and i'm sure drumming was live. Nearly impossible to learn the air-drumming so exactly. Just my opinion - i feel quite sure but always ready to learn something new and prove me wrong - no problem....

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  #57  
Old 02-10-2010, 05:06 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Hands down, the best thing on that stage from the start to the end, was Pino Pallidino on the bass. Dude was just on fire.
Yep, he was awesome. The bass lead in on "who are you" was so in the pocket.
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  #58  
Old 02-10-2010, 06:20 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Who's Robert?????????
Crap. Roger, not Robert. Forgot my coffee this morning. Oh well, we slip up now and then....more now than then.
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  #59  
Old 02-10-2010, 06:22 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by DSCRAPRE View Post
I'm just sick of hearing people talk about the NFL "dusting off the Who". Those guys still perform regularly. It's not like this was some one-off show that Roger and Pete were coming out of retirement to do. People have off-nights. I'm just questioning why Pete wears those open overshirts. Every video I see of him, they get in the way of his windmills, superbowl included.
From what I heard and read most are aware that they tour regularly. It just seems to me nostalgia keeps most fans from saying anything negative about the performance when it was somewhat lackluster.
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  #60  
Old 02-10-2010, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

I'd bet money it was totally live. I didn't see any mis-sticking.
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  #61  
Old 02-11-2010, 07:34 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Can anyone actually point to clips where Zak was off from what you heard? I have watched twice now and not seen one example of it. Bermuda even said he slowed it down and didn't see any.

Also, anyone who has ever run sound will tell you that, from a technical standpoint, it's the same work to get Pete and Roger to be heard live (which wrong notes prove they were) as to get everyone live, as the Super Bowl promised it would be. The mix was rough, the drummer and bass player both always lined up perfectly with what we heard...and yet people STILL refuse to believe this was live? Really?!?!?!
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  #62  
Old 02-11-2010, 09:10 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Can anyone actually point to clips where Zak was off from what you heard?
Here are the spots that made me raise an eyebrow:
-3:20 two 16ths on the snare can be seen and not heard.
-3:26 clearly out of sync on the snare.
-4:16 "I pick up my guitar and I play" the word "play" sounds like a strong snare/crash combo, but he isn't hitting the snare...
-4:23 looks an awful lot like he's playing a fill that doesn't square with what I'm hearing.
-5:47 I just noticed in impromptu last ending rough on the toms that was almost completely inaudible - oops!

Just 5 that I thought looked/sounded very questionable, there were other minor things where I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not saying that that isn't Zak on the recording, I'm just not sure that that's the performance of it. To learn one's own parts well enough to drum along doesn't seem that far-fetched to me - I do it all the time (in my living room, that is!).

Last edited by MikeM; 02-11-2010 at 05:53 PM.
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  #63  
Old 02-11-2010, 10:15 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Here are the spots that made me raise an eyebrow:
-3:20 two 16ths on the snare can be seen and not heard.
-3:26 clearly out of sync on the snare.
-4:16 "I pick up my guitar and I play" the word "play" sounds like a strong snare/crash combo, but he isn't hitting the snare...
-4:23 looks an awful lot like he's playing a fill that doesn't square with what I'm hearing.
-5:47 I just noticed in impromptu list ending rough on the topms that was almost completely inaudible - oops!

Just 5 that I thought looked/sounded very questionable, there were other minor things where I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not saying that that isn't Zak on the recording, I'm just not sure that that's the performance of it. To learn one's own parts well enough to drum along doesn't seem that far-fetched to me - I do it all the time (in my living room, that is!).
I'm in agreement that the track was pre-recorded. I mean, the SuperBowl is a BIG DEAL, and especially with that synced-up light show...they can't afford to speed up or slow down a single iota! There had to be at least SOME pre-recorded track to sync up with the "hits" of the light show. There is enough evidence in the video such as "seen-not-heard" and "heard-not-seen" and "what-I-just-heard-is-not-what-I-just-saw-him-play" moments. And...when (it looks like) he drops his stick at 3:25?: THAT is why the tracks are pre-recorded!

After watching the video under careful scrutiny, I'm of the opinion that only the original members of The Who actually performed live. Zak wasn't "air-drumming"--he was actually drumming, probably to his own tracks, but you can't hear him of course, because he's in a huge stadium and the music is blasting over the mains!
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  #64  
Old 02-11-2010, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

To me something was definitely not right...seemed pre-recorded and the drumming had a fakeness to it. Also Pete was screwing up...

Zak Starkey I'm sure is a fine drummer but I really want to see someone with some passion and more of an edge, pushing the band like Moon did.

I think someone like Pridgen would have been perfect for that band. His wildness, taking chances, pushing his licks to the limit IMO is a better fit.
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  #65  
Old 02-11-2010, 08:05 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Pre-recorded or not, there are two undeniable facts:

1) The only two original members are old and they just plain can't pull it off any more.

2) Half of the band + playing a medley of OLD songs = Who Cover Band.

They were The Whom.
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  #66  
Old 02-11-2010, 08:41 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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I think someone like Pridgen would have been perfect for that band. His wildness, taking chances, pushing his licks to the limit IMO is a better fit.
Dude, what're you thinking?? You trying to finish off the last two? :D (I agree, though)
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  #67  
Old 02-15-2010, 10:24 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

That was embarrassing, Man they should just hang it up if they are going to go down like that.

Singing sukked, music was horrible. Only thing good was the light show, and the fact it was a short set.
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  #68  
Old 02-15-2010, 04:43 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Here are the spots that made me raise an eyebrow:
-3:20 two 16ths on the snare can be seen and not heard.
-3:26 clearly out of sync on the snare.
-4:16 "I pick up my guitar and I play" the word "play" sounds like a strong snare/crash combo, but he isn't hitting the snare...
-4:23 looks an awful lot like he's playing a fill that doesn't square with what I'm hearing.
-5:47 I just noticed in impromptu last ending rough on the toms that was almost completely inaudible - oops!

Just 5 that I thought looked/sounded very questionable, there were other minor things where I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not saying that that isn't Zak on the recording, I'm just not sure that that's the performance of it. To learn one's own parts well enough to drum along doesn't seem that far-fetched to me - I do it all the time (in my living room, that is!).
- 3:20 - The stick clearly bounces and looks like it could go down for a second hit...you can't see the actual snare, so you can't be sure, but if you watch the hand, it looks like he's using a double stroke.
- 3:26 - Again, he is right with what is heard. It looks like he starts to drop his left stick, but recovers, and the rest lines up perfectly.
- 4:16 - I got nothing. I see him clearly hit a different crash, but I am hearing the snare drum and seeing him hit the tom. You can argue that this could just be how the tom sounded or whatever, but that's a pretty tough argument to make.
- 4:23 - If you slow it down, it lines up perfectly, he's just moving too fast for you to tell (diddles, etc) in a crappy quality YouTube video.
5:47 - Yeah, you are right about this one. However, it's possible that the soundguy had already started muting channels, etc, for moving the stage. That is not uncommon at all at events like this.

So really, when it's all slowed down and stuff, the only evidence is there is ONE snare hit where he hit his tom, but it sounds like snare (which is hard to explain, but there may be a reason), and then a muted ending which is not uncommon. Add that to the fact that the entire performance, with all the speed-ups, slow-downs, and complex fills (which I know he improvises on at normal shows...it's not the same fills every night) lined up accurately, and I would say it's hard to argue that it wasn't live. I mean, that's a lot of stuff to memorize exactly. It is possible...and I'm not really a big fan of the Who or anything...I just hate the cynicism that I see so much nowadays.

I will say this...if it was pre-recorded, then I'm actually MORE impressed with Zak for being able to play along flawlessly, through tempo changes and everything, and only have one noticable mistake, which was just hitting the wrong drum.
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  #69  
Old 02-15-2010, 05:44 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

Zak's playing was the certainly the highlight of this show. I'm not a fan of his cymbal sound with his rides and crashes being all those washy Ks. As Zildjian calls it his "Wall of Sound" cymbal set up.

In an arena environment they didn't cut very well and his ride was lost in the mix.

I give him a lot of credit for being able to pull it off because these type of performances are notorious for having monitoring issues and that he could even hear himself playing was probably a miracle.

I thought he was channeling Keith Moon quite well.

Did anybody else notice the last second of the closing song where he didn't play the closing crash (because he was late) and he just hit his sticks together?
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  #70  
Old 02-15-2010, 07:09 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by MIkeM
-5:47 I just noticed in impromptu last ending rough on the toms that was almost completely inaudible - oops!
I heard it. It wasnt very loud, but it was there.

While I agree watching it again I can see that it wasnt their best performance, I really enjoyed it when I saw it live. And even if it was prerecorded, then as was previously mentioned, Zack did an even better job lining everything up perfectly and only have a small handful of questionable spots where he may or may not have lined what he was playing up with the track perfectly.
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  #71  
Old 02-16-2010, 01:38 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

how bout those cymbal colors
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  #72  
Old 02-16-2010, 01:41 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by nhzoso View Post
That was embarrassing, Man they should just hang it up if they are going to go down like that.

Singing sukked, music was horrible. Only thing good was the light show, and the fact it was a short set.
oh come on, that was a quality show by a quality band, have you played a Super Bowl?
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  #73  
Old 02-16-2010, 01:50 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

At about 4:00 you could see his right hand bass drum reso head moving. He was at least kicking something.
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  #74  
Old 02-16-2010, 02:18 AM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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oh come on, that was a quality show by a quality band, have you played a Super Bowl?


Oh Sorry, I thought everyone was allowed to have an opinion on it....My bad!
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  #75  
Old 02-16-2010, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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oh come on, that was a quality show by a quality band, have you played a Super Bowl?
I don't think criticism is saying anyone could do better, it's more a comparison with how they used to be. At one time the Who was the greatest live band on the planet imo, and to see them up there with two members like moon and entwhistle gone and the other two looking quite geriatric is depressing.

It's like watching an athlete way past their prime try to keep competing and not being able to do what they once did. Aging is just part of life, so at least try to do it gracefully.
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Old 02-16-2010, 11:29 PM
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mrchattr mrchattr is offline
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

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Originally Posted by ddocimo View Post
oh come on, that was a quality show by a quality band, have you played a Super Bowl?
There were more bad notes from guitars and vocals than my guitarist and vocalists make in a 3 or 4 hour show...at the end of the day, it just wasn't a great musical performance. Quality show? No. Quality band? Yup. Have I played a Super Bowl? Nope, but that doesn't mean it was a good show...go back and watch Janet Jackson or some of the other Super Bowl halftimes.
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  #77  
Old 02-17-2010, 01:36 AM
lukeP lukeP is offline
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Default Re: Superbowl Halftime - Zak Starkey

i don't know, but his cymbals were sooooooo sexy.

did anyone see pete miss his windmill strum? LOL


at least they didn't lipsync like everyone else in popular music does during shows these days.

Last edited by lukeP; 02-17-2010 at 01:50 AM.
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