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  #1  
Old 04-11-2009, 02:17 AM
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Default JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Just got John Riley's new DVD, The Master Drummer. It is filled with ideas and exercises for the jazz drummer. I think it's a great asset for the jazz student or teacher and makes a great addition for those working with John's books.
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  #2  
Old 04-11-2009, 02:20 AM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

I've been VERY interested in checking this out when it came out. His books are GREAT for teaching students, and I've had much success in learning new ideas from them myself!

Wait, it's out now?!?!?!? *footsteps.....door slamming.......car starting.......screeching tires*
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Old 04-11-2009, 05:10 AM
aydee aydee is offline
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

A double thumbs up for all the great teachers of our passion. I'll always check John Riley out
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  #4  
Old 04-20-2009, 03:54 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

Has anybody been working with this DVD? I have and have found it a valuable tool.
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Old 04-20-2009, 11:19 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

Dang it, he told me about it like 3 months ago, and I'd completely forgotten. Time to check if it's out in Australia, and if not to order from overseas.

Anything John Riley does is gold in my opinion, I'd highly reccomend anyone check out his 3 books: Art of Bop Drumming, Beyond Bop Drumming and (i think) The Jazz Drummer's Workshop.
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  #6  
Old 04-21-2009, 04:05 AM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

I've thoroughly enjoyed the material he has produced thus far( I still play along with the tracks on the Art of Bop on occasion!), so I believe this warrants a look.
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Old 04-21-2009, 03:37 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

I just ordered a copy and it will hopefully be here before the weekend. I'm looking forward to working with it.
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Old 04-21-2009, 10:29 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muckster View Post
I just ordered a copy and it will hopefully be here before the weekend. I'm looking forward to working with it.
You're going to love it, it's a awesome DVD. Very informative and educational.
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  #9  
Old 04-24-2009, 01:00 AM
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Default JOHN RILEY here: new DVD

Hey guys,

I'm looking for some input regarding one of the articles in this book - I would PM Mr Riley himself but I would like your ideas too...hopefully he will chime in when he has the time.

I'm talking about the second chapter in the book, "Holding The Groove", in which John provides us with a series of RIDICULOUS independence exercises based on a small selection of 3 beat phrases, to be played under a ride swing. I'm not at the end of the exercises yet, but I would like to know if there is any particular system that can be used to expand on the ideas in this chapter, or even create my own? I've only got a grip on the first few at the moment, but I can see how helpful they are and would like to get my hands on more material like it.

If you haven't got this book I suggest you check it!

Thanks everybody,
Lloyd.
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Old 04-24-2009, 08:44 AM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

You could go about accenting, buzzing, doubling or muting (don't forget the bass drum!) one or more of the strokes. Also, try substituting the hi-hat for the bass drum or the snare drum. How about interpreting each snare stroke as a rim click? See if you can incorporate your ride hand in the patterns without messing up its own pattern. Work with various subdivisions underneath the quarter note pulse. Go nuts, but be smart about it!
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  #11  
Old 04-25-2009, 09:04 PM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

John Riley Here:

Lloyd, those phrases are an out-growth of playing page 5 of the Stick Control book between my feet in quarter-note triplets and filling in the other 1/8 note triplets on the snare drum. Then moving the left hand snare - high tom - snare - floor tom, or moving the left hand either clockwise or counter clockwise around the kit. Once you do this, variations will dawn on you.

Another way to generate similar ideas is to take the 3 voice comping in Beyond Bop and loop any 3, 5 or 7 beats of any line and play it for 4 or 8 bars. Once that's comfortable, experiment moving you left hand around the toms.

These ideas are challenging but the effort will improve coordination, open up your phrasing and strenghten the center of your time.

Good luck,

John
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  #12  
Old 04-26-2009, 08:00 PM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Riley View Post
John Riley Here:

Lloyd, those phrases are an out-growth of playing page 5 of the Stick Control book between my feet in quarter-note triplets and filling in the other 1/8 note triplets on the snare drum. Then moving the left hand snare - high tom - snare - floor tom, or moving the left hand either clockwise or counter clockwise around the kit. Once you do this, variations will dawn on you.

Another way to generate similar ideas is to take the 3 voice comping in Beyond Bop and loop any 3, 5 or 7 beats of any line and play it for 4 or 8 bars. Once that's comfortable, experiment moving you left hand around the toms.

These ideas are challenging but the effort will improve coordination, open up your phrasing and strenghten the center of your time.

Good luck,

John

That's the beauatiful thing about independence. Once you have liberated your limbs from each other then the fun only begins because you are liberating them to actually articulate different phrases at the same time. I've been working with the ideas in your books and DVD to do what you recommended, taking melodic phrases that repeat at odd intervals. It ain't easy, but it is very rewarding, and I haven't even added the left foot plays triangle wood block and high hat at the same time while beating out the clave, of course. :)
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  #13  
Old 05-04-2009, 01:58 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

Is this DVD suitable for beginners? I'm still working with "Art of Bop".
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  #14  
Old 05-04-2009, 03:30 PM
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Default Re: John Riley's new DVD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by romicsteve View Post
Is this DVD suitable for beginners? I'm still working with "Art of Bop".
Yes, acutally it makes a nice companion to The Art of Bop Drumming.
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  #15  
Old 05-06-2009, 01:53 AM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

ANOTHER QUESTION:

Hopefully John will chime in here too, or maybe DeltaDrummer if you can mate.

Another article that has really helped me out (with almost immediate results) is the "Time Matters" chapter. Again, I'm interested in expanding the ideas used in this one, particularly the first part of the exercise where we are given a few basic comping ideas and told to sing the rests with certain syllables. Now I've tried getting Syncopation and Art Of Bop Drumming and writing my own syllables in the rests but it never seems to work out. Are there certain syllables that are supposed to be used at certain points in the phrase? Is it even nesecerry to expand on this section, or can the same brief material be practiced over and over with fresh results each time?

Thanks in advance = ]
Lloyd.
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  #16  
Old 05-10-2009, 11:08 PM
John Riley John Riley is offline
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

John Riley here:

Hi Lloyd,

Glad you like that chapter. The idea here is to use 5 way coordination to deepen one's sense of pulse and to reduce the friction between the limbs. Gary Chester's New Breed has similar themes in the funk area.

The specific syllables are the same syllables horn players use when they sing phrases to each other in order to convey the correct flow and articulation.

You can use these syllables to fill in the spaces in The Art of Bop or Syncopation but I think once you've gotten the basic phrases in The Jazz Drummer's Workshop flowing, you've gained 90% of it.

Have you gotten my DVD yet Lloyd?

Best,

John
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  #17  
Old 05-11-2009, 01:49 AM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Riley View Post
John Riley here:

Hi Lloyd,

Glad you like that chapter. The idea here is to use 5 way coordination to deepen one's sense of pulse and to reduce the friction between the limbs. Gary Chester's New Breed has similar themes in the funk area.

The specific syllables are the same syllables horn players use when they sing phrases to each other in order to convey the correct flow and articulation.

You can use these syllables to fill in the spaces in The Art of Bop or Syncopation but I think once you've gotten the basic phrases in The Jazz Drummer's Workshop flowing, you've gained 90% of it.

Have you gotten my DVD yet Lloyd?

Best,

John

Alright cheers mate. I have The New Breed, but it doesn't help me swing like your exercises.

I haven't got hold of the DVD yet, but I think you'll be pleased to know that Beyond Bop Drumming came through my door the other day. I also think you'll be pleased to know that's it's frustrating my limbs heavily. It really is a phenomenal text. After one quick blast through the first chapter, I now finally understand Elvin's whole approach to the "one instrument" concept. I can't thank you enough.

Regarding the DVD, I looked for it a while back and couldn't find it on any UK sites - I could only find Region 1 imports, which are no good. I'll look for it again. I do really want it.

Kind regards,
Lloyd.
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  #18  
Old 05-11-2009, 03:00 AM
John Riley John Riley is offline
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Hi Lloyd,

Yes, Beyond Bop is challenging. Stick with it and there will be more revelations...

Regardless of the way amazon and some sites list the DVD, there is only one version of the DVD and it is in fact "all" region code 0.

Best,

John
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  #19  
Old 05-11-2009, 10:27 PM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Riley View Post
there is only one version of the DVD and it is in fact "all" region code 0.
What?! Why didn't anyone tell me?!

*Buys*


OK that should be here soon, hopefully :D


By the way, just out of interest - is this an Alan Dawson thing by any chance?:

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Riley View Post
Lloyd, those phrases are an out-growth of playing page 5 of the Stick Control book between my feet in quarter-note triplets and filling in the other 1/8 note triplets on the snare drum.
I read somewhere that you studied with him...
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  #20  
Old 05-12-2009, 11:33 PM
John Riley John Riley is offline
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Hi Lloyd,

No, I never studied with Alan. I stumbled upon this while varying some of the many coordination approaches Joe Morello taught me to Stick Control. I recall doing it in a practice room at North Texas in 1972 or 73. As I was practicing it, my teacher there, John Gates, knocked on the door and asked me if I was practicing the 4-Way book - it sounded like that to him - but I had not seen Marvin's book at that point.

I wonder if Alan was a student of G.L. Stone at the same time Morello was...

Best,

John
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  #21  
Old 05-13-2009, 01:14 AM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Riley View Post
No, I never studied with Alan. I stumbled upon this while varying some of the many coordination approaches Joe Morello taught me to Stick Control. I recall doing it in a practice room at North Texas in 1972 or 73. As I was practicing it, my teacher there, John Gates, knocked on the door and asked me if I was practicing the 4-Way book - it sounded like that to him - but I had not seen Marvin's book at that point.
Brilliant.

Would you care to share at least a taste of those Joe Morello coordination exercises with us? You don't have to if you don't feel it fair.

Funnily enough, I bought Marvin's book at the same time I bought Beyond Bop. It's just...ridiculous. I don't think any other inanimate object has ever caused me so much agony. My plan is to limber up my 4-way coordination with Beyond Bop, Jazz Drummer's Workshop and the completion of Alan Dawson's ways to use Syncopation, then I'll tackle 4-Way Coordination full-throttle.


Lloyd.
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  #22  
Old 05-13-2009, 08:19 PM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

Lloyd,

You can do Stone with the right foot, left hand playing a jazz interpretation of the sticking. I think Alan Dawson had it the other way around.

I got a good one for ya'

You can play the sticking with a jazz interpretation using your feet and then play all of the triplet partials with your left hand. downbeat, trip, let, down beat - trip, trip - let, downbeat - let, quarter note triplet partials, etc.

Of course it goes without saying that you could put the two exercises together and play the partials with the high hat. :)
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Last edited by Deltadrummer; 05-13-2009 at 09:02 PM.
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  #23  
Old 05-15-2009, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: Question Regarding "Jazz Drummer's Workshop" by John Riley

I should add, Lloyd, that a lot of the stuff on the DVD answers your question.
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  #24  
Old 05-23-2009, 04:46 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here: new DVD

It's great, that John Riley joined our Forum - for some time already - and also in other threads.

Just now i put up in collaboration with John and ALFRED
samples from the new DVD:

MASTER DRUMMER - How to practice, play and think like a pro.

The samples include the Headroom Concept, Max Roach Patterns and a short solo...

Here:

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/j...headroom1.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/johnrileysolo.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/j...ymaxroach.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/j...headroom2.html

This a really a great and very helpful DVD - not only for Jazz Players...was not easy to choose the samples from so much great content....

I strongly recommend this DVD for every serious drummer - work for years waiting - but the learning curve started for me already after five minutes....

Bernhard


Last edited by Bernhard; 05-23-2009 at 04:57 PM.
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  #25  
Old 06-08-2009, 11:24 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Hey everyone,

I just wanted to direct you to a little transcription of one of John's solos that Bernhard was so kind to post up.

Here is the link:

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/johnrileysolo.html

Many thanks to Bernhard and to Mr. Riley for helping to make it possible!

Enjoy!!

Terry
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Old 06-11-2009, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

That's great! Thank you very much Terry!
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  #27  
Old 06-11-2009, 02:20 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Funky Jazzer:

You asked about 3-beat exercises similar to what you found in John's Workshop book. Near the back of 4-Way Coordination is a short chapter on playing 3-beat ideas in 4/4, using them on the ride cymbal, like Elvin and Tony.

I remember the chapter well. Mr. Dahlgren was only accepting students from the University of Minnesota. But I used to nag at him to give me lessons. Offhandedly, he told me to learn the chapter of which I am describing. I almost had a friggin' aneurism, but I managed to do it. So, Marv had to teach me. It's funny...what you can do when you have to.
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  #28  
Old 06-16-2009, 11:03 PM
jon e rotten jon e rotten is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

just got the DVD...fantastic...really what i've been looking for..

p.s. great interview in the July Modern Drummer, one of the best i've read in awhile
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  #29  
Old 06-21-2009, 04:40 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry B. View Post
Hey everyone,

I just wanted to direct you to a little transcription of one of John's solos that Bernhard was so kind to post up.

Here is the link:

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/johnrileysolo.html

Many thanks to Bernhard and to Mr. Riley for helping to make it possible!

Enjoy!!

Terry
Thank you all indefinitely for both the samples and the transcription!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I love the groups of 7 in line #5, which I could not have figured out by myself by just listening...!
I cant wait to get the DVD, but unfortunately it is not available in germany yet. Amazon germany does feature it, but labeled as "not available". (sad smiley)
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  #30  
Old 07-02-2009, 02:41 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Well I have had this DVD for a fortnight and have to say it's probably one of the best DVD's a jazz drummer could buy. Though anyone could benefit from it. Really well thought out.

What is so good about this DVD is that it's one of the only jazz drum educational dvds out there.

There is so much stuff to work on, and I really like the section on Creativity by using some of the classic solo phrases used by the great masters. I'm also so sure that the exercise on Latin Rhythms- that the first groove is off Sonny Rollins' "St Thomas", a great Max Roach calypso groove. Though I could be wrong. I will be learning that.

Highly recommended!

Last edited by tim1987; 07-02-2009 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 07-11-2009, 04:30 AM
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  #31  
Old 07-11-2009, 06:07 PM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

dear john,
wow, i've been working on all three of your books for a while and i really need to get this dvd! the samples look great! thanks for continuing to put out so much great material and helping us all get so much better at playing drums. i owe you a lot!
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  #32  
Old 07-12-2009, 02:36 AM
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

I'ts in the mail! can't wait to get stuck in, the sections that Bernhard uploaded onto drummerworld have already greatly helped me!

http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/j...headroom2.html
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Old 07-18-2009, 05:51 PM
RicardoG RicardoG is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

I have a question regarding this video (up tempo ride playing).

In art of bop drumming, john riley says that the skip note must be lower in volume in relation with the quarter notes (1 2 a3 4a). but with this technique, that I've been learning to apply at all speeds (including low), when collecting the stick I can't get a lower volume than the next wrist stroke (being the skip note the one that's collected with the fingers, and the quarter note with the wrist). my question is, at a lower speed, is it correct to use this technique? (in the video, demonstrating at a lower speed, the skip note is at the same volume as the others)

thanks
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Old 07-18-2009, 06:21 PM
tim1987 tim1987 is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Well I have been taught by a top UK teacher called Dave Hassell, who teaches to use the whole arm with the elbow from side to side when doing uptempo ride cymbal playing. I find if I'm just using my wrist and fingers, that fatigue sets in for me personally, and it's better to use the arm, wrist and fingers in conjuction with each other. You can see people like Tony Williams, Jack deJohnette and even Steve Smith doing it on his Drum Legacy DVD.

Watch Tony on here at around 1:15:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVf9McCjT3s

I know there's a slowed down version of Tony playing uptempo on youtube, but for the actual motion, this video is better.

But in answer to your question about slower tempos, I'd say that I use my wrist and fingers mainly, and then at around 140-150, my arm comes into play as well. I like to listen to people like Jimmy Cobb and Philly Joe Jones, just to listen to their ride cymbal. I have actually transcribed Jack DeJohnette playing on some Michael Brecker cd's, and just try to copy his cymbal lines. Highly recommended.

I also highly recommend Jim Blackley's book "Essence of Jazz Drumming" which has lots of practical material but in the intro, he goes over the whole way of articulating the cymbal line with strong and weak pulses, I have been taught that with the regular cymbal pattern the quarter notes are played about F-FF, while the skip notes are at PPP. It has helped my feel, sound and time no end.

Last edited by tim1987; 07-18-2009 at 06:32 PM.
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  #35  
Old 07-24-2009, 01:51 AM
RicardoG RicardoG is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

hey. the reason I asked about the technique is because on the ride I use french grip (it comes naturally), and after swinging for 10~15m my thumb starts to get sore. after looking at my technique I realized I was pushing the stick down with my thumb on the skip note. after that I started to use the wrist for the skip note, but it also gets sore in few minutes, even at low tempos. I'll just keep practicing both techniques at slow tempos until I get comfortable with them. thanks for the help, I've already looked into jack dejohnette, thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tim1987 View Post
Well I have been taught by a top UK teacher called Dave Hassell, who teaches to use the whole arm with the elbow from side to side when doing uptempo ride cymbal playing. I find if I'm just using my wrist and fingers, that fatigue sets in for me personally, and it's better to use the arm, wrist and fingers in conjuction with each other. You can see people like Tony Williams, Jack deJohnette and even Steve Smith doing it on his Drum Legacy DVD.

Watch Tony on here at around 1:15:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVf9McCjT3s

I know there's a slowed down version of Tony playing uptempo on youtube, but for the actual motion, this video is better.

But in answer to your question about slower tempos, I'd say that I use my wrist and fingers mainly, and then at around 140-150, my arm comes into play as well. I like to listen to people like Jimmy Cobb and Philly Joe Jones, just to listen to their ride cymbal. I have actually transcribed Jack DeJohnette playing on some Michael Brecker cd's, and just try to copy his cymbal lines. Highly recommended.

I also highly recommend Jim Blackley's book "Essence of Jazz Drumming" which has lots of practical material but in the intro, he goes over the whole way of articulating the cymbal line with strong and weak pulses, I have been taught that with the regular cymbal pattern the quarter notes are played about F-FF, while the skip notes are at PPP. It has helped my feel, sound and time no end.
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  #36  
Old 07-24-2009, 09:00 AM
tim1987 tim1987 is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Yeah, I think I use french grip when playing the ride for jazz. I had a bad habit with my thumb because the whole pad of my thumb wasn't on the stick. I had some other bad habits in my traditional grip hand, but that's been ironed out now.

I'm no expert at all on ride technique, I know what needs to be done after looking at the masters. It's just doing it myself which is the hard bit!!
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  #37  
Old 08-28-2009, 07:20 AM
Ekim Ekim is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA, Planet Earth
Posts: 681
Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Looks like another great DVD I have to put on the list. Sheesh, I need a better-paying job!
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  #38  
Old 09-11-2009, 06:04 AM
jasonrhcp jasonrhcp is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

John is excellent, and I'm studying jazz alot more these days for school. I've learned so much fro this DVD

I play thumb on top on the ride, and I always use forearm movememnt, never too tight with the thumb. The "Tony" rebound motion! he was a master of using it all!
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Old 09-11-2009, 08:58 AM
jake_larson jake_larson is offline
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Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

anything by John Riley is highly recommended, in highschool I played tons of punk, metal, and prog. Then I got his book art of bop and I can finally swing (i hope) I am going to get this dvd asap
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Old 09-13-2009, 02:56 PM
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Caz Caz is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: London
Posts: 306
Default Re: JOHN RILEY here...new DVD: samples here....

Hi all.. Looking for a bit of advice here if you please :)

I've been working through Art of the Bop Drummer for a while and feel ready to move on to a new book/dvd. Just looked at amazon and there are a few John Riley ones available. Any recommendations where I should go next?

I'm about to be starting a pretty time consuming PHD and am hoping for about 2 hours daily drum practice - so in the interests of efficient practicing I'd rather have one thing to steadily work through at a time (instead of buying them all at the same time and getting lost...) parallel to working on technique. Drum-wise, I've mainly been working through the Ramsay/Dawson book and Art of the Bop Drummer - so if anything jumps out as an immediate logical step up from those please let me know?

Thanks for reading, Caz.
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