HeelToe Question (Not Technique)

dandydonner

Junior Member
I play heel down most of the time, and i was looking into various styles of play. so i've been learning the heel/toe technique a bit, and i was wondering, is that an average, commonplace thing that people use all the time, or is it just some weird technique that just exists?
sorry for my ignorance, i dont really know any other drummers, so i've got nobody to talk drums to.

thanks!
 
Double hits on the kick are pretty common, in some genres more than others. But they really aren't anything out of this world like playing by using the Force the lift your sticks or anything...
 
Well, I think of the heel toe sort of as the Moeller technique for the foot.

To answer your question, there is nothing weird about it, and its more common place than you would think especially with drummers who do fast triplets/quads/doubles etc on a single pedal.

The principle of the stroke is this: You strike the pedal with your heel in a way that the beater hits the drum and instantly bounces back. Since you are striking it with your heel, your toes are already up and in position for the next strike. If done smoothly it creates a rocking motion for the foot.
 
i always found that the heel-toe tecnique is always useful in a west coast shuffle situation. another application i like to do to heel toe is add a snare stroke after which makes the second heel-toe stroke into a 32nd. i find it sounds and feels better than using 2 pedals to achieve 2 strokes and then a snare stroke after, ( sorta hard to explain, if you want an example of it listen from 1;16-1:30 of pull me under by dream theater).

you could also make it into a triplet : bass ,bass, hi-hat
Heel Toe

If your feeling adventurous try heel toe on the hi-hat pedal... shocked me the first time i tried it.

Hope this helps
 
I play heel down most of the time, and i was looking into various styles of play. so i've been learning the heel/toe technique a bit, and i was wondering, is that an average, commonplace thing that people use all the time, or is it just some weird technique that just exists?
sorry for my ignorance, i dont really know any other drummers, so i've got nobody to talk drums to.

thanks!

Heel toe technique is streamlined double strokes just like push pull/open close for hands. It is normal and useful technique that gives speed and accenting possibilities, however strong singles and doubles are the basics. Even such a heel toe monster as Jojo Mayer often would use this technique only in solo section of song(on bass drum, hihat is bit different story).
 
I think the next step for you would be to learn heel up, before jumping into the heel/toe method. Now, this is just my opinion but it seems to me, the heel/toe is for streams of notes, not typical playing. And it's not exactly easy to just pick up.

Basic heel up seem like the logical next step to learn unless it is a stream of consistent notes you are after. Learning heel up will also get your foot in shape to be able to execute the heel/toe thing.
 
Heel toe doubles in 6 sound really interesting, give it a try sometime. In my bands newest song, there is a part in 6/8 that features doubles on the bass drums w/ a simple floor tom pattern, its a half time build up that leads into a double time skank beat w/guitar solo. Honestly, i never thought i had this technique down on both feet, because ive always used single strokes and only used doubles for accents and maybe for some triplet rhythms. Its not that easy to pick up and, at least with double bass, its difficult to get all the strokes to sound even without using triggers. Its worth learning the technique but don't expect to use it that much, its really a secondary technique to single strokes in most cases.
 
Heel toe is useful if you play single pedal, but I can't see it being that great if you play double. I play single pedal and it has affected my playing a lot, but I couldn't see myself using it that much if I had a double pedal.
 
I use it all the time, it's a good technique. Ususally, I begin the night playing heel up, and do doubles by using slide method. No reason, i just like having more than one way to do anything. The best part of heel-toe came to me when I began playing V-drums. I was able to do heel-toe with both feet on my double pedal. What I was doing was superfast ( at least compared to my usual bass drum speed), bass drum rolls by doing R(heel),R(toe), L(heel), L(toe). RRLLRR, kind of like stroke roll. I use that to rely on when I get tired. Sometimes, when a bass roll is coming up, I just don't think I "got it", heel-toe is my savior.
 
Heel toe is, at best, a tertiary technique concern. It' a nice little trick if you want to get doubles going quickly without taking the time to master true double stroke technique. You can also use it like JoJo to get a fast stream of singles going on one foot. Big whoop.

I guess you could spend 6 months like Steve Smith said he did mastering the constant release variation of the technique but, frankly, Steve had great technique for years before he ever did that. It's not as if he is suddenly doing stuff that he couldn't do 20 years ago.

C'mon though, all you guys talking about talking about how much you use it and how great it is. Name me some songs (NOT some YouTube vid) in which the drummer is using it.

Ahhh, I feel so much better getting that off my chest.
 
Heel toe is, at best, a tertiary technique concern. It' a nice little trick if you want to get doubles going quickly without taking the time to master true double stroke technique. You can also use it like JoJo to get a fast stream of singles going on one foot. Big whoop.

I guess you could spend 6 months like Steve Smith said he did mastering the constant release variation of the technique but, frankly, Steve had great technique for years before he ever did that. It's not as if he is suddenly doing stuff that he couldn't do 20 years ago.

C'mon though, all you guys talking about talking about how much you use it and how great it is. Name me some songs (NOT some YouTube vid) in which the drummer is using it.

Ahhh, I feel so much better getting that off my chest.

well, i am very bad at double hits, so i have to use one heel toe stroke if i want to do two beats, i'm so used to it now, that i do it even with slow grooves......check out steve gadd, he does it on the slowest grooves. I can't find the videa where he talks about it
 
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