KIS on drum sampling, video clips.

Andy

Honorary Member
Ever wonder where drum samples come from & how they're recorded?

Just back from recording a selection of Guru snares for the "Best of British" download samples collection at "Blast" studios in Newcastle upon Tyne. For an old fart like me, I found the process both interesting & much more involved than expected. Each drum has to be recorded in 9 different disciplines across about 15 dynamics x 9 samples of each discipline. That makes it possibly the most laborious & tedious recording session ever, yet you still have to really concentrate on consistency. There's also a ton of mic placement to be done, as the customer will have the option to select from any or all of the mic variations & placements on offer. There's a lot more mic's used than you can see on these clips.

I was asked to play a little jam piece at the start of each drum recording. These aren't published (thank goodness!), they're just for establishing a dynamic realism benchmark for the sample audition process. I was asked to generate a range of dynamics & textures from each drum.

There's no performance intended on these clips so please don't hang me on the detail. Anyhow, two clips, one of a 13" x 7" walnut stave with segmented hoops. This has a thin wall shell without rerings. Second clip is my personal 14" x 5" walnut & ash segmented snare with ash segmented hoops. The audio you're hearing is "Youtubeised" but otherwise unprocessed straight from my Zoom Q3 recorder. The studio capture versions are obviously much much better than these. I just put the recorder on a nearby amp so you guys could appreciate a bit of the context.

Play in 1080HD for reasonable quality (for Youtube) :(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3eoOweyRIk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bfB_9u7eBc


Live clip of the 14" x 5" walnut/ash http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2ezZb34SC4&hd=1
 
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Wow great drums, that 14 inch has so much depth for 5 inches. Best of Britain indeed.
 
My kids just scolded me for listening to them so loudly while they watched tv. But I just kept wanting to go back and forth and listen to the differences in those two drums.

As I listen, I say to myself "I like the deeper one better." And then I listen to the 5" and think "Man, I like those rimshots." Actually there is so much I'm thinking when I'm listening, but I don't have the words for the mental reactions to those drums.

Awesome stuff. And just looking at the bass drum is a tease. Couldn't you have hit that just a few times? :)

Keep on keeping on, Andy. I love your clips. Awesome drums.
 
Both drums sound great but I think overall I like the deeper drum more - a tastier rimshot to my ear. Both drums had nice tone at low volume.

Love to have as reliable a rimshot as you have. Well played, old bean.
 
Now that the smaller one is "used" I'd be glad to make you an offer for it. They both sound good. Would love to hear the pro mix when it's done. Hope this side job does you well.
 
Cool clips. I've never been a fan of shallow snare drums, but I really like the tone coming from that 14 x 5 Walnut & Ash. What a great sounding drum! I like the other one too, don't get me wrong, but I'm really impressed with that 14x5. I can only imagine how it sounds live.
 
Hey Andy...You did a great job in that seat!

There were a few headaches all round by the end of that session, but it was pretty productive and we nailed some great sounds.

Next time i'll make sure there's a session guy in place so you can sit in the control room, drink tea and shoot s**t like the rest of us!!
 
wow those sound GREAT!!! I really like the tone on that 13x7! Like others I'd love to hear the finished studio clips of them
 
Hey Andy...You did a great job in that seat!

There were a few headaches all round by the end of that session, but it was pretty productive and we nailed some great sounds.

Next time i'll make sure there's a session guy in place so you can sit in the control room, drink tea and shoot s**t like the rest of us!!
Hi Kevin, glad you could join us here :)

By way of introduction guys, Kevin own/runs Beatmaster Audio, & he should be given kudos for having the balls to come to the market with distinctive samples, rather than the stuff everyone else is doing. So you guy's who trigger samples in the studio or live, either via an acoustic set or Ekit, keep an eye out for the finished Beatmaster Audio "Best of British" release later this year.

I enjoyed the session Kevin, & look forward to working with you again :)

Actually there is so much I'm thinking when I'm listening, but I don't have the words for the mental reactions to those drums.

Awesome stuff. And just looking at the bass drum is a tease. Couldn't you have hit that just a few times? :)

Awesome drums.
Maybe next time for other Guru drums. This time out, we only had time for a snare selection.

Wow great drums, that 14 inch has so much depth for 5 inches. Best of Britain indeed.
Thank you!

Awesome drums you got, enjoy listening to them :B
Thanks BB! & if you're recording somewhere in the future, you can dial your snare drum into the Guru sound. How cool is that!

Both drums had nice tone at low volume.
Cheers Pol, I thought you'd like the more earthy 13", & tone at low volume is a benchmark for a quality shell :)

wow those sound GREAT!!! I really like the tone on that 13x7!
Firmly in the Polly camp :)

Cool clips. I've never been a fan of shallow snare drums, but I really like the tone coming from that 14 x 5 Walnut & Ash. What a great sounding drum!
Thanks, & I love it live. Give me 30 minutes or so, & I'll have a clip up from last night's gig featuring that snare.

Now that the smaller one is "used" I'd be glad to make you an offer for it.
If I've played it, the price increases by 10%, lol!
 
I'm all over that 14 x 5. Can't believe I just said that. I like it's voice better. Not that the 13 x 7 is a slouch, I do prefer the 14" drum though.
Andy the snare sound at the "last night's gig" vid sounds beautiful, as does your bronze. I notice some real advancement in your playing, crispness and tone. The end of BTBW was awesome! Loved your roll! Seriously, there's a big diff in your whole vibe that I never got before, and your drum and cymbal tones are peerless.
 
I'll join Larry's view, I prefer the 14" x 5" walnut & ash segmented snare with ash segmented hoops, perhaps it's because I've heard it so many times, but it's more articulated for me, and seems to have a greater response, maybe due to the depth, but the 13" x 7" walnut stave is a very good snare, and depending on the style it can be the perfect snare, but for me, from what I heard the 14" x 5" walnut & ash is the one, born to be wild indeed :))

Are we gonna get to hear the studio recordings of these samples you so gracefully played? It certainely belong to the "best of british" drum samples :)

BTW, the Zoom Q3HD sounds amazing, especialy on the "live" clip :))
 
I'm all over that 14 x 5. Can't believe I just said that. I like it's voice better. Not that the 13 x 7 is a slouch, I do prefer the 14" drum though.
Andy the snare sound at the "last night's gig" vid sounds beautiful, as does your bronze. I notice some real advancement in your playing, crispness and tone. The end of BTBW was awesome! Loved your roll! Seriously, there's a big diff in your whole vibe that I never got before, and your drum and cymbal tones are peerless.
Thanks Larry, I think I just blushed ;)

That press roll at the end of BTBW was pure improv'. I normally just continue with crash swell to the end bash. I surprised myself actually. I'm not sure you can hear it on the recording, but about a third of the way through that roll, I build up a fast single stroke roll on the double bass drum pedal (I'm shocked at how much my bass drum moves when I do that). I'm pleased that I managed to hold that press roll together with the bass drum thang going on at the same time :)

As for my general playing, I'm starting to get my old mojo from back in the day. I find myself throwing stuff into the mix that I used to play, & when that works, it spurs me on. I'm not up to speed yet, but a good round of gigging this year will help a lot. Maybe someday I'll actually practice, but I'm both super busy, and suffering age related laziness ;)

I'll join Larry's view, I prefer the 14" x 5" walnut & ash segmented snare with ash segmented hoops, perhaps it's because I've heard it so many times, but it's more articulated for me, and seems to have a greater response, maybe due to the depth, but the 13" x 7" walnut stave is a very good snare, and depending on the style it can be the perfect snare, but for me, from what I heard the 14" x 5" walnut & ash is the one, born to be wild indeed :))

Are we gonna get to hear the studio recordings of these samples you so gracefully played? It certainely belong to the "best of british" drum samples :)

BTW, the Zoom Q3HD sounds amazing, especialy on the "live" clip :))
Cheers Henri! Clearly, I'm going to be biased towards the walnut/ash drum, as I chose it, but I do crave for a 13" again too (probably purpleheart steambent.) The ash segmented hoops make that drum for me. I like all styles of hoops, especially cast hoops on certain snare drums, but there's no doubt that well made segmented or steam bent solid hoops (that are well matched to the drum) are the ultimate way of bringing out the best in shell tone woodiness.

Yep, now I can say I've heard the perfect snare drum. I'm always impressed with those Dervish cymbals too for some reason.
Thanks man, I'm glad you liked that drum. I'm looking forward to doing a fair bit of drum recording this year, both for digital samples, but also for the new Guru series later this year.

BTW, my live set of Amedia cymbals are a selection of series from that great maker, but non of them are Dervish series. My dervish pies live with my prototype kit, & are also used for recording, as they're a distinctive voiced set with a close family feel.
 
Listening to these again, I think I like the shallow drum more at low volume but I find that rimshot a bit ... boingy in the sample but the grating tone didn't come through in the band clip

I won't comment on your playing because this thread isn't in the Your Playing area :)
 
Listening to these again, I think I like the shallow drum more at low volume but I find that rimshot a bit ... boingy in the sample but the grating tone didn't come through in the band clip

I won't comment on your playing because this thread isn't in the Your Playing area :)
Pol, I'm using a much higher tuning on the band clip than I am in the studio samples session. As you tune this snare up, it takes you through a range of higher overtones, almost as if it's presenting you with a choice of flavours for the day, but the fundamental still underpins the palate.

Agreed on the "Your Playing" area policing. I put that gig clip in as MZ requested a live sample, & that's what I had to hand. I was thinking of putting a selection from Saturday's gig in the Your Playing section, but figured most would be pretty sick of me putting drumcam clips up, at least for now ;)
 
Hi Kevin, glad you could join us here :)

By way of introduction guys, Kevin own/runs Beatmaster Audio, & he should be given kudos for having the balls to come to the market with distinctive samples, rather than the stuff everyone else is doing. So you guy's who trigger samples in the studio or live, either via an acoustic set or Ekit, keep an eye out for the finished Beatmaster Audio "Best of British" release later this year.

I enjoyed the session Kevin, & look forward to working with you again :)

Maybe next time for other Guru drums. This time out, we only had time for a snare selection.

Thank you!

Thanks BB! & if you're recording somewhere in the future, you can dial your snare drum into the Guru sound. How cool is that!

Cheers Pol, I thought you'd like the more earthy 13", & tone at low volume is a benchmark for a quality shell :)

Firmly in the Polly camp :)

Thanks, & I love it live. Give me 30 minutes or so, & I'll have a clip up from last night's gig featuring that snare.

If I've played it, the price increases by 10%, lol!

How can I do that hmmm....
 
How can I do that hmmm....
It would apply more to the use of an Ekit than triggering an Akit in normal use, but if you were recording, you can use any replacement sound you want. Essentially, you pay for, & download a sample package. Probably better if Kevin from Beatmaster Audio answers the "techy" questions, as the program side of it is over my head.
 
How can I do that hmmm....

It's quite simple BabyBob.

You can have an A-Kit with triggers or an E-Kit - which are just pads with triggers. The triggers have an output that sends a small electrical signal to a unit (commonly called the 'Brain', I prefer 'Module') that converts the electrical signals (which get bigger when you hit the drum harder) into a MIDI control signal. The MIDI signal can then be sent to a computer, where it can be read by software (e.g. Logic Pro or Ableton Live) and can trigger samples based on the information contained in the MIDI data.

Essentially:

Trigger -> Module -(Conversion to MIDI)- -> Computer -> Sample Triggered -> Playback
 
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