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  #1  
Old 04-15-2015, 10:08 AM
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Default The Best Drummer in the World

Hi all,

I've released a video in which I talk about the best drummer in the world. I think it's a really interesting debate or discussion, so I'd really be keen to hear you thoughts on it.

Please watch the whole video first in case you get the wrong idea. https://youtu.be/OFMWq3j7Xro

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Thanks,
J

Last edited by Mighty_Joker; 04-15-2015 at 04:01 PM.
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  #2  
Old 04-15-2015, 11:40 AM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Listend to the first few mins but I dont have time to hear it all.

My two pence.

Never even thought about "Best in the World". Personaly? If I am playing a part in what I consider to be a great piece of music, and I play it well, and with invention and passion, then I could not be happier.

I dont even like listening to a recording of a gig. If a gig was a blast for the band and the audience were having a great time, and I come off the stage elated, what more could I wish for?

For me playing is all about the feelings and emotions I get from a performance. Was it perfect? I dont care one way or the other, If I was lost in the moment then we were great.
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Old 04-15-2015, 12:32 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

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Listend to the first few mins but I dont have time to hear it all.

My two pence.

Never even thought about "Best in the World". Personaly? If I am playing a part in what I consider to be a great piece of music, and I play it well, and with invention and passion, then I could not be happier.

I dont even like listening to a recording of a gig. If a gig was a blast for the band and the audience were having a great time, and I come off the stage elated, what more could I wish for?

For me playing is all about the feelings and emotions I get from a performance. Was it perfect? I dont care one way or the other, If I was lost in the moment then we were great.
You pretty much summed up my conclusion at toward the end of the video. Maybe give the whole thing a listen if you get the chance, as I discuss most of what you have mentioned.
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Old 04-15-2015, 03:26 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

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You pretty much summed up my conclusion at toward the end of the video. Maybe give the whole thing a listen if you get the chance, as I discuss most of what you have mentioned.
Apologies, but the title was best drummer in the world, and 20 mins is a long listen. They were my thoughts. If you covered everything, then we agree.

Thomas Lang, he of session and drum clinic fame, states that he never plays a fill in a session unless "asked" to, cos he wants to maintain the groove. Now If a guy with the technique and chops that he has worked for decades to hone spends most of his drumming life playing, in essence, 2 and 4, clinics aside, you may wonder why some spend so long trying to learn everything, and to play it at 250 BPM?
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Old 04-15-2015, 04:00 PM
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Apologies, but the title was best drummer in the world, and 20 mins is a long listen. They were my thoughts. If you covered everything, then we agree.

Thomas Lang, he of session and drum clinic fame, states that he never plays a fill in a session unless "asked" to, cos he wants to maintain the groove. Now If a guy with the technique and chops that he has worked for decades to hone spends most of his drumming life playing, in essence, 2 and 4, clinics aside, you may wonder why some spend so long trying to learn everything, and to play it at 250 BPM?
With respect, I did stipulate in my original post to please listen to the whole thing before replying in case the point was missed. And yes, we do agree, and your paragraph again almost echoes word for word with what I say in the video.
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Old 04-15-2015, 05:06 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

The best drummers in the world can be defined by era, to a degree.

Much like 18th century intellectuals weren't as intelligent as the average 21st century college grad from modern universities, drumming and drum set drumming has come a long way in a rather short amount of time and has evolved. That's one point I didn't hear discussed.

Anyway, enjoyed the talk.
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Old 04-15-2015, 05:18 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Very interesting point Brian. You're right, I didn't discuss that. So you think it's fair to have era-based benchmarks as opposed to "all time best"? Would this apply to something like boxing as well? People always want to debate Ali vs. Tyson.
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Old 04-15-2015, 05:49 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

My thoughts, all JMO only:

Striving to be the best, or even being concerned with being the best, in music, IMO, is a misapplication of energies. Trying to be best is a misguided goal in music, because there's no way to quantify it. Not only that, but I feel it's a fools errand. I feel it gets in the way of what's really important.

What's really important? Each person should be able to reel off what's important to them without too much thought. I can only speak for myself here. For me, it's being able to feel music deeply, with the goal of duplicating those sounds in my head...on the drumkit. At a high level. Constantly clarifying in as much detail as I can, my own one of a kind unique voice. That's my "inner" goals. But more importantly, and the real reason for me playing...I try to feel music and execute it in a way that touches people's emotions. Even if it's just a little. Making them feel something positive. It's not about me or my abilities at all. It's much larger than that. It's all about how they feel watching the band. I try and make it all feel really good so it's enjoyable to experience. I don't try and show off how cleverly I can play because I'm not good at it, and I don't deliberately try and impress anyone with some cool drum thing because that usually backfires. I'm now concerned with the net result first, my individual part 2nd. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts kind of approach

Now I like accolades as much as the next guy, don't get me wrong. But I found the best way to get those accolades, for me, is to be the best supporting, deepest listening drummer I can be.... In my little world, I am the drummer people want backing them up because I am listening hard to what they are trying to accomplish, and all I want to do is help them get there. That attitude right there is my secret weapon, and one of the things that separates me from the rest of the pack who are still stuck in the "I have to impress everyone with my drumming" stage. Singers love me. A supportive approach can absolutely trump blazing chops in many situations. I found it works tons better to look past myself and try and help whoever has the floor to shine. I give them the beat they need/want, at a volume that doesn't divert attention from them. I try and play a little something in their spaces, so they know I'm listening and quickly reacting. It really creates an energy. People working off one another, not staring a hole in their instruments. So I actively seek that conversational aspect of playing. The audience picks up on it too. It elevates the proceedings. And it's easy in concept.

But comparing yourself, or anyone else for that matter, to any other person is just a huge waste of time. Is DaVinci better than Raphael? That's an impossible question. There's no right answer.

Wanting to be the best is a one man goal, while playing music is a team effort. Not the right attitude from a team effort POV right?
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Last edited by larryace; 04-15-2015 at 06:59 PM.
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  #9  
Old 04-15-2015, 06:16 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Beautifully said Larry
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  #10  
Old 04-15-2015, 06:21 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

I listened to your entire YouTube segment. It is well thought out and conceived. You are right "it is not a big deal" who the best drummer in the world is. The best drummer in the world argument is for the immature whatever age they may be.

I agree that "best" is problematic to define. Does dependability, trust/trustworthy, friendship or humility come into the equation? I think so.

Your supporting visuals have little to do with our argument other than to showcase you, your drums and what you have done.

Favorite rather than best. I agree.

Best wishes and thanks for posting.

GJS
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Old 04-15-2015, 06:37 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
The best drummers in the world can be defined by era, to a degree.

Much like 18th century intellectuals weren't as intelligent as the average 21st century college grad from modern universities, drumming and drum set drumming has come a long way in a rather short amount of time and has evolved. That's one point I didn't hear discussed.

Anyway, enjoyed the talk.
That would depend how you define intellegence. If they were the intelectuals of there era that would mean they were in the very top bracket intellegence wise. Bring them forward to today and there brains would still place them in the top tier given the historical knowlege bank and learning facilities we now have. The cream would still rise to the top.

We are not cleverer now, we just have access to more material, the same goes for drumming. Original thought and invention, rather than book learning, now that is clever.
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  #12  
Old 04-15-2015, 07:31 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Haven't you guys heard of mike portnoy?
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  #13  
Old 04-15-2015, 08:52 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

I thought the best drummer was Gil Gilbert=drummer extraordinaire.
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  #14  
Old 04-15-2015, 08:56 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

I agree Mike Sir Isaac Newton supposedly had a higher IQ than Einstein. Knowledge has grown but true brilliance is still rare-fortunately we all benefit from the gifts of the few. Although I'd like to take Newton to the woodshed for inventing Calculus=dang freak.
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  #15  
Old 04-15-2015, 09:39 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

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Originally Posted by Skulmoski View Post
I listened to your entire YouTube segment. It is well thought out and conceived. You are right "it is not a big deal" who the best drummer in the world is. The best drummer in the world argument is for the immature whatever age they may be.

I agree that "best" is problematic to define. Does dependability, trust/trustworthy, friendship or humility come into the equation? I think so.

Your supporting visuals have little to do with our argument other than to showcase you, your drums and what you have done.

Favorite rather than best. I agree.

Best wishes and thanks for posting.

GJS
Thank you for you encouragement. I think you raise important points regarding humility, especially. I was very touched by Rodney Holmes' humility. I would go so far as to say it enhanced the experience of listening to his playing.

Regarding the bold section, that was only because I was worried about ownership of images. I monetise the videos as I am a YouTube partner, and I can run into difficulty if I use other people's images. By using my own photos, I avoid that issue. It's only to provide a bit of eye candy. I could have just left a black screen I suppose.
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  #16  
Old 04-15-2015, 09:40 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

Also, Larry, I agree whole heartedly, and this is pretty much what I say in my video.
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  #17  
Old 04-15-2015, 11:48 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

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Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post
Also, Larry, I agree whole heartedly, and this is pretty much what I say in my video.
Not taking a pop here but it would seem from your answers to others posts that you covered everything in your video. So why the OP?
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  #18  
Old 04-16-2015, 09:04 AM
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Not taking a pop here but it would seem from your answers to others posts that you covered everything in your video. So why the OP?
Because I wanted a discussion. But when people don't watch the video and instead post their own thoughts (which happen to line up with what I say in the video), it's difficult to know how to respond. I appreciate it's a 20 minute video, but it's kind of like commenting on an article you haven't read by spelling out everything the article says.

I appreciate everyone getting involved in the discussion, so I'm not going to fly off the handle and say "hey, watch the damn thing", so I kind of have to just say that it agrees with the video.
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Old 04-16-2015, 08:42 PM
AllTheCoolNamesAreTaken AllTheCoolNamesAreTaken is offline
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That would depend how you define intellegence. If they were the intelectuals of there era that would mean they were in the very top bracket intellegence wise. Bring them forward to today and there brains would still place them in the top tier given the historical knowlege bank and learning facilities we now have. The cream would still rise to the top.

We are not cleverer now, we just have access to more material, the same goes for drumming. Original thought and invention, rather than book learning, now that is clever.
Seriously. I have never before heard anyone say "we're smarter than those 18th century intellectuals who basically created science, created the United States ..." I wouldn't stack a modern safe-spaces, check-your-privilege, social-justice humanities college grad up against even the lowest 18th-century rat catcher.

But I have to admit it doesn't really surprise me people believe this. If there's one thing that defines modern generations it's certainty about their own preciousness.
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Old 04-16-2015, 08:43 PM
AllTheCoolNamesAreTaken AllTheCoolNamesAreTaken is offline
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If a guy with the technique and chops that he has worked for decades to hone spends most of his drumming life playing, in essence, 2 and 4, clinics aside, you may wonder why some spend so long trying to learn everything, and to play it at 250 BPM?
Because if everyone played like Thomas Lang does at session recordings it would be pretty boring :-P
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  #21  
Old 04-16-2015, 09:03 PM
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Seriously. I have never before heard anyone say "we're smarter than those 18th century intellectuals who basically created science, created the United States ..." I wouldn't stack a modern safe-spaces, check-your-privilege, social-justice humanities college grad up against even the lowest 18th-century rat catcher.

But I have to admit it doesn't really surprise me people believe this. If there's one thing that defines modern generations it's certainty about their own preciousness.
I think it was just a misplaced word. Replace "intelligent" with "knowledgeable" and he has a point. Modern day scientists, for example, have a much greater understanding of the universe and much more information available to them than Newton, Galileo, or DaVinci did, but their intellect would be hard to match in any era.
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Old 04-16-2015, 09:05 PM
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Because if everyone played like Thomas Lang does at session recordings it would be pretty boring :-P
My point was that he is famous for his drumming but earns a living playing simple beats. Meaning.....all his chops are for nothing, or clinics, which is basicly showing off. So you could argue that If you want to be an in demand pro drummer you dont realy need all the fancy stuff people spend years in music colege learning. Just a thought.
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Old 04-17-2015, 02:23 PM
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I think it was just a misplaced word. Replace "intelligent" with "knowledgeable" and he has a point. Modern day scientists, for example, have a much greater understanding of the universe and much more information available to them than Newton, Galileo, or DaVinci did, but their intellect would be hard to match in any era.
Correct, poor choice of wording on my part.
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Old 04-17-2015, 02:55 PM
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I thought the best drummer was Gil Gilbert=drummer extraordinaire.
It is Gil Gilbert. I think we've all established that a long time ago, so I don't understand what all this discussion is about.
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Old 04-17-2015, 03:13 PM
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That would depend how you define intellegence. If they were the intelectuals of there era that would mean they were in the very top bracket intellegence wise. Bring them forward to today and there brains would still place them in the top tier given the historical knowlege bank and learning facilities we now have. The cream would still rise to the top.

We are not cleverer now, we just have access to more material, the same goes for drumming. Original thought and invention, rather than book learning, now that is clever.
Yes, but the gov't prevents this from happening by putting Flouride in our water which calcifies the Pineal Gland and thusly closing the Third Eye. Our intelligence hasn't exactly flourished in this century. I have to train people at work and it is not exactly inspiring. Instead it is a painful process watching how they problem solve and seeing the same mistakes over and over. I'm not that smart really, it's just all about how you look at things.

Sorry for the derail. Please continue....
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:30 AM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

I know there's a million nerds out there always saying that this or that guy is the OMG b3s7 druxMMxer ev4r, but has anyone actually ever purported to be or laid claim to the title? Is there a kanye of drummers?

If not then I am the best drummer in the world. Fight me.
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I am the best drummer in the world.
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Old 04-18-2015, 06:08 AM
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Yes, but the gov't prevents this from happening by putting Flouride in our water which calcifies the Pineal Gland and thusly closing the Third Eye. Our intelligence hasn't exactly flourished in this century. I have to train people at work and it is not exactly inspiring. Instead it is a painful process watching how they problem solve and seeing the same mistakes over and over. I'm not that smart really, it's just all about how you look at things.

Sorry for the derail. Please continue....
Ever seen the movie Idiocracy?
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Old 04-18-2015, 06:20 AM
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Water? You mean like out the toilet?
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I am the best drummer in the world.
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  #29  
Old 04-18-2015, 05:11 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

I played professionally for over 30 years, and I just pulled off my first real 3 stroke per hand buzz roll a couple days ago.
I am learning to play like a drummers drummer for myself now, and the cool drummer technical stuff was really not required, needed or welcome during all my years playing for thousands of audiences.
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:26 PM
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My point was that he is famous for his drumming but earns a living playing simple beats. Meaning.....all his chops are for nothing, or clinics, which is basicly showing off. So you could argue that If you want to be an in demand pro drummer you dont realy need all the fancy stuff people spend years in music colege learning. Just a thought.
I wouldn't say it was for nothing. All his chops are what help make his name known so he has a shot at those sessions in the first place. And those videos and clinics aren't just showing off, they are employment.
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Old 04-18-2015, 05:42 PM
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I wouldn't say it was for nothing. All his chops are what help make his name known so he has a shot at those sessions in the first place. And those videos and clinics aren't just showing off, they are employment.


Hey,I am not knocking it, If I could play like that I would, but a clinic is just showing off. Its look at all my chops. Just my opinion, but Thomas himself says he earns his money playing the simple beats.
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  #32  
Old 04-20-2015, 07:45 PM
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Default Re: The Best Drummer in the World

The best drummer in the world is probably some kid in Peoria who no one ever heard of (and will likely never hear of unless he gets a one in a zillion lucky break).
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