Billy Ward here!

[billy ward]

Originally Posted by ThomasDee

Billy, love your playing. I'm a big fan of your approach to time and your consideration to the music. I have worked on several projects with the WFD guys and it is no secret that on a couple different forums you are championed as the 'pro' anti WFD Guy.

Well, I just wanted your side of the story in your own words.

TD
ps really a fan.

Hey Thomas - I'm just back from DrummerLive (and totally jet-lagged...been up for more hours than I can count) but thought I'd try to respond. First of all, thanks!

About the WFD - I tried to get in there to post some comments (this was perhaps two years ago or more) to try to explain (defend) that i thought that Ron Spagnardi was being unfairly attacked. simple as that.
He was simply saying that music matters the most. He was a great guy. We drummers owe Ron Spagnardi alot because of his pursuit of having a durmmer's magazine - the very first magazine dedicated to drummers. This must not be under-appreciated!!! Mod. Drmr was the first!

AS far as the WFD goes... I think excellence in ANYTHING is worth noting / enjoying / complimenting. OK? I'm down with that. Many of the drummers who participate in the WFD are noted-great technicians, yet I personally have never heard most of them play in a band/play music - so I can't really comment on them as musicians. Have you heard them play in a band? Would you mind recommending a record to me of their playing? I'd enjoy listening to it.

My perspective is:
I am a drummer that is out there doing gigs mostly - recording/touring...
stuff like that. Lately, I admit to receiving great joy from my teaching - whether it is articles in MD mag, or clinics or masterclasses. I'm feeling warm and fuzzy to speak with you and others who look in on this discussion! My perspective on the speed thing is that it is good to go for speed - who could argue otherwise? But eventually, once some facility is achieved, tone and music will matter more. As for me, I am personally comfy with my speed. If I were to measure my single stroke roll solely for speed (which is something that I haven't practiced with a focus on speed for more than thirty years..I'm looking for tone when I play a single stroke roll) I'd guess that I can do somewhere around 800 strokes per minute - give or take a hun. That's a guess and frankly, I have no idea whether that would be considered good or bad by the WFD. But I'm very content with what I can do speed - wise. It works for me. Somedays, I hit an obstacle with speed and I THEN try to get faster with whatever I think I need.

HOw about this? Maybe it would be cool for the WFD to expand out of the single stroke roll and, for instance, see who can play the Long Roll while accenting the second note. Open to closed and back to open. Who would sound best doing that? In fact.. how about a contest where the long roll with the accented second note has to happen on a loosely tuned flappy floor tom instead of a tightly tuned snare drum? I mean, THAT takes chops!!!! Just a crazy thought...

I honestly think it is great that the WFD is helping to keep sticks in the hands of drummers that might not otherwise be too interested in spending the time it takes to have some chops. If striving for speed makes that happen, I think that is wonderful. Like I said before, excellence in anything is a great thing. I remember trying to get faster with my 26 rudiments when I was a kid. But, regarding speed or tempo, I'm glad that Led Zep/the Beatles/Creme/Jimi Hendrix/the Who/Radiohead/Miles Daivs/James Brown/Styevie Wonder and a million other musicians were not ENTIRELY concerned with speed. I love their chosen tempos on those songs!
So hopefully this is clear (which my not be the case because I am so tired now and sleep deprived)

This seems to me to be an over-discussed topic. Should we start a campaign against Jim Keltner because he doesn't fill enough? Speed is simply one isolated aspect of drumming - one isolated aspect of MUSIC. I have no idea what moves this WFD discussion forward. it makes me think of Monty Python's Life Of Brian - where some are following the sandal..others the gourd... I figure I'm definitely NOt making sense anymore - so I'll sign off. This is more than I typed on my OWN website tonight!!! :D
best wishes. (and going to bed now)
BW

[DrumNut]

Ron was a GREAT man, and contributed sooo much to the drumming industry.

I was a bit cyncial of WFD as musicians at first, but I know that the champs have played with some of the best musicians.

Mangini - Extreme/Stevie Vai, etc
Verdi - Jack Wilkins/Shirley Scott, etc
Jotan A. - Britney Spears/Rick Martin, etc
Johnny Rabb - Hank Williams III, Tanya Tucker

[billy ward]

Originally Posted by DrumNut

Ron was a GREAT man, and contributed sooo much to the drumming industry.

I was a bit cyncial of WFD as musicians at first, but I know that the champs have played with some of the best musicians.

Mangini - Extreme/Stevie Vai, etc
Verdi - Jack Wilkins/Shirley Scott, etc
Jotan A. - Britney Spears/Rick Martin, etc
Johnny Rabb - Hank Williams III, Tanya Tucker

Absolutely! And I've met three of the four above (except for Jotan A.) and always enjoy their company. I am aware of their credits - just wish I could hear something. I'll ask them when I see them next.

[Rick Wilkinson]

I’m the kind of guy that likes a little "Space" between the notes. However it’s great to have gentlemen like competition like Jazz band, Marching band etc. And I guess it would be easier to judge or grade "speed" rather than to judge "playing talent", (two separate things in this case) so let them have their fun if their good at it. I’m sure they have spent allot of time working on it. And if they can really play, that’s all the better. It’s just not for me.

But I do think whatever gets you excited enough to pickup the sticks, is great.

[ThomasDee]

Originally Posted by billy ward

Hey Thomas - I'm just back from DrummerLive (and totally jet-lagged...been up for more hours than I can count) but thought I'd try to respond. First of all, thanks!

About the WFD - I tried to get in there to post some comments (this was perhaps two years ago or more) to try to explain (defend) that i thought that Ron Spagnardi was being unfairly attacked. simple as that.
He was simply saying that music matters the most. He was a great guy. We drummers owe Ron Spagnardi alot because of his pursuit of having a durmmer's magazine - the very first magazine dedicated to drummers. This must not be under-appreciated!!! Mod. Drmr was the first!

AS far as the WFD goes... I think excellence in ANYTHING is worth noting / enjoying / complimenting. OK? I'm down with that. Many of the drummers who participate in the WFD are noted-great technicians, yet I personally have never heard most of them play in a band/play music - so I can't really comment on them as musicians. Have you heard them play in a band? Would you mind recommending a record to me of their playing? I'd enjoy listening to it.

My perspective is:
I am a drummer that is out there doing gigs mostly - recording/touring...
stuff like that. Lately, I admit to receiving great joy from my teaching - whether it is articles in MD mag, or clinics or masterclasses. I'm feeling warm and fuzzy to speak with you and others who look in on this discussion! My perspective on the speed thing is that it is good to go for speed - who could argue otherwise? But eventually, once some facility is achieved, tone and music will matter more. As for me, I am personally comfy with my speed. If I were to measure my single stroke roll solely for speed (which is something that I haven't practiced with a focus on speed for more than thirty years..I'm looking for tone when I play a single stroke roll) I'd guess that I can do somewhere around 800 strokes per minute - give or take a hun. That's a guess and frankly, I have no idea whether that would be considered good or bad by the WFD. But I'm very content with what I can do speed - wise. It works for me. Somedays, I hit an obstacle with speed and I THEN try to get faster with whatever I think I need.

HOw about this? Maybe it would be cool for the WFD to expand out of the single stroke roll and, for instance, see who can play the Long Roll while accenting the second note. Open to closed and back to open. Who would sound best doing that? In fact.. how about a contest where the long roll with the accented second note has to happen on a loosely tuned flappy floor tom instead of a tightly tuned snare drum? I mean, THAT takes chops!!!! Just a crazy thought...

I honestly think it is great that the WFD is helping to keep sticks in the hands of drummers that might not otherwise be too interested in spending the time it takes to have some chops. If striving for speed makes that happen, I think that is wonderful. Like I said before, excellence in anything is a great thing. I remember trying to get faster with my 26 rudiments when I was a kid. But, regarding speed or tempo, I'm glad that Led Zep/the Beatles/Creme/Jimi Hendrix/the Who/Radiohead/Miles Daivs/James Brown/Styevie Wonder and a million other musicians were not ENTIRELY concerned with speed. I love their chosen tempos on those songs!
So hopefully this is clear (which my not be the case because I am so tired now and sleep deprived)

This seems to me to be an over-discussed topic. Should we start a campaign against Jim Keltner because he doesn't fill enough? Speed is simply one isolated aspect of drumming - one isolated aspect of MUSIC. I have no idea what moves this WFD discussion forward. it makes me think of Monty Python's Life Of Brian - where some are following the sandal..others the gourd... I figure I'm definitely NOt making sense anymore - so I'll sign off. This is more than I typed on my OWN website tonight!!! :D
best wishes. (and going to bed now)
BW

Billy thanks for the reply, especially as tired a you were. Hope you got some rest. I agree with you and was hoping that was kinda the way you thought about WFD. Most people seemed to have gotten hung up on the word Speed and forgot that it is really all about technique.

Did you read the latest (sept issue) issue of MD going inside the WFD article? If so what did you think of it? Did you think it explained WFD and possibly cleared some misunderstandings?

Who are you playing with now? Still doing some stuff with Joan Osborne? I love your work with her. So tasty.

Thank you for taking the time to respond and hope you're feeling better.

TD
ps. Also really enjoy your articles in MD.

[billy ward]

Hi Thomas - yeah (about the WFD article). i thought it was very well presented in MD - a good read.
As you probably know, I'm just back to NYC after being in the UK for DrummerLive. I am mixing an album by Jon Albrink that i am producing (you can hear a clip of one rough mix on my website under listening section - the song is titled "What Would You Give")/ I am playing on three songs (the New York sessions) of BB Kings latest album titled "80". This record was just released. I think it's a good album and BB IS 80 years old. What an incredible man!! I had a few gigs with Joan last month in Colorado at festivals - things will probably remain quiet with her now - though, a Christmas record that we did will be out shortly - it should be pretty cool for that kind of thing. I'm also recording some instrumental music - I guess you would call it jazz... with a guitarist and bass player that I used to play alot with when I lived in LA (13 years ago). That happens in six days late October. In less than a week, I'm traveling to Copenhagen to "beat up" a rhythm section as an artist in residence at the Rhythm University there. :D
November has me attending PASIC - just hanging out. Then (hopefully) I'll have some time off. I do have a Bill Champlin song sitting at my studio for more than 6 months now - I should get to that in November I hope! Also looking forward to some "down time" so that I can write some more... Thanks for asking!

[finnhiggins]

Originally Posted by billy ward

Hi Thomas - yeah (about the WFD article). i thought it was very well presented in MD - a good read.

Billy, I just caught up on this thread and your marathon WFD comments below. Thank you. That expressed all the things that impress and slightly worry me about WFD at at the same time, better than I ever could.

I'd also like to say thanks a heap for your educational ventures. If I'm going to read an article by a pro these days I think I'd look your way first. Your writing style is wonderfully clear, and you always have a whole bunch of great ideas that make me want to run off and practice! Keep up the amazing work...

[RudimentalDrummer]

Mr. Billy Ward:

So "Rythmn Tech" does works for you .... hehehehe !..you were on Page 85 of Drums Mgazine this months October 2005. .... it features the Rythmn Tech Hat Tricks available in Nickel or Polish Brass.....though of getting one of these ... looks nice - but I don't know how it works?..

[RudimentalDrummer]

In Gregg Bisonette Musical Drumming DVD ...Gregg said - Pss.sss Tell you all something ... a Secret..."Speed is not the most important aspect of Drumming .... Keeping Time and playing with the band is"

Luckily - Speed is not the most important. Gregg continue to say ... In ancient time, people dance to the Drums (very true) they don't dance to any other Musical Instruments right ? ... yes.... and so ... Making our Drums Groove is important ... make them bop their heads and wanna dance to your beat ... not speed.

PS: Not the speed is not important - just that it's not the most important aspect of drumming.

[Bernhard]

Originally Posted by RudimentalDrummer

In Gregg Bisonette Musical Drumming DVD ...Gregg said - Pss.sss Tell you all something ... a Secret..."Speed is not the most important aspect of Drumming .... Keeping Time and playing with the band is"

Luckily - Speed is not the most important. Gregg continue to say ... In ancient time, people dance to the Drums (very true) they don't dance to any other Musical Instruments right ? ... yes.... and so ... Making our Drums Groove is important ... make them bop their heads and wanna dance to your beat ... not speed.

PS: Not the speed is not important - just that it's not the most important aspect of drumming.

For me there are two aspects in this:

a) To double-bass speed maniacs: did you ever see somebody dance to the sound of a lawn-mower???

b) To the lazy-ones: Oh speed is not important, great I don't have to practice regularly anymore, just keep the groove, yeah....

Bernhard

[NUTHA JASON]

dancing to a lawn mower! ha ha ha . B you kill me. that is brilliant.


j

Originally Posted by Bernhard

For me there are two aspects in this:

a) To double-bass speed maniacs: did you ever see somebody dance to the sound of a lawn-mower???

b) To the lazy-ones: Oh speed is not important, great I don't have to practice regularly anymore, just keep the groove, yeah....

Bernhard

Bernhard... you know I'm a strange kid right?

Danced to a lawnmower...

[Bernhard]

Originally Posted by mediocrefunkybeat

Bernhard... you know I'm a strange kid right?

Danced to a lawnmower...

In another thread you just admitted, that you stopped double-bass?
I've got it now - makes sense - you switched to dancing. But season is over. In winter the lawn-mowers are sleeping.

Bernhard

Originally Posted by billy ward

Hi Thomas - yeah (about the WFD article). i thought it was very well presented in MD - a good read.
!

I'd like to introduce you to your new diplomatic attache to the EU......


Mr Billy Ward!............:)

Originally Posted by Bernhard

In another thread you just admitted, that you stopped double-bass?
I've got it now - makes sense - you switched to dancing. But season is over. In winter the lawn-mowers are sleeping.

Bernhard

My feet will now lie dormant. I have danced to a lawnmower, I've danced WITH a lawnmower whilst using it. I have a retarded left foot; it's really THAT simple.

I can dream... dream of one day appearing on stage as a tap dancer.

[RudimentalDrummer]

Originally Posted by Bernhard

b) To the lazy-ones: Oh speed is not important, great I don't have to practice regularly anymore, just keep the groove, yeah....

Bernhard

Don't misrepresent what I said ... I said Not that speed is not important ... BUT ... it's not the MOST important in drumming and that doesn't means that we don't need to practice speed ... but we don't need to be the fastest hand ... to be a very good drummer.

[Bernhard]

Originally Posted by RudimentalDrummer

Don't misrepresent what I said ... I said Not that speed is not important ... BUT ... it's not the MOST important in drumming and that doesn't means that we don't need to practice speed ... but we don't need to be the fastest hand ... to be a very good drummer.

Of course Rud, I've got it....was just a joke with serious background.

By the way: when you want back the fun of drumming: Look at the Billy Ward DVD - and also the new old rebrushed clips of Bernard Purdie i will put p these next days

[RudimentalDrummer]

Originally Posted by Bernhard

Of course Rud, I've got it....was just a joke with serious background.

By the way: when you want back the fun of drumming: Look at the Billy Ward DVD - and also the new old rebrushed clips of Bernard Purdie i will put p these next days

Yes ... sure will and thank you so much my dear Bernhard.

[NUTHA JASON]

A series of WFD arguement has been removed from this thread and posted in the WFD thread here. http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...2&page=3&pp=35
i have taken the billy bits out and put them back here:

dogbreath said...

So... back on subject! Thanks to Billy Ward I've really gotten into smaller sizes for hi hats. I haven't made the move to anything drastically small (although I was lucky enough to try out a set of 11-inch hats that Billy helped design), but I'm really loving my new 12-inch K Custom Dry hats. Any other fans of relatively small hats?

and i replied:

i played 13'' dark paiste hats at church and i must say they were far more controlled and, for want of a better description, had a silvery sound to them. very elegant. now for my rock playing they would probably not do so well, although i never got the chance to really bash them and see how they sing, but in church they fitted everything very well. i would say they were great for funk and jazz but not for punk. i would like a pair for studio work. and now i am intrigued about having a try on even small hats. Dogbreath, i suppose smaller hats would fit in your giant kit neater as well.

[billy ward]

Thanks Nutha - I realize it is very hard to maintain some logic within a free-for - all discussion forum!
The wfd doesn't disturb me at all though. Seem to be alot of good guys doing it.
I'd like to stress that rudiments should be learned and played Open to closed and then back to open. (Slow... then fast...then gradually and musically back out to slow)
This is the WAY to getting some hands! (along with the newspaper exercise that is in my DVD.

re: hats- I look forward to some of you hearing my 11" hats. It is possible that Zildjian will end up making these available to all! They are fast (obviously) but feel and play like normal sized hats - incredible.
thanks-

and Bernhard - you DO look alot like Steve Gadd!! :D

[Tim Waterson]

Originally Posted by billy ward

Hey Bernhard - I've finally joined up! :D Nice joint you've got here!
Kind of makes my little forum feel so small... (but we like it that way)

Just wanted to say hello - I'll be checking in (probably pretty regularly) to see what's going on. Until next time...
Billy W

Billy Ward page on DrummerWorld

Hey Billy Good to hear from you....Stick around there are a LOT of interesting drum topics going on.Hope to see you at NAMM take care and God Bless
Tim
www.timwaterson.com

[billy ward]

Originally Posted by Tim Waterson

Hey Billy Good to hear from you....Stick around there are a LOT of interesting drum topics going on.Hope to see you at NAMM take care and God Bless
Tim
www.timwaterson.com

Hey there, Tim! yeah - so far I can get to NAMM, so hopefully I'll see you there! and I try to mosey around here when I have some time - take care
Enjoy the upcoming Holidays!
Billy

[MECHT4NK]

Originally Posted by billy ward

This is the WAY to getting some hands! (along with the newspaper exercise that is in my DVD.

the moment I started with this exercise the newspaper we get was sized down to half it's original size so now I'm still wondering if I could have better result if that didn't happen :D

[NUTHA JASON]

haha. another good hand/finger/wrist exercise that i use is this...

the gyro ball. mine is a neon one. they are amazing. i wont type much here about them. it is best if you check their website out. but it is used by all sorts og sportspeople )tennis and golf particularly).
http://www.powerballs.com/

i wonder if you've tried one of these out billy? anyone else?

[billy ward]

yeah Nutha - that's kinda cool, but it doesn't specifically strengthen the fingers (enabling better fingers on those sticks!) - does it? It seemed to me to be more of a wrist thing when I tried it -
Bw

[NUTHA JASON]

yes. i think for a clasping action you would be hard pressed to beat the newspaper exercise.

but what about this little device? CHOPSTICKS....
i saw it advertised in modern drummer a few years ago. i want to try it out but it is only available in the US. have you seen it tried it liked it? billy? anyone else? seems like a brilliant invention especially to use while watching tv as it is silent and wont drive my girl insane like a practice pad might?


read more about it here:

http://www.ballisticdrums.com/specia..._for_hands.htm

"However, we warn drummers that because the Isotonik System For Your Hands is so effective you can gain too much speed too quickly. If that happens, you should stop doing the exercises and set the Chopstick aside for 2 or 3 days, so you can get used to your new speed."

Originally Posted by drumzalicious

wow this is pretty cool. a pro drummer on our site.


nice.

I'm sure there are quite a few!

[Will-Myster]

Welcome to DrummerWorld Forum ;]

Will

[billy ward]

Hi again. -and thanks for all the good welcomes!

Nutha - I think we all wish for something easy that will solve things. But in reality, my opinion is that watching TV with a stick in your hand WILL do better than buying a gizmo like what is shown in your pic.

the exercise: (I think this is in my DVD - don't remember)
raise your wrist up and over towards your back so that your hand is just over your shoulder (next to your neck and upside down). then flex the fingers - doing single strokes in the air. This'll work! Makes no sound and works even with old re-run tv shows! :D

Hope you all will continue to do well. Peace,
Billy

[NUTHA JASON]

i got a question for you billy.
i don'y know how often a guy who is in the creative side of drumming does this, but you must have done it a lot when you were younger, cover other drummers. do you still do that?
As a cover band drummer primarily myself, my question is what element in a drum beat do you listen out for first? what part do you copy first to form the foundation on which the other parts can be built on? hihat? snare? bass drum? or do you listen to the bass guitarist first? for example what would be you approach to covering roseanna?
j

[Bernhard]

Hi Billy

the forum was down for some days - we did a major server upgrade, so all things should run now a bit smoother.....

Want to talk to you soon about M.C.......

Bernhard

[billy ward]

Hey Bernhard - please write me anytime! I'm always happy to talk with you. I am pretty much recovering from some recent heartbreaks, but all is well and looking up!

Nutha - good question. First of all, since almost all of Joan Osborne's recordings are NOT with her live band, in that sense it IS a cover song gig! :D
Her Christmas record is jsut out and we are on that one - available through Barnes and Noble - titled, "Christmas Means Love". It's very r & b flavored - kinda cool.

Being the drummer in a cover band that is covering songs by other bands can be really hard to do. Maybe I should write an article about this!

The main thing is to listen to the groove in general - you might be playing the exact drum part, but that doesn't ensure that the song will feel the same. For example, sometimes an acoustic guitar is playing 1/8th notes and, even though it is placed way back in the mix of the record, it is a crucial part to the rhythmic feel of the song. Yet maybe theree aren't enough bodies on stage to compensate for that.
So you, as the drummer, need to figure something out there - maybe shakers in your cymbal hand instead of sticks?.. Maybe recommend to your guitarist to TRY to cover both the acuostic and electric gtr parts? It is hard sometimes. It can be VERY creative and challenging to cover songs well and accurately. Just remember, it takes more than just the notes - it is how the band interacts - and, yet again.... it is ALL ABOUT YOUR EARS!!!

[NUTHA JASON]

i guess then it really does come down to the individual song. some demand listening to the hihat first and others bass drum comes prime. we are a fourpiece band and often i hear that missing guitar you are talking about, plus with studio overdubs sometimes what i am listening to is essentially is one and a half drummers. one thing i sometimes do is NOT listen to the original song. Jason at a practice will say, 'hey guys i want to cover this song...(eg: the clash: i fought the law), do you guys know it?' and i will say yes even though i have only heard it on the radio a couple of times in the last decade. then i play my own drums to his guitar and, although they are perhaps not anything like the original drumtrack they fit the guitar jason is playing and so the end result is an original sound version that, more importantly than anything else, grooves right. sometimes i play a song differently every night...like 'play that funky music' - james brown can be played so many different ways.
j
ps: good luck with JO's release this season. i'll look out for it.

pps: congrats on your cool interview in RHYTHM magazine this month. comes off really well.

ppps: if you have a mo please have a listen to my playing on this thread below. its a recent live recording of 'play that funky music'. i just love my cymbal sound in it and the snare is sweet.
http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...9758#post49758 thanks.

[Lingenfelter Twin Turbo]

Hello Billy! Big fan.

[rock_drummer91]

Holy crap it's Billy Ward. I recently bought your DVD "Big Time". It's awesome. I'm a big fan. Keep postin'







Peace.Love.Drums

[billy ward]

thanks guys - Happy to be here!


hey Nutha!... I listened to your clip. you sound great. less mics is always cool and less risky (if you sound great on your own as you do)

That guitar player needs to get some time going though... whew!.. that's rough... I do understand that it is live though... and given the wrong tape at the wrong time... maybe it could be any of us! I hope he is aware of how lame his groove was there- if not.. you've got a rough road ahead of you!

Happy '06 everyone!

Originally Posted by RudimentalDrummer

In Gregg Bisonette Musical Drumming DVD ...Gregg said - Pss.sss Tell you all something ... a Secret..."Speed is not the most important aspect of Drumming .... Keeping Time and playing with the band is"

Luckily - Speed is not the most important. Gregg continue to say ... In ancient time, people dance to the Drums (very true) they don't dance to any other Musical Instruments right ? ... yes.... and so ... Making our Drums Groove is important ... make them bop their heads and wanna dance to your beat ... not speed.

PS: Not the speed is not important - just that it's not the most important aspect of drumming.

A good analogy is auto racing. Straight away speed isn't what makes a fast lap time, because it is the corner preceeding the long straight that determines how fast you will be going on the straight part. Sometimes you have to "slow down" to go fast.

Musically speaking, a little white space every now and then, mixed in with blasts of speed, make the speed seem faster than it really is! A constant barrage of blast beats stops sounding fast after about, oh, 4 bars.

With that said, you can see why Billy has a lucrative career telling people his opinion about music, and I don't ;-)

stu

[kzdruma]

I love inside out! It was one of the best books I have ever read. Do you have anymore? If so where can I buy them?

[billy ward]

thanks for the compliments!

kzdruma- Inside Out is the only book I've written (and may be the last!) :D

But I'm proud of it and grateful Modern Drummer wanted me to do it.

thanks


what's a Lingenfelter Twin Turbo? airplane engine???