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  #6561  
Old 01-25-2017, 03:15 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi Gavin,

crazy how this all came together! Thanks I will check out Tin Drum as soon as the record arrives!

I saw you performing with The Pineapple Thief in Aschaffenburg. To my ears and eyes you guys we´re great! Despite the technical issues you had on stage the sound for the audience was very good!

Speaking of technical issues, in the last song (Final Thing On My Mind) there was a problem occurring that forced you to (I guess) side-read the piece. As having experienced some major technical problems on stage myself, I understood the bad feeling you seem to have.
But - as you may imagine - I found it very interesting, how you dealt with it as well. So could you tell me, what was going wrong and what was sort of your rescue-plan?
(I suppose that you use an individual click that gives you the cues of the song and that thing went off. – So in terms of not getting lost (in that quite long piece) you had to side-read it.

And could you tell me about your monitor-situation in a fairly small club like this. Especially what drum-signals do you route through your in-ears?

Thanks Gavin! :)
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  #6562  
Old 01-27-2017, 08:51 PM
1morechance 1morechance is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi Gavin



Do you think enjoying yourself is enough to make progress ? I can say that i havent worked so hard so far but i dont think it is %100 practicing . i know it is the flow , the taste you got, there so many things effect your playing you have to make them better everyday i know i hope i get somewhere with my way. What did you do to make progress on your life Apart from practicing ?

Thank you from now



Sorry for bad English
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  #6563  
Old 02-01-2017, 05:11 PM
luke_baum luke_baum is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Gavin,

First, just have to say your playing on the new Pineapple Thief album was extremely pleasing to listen to.

Second, I just got ahold of a Speed Cobra double pedal, and realized you play them as well. How do you have the spring tension set up? Is it very drastic or quite loose relatively. I ask, because, in a similar vein of your playing, I only really use the double pedal for short bursts or during fills. Typically I'm not playing blast beats or thrash metal haha.

Thanks!
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  #6564  
Old 02-01-2017, 05:18 PM
luke_baum luke_baum is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Also, on another note:

How do you recommend one works on the chops to execute the 1 &uh 2 &uh hi-hat/ride pattern you use quite often? Typically I see it used, in your playing and others, as the bell of the ride on the downbeats and the edge filling in the other notes. What I'm asking is, how do you manage to play the three close together notes at a relatively quick speed while still getting the stick up for the accent on the downbeats? Is it a Moeller kind of technique or more of a kind of open/close technique?

Thanks again!
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  #6565  
Old 02-01-2017, 05:36 PM
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alparrott alparrott is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Looks like you're having tons of fun on tour, Gavin. It must feel worlds apart from the intricacies of King Crimson. I sure hope Bruce can make an American tour happen.
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  #6566  
Old 02-02-2017, 04:28 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Lightbulb_Sun

How much of Cheating the Polygraph and Mother & Child Divided is written by you? I know that you play guitar (in fact you play on Nil Recurring) as well as bass... so did you come up with some of those parts too, or just the drum grooves? If not, how much input did you have over the other guys' parts?

For those songs I had the rhythmic ideas worked out and some suggestion about the bass and guitar lines - but I don't like to impose on the other guys so I tell them to take my rhythmic suggestions - but choose your own notes.

Enjoyed your new Pineapple Thief Vic Firth video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6hR7ejT9RU :) Is that blue stuff on your snare just the paint/wax from your sticks? Sounds great as always. Also, what ride is that? And is that a 20"+ crash on your left? Sounds fantastic.

The blue stuff is just a bit of paint wearing off - that was a pretty old skin. The ride is a 21" Custom Dark Complex - and the crash is a prototype 20". The other cymbals (as requested by Pass.of.E.r.a.) are 16" prototype Crash of Doom, 14" K Light hi hats, 5 mini custom bells, 9" custom bell, 17" A crash, 19" Avedis crash, 12" Oriental China Trash, 22" Swish

Lastly, I've always meant to ask you this: do you play the percussion in the In Absentia outtake "Meantime", or was it programmed by SW? It was released with no credits on Burningshed as a digital download awhile ago, and I've always liked it. :)

I played percussion on that song - but I haven't heard it in a very long time. It was recorded at the In Absentia sessions.

Hi tom_ac

I just saw the video where you demonstrate your updated signature stick When I tried this stick some time ago they were a little too long for my taste but I liked the feeling, the rebound, the power they provide and especially the grip. What did you change in the stick's design? Did they become shorter by any chance? :)

Only the grip texture has changed. The stick is exactly the same as before.

Hi Robert Schmidt

Speaking of technical issues, in the last song (Final Thing On My Mind) there was a problem occurring that forced you to (I guess) side-read the piece. (I suppose that you use an individual click that gives you the cues of the song and that thing went off. – So in terms of not getting lost (in that quite long piece) you had to side-read it.

correct !

And could you tell me about your monitor-situation in a fairly small club like this. Especially what drum-signals do you route through your in-ears?
I hear all my drum mics in my ears + a bit of reverb. We are using the Presonus RM32Ai system - and it was really good.

Hi 1morechance

Do you think enjoying yourself is enough to make progress ? What did you do to make progress on your life Apart from practicing ?

I take note of things around me - design - architecture - nature - modern art - and it influences my way of thinking about composing from the drumset.

Hi luke_baum

Second, I just got ahold of a Speed Cobra double pedal, and realized you play them as well. How do you have the spring tension set up? Is it very drastic or quite loose relatively.

I have the spring tension pretty loose - but the beaters are angled back quite far so I can have maximum volume in the dynamic range when I need it.

How do you recommend one works on the chops to execute the 1 &uh 2 &uh hi-hat/ride pattern you use quite often? how do you manage to play the three close together notes at a relatively quick speed while still getting the stick up for the accent on the downbeats? Is it a Moeller kind of technique or more of a kind of open/close technique?

basically I play it in one motion rather than three separate ones - so it's more of a Moeller kind of thing.

cheers
Gavin
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  #6567  
Old 02-13-2017, 02:25 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Dear Gavin,

thanks again for your answer!

In your recent video of “tear you up” you don´t use a drop-clutch. Is there any particular reason for that?

And can you please tell me what mics do you use for your overheads and ride and hi-hat (stage and studio) at the moment?

And something a little different: As you may noticed the whole world talks about artificial intelligence (ai) and stuff like this at the moment. I heard that Sony will release the first record that´s made by an ai this year. I think this is one song of it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSHZ...ature=youtu.be

And a company will bring out an ai drummer app this year. This tool allegedly can design drumparts on its own that fit the music.

https://www.positivegrid.com/drumapp/

You already experienced a time when f.e. drum-machines were invented and changed the industry (at least a bit). So it would be very interesting to get to know:

What´s your take on this? Do you care about this? Can you imagine to you use this technology to help you come up with creative parts? What will stuff like this do with music and musicians in the future on your opinion?

Thanks so much!
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  #6568  
Old 02-22-2017, 02:44 PM
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi Gavin

More q's about the Tear you Up video and it concerns rim shots if you don't mind

In the intro, apart from the ghost notes, is every snare hit a rim shot? Even the fills? How about the toms, do you rim shot on those too?

I ask because you seem to get similar velocities regardless of whether it's a rim shot or a whole note. Is this down to compression?

My rim shots sound much larger than my whole notes so I was wondering whether this was down to compression or technique?

Rim shots obviously don't bounce and I'm interested to hear how you can play so many so fast as similar velocities to your non-rims shots.

Cheers fella
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  #6569  
Old 02-22-2017, 03:03 PM
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Swiss Matthias Swiss Matthias is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Dear Gavin

I see you use S-hoops on your toms. Maybe the question has been asked before and I missed, if so, I'm sorry! What would you say those hoops
give you compared to the usual ones? Thanks and all the best.
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  #6570  
Old 02-22-2017, 03:14 PM
crystalfunky crystalfunky is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hey Gavin, I would like to hear your opinion on bringing the hihat to the center like Bill Bruford.
What do you think about that? Did you try it?

What do you think about this construction where you put a slave pedal on a hihat stand? The feeling is quite good, just like a normal stand.

https://www.pearldrummersforum.com/s...han-the-H-2000

Last edited by crystalfunky; 02-23-2017 at 04:12 PM.
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  #6571  
Old 02-28-2017, 03:05 PM
Yzzito Yzzito is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi, Gavin!

First of all, thank you for all the incredible musical playing.You've been a huge source of insipration for me since I discovered Porcupine Tree, not to mention your solo works and the latest King Crimson.

1) Earlier in this thread you mentioned an article you wrote about programming click tracks. Unfortunately, SoundOnSound moved to a new website and the article is nowhere to be found. I will be glad for your help.

2) Have you ever in your career faced situations when the project you participated in was good in terms of relationships and success but you felt you wanted to do something of a completely different kind? I play in two bands, one is more of prog rock, another is free jazz, but I have long-term desire to switch to more academic style (chamber music, percussion ensemble etc). What would you recommend?
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  #6572  
Old 03-02-2017, 02:41 PM
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Stevesmithfan Stevesmithfan is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi Gavin,

Did you noise gates on your 5 Tom tracks to reduce cymbal bleed for your DVD's?
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  #6573  
Old 03-02-2017, 10:47 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Robert Schmidt

In your recent video of “tear you up” you don´t use a drop-clutch. Is there any particular reason for that?

I don't like the feel of a drop clutch (when it's operating as a normal clutch) - there's always a slight bit of play in them.

And can you please tell me what mics do you use for your overheads and ride and hi-hat (stage and studio) at the moment?

In my studio I'm using a matched pair of AKG C12VRs for overheads and a pair of AKG CK391s for the hi hat and ride. I like to use the CK391s in a stage situation but I don't take the C12VRs on tour. Live I use whatever the sound engineer wants to use.

And a company will bring out an ai drummer app this year. This tool allegedly can design drumparts on its own that fit the music.https://www.positivegrid.com/drumapp/. You already experienced a time when f.e. drum-machines were invented and changed the industry (at least a bit). So it would be very interesting to get to know: What´s your take on this? Do you care about this? Can you imagine to you use this technology to help you come up with creative parts? What will stuff like this do with music and musicians in the future on your opinion?

I can't imagine using such a thing myself. I don't really care about AI in the world of art. It takes away the most interesting thing - creative human expression.

Hi JohnoWorld

More q's about the Tear you Up video and it concerns rim shots if you don't mind. In the intro, apart from the ghost notes, is every snare hit a rim shot? Even the fills? How about the toms, do you rim shot on those too?

Yes basically they are all rim shots.

I ask because you seem to get similar velocities regardless of whether it's a rim shot or a whole note. Is this down to compression? My rim shots sound much larger than my whole notes so I was wondering whether this was down to compression or technique?

I don't really know what you mean by "whole notes". There is some compression on my snare drum but I try to play the way I want it to sound in the mix.

Rim shots obviously don't bounce and I'm interested to hear how you can play so many so fast as similar velocities to your non-rims shots.


I don't really rely on 'bounce' that much.

Hi Swiss Matthias

I see you use S-hoops on your toms. What would you say those hoops give you compared to the usual ones?

It's very hard to do a proper "A/B" test of things like this but I think they focus the sound slightly more.

Hi crystalfunky

I would like to hear your opinion on bringing the hihat to the center like Bill Bruford.
What do you think about that? Did you try it? What do you think about this construction where you put a slave pedal on a hihat stand? The feeling is quite good, just like a normal stand.


Looks interesting - but I feel I'm too far down the road to change to a centre hi hat setup. Back in the day - I tried a few different setups but that was in a time where remote hi hats didn't exist - and when the first cable driven remote hi hats came along - they felt pretty nasty.

Hi Yzzito

1) Earlier in this thread you mentioned an article you wrote about programming click tracks. Unfortunately, SoundOnSound moved to a new website and the article is nowhere to be found. I will be glad for your help.

Sorry but I can't access that article either. It was quite a long time ago.

2) Have you ever in your career faced situations when the project you participated in was good in terms of relationships and success but you felt you wanted to do something of a completely different kind? I play in two bands, one is more of prog rock, another is free jazz, but I have long-term desire to switch to more academic style (chamber music, percussion ensemble etc). What would you recommend?


If you have the desire to do it - and know a way to achieve it - go for it.

Hi Stevesmithfan

Did you noise gates on your 5 Tom tracks to reduce cymbal bleed for your DVD's?

No I did not. I never use gates on the toms in a mix.

cheers
Gavin
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Last edited by Gavin Harrison; 03-13-2017 at 11:01 PM.
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  #6574  
Old 03-03-2017, 05:23 AM
Clint Hopkins Clint Hopkins is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Yzzito,

The article you are looking for: http://www.bandrecording.net/SOS/200...licktracks.pdf

Take care
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  #6575  
Old 03-13-2017, 03:24 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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Hi Gavin.
Thanks again for your answer!

AKG D12VR as overheads? Aren´t these actually bassdrum-microphones?

You spend a certain time working in Italy. How did this come up? Where you invited (called) to go there or did you move there and start making it happen by yourself?

I assume that you get asked probably hundred times a week by folks that want you to play on their music. Do you have any criteria to filter out the projects that you can imagine to be a part of?
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  #6576  
Old 03-13-2017, 11:00 PM
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Hi Robert Schmidt

AKG D12VR as overheads? Aren´t these actually bassdrum-microphones?

my mistake - they are C12VRs. (I'll correct my original post).

You spend a certain time working in Italy. How did this come up? Where you invited (called) to go there or did you move there and start making it happen by yourself?

I had a very busy period in Italy (mostly in the 1990's). Originally I was invited to work with a singer called "Alice" (in 1989) because her producer heard an album that I played on from 1988 (Dizrhythmia). After working with her - a studio engineer recommended me for another project and things just started to go from one thing to another quite quickly.

I assume that you get asked probably hundred times a week by folks that want you to play on their music. Do you have any criteria to filter out the projects that you can imagine to be a part of?


I do get a lot of offers. My criteria is this: First I need to hear the song(s). I need to sense that can make a strong connection to the music and feel that I can make a meaningful contribution to the song(s) - otherwise there's no point talking about budget or deadlines.

Cheers
Gavin
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  #6577  
Old 03-14-2017, 09:37 PM
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hey Gavin, hope all is well!

Have you thought about making your DVDs "Rhythmic Visions" and "Rhythmic Horizons" also available to purchase digitally? Benny Greb had his last DVD available in physical and digital, and it's quite convenient. Rhythmic Horizons is sold out on Burningshed (Visions not listed) and the 2 Disc Bundle goes for very high prices on other websites. Even if not digital, are there plans to re-release these (perhaps on blu-ray?)

What ride did you use on the Cheating the Polygraph track "Sound of Muzak / So Called Friend"? Love the sound.

Next, is there a chance of Dizrhythmia playing some shows after the King Crimson tour? I understand that this is a much smaller project and it wouldn't get as much attention as your other projects but I think some intimate shows would be very nice! I understand that there were some recording/writing sessions from a couple years ago? Was all of this material released on "Too", or can we expect some more material to eventually be released?

Lastly, have you heard the new album "Planets + Persona" from Mr Barbieri? Still waiting for my copy but from I've heard so far it's very unique! Very cool mix of electronic and live instrumentation. I know you played on the previous album "Stranger Inside"... were you asked to play on this album? Just interesting to note, Richard has said the track "New Found Land" was written for PT. Here it is - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWoQf0EGDTo

Cheers,
Quinn
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Last edited by Lightbulb_Sun; 03-22-2017 at 12:53 AM.
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  #6578  
Old 03-24-2017, 08:22 PM
Chris Edwards Chris Edwards is offline
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzzito View Post
Unfortunately, SoundOnSound moved to a new website and the article is nowhere to be found.
Hi,

SoS are still working to bring old issues online on their new website. In the meantime, they suggest using the Internet Archive aka "TheWayBackMachine" to view articles that haven't yet made it to the new site.

So I made a page of links to Gav's SOS articles from back in the day.

Hope that's of some use (and that it's OK to post this).

Cheers

Chris
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  #6579  
Old 04-01-2017, 12:34 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Lightbulb_Sun

Have you thought about making your DVDs "Rhythmic Visions" and "Rhythmic Horizons" also available to purchase digitally? Rhythmic Horizons is sold out on Burningshed (Visions not listed) and the 2 Disc Bundle goes for very high prices on other websites. Even if not digital, are there plans to re-release these (perhaps on blu-ray?)

No I haven't thought about making them digitally available and I don't think they would be worth it on Blu-Ray.

What ride did you use on the Cheating the Polygraph track "Sound of Muzak / So Called Friend"? Love the sound.

That is a Zildjian 21" K Dark Complex Ride. It's a beautiful cymbal.

Next, is there a chance of Dizrhythmia playing some shows after the King Crimson tour? I understand that this is a much smaller project and it wouldn't get as much attention as your other projects but I think some intimate shows would be very nice! I understand that there were some recording/writing sessions from a couple years ago? Was all of this material released on "Too", or can we expect some more material to eventually be released?

I think there's is very little chance of Dizrhythmia touring to be honest. Myself and Jakko are quite busy with King Crimson...but you never know! There are no other songs for now. "Too" took 28 years to complete - I can't imagine us working on another 28 year project.

Lastly, have you heard the new album "Planets + Persona" from Mr Barbieri?


I haven't heard the record - only one promo clip that was released and I thought it was excellent. Richard is a master of sounds and textures !

Meanwhile I have been invited to partake in this new project:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChVtCgt4JLw
www.pledgemusic.com/drumfantasycamp

cheers
Gavin
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  #6580  
Old 04-14-2017, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luke_baum View Post
Also, on another note:

How do you recommend one works on the chops to execute the 1 &uh 2 &uh hi-hat/ride pattern you use quite often? Typically I see it used, in your playing and others, as the bell of the ride on the downbeats and the edge filling in the other notes. What I'm asking is, how do you manage to play the three close together notes at a relatively quick speed while still getting the stick up for the accent on the downbeats? Is it a Moeller kind of technique or more of a kind of open/close technique?

Thanks again!
Hi luke_baum,

could you please explain (and maybe provide a snippet/video of Gavin with a time reference) what you mean by the this pattern?

Thanks a lot!
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  #6581  
Old 04-17-2017, 12:48 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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Hi Gavin.

Happy Easter!

Just a few tiny questions again. 1) Do you have a manager? If yes, why? (The reason I ask is it sounded like you have one in the interview you did for "drummers resource".)

2) When will be the day we can watch a lesson with you on drumeo? Even Todd was there...I´m sure they already asked you. :)
(Or maybe consider to go to the German pendant "onlinelessons.tv".)

3) Do you know Dave King - Drummer for a band called "The Bad Plus"? He has a youtube-series for drummers (another distraction) called "Rational Funk". I bit of adult speaking but funny though. An example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GfegGYzD1E
What is your opinion about Whiplash? :)
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  #6582  
Old 04-18-2017, 08:41 PM
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Hi Gavin,

There is a video on YouTube where you demonstrate the tuning of snare drums. You use two drum keys facing opposite each other when tuning. Do you also use two drum keys when tuning toms?
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  #6583  
Old 04-18-2017, 11:49 PM
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Default Re: Gavin Harrison here!

Greetings, Gavin!

I hope the recent practice sessions for the upcoming King Crimson tour went well. It is really good to see Bill R. rejoining but it will take some getting used to seeing him on the back line! We’ll see you guys on a couple of the US tour dates.

I have a question about the KC song “Starless”. We are practicing it for a performance this summer and it is coming along surprisingly well. I confess that I am struggling a bit with the “blowing” section towards the end (after the central section and the call and response bridge) where the tempo picks up and Mel has his fun in the KC version. The bass player and I are having a little difficulty with the count and coming together occasionally on the “one”. Any advice you can offer based on the current arrangement you have worked out with Pat and Jeremy?

Regards,
Croc
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  #6584  
Old 04-19-2017, 01:05 AM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Robert Schmidt

Do you have a manager? If yes, why? (The reason I ask is it sounded like you have one in the interview you did for "drummers resource".)


I don't have a manager - maybe I was referring to the manager of the band?

When will be the day we can watch a lesson with you on drumeo? Even Todd was there...I´m sure they already asked you. :) (Or maybe consider to go to the German pendant "onlinelessons.tv".)


I did meet with one of the guys from Drumeo in 2015 whilst I was on tour - but the logistics of finding a good time to do it and to get out to Vancouver and arrange all my equipment to be there just hasn't happened.

Do you know Dave King - Drummer for a band called "The Bad Plus"? He has a youtube-series for drummers (another distraction) called "Rational Funk".


I'm not familiar with Dave King.

What is your opinion about Whiplash? :)

I didn't really like it.

Hi Souljacker

There is a video on YouTube where you demonstrate the tuning of snare drums. You use two drum keys facing opposite each other when tuning. Do you also use two drum keys when tuning toms?

Yes absolutely - now I always tune with two keys.

Hi Croc

I have a question about the KC song “Starless”. We are practicing it for a performance this summer and it is coming along surprisingly well. I confess that I am struggling a bit with the “blowing” section towards the end (after the central section and the call and response bridge) where the tempo picks up and Mel has his fun in the KC version. The bass player and I are having a little difficulty with the count and coming together occasionally on the “one”.

It's in 13/8 (as is the slower section earlier on - after the singing part). Best of luck !

cheers
Gavin
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  #6585  
Old 04-19-2017, 08:03 AM
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Hello Gavin!

I was curious, knowing your love of jazz, if you're a fan of Stan Kenton and his Orchestra? Any particular favorite era of the band? (The albums with Mel Lewis behind the kit are phenomenal!).

On another note, I've noticed in more recent videos you've included a 22" swish knocker into your setup. Any particular reason for the change? It definitely has a bit more gusto and roar to it.

Thanks!
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Old 05-03-2017, 08:17 PM
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Hi DunkirkDrums

I was curious, knowing your love of jazz, if you're a fan of Stan Kenton and his Orchestra? Any particular favorite era of the band? (The albums with Mel Lewis behind the kit are phenomenal!).

I remember listening to "Sketches On Standards" quite a bit when I was young - and I believe that was Stan Levey on drums.

I've noticed in more recent videos you've included a 22" swish knocker into your setup. Any particular reason for the change?

Now that I'm playing much less 'metal' styled music - I really enjoy playing the 22" Swish Knocker - I also have one of the early Mel Lewis ones.

cheers
Gavin
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:56 PM
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Hi Gavin.

You are a working musician - making a living out of drumming. Did you develop some general behaviors or a mindset for staying healthy so that you can do what you love for as long as possible, like f.e. drive slowly, eat well, (don´t) do sports etc. If yes, what are they?

Do you have certain insurances like occupational disability or anything?

Greetz Robert
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  #6588  
Old 05-27-2017, 12:16 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Robert Schmidt

You are a working musician - making a living out of drumming. Did you develop some general behaviors or a mindset for staying healthy so that you can do what you love for as long as possible, like f.e. drive slowly, eat well, (don´t) do sports etc. If yes, what are they?

Generally I try to get enough sleep and keep a healthy balance in my life between working, practising and relaxing. I try to eat well on tour (it doesn't always work out) and almost never drink alcohol. I try to walk around whatever town I find myself in and see some interesting things. It clears my mind and hopefully inspires some creative thoughts. I miss practising the drums whilst I'm on tour. I work a lot on a practise kit in the dressing room but of course it's not really the same thing. - but I get to work through a lot of ideas that I've notated recently. I don't do sports but occasionally ride a bicycle. In fact the last few Porcupine Tree tours I took a fold-up bike with me and it was great fun (and exercise).

cheers
Gavin
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Old 05-27-2017, 02:43 PM
iwearnohats iwearnohats is offline
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Hi Gavin, apologies if this question has been asked before:

So I as a drummer am constantly working on my sound, aiming to improving my timing and accuracy to make myself as tight as possible. I do some occasional studio work and for the sake of saving time, I've resorted to recording songs piecemeal rather than attempting single whole takes, simply because it is so much faster that way - especially if I don't know the material as well as I'd like.

So my question is, as a working drummer who whilst having an extremely high level of technical facility and many hours behind the kit, do you ever, or often, find yourself nailing the first take in the studio? Not just from a technical standpoint and "every note is correct!", but also having the right feel and emotion come through?

I would love to just sit behind the kit, do one take and know it's perfect, and then just walk away! It's one of the reasons I hate recording for my Youtube channel - people are so much less tolerant of mistakes!

On that same token, if you don't rely on an ability to nail it in one take or if you're limited on practice time prior to entering the studio, do you then recording songs in sections just to make it quicker and easier?
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Old 05-28-2017, 10:36 PM
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Hi Gavin,

Is there a time-frame for when we can expect the Pineapple Thief live Blu-Ray?

Also, happy birthday! :)

Cheers,
Quinn

PS: I like your shoes in the Steve Smith duet haha! Looking forward to hearing more - the kits sound great.
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  #6591  
Old 05-29-2017, 04:08 AM
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Hey Gavin!

First off, a very happy birthday to ya!

I noticed in the studio version of "The Final Thing On My Mind," it certainly sounds like you brought back the 8" EFX #1 just for the occasion. I still have and regularly play my own, it's one of my favorites. If memory serves the last time you were using that cymbal was back on the albums FOABP and Drop way back in 2007. Just wondering if you could verify my ears are correct, and any particular reason why you brought it out for that song?

Also a while back I found this interview with Colin Edwin. He gets asked about you, and to my delight explains the concept of a rhythmic illusion very well. Just thought I'd share it.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aeZv3Nr-CzQ

Finally what's your ride of choice at the moment in the live setting? The 20" K has been my go-to for the past few years and I adore its bell, but I'm always looking to expand my (rhythmic) horizons.

Hope your birthday was swell!
Cheers -- Peter

Last edited by K_HiHats; 05-29-2017 at 04:24 AM.
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  #6592  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:52 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi iwearnohats

So my question is, as a working drummer who whilst having an extremely high level of technical facility and many hours behind the kit, do you ever, or often, find yourself nailing the first take in the studio? Not just from a technical standpoint and "every note is correct!", but also having the right feel and emotion come through?

It has happened that I've got it in the first take - but usually I've rehearsed it for a while before that so I can work out what I might want to play. If it's going to be filmed then you pretty much have to have it down in one take anyway (so you need to rehearse it a lot) - or you'll be looking at edits which may or may not work. On a normal session (when I'm in my home studio) I will rehearse the tune a few times - I might even spend some time working on each individual section (and record them) so I can check if I like the direction it's going in and see if the drum and cymbal sound is working for the tune.

That process might take between 5 minutes and 3 days until I think I've found the best part I can dream up. (Weeks or years later I might think of better parts - especially after I've played it live a load of times - but that's life!)

On a session in a more traditional setting (in a hired studio with other musicians) there often isn't the budget to spend so much time on the songs.

A song like "In Exile" by Pineapple Thief took at least 2 days for me to find all the parts I wanted and to build the shape of the song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LTh10MHMOo

Then I'll try to hook up all the parts and start finding nice transitions from section to section. Next I'll rehearse it as a whole song. That might take a few minutes or hours before I'm ready to start recording whole takes. I'll probably do 4 whole takes that I like and then choose the one that 'feels' the best or had the best overall vibe. That one will be the master track - and I might edit in a section or fill from one of the other takes if there was something really interesting going on. Of course if there are breaks in the tune where the drums don't play - I'll stop - but generally I don't record in sections for the final thing.

HI Lightbulb_Sun

Is there a time-frame for when we can expect the Pineapple Thief live Blu-Ray?

I understand it should be ready for release in September. It's looking and sounding really good.

Hi K_HiHats

I noticed in the studio version of "The Final Thing On My Mind," it certainly sounds like you brought back the 8" EFX #1 just for the occasion. I still have and regularly play my own, it's one of my favorites. If memory serves the last time you were using that cymbal was back on the albums FOABP and Drop way back in 2007. Just wondering if you could verify my ears are correct, and any particular reason why you brought it out for that song?

Yes you're right - and I think I might have used it on more than one song.

Finally what's your ride of choice at the moment in the live setting? The 20" K has been my go-to for the past few years and I adore its bell, but I'm always looking to expand my (rhythmic) horizons.

For the past few years I've been really loving the 21" K Custom Dark Complex Ride. It's a real dark beauty !!

cheers
Gavin
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Old 05-30-2017, 02:13 PM
iwearnohats iwearnohats is offline
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Hi Gavin,

Thanks for sharing your process! It has helped me out in a few ways.

Much appreciated
David
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  #6594  
Old 06-02-2017, 02:01 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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Hi Gavin,
thanks a lot for your answer. Especially the one from iwearnohats was very interesting! If you say 2 days for the parts of "In Exile" (which came out obviously more than amazing!) how many hours (approx. per day) do you mean?

Then I have a little "hearing-experiment" for you if you have the time and mind for it. Shouldn´t take no more than 10 minutes. It covers an already discussed topic of timing and synchronism.

I want to find out the sensitivity of the ear concerning rhythm wherefore I did the following experiment: I programmed two SN-hits (same source); and a BD and a HH (different source) coming at a time. Then I put these two separately exactly above each other (offset of 0 ms) and gradually increased the offset. The question is at what space or offset can I hear two notes.

Here is my result: same source: =< 6ms / different source: =< 9 ms

The next is a simple drum rhythm. A "Polka-Beat" with BD and HH on 1 and SN and HH on 2. The tempo is 135 bpm. A few bars exactly on the beat and then the sort of "worst case scenario", where the 1 is X ms to early and the 2 comes X ms to late and again a few bars of 0 ms after that.

Results are: X = 15ms (I think I can hear it, but only because I know it) / X = 20 ms (I can hear it) / X = 30 ms (it sounds quite off).

It would be very interesting if you would come to similar or different results but of course I can´t force you to do it. :)

Greetz Robert
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Old 06-02-2017, 04:21 PM
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Sorry to butt in as I'm not asking Gavin a question but I'm looking forward to seeing his reply to the hearing experiment questions. Gavin's clearly a very intelligent person but I imagine even he might struggle to understand what on earth is being asked. Seems ridiculously complicated :D

Edit: just seen Gavin's reply. I obviously spoke too soon. My apologies Robert :)

Last edited by Merlin5; 06-19-2017 at 08:42 PM.
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  #6596  
Old 06-03-2017, 12:14 PM
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Robert Schmidt Robert Schmidt is offline
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You´re right, Merlin5. I did not expressed the first two experiments too well:
Play (or program) two snare notes at the same time. Then gradually increase the space between them. On what space (measured in milliseconds) can you hear two notes?
Then do the same with Hihat and Bassdrum played together (the result maybe differs).
It´s about checking the sampling rate of the human ear if you will.
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Old 06-19-2017, 08:37 PM
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Hi Robert Schmidt

If you say 2 days for the parts of "In Exile" (which came out obviously more than amazing!) how many hours (approx. per day) do you mean?

about 2 hours in the morning and 3-4 hours in the afternoon. Most of that time was equally split between playing/experimenting and listening/considering/imagining.

I want to find out the sensitivity of the ear concerning rhythm wherefore I did the following experiment: I programmed two SN-hits (same source); and a BD and a HH (different source) coming at a time. Then I put these two separately exactly above each other (offset of 0 ms) and gradually increased the offset. The question is at what space or offset can I hear two notes.


I can hear the sound change as soon as I apply even 0.5ms as the two identical sounds start to phase against each other. I would say around 4ms I can hear two attacks coming from the sound. A bit harder with two different sounds (bass drum/hi hat) more like 6ms when I start to sense some they have some distance between them but of course the attack on a bass drum and hi hat are completely different.

The next is a simple drum rhythm. A "Polka-Beat" with BD and HH on 1 and SN and HH on 2. The tempo is 135 bpm. A few bars exactly on the beat and then the sort of "worst case scenario", where the 1 is X ms to early and the 2 comes X ms to late and again a few bars of 0 ms after that. Results are: X = 15ms (I think I can hear it, but only because I know it) / X = 20 ms (I can hear it) / X = 30 ms (it sounds quite off).

I had similar results to you - but this is of course a 'programmed experiment' - real human results in playing would be much more varied and organic. Each hit would produce a slightly different sound and the relationship between the hi hat and bass drum would be changing all the time (by a few ms) and so the odd slightly early or late snare would have to be judged in a more general 'overview' sense about if the tempo 'feels' steady and if you can sense that the internal sync between the limbs 'feels' good to you personally. I think what we're talking about here is a 'window of acceptability' and that would vary depending on the listener and how good their ears are at spotting such things.

cheers
Gavin
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Old 06-22-2017, 12:51 AM
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Hi Gavin,

I hope all's well! I have just a couple of little questions...

How often do you rimshot the toms (if ever)? I have a hard time telling from watching vids of you playing. Either way, I'm always floored by the sound you get from them (and the rest of the kit!).

Also, I noticed that you always seem to wear the in-ear-monitors with the cable in front of you, while most people I've seen wear it running down their back. Is there any reason behind why you do this?

Thanks for your time,
Robin
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Old 06-23-2017, 11:50 PM
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Gavin Harrison Gavin Harrison is offline
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Hi Drummerrobin

How often do you rimshot the toms (if ever)? I have a hard time telling from watching vids of you playing. Either way, I'm always floored by the sound you get from them (and the rest of the kit!).

I almost never rim-shot the toms.

Also, I noticed that you always seem to wear the in-ear-monitors with the cable in front of you, while most people I've seen wear it running down their back. Is there any reason behind why you do this?

I just never liked the feeling of it on my back - it kind of irritated me so I just always run the cable down the front - sometimes inside my shirt.

cheers
Gavin
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Old 06-27-2017, 03:28 AM
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Hi Gavin,

I just saw you with King Crimson the other night in LA, and I have to say, what an incredible show overall – and an incredible performance by you (and Pat and Jeremy too, don't want to leave them out!). I really liked all of your grooves, fills and solos, especially your intricate double-bass interplay with the toms in a few spots. I also liked how your solo on 21st Century Schizoid Man has evolved since the Radical Action recording.

So I have a few questions, and I apologize if you’ve answered any of these before. First, how did you first get the KC gig? Did you have to audition, or did they seek you out based on your PT and other work? Once on board, since there’s so much percussion going on, did you and the other drummers have to decide who was playing what, or was that all pretty much figured out before you joined? I know Pat has been playing with them for a long time, so I’m guessing he’s playing what he always has – but who knows, he may have wanted to change things up.

It also looks like you were playing the main groove on a lot of the songs, with Pat and Jeremy adding fills and counter grooves on top. Did they initially have you in mind for playing the lead groove on these songs, or did it evolve that way? There were also a number of spots where it’s just Pat playing and you’re sitting out. During these times, are you just watching and enjoying the show (like the rest of us), or are you thinking about/mentally preparing for other things? I’m also curious as to what you have going on in your IEMs. I remember reading a while back that you had cues (i.e. count offs for section changes) and other tidbits in your IEMs for PT. Are you doing something similar with KC?

Finally, this is almost more of a question for Pat, but you may know the answer. During the slow middle section of Starless, he’s cranking on some handheld percussion thing that looks like a tiny teapot-sized drum with a string hanging out of it. Do you know what this is? I have no idea, but I like the eerie, creaky sound it produces.

Can’t wait to see you play again! Any chance Pineapple Thief will make it to LA at some point?

Last edited by Bernhard; 07-07-2017 at 11:59 AM.
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