Resonant head for more sustain?

gianop81

Junior Member
Hi everyone!Does anyone know, from experience, which type of resonant head gives the most sustain, in combination with 2ply batter head(i know that 1ply batter head resonates more but i like the deepnees of 2ply).The shells are birch and basswood.Thanks!
 
*k-ch!* (sound of a can of worms being opened)

Your best bet, in my opinion, is to get a clear 10-mil head (whether that be Remo Ambassador or Evans G1 or whatever...). In my experience, they have the most sustain, more so than the 7-mil heads, and more than the Gplus (12-mil). If you want your tone to be warmer at the cost of your sustain being shortened, get a coated 10-mil head. If you want a lower tone from your resonant head, again at the cost of a shorter sustain, get one of those Evans EC Resonant heads.
 
Once again, it's Bob Gatzen to the rescue! And he agrees with Caddywumpus.

Well, close. He believes that the EC Resonant heads ring longer than G1s (and pushes the fact to sell Evans drumheads). It doesn't make sense that having something on the head that inhibits its freedom to move would allow it to ring longer. I proved it incorrect in my home experimentation, but sometimes miracles happen, I guess...
 
Remo Ambassadors or Evans Clear G1 are the industry standard for nice, long sustain. If you want to reduce the sustain a bit and warm up the tone, you can go with Coated Ambassadors or Evans Coated G1.
 
Actually he would say the 12 mil heads would sustain longer since they have more mass

When the EC Resonant heads came out, the Gplus had just come out as well, if I remember right. If that were true, he would have mentioned the Gplus, I imagine, right?

Plus, where does it end? What if the resonant head is 3 cm thick? THAT wouldn't be very resonant, would it?!?!?
 
Im with caddy on this one.
You can't go wrong with a 10 mil reso when it comes to all around performance on toms. I've used thinner heads like diplomats when I wanted less sustain and double ply resos when I wanted deep thump. Coated for warmth. I've tried thick single ply also and I didn't notice more sustain. Just a lower sound was all that I could hear.
The best tuning range and sustain has always come from a clear 10 mil.
10 mil resos work wonders on low end kits also. I gig with entry level beater kits.
 
Mini hijack......apologies, but I'm still on topic and it seemed pointless to start a new thread..

I've read much on this topic since joining the forums, but the argument still seems to be very much unresolved. Is someone able to settle the resonance dispute for me once and for all?

I've always thought that the thinner the head, the more sustain. Due to the fact that it would be more flexible and therefore move more air etc. But the physics debate is that more mass = more sustain. If this is the case, wouldn't something like an emperor x or even hydraulic heads be optimal for more resonance? Whereas my limited experience with them seems to indicate that the opposite is the case.

It's a concept I just can't get my head around........any takers?
 
I've always used a 10 mil reso head, to the best of my recollection, lol. I bought a new kit last year and it came with 7 mil heads on it's toms and I just didn't like to coolness of their sound. They were changed immediately to Evans G1 clears, the equivalent to Remo clear Ambassadors. I have Evans G1 clear resonant heads on every tom I own.


Dennis
 
Mini hijack......apologies, but I'm still on topic and it seemed pointless to start a new thread..

I've read much on this topic since joining the forums, but the argument still seems to be very much unresolved. Is someone able to settle the resonance dispute for me once and for all?

I've always thought that the thinner the head, the more sustain. Due to the fact that it would be more flexible and therefore move more air etc. But the physics debate is that more mass = more sustain. If this is the case, wouldn't something like an emperor x or even hydraulic heads be optimal for more resonance? Whereas my limited experience with them seems to indicate that the opposite is the case.

It's a concept I just can't get my head around........any takers?

It is solved, there is no debate.

More mass = more sustain EXCEPT for 2 ply heads.

However, there does have to be a breaking point as to where this rule in physics would stop. Like previously posted, a 3cm thick 1 ply head won't be too resonant or have much sustain. There is a cut off point, and that is where the uncertainty lies.

The thinner the head like a Resonant Glass or a Diplomat means there is less mass to vibrate. Remember drums are membranophones. The thinner the head the quicker it gets excited, vibrates, makes a brighter and quicker tone, then quickly decays.
More mass is slightly excited less, takes more to move it, it starts to vibrate at a lower frequency or speed, makes a slightly darker and slower tone, then decays longer.

We also have to use correct terminology. Resonate or resonant is not the same thing as sustain. Thinner heads will have a bit more upfront resonance, but they don't have nearly as long sustain as a thicker resonant head. A drum with a thicker resonant head has a bit of time before you hear the resonance. Its attack time is slower if you will. It really isn't noticeable to the ear, but guarantee its there. It's like "Thwack...dooooooom" instead of "Thwackdoom"
 
Before I learnt how to properly tune a drum a head to my liking, or rather learnt to tolerent the moments when tuning. I put Ec2's over G1's on my Toms, I'm eagerly awaiting to get to the point where I feel the batters need replacing so I can put a G2 or a G1 coated on.

I would go for G1 coated over a G1
 
It is solved, there is no debate.

More mass = more sustain EXCEPT for 2 ply heads.

However, there does have to be a breaking point as to where this rule in physics would stop. Like previously posted, a 3cm thick 1 ply head won't be too resonant or have much sustain. There is a cut off point, and that is where the uncertainty lies.
It's a function of the diameter of the head, and the force with which one is moved and the tension of the head. Thicker heads will resonate longer if they are hit hard enough to start vibrating, and it would take a lot of force to get a 3 cm head going. A thinner head hit with the same force would resonate shorter. Also, a very thick head becomes loses flexibility, so it needs to increase in diameter. This is also where the tuning comes in - a thinner head tuned very loose will be dead; a thicker head tuned tight will be rigid. Think guitar strings, there is a note where each one sounds best. The same works for drum heads.

All other factors excluded, a well tuned thicker head hit with sufficient force should resonate longer than a well tuned thinner head hit with the same amount of force. If G Plus heads really have shorter sustain than G1 heads, I'd guess it's due to inherent properties of the material used.
 
In my home experiments I found that the GPlus (a 12 mil single ply head) did in fact resonate longer without losing the good tone of a 10 mil head. I use the G Pluses on all

my toms, I prefer them to a 10 mil head, which also sounds great. If I can get a 1/2 second more resonance from my drum, it's worth it to me, and to my ear the 12 mil head does just that.
 
In my home experiments I found that the GPlus (a 12 mil single ply head) did in fact resonate longer without losing the good tone of a 10 mil head. I use the G Pluses on all

my toms, I prefer them to a 10 mil head, which also sounds great. If I can get a 1/2 second more resonance from my drum, it's worth it to me, and to my ear the 12 mil head does just that.

This is correct both in theory and in my experience. Don't know where anyone learned that a G-plus sustains less than a G1. It doesn't--it sustains more, just as you would expect. On my kid's kit I use them as resos on the 8" and 10" toms, to better match the sustain of the 12" and the floors. Works great.
 
There has to be a point of diminishing returns. I actually think that the 12 mil head isn't yet approaching that point, but couldn't tell for sure unless they made a 14 mil single ply head to compare it to. Anyone from Evans R&D listening???
 
Once again, it's Bob Gatzen to the rescue! And he agrees with Caddywumpus.

*k-ch!* (sound of a can of worms being opened)

Your best bet, in my opinion, is to get a clear 10-mil head (whether that be Remo Ambassador or Evans G1 or whatever...). In my experience, they have the most sustain, more so than the 7-mil heads, and more than the Gplus (12-mil). If you want your tone to be warmer at the cost of your sustain being shortened, get a coated 10-mil head. If you want a lower tone from your resonant head, again at the cost of a shorter sustain, get one of those Evans EC Resonant heads.

Quite silly. On Gatzen's video the EC resonant sustains much longer than the rest.
 
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It does seem to sustain longer than the G1...

I had EC2s over EC Resos on my Rockstars before I got rid of them. I thought they sounded great...

I apologize, my HDD crashed a while back and all I have left is this terrible quality 64kbps bitrate MP3 of this, but I don't think they sounded bad at all. The low quality cuts out a lot of the low end unfortunately...

I have G Pluses on my reso sides right now, and I think they sustain longer and warmer than my previous reso heads...
 

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Quite silly. On Gatzen's video the EC resonant sustains much longer than the rest.

...and in David Blaine's video, he walks on water!

I'm not here to deface or discredit anyone, but in my own experience with my own kits (1970 Ludwig and 2004 DW), the EC Resonant head simply did not sustain longer than the 10-mil clear head. It had a lower pitch, and the initial "attack volume" lasted for a longer period of time, but the overall sustain time was reduced to about two-thirds of what was given by the 10-mil head. I tried it at low and medium tunings, and it simply wasn't so.
 
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