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  #161  
Old 10-31-2013, 11:50 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by B_HALF19 View Post
Metallica sucks.

Lars sucks.

Who cares???
Insightful post.

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  #162  
Old 10-31-2013, 12:46 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by B_HALF19 View Post
Metallica sucks.

Lars sucks.

Who cares???
If you didn't cared , then why bother posting in this thread which is about Lars' drumming?

I don't get it.

???
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  #163  
Old 10-31-2013, 03:12 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by Jeff Almeyda View Post

The double kick songs at that time were "Angel of Death" and "Among the Living", never anything by Metallica.
absolutely Jeff !

I heard Among the Living and knew I HAD to do that ....... so I practiced and practiced sacrificing time with friends and family until I could

no technique worries, not even a metronome ......just hard work and a cassette of Among as a reference


I remember when Among the Living came out I put the red Evans hydraulics on my two Tama Swingstar bass drums and put silver dollars behind those old felt bass drum pads and smacked them with my round wood beaters until the coins literally cracked in half

ah the good old days
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  #164  
Old 10-31-2013, 04:16 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

I think he made a robot to play the double bass drum for him but before the robot's first gig aliens came to abduct it and use it to play double bass drum in morse code to communicate with human brains and mind control us. that's why I always wear a tin foil hat unless I want to play Dyers Eve on the drum set contraption
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  #165  
Old 10-31-2013, 05:35 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by WhoIsTony? View Post
I was a huge Death Angel fan as a teen ...right around the time the Ultra Violence and Frolic came out

I remember hearing that Andy was like 15 or 16 when they recorded the Ultra Violence and I aspired to play just like him

he was a real inspiration to me in the late 80s
When I was working in drum shops in SF, Andy was a client. I used to need a hand truck to wheel out huge stacks of heads to his car when when they were getting ready to hit the road.

I actually still keep in contact with him to this day.
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  #166  
Old 11-01-2013, 02:28 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by BabyBob View Post
If you didn't cared , then why bother posting in this thread which is about Lars' drumming?

I don't get it.

???
Because even to voice your displeasure about something, you kinda, ya know, have to post in the thread. There's billions for the taking for the person who invents a way to post in a thread without actually posting in it.
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  #167  
Old 11-01-2013, 07:56 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by WhoIsTony? View Post
I was a huge Death Angel fan as a teen ...right around the time the Ultra Violence and Frolic came out

I remember hearing that Andy was like 15 or 16 when they recorded the Ultra Violence and I aspired to play just like him

he was a real inspiration to me in the late 80s
From the posts I've read of yours before, I always thought you were a Jazz guy
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  #168  
Old 11-06-2013, 06:31 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
Sounds just like the album version, it's no technical masterpiece by any means.

Regardless, this song was THE double kick song to be able to play for aspiring metal drummers back in the day. No one cared about the kicks being a bit off, or how it was recorded. This was the song you were measured by.

And seriously, of all the people complaining about it being fixed/pieced together, how many can actually PLAY it?
MANY people can play it. It is not that difficult.

But I do agree that many (of that time) measured drummers' ability to that song. It was One, first, and then Dyer's Eve. I got that question OFTEN - "Hey, can you play One?"

To disqualify my credibility, I was also asked if I could that beginning part to "Smells Like Teen Spirit".
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  #169  
Old 11-06-2013, 07:29 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by JasperGTR View Post

To disqualify my credibility, I was also asked if I could that beginning part to "Smells Like Teen Spirit".
To be fair though, that's quite a challenging beat...
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  #170  
Old 11-06-2013, 07:54 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

Really, watch this, it's hilarious! I cried out loud

http://youtu.be/4-PegaXlZFo
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  #171  
Old 11-06-2013, 09:30 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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From the posts I've read of yours before, I always thought you were a Jazz guy
I am ....but grew up on metal and NYHC
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  #172  
Old 11-07-2013, 09:17 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by Grolubao View Post
Really, watch this, it's hilarious! I cried out loud

http://youtu.be/4-PegaXlZFo
Not really. It is frustrating because we have absolutely NO idea what was being attempted there. It was a small 20 second clip of something that could be part a 10 minute song that went perfectly.

I've played overly simple beats before that sometimes fit, sometimes not. The only way to find out is to try it.

I hope someone doesn't sift through thousands of hours of my jam sessions, and then pinpoint 1 thing I did wrong for several seconds, and then glorify that with overdubbing from 20 years ago.

What a stupid video.
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  #173  
Old 11-10-2013, 06:49 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

I've always loved Lars and he gets bagged on HARD on youtube but I still admire him. I was far more upset when he went from 4 toms up top to two but I understand why he did it. Seeing him in the 80's just beat the piss out of his kit, hands destroyed, breaking many sticks per show, entire set a rusty mess at the end of a tour from his sweat, all things I personally like. I HATE hearing a cover band play Sandman and the drummer isn't wailing like Lars did back then.
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  #174  
Old 11-14-2013, 09:29 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by WhoIsTony? View Post
I am ....but grew up on metal and NYHC
Had to google "NYHC"......................good stuff................from that to jazz is definitely an eclectic mix.........................do you still play the heavier stuff or mainly jazz now?
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  #175  
Old 11-14-2013, 09:51 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Had to google "NYHC"......................good stuff................from that to jazz is definitely an eclectic mix.........................do you still play the heavier stuff or mainly jazz now?
I'll play anything they pay me to play

my heart is in jazz music ...but I still have love for the heavy stuff I grew up playing and can still do it ....and will if the money is right

I just recently turned down a couple tours because I just can't spend that kind of time away from my family playing something my heart is not in ....but I do some one or two nighters and a heavy record date hear and there .

many of the guys I grew up playing with are still in the NYHC scene
the guys from Leeway, Cro Mags , Sick Of It All, Madball, Agnostic Front, 25 Ta Life, V.O.D., Sworn Enemy, Skarhead, Crown Of Thorns, 141, etc ......lots of those guys are still doing it and I go to see them when I can ....and if they call me to fill in I will

but for the most part I'm in the jazz clubs
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  #176  
Old 11-15-2013, 01:45 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by WhoIsTony? View Post
I'll play anything they pay me to play

my heart is in jazz music ...but I still have love for the heavy stuff I grew up playing and can still do it ....and will if the money is right

I just recently turned down a couple tours because I just can't spend that kind of time away from my family playing something my heart is not in ....but I do some one or two nighters and a heavy record date hear and there .

many of the guys I grew up playing with are still in the NYHC scene
the guys from Leeway, Cro Mags , Sick Of It All, Madball, Agnostic Front, 25 Ta Life, V.O.D., Sworn Enemy, Skarhead, Crown Of Thorns, 141, etc ......lots of those guys are still doing it and I go to see them when I can ....and if they call me to fill in I will

but for the most part I'm in the jazz clubs
We must know many of the same people from the NYHC scene. Vinnie Stigma and his boys shared a rehearsal space with my old band for quite a while.
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  #177  
Old 11-18-2013, 08:30 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

i heard that lars had two midgets behind the drums jumping on the bass pedals ... that's total cheating .. he should have used triggers because they make you faster








******* sarchasm alert

my guess .. he punched in or looped some stuff .. typical studio magic and very common ... i bet he can play it .. but he's just getting lazy and when you are playing a 3 hour set ... especially getting up in age ... i don't doubt some of the lazy aspect .. just trying to get through the set without dropping dead of a heart attack :)
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Old 11-18-2013, 03:45 PM
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  #178  
Old 11-18-2013, 08:02 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

Now it's Dave Lombardo that wants to give some lessons to Lars:

http://www.metalinjection.net/latest...ns-accept-lars
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  #179  
Old 11-18-2013, 09:38 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

The thing is, lessons won't do much if you are too lazy to practice what your teacher gives you.
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  #180  
Old 04-03-2014, 01:50 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

I like Metallica a lot. They wrote some really great tunes in the 80s and 90s (I actually like Load and Reload a lot as well!) But listening to them live these days, combined with the very slow pace of songwriting and the rather subpar last couple albums (St. Anger was horrible, Death Magnetic I have mixed feelings about), reminds me why I am much less of a fan than I used to be. And Lars is a big part of that; it's ridiculous that after all these years of playing, he still can't keep time, has horrible technique, and messes up his own songs-which for the most part, are quite simple hard rock/metal songs!

IMO, he should stop trying to be "creative" with his drum fills because he lacks the technique, finesse, and even a basic sense of good phrasing to do it. Rather, he should concentrate on a solid back-beat and occasional double-bass fills, like he did on much of the 90s Metallica material.

I don't think Lars needs any defenders, FWIW. He's set for life, many times over. And he has plenty of fans, too; it's not like most of his critics deny his influence on many aspiring young musicians in the hard rock and heavy metal genres.
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  #181  
Old 04-03-2014, 03:15 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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I like Metallica a lot. They wrote some really great tunes in the 80s and 90s (I actually like Load and Reload a lot as well!) But listening to them live these days, combined with the very slow pace of songwriting and the rather subpar last couple albums (St. Anger was horrible, Death Magnetic I have mixed feelings about), reminds me why I am much less of a fan than I used to be. And Lars is a big part of that; it's ridiculous that after all these years of playing, he still can't keep time, has horrible technique, and messes up his own songs-which for the most part, are quite simple hard rock/metal songs!

IMO, he should stop trying to be "creative" with his drum fills because he lacks the technique, finesse, and even a basic sense of good phrasing to do it. Rather, he should concentrate on a solid back-beat and occasional double-bass fills, like he did on much of the 90s Metallica material.

I don't think Lars needs any defenders, FWIW. He's set for life, many times over. And he has plenty of fans, too; it's not like most of his critics deny his influence on many aspiring young musicians in the hard rock and heavy metal genres.
Agree with everything you've said (except for liking Load and Reload).
The trouble is Lars' priorities these days are 1) Family 2) The business of keeping the Metallica machine running. Drumming/ practising comes a distant third.
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  #182  
Old 04-03-2014, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Originally Posted by toddmc View Post
Agree with everything you've said (except for liking Load and Reload).
The trouble is Lars' priorities these days are 1) Family 2) The business of keeping the Metallica machine running. Drumming/ practising comes a distant third.
Then Lars has his priorities right, right?
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  #183  
Old 04-03-2014, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

Wow, really sad to see people, ever some of the so called "pros" on this board beating up on a famous drummer. I couldn't care less but I do know that I've seen the band dozens of times and back in the day, Lars would just pummel his set for hours and there was a huge pile of sawdust, sweat covered the kit, and Lars left the stage completely exhausted, hands a blistered mess. That is metal drumming to me, not this new blast beat marathon stuff!
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  #184  
Old 04-03-2014, 07:25 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Wow, really sad to see people, ever some of the so called "pros" on this board beating up on a famous drummer. !
I disagree - the problem is not the pros here criticizing Lars - that is part of the deal. Anything in the public domain is subject to critique.

I think the sad thing was the video of the rehearsal stuff being posted in the first place. That was dirty pool - what was the agenda of the poster or the person who filmed it for that matter?

MM
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  #185  
Old 04-06-2014, 04:30 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

I learnt to drum by playing along to ...And Justice For All and Arise by Sepultura amongst others. I had a fair idea of what drums made what noise, and used to air drum whole albums. By the time I actually got to play on an actual drum kit I knew what I was doing. Looking back I'm not sure what was the bigger thrill, playing a drum kit for the first time or losing my virginity. I know I mercilessly prepared for both during my teenage years.

I remember hearing about how he was such a lousy drummer there was drum tracks that weren't recorded in one take and felt a little let down. Then one day I entered a recording studio and fucked everything up under pressure and learnt it is common practice to cut copy n paste. When I think about it, my shock at learning Metallica/Lars did this was largely based on ignorance.

Although it did piss me off again when seeing them live for the 2nd time and Lars copped out on the double kick bits in 'One' again.
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  #186  
Old 04-06-2014, 04:58 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

I have no problems using studio "magic" to tighten up things on recordings. I have problems with creating tracks that you can't actually play. It seems like a mistake to me.

For years Type O used a drum machine. But the tracks created John Kelly could actually play. He proved that live and in the last album they recorded.
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  #187  
Old 04-07-2014, 12:46 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Although it did piss me off again when seeing them live for the 2nd time and Lars copped out on the double kick bits in 'One' again.
Wow, that's the first time I've heard of him cutting out the triplets in "One" (not to mention the tom fills towards the end which I don't think he's ever played live).
Don't get me wrong, I'll always go to see Metallica whenever they head down this way but these live drumming omissions (which seem to be increasing as the years pass) are getting ridiculous!
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  #188  
Old 06-12-2015, 04:42 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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Agree with everything you've said (except for liking Load and Reload).
The trouble is Lars' priorities these days are 1) Family 2) The business of keeping the Metallica machine running. Drumming/ practising comes a distant third.
...
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Then Lars has his priorities right, right?
Exactly! But for a person, not a drummer.
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  #189  
Old 06-12-2015, 05:16 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

Actually, it was Bernard Purdie.
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  #190  
Old 06-12-2015, 06:38 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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For years Type O used a drum machine. But the tracks created John Kelly could actually play. He proved that live and in the last album they recorded.
I had seen them live, saw them rip it up, and never questioned the albums until a guitar player came through and broke my illusion. I then went back and listened to the earlier albums and it stuck out like a sore thumb. I definitely don't listen to them much after that. I don't understand why you wouldn't use your drummer if you have one. It's so much better. The funny part is, when I was young and into type o, I would often comment on how much of a "machine" that drummer was. Turns out it was too perfect!
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  #191  
Old 06-12-2015, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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I had seen them live, saw them rip it up, and never questioned the albums until a guitar player came through and broke my illusion. I then went back and listened to the earlier albums and it stuck out like a sore thumb. I definitely don't listen to them much after that. I don't understand why you wouldn't use your drummer if you have one. It's so much better. The funny part is, when I was young and into type o, I would often comment on how much of a "machine" that drummer was. Turns out it was too perfect!
I felt the same way about Def Leppard. Rick Allen was one of my idols growing up from his 2 armed days up to even after his accident. Total bummer finding out Pyromania and Hysteria were programmed drums. However I'd still gone to see them live after his accident and the man just blew me away with his playing, "disability" or not.
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  #192  
Old 06-13-2015, 05:23 PM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

As for Lars he got burned out by the end of the Justice tour as far as his drumming went and felt he had to compete with the big 4 in thrash.

He turned 180 degrees around to groove playing and he also kept the simply changing the parts after a song was out on record.

As for the recording of drums yes they were pieced together with a lot of overdubs. This is public information.

One of the reasons they never liked the mixes was the fact that the drum parts where not to clear. One drum magazine asked if he played double bass on the Puppets album and the response where every song.

So when it came to Justice it took 1 more month of recording time according to Flemming Rasmussen.

Dyers Eve where put of to last and a lot of coffee got Lars into it.

As for One Lars nailed that in one take!!
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  #193  
Old 11-10-2015, 06:22 PM
JasperGTR JasperGTR is offline
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

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I felt the same way about Def Leppard. Rick Allen was one of my idols growing up from his 2 armed days up to even after his accident. Total bummer finding out Pyromania and Hysteria were programmed drums. However I'd still gone to see them live after his accident and the man just blew me away with his playing, "disability" or not.
I never would have thought that about Pyromania... It seems quite easy to play.

Interesting. I'm not sure this affects my opinion of Allen as a drummer, though, because I've seen him play everything that was recorded.

It has brought into question, though - exactly how many drummers are still playing in the studio?

Do guitarists have the same method?
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  #194  
Old 11-10-2015, 10:41 PM
Friedmett Friedmett is offline
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

A point to ad with Lars is that he is not a musician by heart and never was.

The disipline on tennis got him into music but practise makes music to a point and so he went along with the disipline of Metallica in the '80s. Finally coming to a stop by the end of the Justice tour. Where to go Metallica has proven the point! Or Cliff was not there to guide them anymore.

Since getting another bass drum for Camco kit now painted black in 1983 he had the practise to play double bass for Dyers Eve in 1988. It was starts and stops the was the trouble besides the Justice material was a bit more technical and progressive than was dialed in the playing departments since Puppets was recorded.
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  #195  
Old 11-12-2015, 05:56 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

Dyers Eve only sounds to me like about 190-200 BPM, just a guess. I've seen average drummers on youtube nailing the double bass. So I don't see why the speed should be a problem for Lars unless he simply quit working on double bass.

Nevertheless his drumming was unique and inspirational to me even when I was playing guitar.

Last edited by bud7h4; 11-13-2015 at 09:37 AM.
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  #196  
Old 11-13-2015, 02:01 AM
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

If pretending that something is real when it's fake is so bad then why is there so much of it in this thread. A couple of articles about some songs being punch edited and suddenly the guy didn't play any of the songs. It's bizarre to me. He can play the songs but, let's have him play one note per punch edit, and then we'll spend weeks and x amount of dollars to digitally turn them into usable tracks. It's petty and it's false. Today's recordings are really edited. No comparable technology even existed then. "Do it again,do it again,do it again!" gave way to "stop, we need to do it again from the second verse. I'll rewind to 1:38 and start the tape, you just play along and I'll punch you in at the second verse. It'll be seamless, and you'll just play the song out from there". Now its "don't stop playing, I'll cut, copy and paste the good parts over the mistakes and then run the whole program through quantizing software to fix all the speeding up and slowing down". A lot of you guys are pretty weird, which is mostly okay, but the outright dishonesty about some topics such as brands, musicians, etc. is just too much. How can I trust your opinions on other topics?
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Old 11-13-2015, 11:15 PM
Friedmett Friedmett is offline
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Default Re: Was Lars' double-bass on the track Dyers Eve a fraud?

You know what is very interesting with this whole thread on Lars and Dyers Eve?

It was to much of a technical progressive record with And Justice For All rather than music! Metallica eventually realized that. Never looked back.

And here we have the technical analyse of it but the drum recording detail was public since the mid '80s in magazines! By Puppets they had drum overdubs skills pretty well established.

But I guess it is the cultural vibe of anything being fake in US that paints fear in every one who can't tell the difference.

Also that Slayer tune angel of death must have been some sort of competitive thing for Lars who at the time was into keeping up with the big 4 in the thrash department.

Justice is also a musical statement that Metallica soon got out of their system.

Last edited by Friedmett; 11-14-2015 at 01:35 AM.
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