Single ply batters
- Thread starter MikeM
- Start date
Larry...I know that lol, You have me confused now?
Larry - I'm surprised you use a double ply for your snare. Maybe its because I have an acrolite, which is pretty dry, but I can't imagine putting a 2 ply on my snare. A single ply on a snare allows more tones to come out of the drum. It gives the drum energy. Idk it just seems wierd that you'd advocate single plys on everything but your snare. Is it a durability issue, or do you like the 2 ply sound better for your snare.
Larry
"Uncle Larry"
For your Acro, (5" deep, aluminum shell) you probably have the best head on there, agree for the Acro. The rules I apply to my toms are different than my snare, and kick for that matter. IDK, everytime I put on a single ply batter on my snare, it just sounds too thin to me. I think if I played a 5" deep snare, a single ply might work better. But I play 6.5's exclusively, and to my ear, a single ply doesn't have the nuts that a 2 ply head has....on a 6.5" snare drum. I don't think I'd put a 2 ply on an Acro either. Those drums need to be lively as possible. I have enough ring and body to spare with a deeper shell that the 2 ply head gives me the oomph I crave. Yes it's all about the sound first. Durability...I don't select for that.
Jeremy Bender
Platinum Member
I'm using a Remo "Vintage A" coated on a heavy brass snare. Sounds great to me. It seems to be the best of both worlds seeing as how it's 2ply-but only .5 mil thicker than a regular Ambassador.
Larry
"Uncle Larry"
If I have my facts straight, most 2 plys are only .5 mil thicker than single plys already. 2 ply heads like Emps and G2's are made with 2 - 7.5 mil layers, so the Vintage A's are no different than Emps in thickness. If I have my facts straight.
wildbill
Platinum Member
There's two aspects to consider with 'attack' - as shown in the graph.
First - there's the 'time' aspect, which is shown horizontally on the X axis. The shorter the time taken to reach a given amplitude, the quicker the attack. Drums normally have an extremely short attack time compared to most other instruments. With other instruments, a slow attack time can produce a 'swell' - similar to a cymbal swell using soft mallets.
Second - there's the 'amplitude' aspect, which is shown vertically on the Y axis. A harder hit produces a greater amplitude.
Actually - a 3rd aspect could be that different frequencies have different attack and decay characteristics (initial fundamental, frequencies that sustain or ring for different amounts of time, and so on). But I don't think that's part of the discussion here.
Both could be easily measured by running a mic'd drum's audio into a computer with a suitable program. But I haven't done it - so have little else to add, ha ha.
LOL...thanks Larry! To clarify what I babbled about in my post is that I was scared to go with a single ply's as batters in the past all out of pure ignorance ;-) Now I look at single ply's with a whole new outlook and most of this is probably due to me spending so many hours practicing tuning.
I'd like to hear if anyone has tried single ply's on saturns yet and what they think of them
kettles
Gold Member
I've done it. Just clear ambassadors and G1s. They sound good, very fresh and clear. They feel louder behind a band. I suggest you just give it a go.
Spectron
Silver Member
I've been lovin the coated ambassadors over clear ambassadors for some time now.
I bit of a warmer tone but same glorious attack and resonant full sound as clear/clear
I may never go back to 2 ply heads - however I had the attack single ply clears on and they got severly dented after just 2 hours of play! clear amb's seem much more durable and have a more "pingy" sound than the attacks.
I'm not a heavy hitter, I use 5b's.
My coated amb has had 20+ hours of abuse and not a single dent.
Attack heads are cheap, dent easy, but their collars are extremely rigid.
I may try evans g1's but for now I'm a remo ambassador guy all the way
Emad and fiberskyn for kick,
that's how I roll...
I bit of a warmer tone but same glorious attack and resonant full sound as clear/clear
I may never go back to 2 ply heads - however I had the attack single ply clears on and they got severly dented after just 2 hours of play! clear amb's seem much more durable and have a more "pingy" sound than the attacks.
I'm not a heavy hitter, I use 5b's.
My coated amb has had 20+ hours of abuse and not a single dent.
Attack heads are cheap, dent easy, but their collars are extremely rigid.
I may try evans g1's but for now I'm a remo ambassador guy all the way
Emad and fiberskyn for kick,
that's how I roll...
kettles
Gold Member
I never heard my kit out front when I had them on, but from the drivers seat they felt louder and as if the tone was stronger. My 16x16 floor tom especially.
Don't have them on at the moment, the last ones were just my stock reso heads that I replaced. After they wore out I put on the new G2's that I originally bought to replace the stock batters.
I'm not often impressed by the out-front tom sound that other drummers round here have, I guess most of them are using a 2 ply clear batter of some sort, so I'll give singles another go next time I renew my heads and let someone use a tom or two. This is at gigs with usually nothing more than a kick mic, by the way.
Don't have them on at the moment, the last ones were just my stock reso heads that I replaced. After they wore out I put on the new G2's that I originally bought to replace the stock batters.
I'm not often impressed by the out-front tom sound that other drummers round here have, I guess most of them are using a 2 ply clear batter of some sort, so I'll give singles another go next time I renew my heads and let someone use a tom or two. This is at gigs with usually nothing more than a kick mic, by the way.
Larry
"Uncle Larry"
2 ply batters sound better to the drummer, but they lose liveliness out in the room to my ear. I like a noticeable slap attack and a crisp, pure, unmuffled note loaded with overtones. A lively "out of control" tom tone. Single plys are the only heads that give me that satisfying tone, from out in the audience.
tard
Gold Member
+1 on that. Properly tuned single ply heads sound incredible and much fuller with a good balance of everything. Even from behind the kit I now find 2 ply heads way too muffled and dead sounding especially after they are "played in". I find it much easier to tune a single ply to remove the overtones or even add a moon jell if needed but totally impossible to get resonance out of a head designed to sound like "cardboard" to my ears. BTW when you said overtones I believe you were actually referring to resonance, properly tuned singly ply herds will have lots of resonance with little or no overtones, full warm resonance = good, odd harmonic overtones = bad...lol
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You know I've been thinking about having my saturn kit be at my band practice location and fitting it with single ply heads just to see if I can hear better from the drivers seat when striking the toms during fills. My band is tastefully loud if that makes any sense, lol
N
nhzoso
Guest
I don't know why more people do not try 2-ply over 2-ply, especially with all the pics I see of drums with rings, moongel, tape or some other muffling device. I bet if they put a 2 over 2 combo they would not have the need for any of that.
tard
Gold Member
A single ply with a moon jell on the edge or a piece of tape only removes a bit of the high frequency overtones as opposed to a second layer of mylar on a 2 ply head which removes a full rage of frequencies as well as most of the resonance. A single ply with some dampening still has a lot more resonance and is much more lively and full sounding than a 2 ply, plus you can remove the dampening if need be as they play in. I play studio x over classic clear on all toms with a moon jell on my 16" and I find all 2 plys too dead when just used on the batter, I couldnt imagine how dead a tom would sound with 2 ply over 2 ply. We spend thousands of dollars to get rich, warm and resonant sounding toms and then kill it with 2 ply heads, why?