Legal question

I used to be in this band, they treated me absolutely terribly, we recorded a few songs in April, which were never released to buy. I wrote and recorded all the drums in the songs. I left the band in June, asking for all the drums to be removed since I was embarrassed to have any relation to that band, because I don't feel they deserve the drum parts, an because I wrote them, and want to keep them. After saying they will remove them. They are now refusing and are keeping them on the record. What should I do?!
 
If you had a contract giving you rights to the potential earnings of the tunes or ownership of the drum parts then you have more of a case.
If there is nothing in writing then I don't think that you can do much. If you vested money into the recording expenses and you can prove it, then you may have some legal say if they can you use your contributions to the tracks.
 
If you had a contract giving you rights to the potential earnings of the tunes or ownership of the drum parts then you have more of a case.
If there is nothing in writing then I don't think that you can do much. If you vested money into the recording expenses and you can prove it, then you may have some legal say if they can you use your contributions to the tracks.

+1 it's not about what say,it's about what you can prove.

Hard evidence will win in court,not conjecture.Be more carefull in the future and don't take anything for granted.

The music biz is a hard mistress...the sooner you learn that lesson..the better.

Trust no one,till the've earned it.

Steve B
 
I hate to tell you man, but you are pretty much screwed here. As a drummer you are not entitled to any songwriting credits and your drum parts are not protected by any music copyright laws. That being said your drum parts can be used without your permission, they are not considered intellectual property by law. Even if you had a written agreement prior to recording they could still use the parts without your permisson. What is funny is to think is that they could also use the drums from Hot For Teacher or YYZ or When The Levee Breaks if they wanted to. Life sucks sometimes.
 
From a purely legal standpoint, coming up with drum parts to a song is not considered "writing."

So as others had said, there is nothing you can really do.

Here is an article on drum parts generally not being subject to copyright:

http://www.dicciani.com/materials/Copyright_q_and_a.pdf

Harmony, rhythm, and accompaniment
can sometimes be given copyright protection, but in most cases those elements don’t
meet the minimum criteria of being sufficiently original. This, unfortunately, often
includes what the drummer plays. The
drum part may be creative, have a great
feel, and contribute to the song in a meaningful way. But it’s probably not sufficiently original to meet legal copyright requirements.

Another legal case on the matter:
http://www.law.stanford.edu/news/pr...t-action-against-electronic-music-artist-“bt”


New York federal judge has dismissed a copyright infringement lawsuit accusing prominent electronic music artist Brian Transeau (known professionally as “BT”) of illegally copying a nine-second drumbeat from another artist.

“Basic drumbeats and rhythm patterns should not be subject to copyright protection at all and there is substantial case law that says they are not,”
 
Eclipse is right on the money. Ownership of music is defined by 2 things: music and lyrics. Unless you wrote either of those, you're not a songwriter. Unfortunately, as far as the biz is concerned, drums are just a production tool.
 
Without a contract, you have no legal claim.

More importantly, it's presumptuous - and somewhat arrogant - to suggest that they should delete/replace your tracks. Were you going to pay for that? Do you really think they should pay for that? Anyway, it's up to them, not you, if they want to replace the tracks.

Do you believe that Mike Portnoy's tracks should have been replaced after his acrimonious split with Dream Theater? (etc etc for the countless number of groups whose drummers left. Heh, Zappa, McCartney and Steely Dan would have a field day with that!!)

Bermuda
 
OK so if I take Gadd's "50 ways" drum part, and I am able to isolate it and put HIS playing on my new record, I am allowed to do that and legally speaking, Steve has not a leg to stand on? That's insane!
 
I'd say that yours is a different story, larryace. You would be sampling from/dealing with those who 'own' the rights to the 50 Ways recording.

But if you copy that drum groove by playing and recording it yourself, note for note, I don't think that Gadd or those who hold the rights would have a case against you.
 
(Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer)

In some states, a verbal contract is binding. Proving that there is one can be expensive.

Did you get paid in any way for your services? If not, there may be applicable performance rights issues that could help you, but once again you'd need to be able to prove that it is your performance on their recordings if they should eventually release them to the public for a profit.

As has been mentioned, you don't own the drum parts. But until they buy your recording of them from you in some way (or you sign them away to someone) you own the performance rights.

If the recordings are never released, then no one profits from it and you have no damages to prove.

Life is a learning experience.
 
OK so if I take Gadd's "50 ways" drum part, and I am able to isolate it and put HIS playing on my new record, I am allowed to do that and legally speaking, Steve has not a leg to stand on? That's insane!

His actual performance is owned by whomever owns the masters to that recording. (Paul Simon's record company at the time, most likely). So, legally, no you can not sample his actual performance and put it on a new record. Sampling a small section is still a bit of a legal grey area.

If you copy the drum part note for note, play it (or program it) yourself, free reign.

Either way, Gadd himself has no ownership, since he was paid as a studio musician for services rendered.
 
This is really frustrating, if I contribute to a record I sure as hell wouldn't want it released without my consent.

If the band decides to release the songs and start profiting from them, isn't OP entitled to some of the earnings unless there was a written contract beforehand?

Makes me think, I should write a contract with my current band, but proposing that will certainly feel weird since they're all really nice people.
 
Maybe this is a stupidly simple solution but what about just making sure that you are not credited as the drummer on the recordings? If the drumming can't be removed then at least no one has to know that you were the one doing the drumming, right? Just a thought.

Of course, if there is profit and/or royalties to be earned than I can see where that wouldn't be a viable option.
 
I have the opposite problem right now. Just joined an indie band, and for their demo/first EP, they had the bass player on drums. As expected, the drum tracks are not up to my standard and it bothers me that people might think that it's my playing.

Oh well.
 
I have the opposite problem right now. Just joined an indie band, and for their demo/first EP, they had the bass player on drums. As expected, the drum tracks are not up to my standard and it bothers me that people might think that it's my playing.

Oh well.

Well Doc, you ARE the world's greatest drummer (and human being). I don't think anyone could live up to your standards. It's probably an unfair comparison.
 
Well Doc, you ARE the world's greatest drummer (and human being). I don't think anyone could live up to your standards. It's probably an unfair comparison.

Right, but I'm only the best by like, a huge margin. I don't understand why others can't be closer to my greatness.
 
If you copy the drum part note for note, play it (or program it) yourself, free reign.

Either way, Gadd himself has no ownership, since he was paid as a studio musician for services rendered.

Correct, the majority of studio players are a "work for hire" situation, which means they are paid-off with no recourse with regard to the product, not even to expect a credit (although that's fairly unheard-of since the ghost-drumming days of the sixties.)

The bigger question is, would anyone actually play such a signature part on another artist's recording of a different song?

Anyone remember The Youngbloods' "Get Together"? That poor drummer will forever be known as the guy who nabbed Ringo's part from "In My Life", "All I've Got To Do" and "Anna".

Bermuda
 
OK so if I take Gadd's "50 ways" drum part, and I am able to isolate it and put HIS playing on my new record, I am allowed to do that and legally speaking, Steve has not a leg to stand on? That's insane!

No,he dosen't.He was a hired gun.Once he fulfills his contractual obligation to whomever hired him for the session,and he acceptes payment for his services...then they can do whatever they want with it.

As far as isolating his drum part,as long as you have permission to use the original material,and pay the performance rights to say , ASCAP,then have at it.

Just take a look at the original "money beat" that's been copied thousands of times.

Steve B
 
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