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  #1  
Old 08-17-2018, 02:51 PM
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Default A suggestion for reviewing others

There's no way of enforcing this, even if anyone wanted to make it a forum rule, but I think it would be a great thing if........

When reviewing someone else's performance here, always point out the one thing they did best and the one thing that needs work. Nothing else.

That way no-one needs to be intimidated, but everyone will hear the criticism that they most need to hear (which hopefully is what we're here for!)

I guess in order to have a say I should submit something, although I have no recent recordings. Here's my college band. First few seconds sound bad, then it levels out a bit.

https://video.fymy1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/...fe&oe=5B76F84B

PS I should mention that I rarely get to review others because I normally check out this forum at work, where I can't listen :(. At home there's only an old blackberry with sketchy reception.
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Last edited by PlayTheSong; 08-17-2018 at 02:58 PM. Reason: Added info
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Old 08-18-2018, 12:43 AM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

Well generally people just watch but they if they respond generally it’s supportive and then a critique. It’s all good- I keep posting crappy videos to encourage others to post. The super stellar ones can be intimidating and all the produced YouTube wannabes gets old fast. I wish more pros and beginners would post- a conducive environment to learn
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Old 08-18-2018, 01:46 AM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlayTheSong View Post
There's no way of enforcing this, even if anyone wanted to make it a forum rule, but I think it would be a great thing if........

When reviewing someone else's performance here, always point out the one thing they did best and the one thing that needs work. Nothing else.

That way no-one needs to be intimidated, but everyone will hear the criticism that they most need to hear (which hopefully is what we're here for!)

I guess in order to have a say I should submit something, although I have no recent recordings. Here's my college band. First few seconds sound bad, then it levels out a bit.

https://video.fymy1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/...fe&oe=5B76F84B

PS I should mention that I rarely get to review others because I normally check out this forum at work, where I can't listen :(. At home there's only an old blackberry with sketchy reception.
Link does not work...
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Old 08-18-2018, 02:52 AM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

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Originally Posted by GruntersDad View Post
Link does not work...
You forgot to point out the one thing he did best.
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:11 AM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

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Originally Posted by PlayTheSong View Post
..and the one thing that needs work..

The problem with that, in my opinion, is that the person who recieves the criticism should have trust in the expertise of the person who gives the criticism..

For example, i am not a jazz-expert and when i would post a video here of me playing some jazz, then there are maybe 1 or 2 people untill now who i would trust on their opinion/criticism..For the rest i really couldnt care less about what someone here would tell me about what i need to work on..

I think, when someone wants some constructive criticism, the best thing is to send the person that you trust a link via pm and ask friendly what he/she thinks about your playing and what could be improved or not..
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:27 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

I can’t open the link either, so can’t comment on that. I fully agree with your points PTS. I posted a couple of videos a while back, knowing they needed work. One was a Dave Mathews song I was having a tough time getting the right feel. I mentioned I was on the threshold of failure the whole time and asked for recommendations.

The whole video took me hours to sync up and get to a point where it at least sounded like something someone could listen to. I don’t have sophisticated equipment, so producing videos are more painful than they should be.

Anyway, after three days I got zero responses and 47 thumbs down to the video that was only available to forum members with a link. I knew it wasn’t my best, but that still really hurt. I would have been far less annoyed, if I had pushed record, and uploaded to YouTube, with little effort. To try and get something that was quality enough for someone to hear neuances and offer recommendations, and get nothing but thumbs down? Definitely not worth the effort.

I can post easy songs and ask for pats on the back like anyone, but most of what I practice a is pushing my abilities. I’ve had some really killer takes I’ve been super proud of, but then can’t get things to sync up. I posted a question a while back asking if anyone knew why GarageBand locks files at random and got no answers. It seems it only likes to lock files when I’ve successfully played something. Very frustrating.

Anyway, as has been mentioned, there are maybe 5 or 6 I would even trust to give me any input here anyway. Most of the time, they don’t hear from me, because of the above file lock/sync issues. To many don’t have the common curtesy to not click thumbs down if they aren’t going to offer any feedback. The way I see it, privately shared YouTube links among a community like this should be A-hole exempt and serve to help he/she who took the time to post improve, but far too many rather pump themselves up.

There’s one thing in particular that bothers me about clicking thumbs down. If you click thumbs up, the video goes into your favorites bucket. If you click thumbs down, it will never show up on your searches. If you do nothing, it may pop up on a search, but not likely, so making the effort to click thumbs down seems extra A-holish.

Okey, rant over, but I Bet there are more on here who feel it’s just not a safe enough environment to share anything less than spectacular.
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Old 08-18-2018, 09:27 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

Yes, link broken.

I just wish more people commented in general. I dont always comment either, but I have a lot. If people have already said something I was going to say I just keep quiet(unless Im inspired and/or truly impressed). If its something I think is great but has no comments Ill add something to let the person know what I thought. I dont think Ive ever commented on a negatively.

I barely ever received any comments at all for videos Ive posted and it is disappointing but this is the internet after all. I felt like I never received comments back because Im not a beginner or an expert, so no one really cares. Or I just suck and no one wants to be the one to tell me.
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Old 08-19-2018, 04:31 AM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

Quote:
Originally Posted by AzHeat View Post
..but I Bet there are more on here who feel it’s just not a safe enough environment to share anything less than spectacular..

About the 'not safe environment' i am not sure, but the statement that something 'spectacular' needs to be shared i think is an interesting one..

Because to me that leeds kinda automatically to the question why someone would post something to begin with..And, in my opinion, in 99,9% of all cases the honest answer is to recieve some sort of recognition/applause/admiration for their playing..And ofcourse the best way to get those things, is when someone can play a typical drummersong pretty well, or when someone can show off a little with some technique, such things..

The interesting question to me always is, why would someoneneed (or want) the recognition/applause/admiration by posting a drumvideo online..

Thats at least the question i also asked myself a few times when i thought about posting something here and since i still havent found a satisfying answer for myself, i will just skip..But i think in general the answer on a forum like this could be that people want to be taken serious when they say something..

But, like i said before, safe environment or not, in 99,9% of all cases people post videos to recieve some sort of applause and not to recieve criticism about things that (in the opinion of the replying 'expert') should be worked on..

Drumlesson/informing videos are btw a little different in my opinion, because from those always a few members can learn something maybe..
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:00 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

IMO, the great majority of people just don't want to spend their time to comment on someone else's video. That would be giving too much or something. It's kind of like why should I take the time to critique something someone else does? What am I personally getting back for my effort? What's in it for me? Then there's the dilemma of just how truthful to be. And how the critique is delivered is a delicate maneuver. It's a minefield.

I'm pretty sure the majority of posters of their own playing are looking for positive reinforcement. I know I did. Some may actually be looking to have some bad stuff pointed out to them, but most do it for accolades. My opinion only. When a person is looking for positive reinforcement... it stings a little to hear things they didn't plan on. I don't want to sting anyone. Now I choose to sidestep any commenting with a very few exceptions. Like my really great friends who go back to my beginnings here like Andy, Bo, spleeeeen and a bunch of others, or when I am totally blown away by something someone posted. Or someone I have a ton of respect for, like Tony.

I used to comment on most of the stuff posted. Then I would have people sending me stuff via PM to critique. I mean it's flattering and all, but it gets to be too much sometimes. I'm not a professional critic. I took a lot of time and tried to word my comments as nicely as I could. So it was definitely an effort. And the reward for that is I got to keep doing it lol. If I didn't feel like critiquing something that day, I feel that perhaps that poster may think I was dissing them. I do care about that. I usually watch almost everything that's posted. I rarely comment anymore, it's a minefield. I haven't posted any of my own playing since 2013. I don't want to put people in an awkward position where they feel an obligation to comment. Because if someone doesn't comment, I could say to myself, "Oh so and so didn't comment. Maybe they didn't like it". So not commenting is making an unintended statement there too. Socially problematic.

Then you have the folks who post their playing all the time but never give back anywhere else here. Like the DJKdrums guy. Hey, I think he's really, really good, especially for a young drummer. I would have loved to have been that good when I was his age. But I'm pretty sure he only looks at the threads he started. He's young and I get that, I do give him a pass there, but he does make a great example of what not to do with the My Playing section. Then there's the folks who don't normally comment on anyone...except when they have a new vid posted. So they will comment on others videos only when they have new videos up that they posted. I guess that's better than the DJK guy for example, but it's still a little disingenuous IMO.

You have to give at least as much as you take, is my attitude. Actually more would be better. You should always give back to what you love.
Maybe it's best to not expect comments. But then what would be the purpose of posting there?
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Last edited by larryace; 08-19-2018 at 04:55 PM.
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  #10  
Old 08-19-2018, 03:11 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

On Facebook there is a Jam of Week group (Farnell Newton started it) that I'll sometimes post something-mostly jazz cats. Lots of great talent. It is limited to mostly short 1-2 minutes of playing-you can just post or ask for Critiques & Comments. Maybe a format like that would be more conducive where people qualify whether they want C&C. Personally I like the short ones-maybe it's my ADHD LOL. The videos with all "fancy production and promotion" and "subscribe to my site" I find tedious -I'm sorry I'm sure people really work hard on them. I really like the "live gig" videos too-makes me want to start gigging again. I think the idea of posting "your playing" should be just to participate and show you are an actual drummer (no matter where you are on your journey-which it is a life long one). I agree that one should comment and post-contribute in both capacities. People have brought to attention my weaknesses which I really appreciate-I can be clueless at times.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:30 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

I remember someone once posted a what am I doing wrong video that got a lot of very helpful comments. That’s the only one I can think of. If you ask for help, you really should receive some commentary. Otherwise, it’s sort of like asking, “does this tie go with this shirt?l, and you get a lhey look at that shiny airplane in the sky” answer.

If you were told yes, but today’s ties are a much narrower style, then you know the color is right, but not the style, so you have something to work with. Otherwise, you may go back to the closet and pull out a different wide tie, worse than the first. Now you’re likely to get a “no man, that tie looks like s**t!” comment. Problem is, you still don’t know why you’re selections are such a miss!

Kinda the problem with asking on a forum I suppose. If you asked a good friend the same question, you’d probably probably get an answer like, “ROFLOL, was Gerald Ford president when you bought that thing?” You’d instantly know the issue, laugh it off and go have a beer, then laugh about it some more.

Kinda why things get so hostile so quickly on the Internet...no beer!
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:54 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

Quote:
Originally Posted by AzHeat View Post
I remember someone once posted a what am I doing wrong video that got a lot of very helpful comments. That’s the only one I can think of. If you ask for help, you really should receive some commentary. Otherwise, it’s sort of like asking, “does this tie go with this shirt?l, and you get a lhey look at that shiny airplane in the sky” answer.

If you were told yes, but today’s ties are a much narrower style, then you know the color is right, but not the style, so you have something to work with. Otherwise, you may go back to the closet and pull out a different wide tie, worse than the first. Now you’re likely to get a “no man, that tie looks like s**t!” comment. Problem is, you still don’t know why you’re selections are such a miss!

Kinda the problem with asking on a forum I suppose. If you asked a good friend the same question, you’d probably probably get an answer like, “ROFLOL, was Gerald Ford president when you bought that thing?” You’d instantly know the issue, laugh it off and go have a beer, then laugh about it some more.

Kinda why things get so hostile so quickly on the Internet...no beer!
Great post.

No beer, hilarious. AFAIK, there's no app for that yet :)
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Old 08-19-2018, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

There is also the issue of people like myself who don't have a way to record themselves. I sort of feel like 'who am I to tell you good or bad when I have no way to reciprocate my playing to you'. The only time I will if if someone is doing something that causes, or potentially causes injury.

I'm sure I'm not the only one in this boat. I have linked 2 .mp3 files of my playing, but you can't see anything, only listen. And the CD's the songs came from are redily available on YouTube. The people who want to listen probably all ready have. I would love to post videos, but it just isn't an option.
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Old 08-19-2018, 07:39 PM
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Default Re: A suggestion for reviewing others

I have developed a rubric for this:

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...d.php?t=125864
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