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  #1  
Old 04-11-2013, 01:05 AM
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Default Admit it and be cleansed!

As a sort of extension of the thread where we were stating what songs we loved and now hate, I'd like to add another step to the program and have everyone list their overblowing muck-jazz albums they've actually bought. You will feel better as the weight is lifted from your shoulders. I know I feel better.

I think this all started with Dave Sanborn and other GRP recording artists when they were cranking out the elevator jazz which featured alot of overplaying. But never fear, it still happens to this day. One that comes to mind is that Oz Noy guy with Keith Carlock on the drums. Due to the nature of what they're doing, I'm not sure about including Jojo Mayer's Nerve on the list. Omar Hakim also put out a solo album, but he was singing songs, so I'm not sure that counts either - as soon as you start singing, your drums start playing for the song.

So, I'll admit this one. Niacin, which was a quartet featuring Dennis Chambers in the 90s. I couldn't hum any of those tunes for you.

I know, some of you will be offended because we are taught to revere the musical mastery of the players involved, and because, of course, we can't do it. It just blows my mind that after listening to several of these types of groups, I often wonder how did they ever fill an entire club with people to listen? The tours must've been very short because I can't see anyone wanting to fund this stuff for a full-blown tour. You never hear this music on the radio, or see any videos on cable television, so musos are the ones seeking this stuff out and paying for it - and musos still aren't a big enough crowd to fund anyone for an entire tour. Sad.

Pat Metheny? Ronnie Lawson? The Crusaders in the 70s? Let it all out. The sooner you admit, the better you'll feel ;)
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:14 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Was it Harvey Mason that did "Fourplay" back in the early 90s? Approximately 67 minutes I wish I had back.
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:15 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

This is the very reason that I laugh whenever somebody says they listen to Dave Weckl. I'm reasonably open-minded and open to most music but the minute I hear 'those' saxophone tones, I'm out of there like proverbial from a goose. It just does absolutely nothing for me. It's as much the production as anything else - sucking the life out of what is being laid down.

I'm sorry guys. I like virtuoso players as much as the next person but musical masturbation is just not my thing.

This makes me feel like jumping off a bridge:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ng_1zKcdw8M
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:18 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I actually have the Crusaders on my Pandora list and was listening to them today doing my end of day paperwork. I have a few sax players in the smooth jazz genre but have tired of them. Mindi Abair was my favorite and paid to see her twice, but she got a little old, the music, and I left her by the roadside.
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:31 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I admit I like Oz Noy, but I wouldn't class his music as elevator music like those albums made under the GRP records, yes the musicianship is on the forefront, but not in the same way, it's more organic with a touch of rawness, a rock fusion type of music, Weckl also played with Oz Noy.

I also admit I like Rudder, Keith Carlock's Rocky/Jazzy/Fusion type of band, there's some killer grooves in their music.

I also have a soft spot for the Hiromi Trio, with Simon Phillips, kinda over the top excellence playing from all involved, but it's no elevator's music, it's not soapy, just modern jazz stuff.

Off course I cannot touch the playing of these guys, it's purely for pleasure (and inspirations)
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:45 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad About Drums View Post
I also have a soft spot for the Hiromi Trio, with Simon Phillips, kinda over the top excellence playing from all involved, but it's no elevator's music, it's not soapy, just modern jazz stuff.
Yes it is. Just like MIchel Camilo ;)

And yeah, I must admit I liked the Elektrik Band when it debuted, but after about six months I felt silly.
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:53 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Thanks Bo, I have a lot to get off my chest here - so much so that though no matter how hard I scrub I will never be cleansed!

I've owned more festering fusion, egregious elevator music and pus-filled prog than you can poke a stick at. Tons of albums bought because Steve Gadd, Billy Cobham etc play on at least one track - often solo albums by players who excel as sidemen for artists who can actually write decent songs.

You'll find some relevant lists here on the Best/worst Fusion Albums thread - http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=92385
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:55 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

If you're going to build off that topic, you have to include my quote on it: LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrumEatDrum View Post
. Years of mis-spent youth spending money buying fusion albums just because they had name players on them, just to realize after a while the music was just that: Elevator music.

Kids today with their fancy internet don't ever have to know the horror of wasting $12.99 on an album of mindless chop blowing just because it seemed like a good idea at the time.
Assorted Dave Weckl albums (at least I didn't pay for some of them, but some I did).
Planet X (Virgil Donanti)
Black Light Syndrome (Terry Bozzio)
Polytown (Bozzio)

And before that, I had a stack of vinyl fusion albums, and I don't even recall what was in the stack.

And then I had a ton of 80's shred metal/fusion tapes from Shrapnel records. The drumming in awesome, but musically most of it was forgettable. Marty Friedman, Cacophony, and bunch of other Shrapnel titles.

Out of everything, the only ones I still really enjoy are:
Tony MacAlpine's Edge of Insanity
Jeff Beck's Guitar shop
and
Jean Luc Ponty's Mystical Adventures (with Rayford Griffin on drums).
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:11 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

^
I love planet X but I appreciate that alot of people can't get into it.

I didn't think anything of Greg Howe's Extraction. Hyperacuity although a little half baked was awesome but Extraction was just kind of cheesy and annoying.
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:18 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I really love Weckl's stuff right now. Don't know if I'll ever not, but his composing is so playful it makes me happy.

I used to listen to Dragonforce but at least I got over that.
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:24 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I obviously can't contribute, since I don't know what muck-jazz is.

I do love Maynard Fergesen's covers, though.
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:31 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Yes- the pleasure of admission. I have a couple of Spiro Gyro records. I have Danny Gotlieb, Pat Metheny, Yellowjackets, Alan White and some other fusion stuff that really got me interested back when. Now it tends to sound like elevator music or guys showing off (even some of the Alan Holdsworth and Jeff Beck stuff). I certainly appreciate the expertise of the musicians, but it does nothing emotionally for me any more. Don't know what happened. Still like some Headhunters, Weather Report, Brand X, Mahavishnu and some others though.
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:49 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Good thread Bo, but you can definitely expect some blowback on this one...

http://www.palmradioproductions.com/...RUM-SET-21.jpg

My 30 year old son has a degree in music, and is a player and guitar instructor in Seattle. He heard my 70's fusion influences repeatedly in his youth, but tired with all of the cd's which featured no real song structure. He complained the "songs" were simply a vamp to allow everyone to solo endlessly.

At the time, it offended me slightly, although we have always been very close, but I had to reluctantly agree. A bunch of that music didn't age very graciously. That said, great players can be entertaining to watch, especially if you can appreciate the hours spent on technique. It all serves as a reminder a tune with no drums still can be one of my favorites.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY5i4-rWh44
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:02 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

On the other hand, I'm starting to look at Bruford's early fusion work in a more favourable light. I have one of the live albums on vinyl and it kicks hard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIcU--oNKQ4

The dungarees must die but I would rather watch this a thousand times than any Weckl. At least it has balls. Berlin has a very odd bass tone - which I like.
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:03 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I'll admit I bought the Niacin album b/c Chambers was on it and for the life of me I never felt anything but overstimulated listening to it. I didn't like it - ah, that feels better. On the other hand Stanton Moore's Emphasis (on Parenthesis) is an album that I can both listen to for genuine enjoyment and be inspired by.
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:41 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

This is one of the few sins I don't need to confess to. :-) I never even heard of most of the stuff you folks are talking about.
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Old 04-11-2013, 04:11 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I love fusion and ain't about to give it up anytime soon. Niacin is a trio, and their new CD is on the way to my mailbox as I type this. I also like prog rock. Since when did being likely to hum a tune become the measure of musical quality? Most people are lemmings when it comes to music, so I could not care less about what anyone else likes. Peace and goodwill.
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Old 04-11-2013, 04:20 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
I know, some of you will be offended because we are taught to revere the musical mastery of the players involved, and because, of course, we can't do it. It just blows my mind that after listening to several of these types of groups, I often wonder how did they ever fill an entire club with people to listen?
Assuming you're talking about fusion in general, here-- but they did; they worked in clubs all the time, and filled them; and I know guys who bought pretty nice houses off of touring with those groups. It was a fairly popular form of live music.

I have a lot of history with fusion, but don't really have any dirty little secrets. Most of what I was around, and listened to-- like a whole lot of Weather Report and Billy Cobham-- was actually good, as it turns out. The few bad things I accidentally bought, I dumped, or never listened to-- like a Special EFX record, and some GRP all-stars live thing. I had some Tom Scott and David Sanborn, which I was never wild about, but listened to because they had great drummers with them-- I wanted to be a pro, so I tried to learn from them and withheld judgment.

I do still listen to a lot of stuff that most people would not be able to distinguish from total cheese-- like George Duke's Brazilian Love Affair. It's like a test-- when I mention that record to somebody, and they start raving about it, I know they know their s__.
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Old 04-11-2013, 04:35 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Ok, Bo I confess ... I was captured by Weckl, the small drums, and "that sound". I bought all I could after the first Elektrik Band. I argued to all who would listen that it was the best music ever recorded ... then never listened to it again. Except for "Got a Match" - I can still listen to that.

To my credit, I always thought his mullet was brutal. (I'm Canadian, mullets only ever looked good under a helmet.) ;-)

It's an odd thing though how some stuff stands up. "Kind of Blue" still gets a regular listen, even after all these years.

Also, if I start getting all fancy listening to Camilo or something, I'll hear "Not for you" on the radio and veer off in that direction for a while. I'm sure it isn't just me.... right ...?

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Old 04-11-2013, 04:42 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

I thought I was being obvious about the tongue-in-cheek-ness of the thread. No one need get offended. Like Polly, I look back at my record/CD collection and realize like her, I bought alot of albums because so-and-so played a track on it, and rarely has the music actually been memorable. It's like looking at past snapshots of your life that you're ashamed to see.

And I truly respect all these people all players and musicians. But it's funny because Stewart Copeland totally admitted to his Klark Kent stuff as being completely self-indulgent teen-age stuff, yet it doesn't come across that way and I can still stomach it after 30 years. It's totally fun stuff to play and to listen to. But the Elektrik Band stuff, the endless Maynard Ferguson albums, and other nameless 70s-80s music fluff did not age well.

And I remember when Prince's Purple Rain came out and I hated it because it was all over the place then. In the last ten years or so it's become a classic to me - the man definitely does not sound like anybody else.

Regardless of how great the current crop of solo instrumental artists are these days, it really is elevator music. In fact, a friend of mine who does packaging for the x-rated industry, thought he heard one of these solo artists' instrumental tracks as background music in a recently released film (no, I don't know which one it is, but you know what I mean).

I'm sure, as a player, and encourager of others who should get out and play, I'll play for whoever and whatever needs me. I'm not above doing anything I can do if I get to play. And I suppose having spent all this time listening to great players play anything was an education of sorts. But like I said in another thread, I'm sorry I didn't just latch on to people like Clyde and Jabo, Zigaboo, Ringo, and Charlie earlier. I've probably heard more Hal Blaine, Earl Palmer, and Gary Chester without knowing it than anybody. I admit like every other young person, I was attracted to alot of flash, and none of those guys I mentioned were flashy. Like Gadd said: technique ain't $^#@ if you can't lay it down.

I often wonder if my career would've been much different if I really just listened to my mentors and got my time together first? I'm even teaching privately this way now - I get them into grooving and time, then we'll get their hands together. I'll probably not get alot of students by doing that, eh?
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:44 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BacteriumFendYoke View Post
This is the very reason that I laugh whenever somebody says they listen to Dave Weckl. I'm reasonably open-minded and open to most music but the minute I hear 'those' saxophone tones, I'm out of there like proverbial from a goose. It just does absolutely nothing for me. It's as much the production as anything else - sucking the life out of what is being laid down.

I'm sorry guys. I like virtuoso players as much as the next person but musical masturbation is just not my thing.

This makes me feel like jumping off a bridge:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ng_1zKcdw8M

My thoughts exactly!
This type of playing is a reminder of the fact that skill and a sense style don't automatically go hand in hand

But with that said, I do have an enormous amount of respect for the talent level that someone like Dave Weckl has.
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Old 04-11-2013, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by ggmerino View Post
Still like some Headhunters, Weather Report, Brand X, Mahavishnu and some others though.
+1 - good choices!

I'd also add:

Chick Corea's first RTF album

Early and mid period Gong.

Beck's Blow By Blow

Bruford, as Duncan said, has some great tracks (and some sleep inducers).

Billy Cobham's Spectrum (aside from the ugly drum solos)

Uncle Frank's Grand Wazoo

and of course Steely Dan's Countdown to Ecstasy, Katy Lied, Royal Scam and Aja *ducks for cover*

All it takes for fusion to avoid being elevator dross is for the music to have a little originality, care in composition and some personality. You wouldn't think it a big ask ...

Not sure how I came to be such a fusion tragic when I'm so basic that I make Phil Rudd look like Steve Gadd haha - opposites attract?? Like Bo, I think I would have developed in a more, um, marketable way if I listened to playing peers rather than gods.
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Old 04-11-2013, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Anon La Ply View Post

Like Bo, I think I would have developed in a more, um, marketable way if I listened to playing peers rather than gods.
I often wondered about this. I have a theory that people who play the music we drummers help support, are just not turned on by drummers with too much facility. I had a friend in college who didn't play drums very well, but was very enthusiastic and provided what people wanted, and this person was out playing all the time. And there I was, putting my 3-hours a day in on the practice rooms, doing all that macho musician crap, and struggling to hear about gigs.

Of course, learning is a good thing. I don't tell people they shouldn't learn all that they can learn, and be able to execute at a moments' notice, but part of me kind of shrugs my shoulders about all of it. And I get that having reference points in terms of who you studied is good to lay future groundwork with other musicians, but part of me also has been saying "who cares?" about this as well. The guy who wrote the song is only really concerned about getting what he wants for his song at the time. Who you studied and listened to really only helped you get to that point of being noticed, right?
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:13 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Not sure how you define "muck-jazz", but as much as their was a time I delved into fusion (and learned a lot from it by the way), the phase dissipated for the most part just as quickly. I still do enjoy some Metheny, Scofield, Weckl, & Camilo but I just need to take it in small doses over a long period of time.

Didn't then and still don't enjoy watching Lenny White, Billy Cobham, any Mahavishnu, Weather Report, most Return to Forever, Narada Michael Walden, anything that resembles elevator music and a whole freakin lot more that for the most part I have thankfully forgotten. That being said, if I'll never say these folks are musicians of the highest order, I just don't connect.

While I'm at it. I don't have much interest for the pop music many of the folks around here enjoy. Again, there was a time I listened to it and made a living playing it.

Not diminishing it - just saying I can't stand it and would rather quit, sell everything I own and never play again than to play / listen to it again. Many here continuously say the statement "Good - more gig's for me"... To that I respond - good take them all and I seriously hope you get rich doing them. We're even though - you'd probably not be too interested in the music I like the most as well..

What I have found in my short time here is I have not much in common musically with many of the fine people here, but have a great deal in common over the instrument itself. That makes it worth sticking around for me.

Last edited by dmacc; 04-11-2013 at 11:31 AM.
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:37 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Bo, I think I came to jazzrock from heavy rock like Zep and Purple, who had a strong focus on shredding musicianship. It wasn't such a big step to the proggers like Crimson and Yes and ELP and from there it was a very small step to Mahavishnu, RTF etc. Then I discovered Steve Gadd's magical feel and I bought anything with him playing, which lead me to some pretty boring elevator music with fabulous drumming :)

Here's an interesting article: The Assassination of Jazz Rock

My view is that music is there to be enjoyed and I like to graze widely - if it's not cynically commercial, too soppy, too brutal or too blank, there'll be something there to enjoy. Unlike many, pretension in music is fine by me - it can lead to some interesting experiments and be a whole lot of fun IMO :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 12:03 PM
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..........Then I discovered Steve Gadd's magical feel and I bought anything with him playing, which lead me to some pretty boring elevator music with fabulous drumming :)......


My view is that music is there to be enjoyed and I like to graze widely - if it's not cynically commercial, too soppy, too brutal or too blank, there'll be something there to enjoy. Unlike many, pretension in music is fine by me - it can lead to some interesting experiments and be a whole lot of fun IMO :)
So very true on both accounts. Which is why I say - you want it - take it. Fine nothing wrong with it, just not for me. And.... Anything with Gadd on it, elevator or not - I'm taking for the keeping.
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:40 PM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

At one point in the early to mid 1990s my city had not one but two, yes TWO, "Smooth Jazz" radio stations. Ah the heyday of Kenny G. The guy's a billionaire probably, and here we are complaining.... lol
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:52 PM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

My forays into self-indulgent, solo-happy, non-melodious, musicianship still happen fairly regularly, but I think it's because I just seek out new nonsense to listen to once the other stuff ages a bit.

I've really been digging the guitarist Buckethead's huge catalog and insane diversity...and that brought me into Bill Laswell, who has recorded and produced a ton of artists. I think I'll be there a while, but only occasionally, because I don't want my brain to start using that music as a basis for new thought patterns....basically, I don't want it to drive me totally crazy.

I haven't listened to a lot of the stuff mentioned in this thread, nor have I heard of a lot of it TBH. Mahavishnu, Headhunters, and Weather Report definitely...and I've delved into Liquid Tension Experiment, some Jeff Beck, and I still love Zappa!

I don't even know if we're all talking about the same brand of music here, but I do feel relieved none-the-less :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 04:50 PM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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Originally Posted by Anon La Ply View Post
It wasn't such a big step to the proggers like Crimson and Yes and ELP and from there it was a very small step to Mahavishnu, RTF etc. ...
Similar progression for me rock->prog->fusion->jazz->everything. Bring on the pretension I say, just so long as it is done with conviction and has some feeling.

Perhaps a thread devoted to some newer good pretentious rock/prog/fusion bands?- Radiohead? Mars Volta? Meshuggah even?

Had forgotten about "The Grand Wazoo"- listening to it now- thanks. Hot Rats is another good one.

Last edited by ggmerino; 04-11-2013 at 05:00 PM.
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:24 PM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Sorry, I didn't mean to just focus on the fusiony or smooth jazz stuff. I pretty much mean all of it: prog rock, self-indulgent polkas......I think every genre will have its pioneers who open it up. Bela Fleck in a way is doing it to folk music. Rush is doing it to rock. The Police have even sorta done it to reggae. So when I refer to this "muck jazz" I was insulting everyone's sensibilities ;). Chicago started of very cool because it was something nobody else was doing at the time, and they gradually changed to where they don't even resemble what it once was.

But I can't explain my collection of Joe Pass' "Virtuoso" albums. I can sit and listen to that guy all night.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:07 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Well there was that Herb Alpert album that time. :)
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Old 04-12-2013, 01:20 AM
5678...procrastinate 5678...procrastinate is offline
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

For me it's kind of like the Olympics. I'm happy to be amazed at what's possible. But my ears become fatigued after a while; and I'll need to 'ground' myself.

I think that's why I never made it all the way through ' Spectrum ' in one sitting. Too intense.

"and the gold medal for Noodling goes to..............."

Polly, I don't know how you could say that. I'm hurt, cut, wounded.
"Ducks for Cover" is my all time favourite Steely Dan track. Take it back, take it back.
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Old 04-12-2013, 01:33 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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Originally Posted by 5678...procrastinate View Post
For me it's kind of like the Olympics. I'm happy to be amazed at what's possible. But my ears become fatigued after a while; and I'll need to 'ground' myself.

I think that's why I never made it all the way through ' Spectrum ' in one sitting. Too intense.

"and the gold medal for Noodling goes to..............."

Polly, I don't know how you could say that. I'm hurt, cut, wounded.
"Ducks for Cover" is my all time favourite Steely Dan track. Take it back, take it back.
I think this is also why I cut all the drum solos out of the Spectrum album and listen to it that way. The album kinda settles down much better ;)
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:04 AM
5678...procrastinate 5678...procrastinate is offline
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Thinking back, I seem to remember there being a certain competitiveness to 'discovering', lets say 'challenging' music, and your membership of the serious muso club very much depended on 'getting it'.
I can certainly recall moments of 'serious listening' and thinking............
"Dear god, will it never end?"

I guess that's why babies dig Mozart, not Stockhausen!
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:07 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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Originally Posted by 5678...procrastinate View Post
Thinking back, I seem to remember there being a certain competitiveness to 'discovering', lets say 'challenging' music, and your membership of the serious muso club very much depended on 'getting it'.
I can certainly recall moments of 'serious listening' and thinking............
"Dear god, will it never end?"

I guess that's why babies dig Mozart, not Stockhausen!
Interesting how peer pressure gets people to do the dumbest things, eh? I think I was fortunate that that phase was burned out of me by the time I got to college. But while I was there I would chuckle about who I should be listening to. I actually got people turned on to listening to Jay Osmond.
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:52 AM
5678...procrastinate 5678...procrastinate is offline
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

As in "Crazy Horses"?
For me one of the benefits of being directed to Drummerworld has been learning more about the drummers,[and bassists, etc.], that I had been 'listening to' with out realising it.....
Take the Funk Brothers for instance.
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:58 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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What I have found in my short time here is I have not much in common musically with many of the fine people here, but have a great deal in common over the instrument itself. That makes it worth sticking around for me.
Ditto D. It always amazes me that most people care for my preferred music.


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rock->prog->fusion->jazz->everything. Bring on the pretension I say, just so long as it is done with conviction and has some feeling.
Yep. Rolling Stone etc journos read all sorts of odd stuff into bands because they are writers, not musicians - they have a hammer and everything is a nail to them. So they focus on lyrics and their meaning and you get the impression that they wouldn't care if the band went home and left the singer to recite poetry.

It doesn't seem to occur to them that we like playing music and stretching ourselves and that people enjoy that when given a chance.


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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
Sorry, I didn't mean to just focus on the fusiony or smooth jazz stuff. I pretty much mean all of it: prog rock, self-indulgent polkas......I think every genre will have its pioneers who open it up.
Sorry Bo! I think that was me ...


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Originally Posted by 5678...procrastinate View Post
I think that's why I never made it all the way through ' Spectrum ' in one sitting. Too intense.
Like Bo, I chopped off the solos either end of Stratus and the Red Baron solo - I love those tracks sans the drum solos, even though Red Baron was backdrop to one of my biggest fails.at a jam where I fluffed a fill and the guy who organised the jam tore me to shreds! That sure let me know where I stood lol


Quote:
Originally Posted by 5678...procrastinate View Post
Polly, I don't know how you could say that. I'm hurt, cut, wounded.

"Ducks for Cover" is my all time favourite Steely Dan track. Take it back, take it back.
Oh dear! 5678, I apologise unreservedly and offer a complete and utter retraction. The imputation was totally without basis in fact, and was in no way fair comment, and was motivated purely by malice, and I deeply regret any distress that my comments may have caused you or your family, and I hereby undertake not to repeat any such slander at any time in the future http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KniUNdVZvH4

Another one ... I recently went through a phase where I could get enough of the Gentle Giant live clips on YT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzDCfnBhinw
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Old 04-12-2013, 03:54 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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As a sort of extension of the thread where we were stating what songs we loved and now hate, I'd like to add another step to the program and have everyone list their overblowing muck-jazz albums they've actually bought. You will feel better as the weight is lifted from your shoulders. I know I feel better.

I think this all started with Dave Sanborn and other GRP recording artists when they were cranking out the elevator jazz which featured alot of overplaying. But never fear, it still happens to this day. One that comes to mind is that Oz Noy guy with Keith Carlock on the drums. Due to the nature of what they're doing, I'm not sure about including Jojo Mayer's Nerve on the list. Omar Hakim also put out a solo album, but he was singing songs, so I'm not sure that counts either - as soon as you start singing, your drums start playing for the song.

So, I'll admit this one. Niacin, which was a quartet featuring Dennis Chambers in the 90s. I couldn't hum any of those tunes for you.

I know, some of you will be offended because we are taught to revere the musical mastery of the players involved, and because, of course, we can't do it. It just blows my mind that after listening to several of these types of groups, I often wonder how did they ever fill an entire club with people to listen? The tours must've been very short because I can't see anyone wanting to fund this stuff for a full-blown tour. You never hear this music on the radio, or see any videos on cable television, so musos are the ones seeking this stuff out and paying for it - and musos still aren't a big enough crowd to fund anyone for an entire tour. Sad.

Pat Metheny? Ronnie Lawson? The Crusaders in the 70s? Let it all out. The sooner you admit, the better you'll feel ;)
Is Candy Doffer (sp.?) stil around?
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Old 04-12-2013, 04:12 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

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Is Candy Doffer (sp.?) stil around?
I think it's spelled "Dulpher". And maybe she's happier being a soccer mom these days ;)
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Old 04-12-2013, 04:38 AM
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Default Re: Admit it and be cleansed!

Emerson Lake and Palmer. Tarkus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJINce7l3P4
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