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  #1  
Old 06-02-2011, 04:21 AM
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Default When mistakes happen live.

Though not written by a drummer (but pretty close) I feel this is a great read for all musicians:

http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2011/05...nder-pressure/

Anyone have similar experiences?
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  #2  
Old 06-02-2011, 04:46 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Great article!

...............
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Old 06-02-2011, 05:52 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

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Great article!

...............
+1

................... :-)
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Old 06-02-2011, 06:51 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Yes, a great article. Although I thought the solution to making mistakes was to make it again so it doesn't seem like a mistake.... ;)

Wrong context here, I know.
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Old 06-02-2011, 07:05 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Cool article. Mistakes do tend to happen sometimes. But that's often the way, besides we're all human.
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Old 06-02-2011, 09:39 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
Yes, a great article. Although I thought the solution to making mistakes was to make it again so it doesn't seem like a mistake.... ;)

Wrong context here, I know.
Fudge it once; shame on you. Fudge it twice; that's jazz baby.
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Old 06-02-2011, 09:58 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Thanks Numberless - such an inspiring attitude! Certainly one I could learn from. Hands up those who have given or received the Death Glare after a blunder?



It says a lot about the confidence those players have in their musicality, not to mention maturity.
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Old 06-02-2011, 12:03 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

So many times when my band makes a mistake I think it's me and before I get chance to say anything someone else takes the blame. It's made me wonder if sometimes it's that a mistake in timing quickly ripples through the band and it's hard to know who actually initiated it?
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Old 06-02-2011, 04:57 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
Yes, a great article. Although I thought the solution to making mistakes was to make it again so it doesn't seem like a mistake.... ;)

Wrong context here, I know.
I play every week on a TV show for over a million people. We tape two shows a week with under rehearsed guest acts and have never been given the chance for a second take EVER. So obviously we do it Bo's way all the time. So far I've discovered that most of the ones who act supremely rude in live situations have substance abuse problems.

Then there's those Buddy Rich stories my dad likes to share from time to time lol.
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Old 06-02-2011, 05:15 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

If my playing was going before a million people I'd mess my throne! Fantastic experience, especially having to wing it. I guess the challenge is always to make musical sense and doubled blunders at least have symmetry going for them. In office work it's known as CYA :)


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Then there's those Buddy Rich stories my dad likes to share from time to time lol.
Funny, I was thinking about Buddy's bus tirade after reading the article. At first I was thinking he was the polar opposite to the guys in the article, but he was carrying more responsibility. Still wildly hard core, though ...
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Old 06-02-2011, 05:15 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

thanks for posting that! really great article.

in my band that kind of thing happens all the time. i make my share of mistakes, but our lead singer and guitar player are notorious for forgetting how songs go. when one of them goes off in a completely different direction than we've practiced, the bass player and i have to make a snap decision as to whether we're going to follow them or press on with how we know the song goes and hope they'll follow us. if it's the singer though, we pretty much have to follow her no matter how wrong we know she is. as they say "the singer is always right".
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  #12  
Old 06-02-2011, 05:56 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Great article. Inspiring.

Haha, Polly, I too have both given and received the 'wtf are you doing' glare. Its definitely one to be avoided if possible. However, this article gives an interesting perspective that I respect.

There is a player in my band that is unfortunately subpar compared to everyone else. Once at a gig, he was rockin his keys WAY off beat, almost a 16th note behind.. and thats unforgivable for funk. Anyway I gave him the glare, because I knew it could be justified by my better playing, and I thought it was necessary to except more from him if he wants to play with us. I thought it made me look like the better/more mature musician for expecting more from him even if I'm a dick about it by giving him the glare. But this article makes me see that you can be the better musician and expect more from someone by being an ally to others and covering for their mistakes.

I still think playing off beat in funk is unforgivable, but this article made me realized that taking the highroad and looking down on others for their mistakes isnt always best way to go. Mistakes happen, and if you give someone the glare during a show, it kills the energy for that person. They might not get over their mistake for the rest of the night and ruin the gig. Better to let it slide at the gig and work it out in rehearsal.

We haven't talked about it since, but I think I'm going to apologize to that guy for being a dick.
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  #13  
Old 06-03-2011, 02:03 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Great article. I think some of my friends who I've played with could do well to read it.

I saw Will Calhoun do a drum clinic and he was talking about a show he did with Living Colour. He dropped a stick during a song and got 'the death stare' from the singer who was clearly annoyed...so he just held his hands up and dropped the other stick. I thought that was great.
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  #14  
Old 06-03-2011, 02:11 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wsabol View Post
There is a player in my band that is unfortunately subpar compared to everyone else. Once at a gig, he was rockin his keys WAY off beat, almost a 16th note behind.. and thats unforgivable for funk. Anyway I gave him the glare, because I knew it could be justified by my better playing, and I thought it was necessary to except more from him if he wants to play with us. I thought it made me look like the better/more mature musician for expecting more from him even if I'm a dick about it by giving him the glare. But this article makes me see that you can be the better musician and expect more from someone by being an ally to others and covering for their mistakes.
Yes, that's the tough issue .. the player who's a bit behind everyone else and is stubborn about taking advice. In my band it's the keys player / 2nd guitarist. His timing is shaky yet he snorts whenever I mention the words "metronome" or "click" because he thinks it's overly precious and "inhuman". Last time we had that coversation I said that this band could try to be inhuman for 60 years and we still wouldn't be achieve inhuman perfection ... which he had to concede lol

It's tricky because we're not a "serious" band ... yet the pleasure comes from creating beautiful music and it's jarring when someone fumbles. The natural reaction is to go "grrr, I was enjoying that until ...". Still, being more laid back helps everyone relax, which in turn helps everyone get in the zone. Really, a knowing smile gets the message across without putting people on edge. Still, I find the diplomacy needed in bands a tricky terrain.
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:20 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Glares are for private band practice only. It's not only extremely rude, but counter-productive to give a band mate a nasty stare in front of people.

Frankly, folks would more likely notice your antics at the mistake more than they'd notice most mistakes being made.

We've had to start over on the occasional song if it got off to a terrible start... But the key is to make light of the situation, don't take it so seriously, and nail it on the next go.
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Old 06-03-2011, 04:03 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Re: The article...That's real professionalism, and you have to admire that. It elevates everything.

Mini hijack, the bassist I play with in the blues trio (Ryan Madora) was interviewed in an article in the same magazine (No Treble) as the article in this thread. At the end of the article they have 2 YouTubes of the blues duo (Don and Ryan) playing without me. :( Sorry for the hijack, had to mention it.
http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2011/05...out-a-drummer/
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  #17  
Old 06-03-2011, 05:43 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

I play in a Duo and the singer stroke guitarist never ends the same song twice so I get the dirty look off him all the time...its sh*ts me to no end but there you go

I take the blame

With the story below it's a great tale but one every sesssion musicians has to do...you kiss the backside of your Boss or you don't work.........simple as

Look at Madonna, Beyonce any solo artists all the people around them lie in a puddle so they don't get their feet wet

it's how the world works
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  #18  
Old 06-03-2011, 06:18 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spides666 View Post
I play in a Duo and the singer stroke guitarist never ends the same song twice so I get the dirty look off him all the time...
Surely the answer is to only to end the song once? :)
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Old 06-03-2011, 07:48 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Ba-dum-bum. She will be here all week. Tip your waitress and try the veal.
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Old 06-03-2011, 08:59 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

This past year in my band class in high school, I got the death-stare from nearly everyone in rehearsal - my band teacher, both violins, the keyboardist, and the bass player (before he started skipping and not coming back). I had horrible time though, so it was kinda justified. Didn't do much for my confidence though - made me play noticeably worse from my standpoint.

And then we'd go onstage and play at one of my teacher's orchestra concerts, and my time would get better all of a sudden. I'd still fumble a beat here and there, but I'd still get the stare from one of the violins, who just so happened to be my ex-girlfriend. Apparently she wanted to add insult to the breakup (which I got over fairly quickly) by calling me out at every opportunity that arose.

This was my teacher's first year dealing with a drummer for the band and probably my bandmates' first time playing with a drummer, so it wasn't really easy for anyone! :P
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Old 06-03-2011, 09:13 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ineedaclutch View Post
Ba-dum-bum. She will be here all week. Tip your waitress and try the veal.
lol - I deserved that :)


Quote:
Originally Posted by N.I.B. View Post
TI got the death-stare from nearly everyone in rehearsal ...

... Didn't do much for my confidence though - made me play noticeably worse from my standpoint.
That says it all!
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Old 06-03-2011, 10:02 AM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mattsmith View Post
I play every week on a TV show for over a million people. We tape two shows a week with under rehearsed guest acts and have never been given the chance for a second take EVER. So obviously we do it Bo's way all the time. So far I've discovered that most of the ones who act supremely rude in live situations have substance abuse problems.

Then there's those Buddy Rich stories my dad likes to share from time to time lol.
We have a recording of Buddy floating around somewhere of him berating his band backstage or on the bus or something. I have to admit, at least he did it off stage (for the most part, right?). But I think guys like him are a different case - it's his band, he's paying the bills, everything goes his way, because the audience is paying to see him. With that in mind, I think it very professional that he doesn't fly off at the band during a performance. It's these in the middle people I have a problem with....
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Old 06-03-2011, 08:35 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

Great article.Those are examples are of clear professionalism and class,can never be overstated.In the first story,I think clearly that this "star"has some major self esteem problems,that she addresses by trying to make others feel as badly about themselves,as she does about herself.That guitar player handing her a rose was just perfect.

I have been in situations where the band I was in used employed both methods.Stopping the tune at the very beginning,making a joke out of it,and starting again,and just keep going and "if it sounded bad the first time,it will sound at least as bad when we do it again".I find though,that the latter, usually works better when playing original material.

Hey,its life..we all make mistakes in real time.Some we admit,some we say"who me?"

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Old 06-06-2011, 08:03 PM
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Default Re: When mistakes happen live.

hmm Grace under pressure, tricky. I get frustrated with the guys I play with (and I'm sure they get frustrated with me) the tempo gets pushed/pulled a lot, I used to adjust to keep pace with it but now I don't I stick to the tempo with grim determination, mainly because I'm concerned its to my detrement if I don't.

More to the point, I don't mind offering myself up as a sacrificial lamb but I don't want to forced onto that stone table.
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