Am I allergic to "2-down"?

Bo Eder

Bo Eder

Platinum Member
Looking at my Zep kit in all its aweseomness today, I thought I'd go back to what I was doing before I had it. I stripped it down, removed the 18" floor tom. Took away the two crashes. Put my 17" phat hats back up and kept the 24" ride.

An improvement was made and I enjoyed it alot more. Physically removing the 18" tom made a big difference - now I didn't feel compelled to keep using it whenever I took a fill. In fact, now it felt OK if I did a fill without using the remaining two toms.

I wonder if I'm just allergic to bigger kits in general because my mind opens up so much more when there are less pieces to use.

Don't get me wrong, I like having the option of going completely big when needed, but being able to make music with this small amount of gear is greatly satisfying - but I love it with the 26" bass drum.

I know alot of you here are on the quest for incorporating more, but don't really take that much out on a gig. I'm just playing what I would actually use on a gig in practice. Or has anyone here gradually taken pieces away? I remember my double bass adventure didn't last long either - it felt more comfortable when I took down three toms and left two.

Maybe practicality is bad for me. Maybe I'd get hired more if I just gave the client what they wanted to see regardless if I played it or not. I haven't done that yet ;)
 
I tend to use whats required for the gig. For example, I was doing a Woodstock show a couple of years ago, and with all the Santana, Who etc material it was easier to use my 6pc and rack with lots of cymbals and some electronics. Fast forward to NYE recently when I did a soul/r&b gig and I just went in with 4pc with hats, crash and a ride.

Personally, I enjoy the smaller kit. I think it feels a little more "intimate", if that makes sense.
 
Do what you're comfortable with. It's great to experiment. Try different things .... but only you decide what is really the perfect set up. Your "default". Nothing wrong with playing a 4 piece.​
Heck. My default set up is still my 13 and 16 on my right ..... my 18 on my left. No rack tom in the "traditional" position. My style suits this set up, and this set up suits my style.​
 
I usually put the larger FT on my L like Harry (think I did it after seeing your kit set up that way so many times) as it offers an option to go either way and play a low FT in between hits on 2 handed 16th notes (which is fun as hell). It also makes me feel less like the way you describe feeling- like there are 2 there and they must be used for some reason.

You have said yourself that the gear doesnt matter. I wonder if you are just in a stage where you prefer one set up? I say wait a couple months...
 
Toolate said:
I usually put the larger FT on my L like Harry (think I did it after seeing your kit set up that way so many times) as it offers an option to go either way and play a low FT in between hits on 2 handed 16th notes (which is fun as hell). It also makes me feel less like the way you describe feeling- like there are 2 there and they must be used for some reason.

You have said yourself that the gear doesnt matter. I wonder if you are just in a stage where you prefer one set up? I say wait a couple months...
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I suppose. I've always played a regular 4-piece. Even when I had a 2-up, 1-down kit, I eventually made it a 1-up/1-down kit. That phrase "There's so much you can do with just four drums" was so burned into me when I was young, especially seeing Buddy Rich live using his second floor tom as a drink holder. And then latching on to guys like Steve Jordan, David Garibaldi, and Charlie and Ringo at an impressionable age - I literally didn't understand the hoopla of the 'big kit' when I got those Slingerland and Ludwig catalogs in the mid-70s (although I probably did my fair share of lusting after the huge Octa-Plus kits - thinking more drums would make me a better player). I guess it was good growing up poor - I really learned how to play the bare minimum and make it work. It's just ironic that nowadays I can get whatever I want, but can't really fall in love with anything more than four-friggin' drums ;)

But I'll keep playing with that 18. It is really nice having this secondary big bottom end on the kit too. The 18 kinda' paid for itself on the first concerts this past weekend when I had to do several timpani type rolls and I went to the 18 everytime!

I wonder if it would be too weird seeing the big kit like that, but there's no cymbals?
 
One up, 2-down has never worked for me. I find that I get too caught up in going to the second floor tom, which seems like an unnatural position for me, away from the hats, rack tom, 1st floor, ride, and crash. It seems too "disconnected" and not comfortable, if that makes sense. 2-up, 1-down has never worked for me either, because it screws up the position where I prefer to put my ride cymbal.Double bass messes up the position of the hats and snare for me.

Right now I'm using a 1-up, one down four piece with three cymbals, but don't feel limited at all. The ergonomics seem so comfortable and perfect to me, and I have no need for more. I tried even stripping down to a three piece with no rack tom, but after two weeks, that felt way too limiting for me. I've used everything from just bass-snare-hats to a six piece double bass set with three rack toms. A traditional, single bass four piece seems to work best for me and the one I use the most.
 
It's funny what having those extra drums there does to your mind (and your playing), even if you don't use them.

For the most part, I have gone to a smaller kit because it is easier to haul around and fit on small stages. In fact, I only own a 4-piece currently. But when I had a bigger kit, I noticed that using different numbers of drums changed the feel of my playing, at least subjectively. Must be a psychological thing.

I actually DO like two down, but many local stages preclude it, so I just saved my $ when I bought my Ludwigs and went with one FT. I can play everything I need.
 
Bo Eder said:
I wonder if it would be too weird seeing the big kit like that, but there's no cymbals?
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I don't think this looks weird, and it's more than a 4 piece, so a 4 piece with 2, or just a ride and hats would seem fine to me.

Yes, a Steve Jordan influence (also Cindy Blackman).

Some years ago, I had it in my head that "one day" I wouldn't be afraid to leave everything else off I had been using, and go with 2 cymbals. Finally did it in '09 & I love it.
I use 3 cymbals usually, but I kinda don't want to use 3, it's just that the 22" 2002 sounds so dang good, I don't want to leave it out :)!

I finally got over feeling like I had to use at least one ft (snare tom, ft...) in a fill last year.
Now I'll do something, and it might just be the 18, or snare and the 12, or whatever. I don't know how I got that old idea out of my head, other than just doing something different, and not thinking about it.

Good luck!
 
The 2nd FT is there if, and when you need it.

In addition, its placement, and what is near it makes a huge difference. Mine is always in a position where hitting it is not a huge move. And if a fill or stunt finishes in that area, there are crashes nearby, as well as the 2nd HH and Ride.

My personal style requires that pitch. I use to have 3 FT''s
 
SirRimshot said:
The 2nd FT is there if, and when you need it.

In addition, its placement, and what is near it makes a huge difference. Mine is always in a position where hitting it is not a huge move. And if a fill or stunt finishes in that area, there are crashes nearby, as well as the 2nd HH and Ride.

My personal style requires that pitch. I use to have 3 FT''s
Click to expand...

I saw Tony Williams play his three floor toms once and I was impressed. Danny Seraphine is also playing three floors these days. But those guys have alot more to say than I do and they actually need them ;)
 
Never heard of "2-down" but I am highly allergic to ".05-back".
 
I find that second floor tom too hard to reach, too.

I should probably try it again one of these days. I've actually never set my current drums up that way. Part of the reason is I put different heads on my the drums I use for jazz, so my floor toms wouldn't match unless I replaced some of the heads.
 
Gotcha, Bo. I get confused with anything more than hats, snare and bass - oh heck, who am I kidding? I get confused enough no matter what!

Add extra instruments to the kit and their siren call creates an internal pressure in me - each bar and song that I don't play the extra toms (or splashes or cowbells) makes the urge a little more desperate lol
 
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