Possible future dilemma

larryace said:

I'll cut right to the chase and spare the details.
Would you cancel an already booked bar gig (with at least 4 weeks notice) if you got an opportunity to play a gig that is a few cuts above the bar gig with a much higher echelon of players?

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Yes. Especially with four weeks notice. People may look at this as a "loyalty" issue, but I say it's a "put yourself in the best light every chance you get" opportunity. Another way to look at is the old adage, "if you want to fly with eagles....." you know.

Larry, I'm routing for you here, but I'm pretty black & white on this. You've committed to this gig, you need to honor that. No subs, no excuses. Illness or some other unforseen event is a different thing, but breaking a personal "contract" on the basis of something better coming along is a huge no no for me. Rightly or wrongly, you've already had loyalty expectation issues with your rock band guitarist, so this would be pulling his string big time. In my opinion, he/they'd be right to be pissed, I would be. In taking this other gig above one you've already contracted to do, you're essentially saying to your rock band, "guys, I'm here with you until something better comes along". How would you expect them to react to that? I know I'd be looking for someone else next day. There is a wider long term issue here too Larry, your credibility as a reliable player who conducts himself honorably within the business.

Now, on the other side of things, what you do with your time when not contracted to work with the rock band is entirely your affair & non of their business. If they're threatened by that, tough crap, the decision is taken for you, & you've walked away with dignity & reputation intact. So, the question is, how valuable is this rock band to you?

My gut feeling is you're a blues player through & through. Not only do you clearly excell in the genre, it's also your passion & source of greatest pleasure. I'd go to the blues band leader and explain the position with your rock band, tell him you'd like to play in his band for every gig, tell him if that was on the table that you'd consider leaving your rock band to allow that to happen, but would need the security of knowing you had the gig as a permanent band member. If he values you as a player, you're essentially asking him for a reciprocal commitment. Use that leverage respectfully, & if you get that deal, then leave the rock band.

Choices choices, I know, but sometimes you need to take one step back to take two steps forward. You know your motivations Larry, so go with what floats your boat, but you can't have your cake & eat it!

this is a toughy, but if it were me i'd honor my previous commitment. the only way i ever back out of a gig is if i'm very sick or injured or something of that magnitude. if fact, just yesterday i had to say no to a gig opportunity with some other guys i really, really want to get together with because their gig conflicted with one from my main band. i told them to please consider me for future gigs, but that was the best i could do for now.

having said that, i would still pursue this opportunity. if it turns out that they want you to actually join their band then i wouldn't see a problem with quitting your current band and joining that band. that kind of thing happens all the time. i also wouldn't see any issue with playing gigs with them that don't conflict with your current band's gigs. a lot of people juggle multiple bands by being careful about scheduling.

Do it Larry!

Yeah, Yeah, there's the "already comitted" issue but 4 weeks is plenty of notice and besides you know if you turn down offers they quit coming.

The only honorable thing to do is to make good on my word regarding my already booked gigs. I have my reputation to consider. Like I said, this scenario hasn't happened yet, but I really feel it will eventually. If it comes to a point where I have to pick one band over the other, then I will cross that bridge when I get to it. I am clear on this now, thank you for letting me bounce this off you. It's great because I feel like I have a board of advisors in you people.

quote-but breaking a personal "contract" on the basis of something better coming along is a huge no no for me... "guys, I'm here with you until something better comes along".-quote

Isn't this what we all do and wait for. If not we would all still be playing with the garage bands we started with in high school.

quote-,,, I'd go to the blues band leader and explain the position with your rock band, tell him you'd like to play in his band for every gig, tell him if that was on the table that you'd consider leaving your rock band to allow that to happen, but would need the security of knowing you had the gig as a permanent band member.-quote

I agree with you on this one though. It's a good idea and a possible way to secure something with the new group before you quit your group and this guy only uses you on one gig. Remember though; this is business and peoples feelings are going to get hurt no matter what happens. You can't make everybody happy, but there is nothing wrong with making yourself happy in the process.

ineedaclutch said:

Isn't this what we all do and wait for. If not we would all still be playing with the garage bands we started with in high school.

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That doesn't mean you should be dishonorable and break your current agreements with your group that's counting on you. Maybe I've just been unlucky, but playing with subs kinda sucks, it's simply not the same as rocking with the group that's painstakingly practiced together and worked on little issues as they come up. Sticking the band with a sub when you could easily play the show you committed to, simply because you'd rather do something else is just wrong in my book. If a band member pulled that with us, we wouldn't trust them anymore to be at the gigs they say they will, and resentments would certainly ensue.

Some guys will always ditch their girl the moment a prettier one comes along and bats her eyes. Other guys understand that there's a lot more to integrity and commitment than just selfishness; relationships both band and personal should be about more than just furthering your own wants.

At the same time, if you're not really happy with a relationship, the honest thing to do, is, well, be honest. Tell them that you're not totally committed to that band or relationship so they can find someone who will be. Don't just string them along until something better catches your eye.

Dr_Watso said:

That doesn't mean you should be dishonorable and break your current agreements with your group that's counting on you. Maybe I've just been unlucky, but playing with subs kinda sucks, it's simply not the same as rocking with the group that's painstakingly practiced together and worked on little issues as they come up. Sticking the band with a sub when you could easily play the show you committed to, simply because you'd rather do something else is just wrong in my book. If a band member pulled that with us, we wouldn't trust them anymore to be at the gigs they say they will, and resentments would certainly ensue.

Some guys will always ditch their girl the moment a prettier one comes along and bats her eyes. Other guys understand that there's a lot more to integrity and commitment than just selfishness; relationships both band and personal should be about more than just furthering your own wants.

At the same time, if you're not really happy with a relationship, the honest thing to do, is, well, be honest. Tell them that you're not totally committed to that band or relationship so they can find someone who will be. Don't just string them along until something better catches your eye.

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I agree. I am not telling him to ditch his group a day before the gig. He has a month to find a sub. Also, this sounds like a long term opportunity. If it is not then forget it. Not worth pissing everyone off to do one gig. It sounds like he would be happier with the new group if they will have him. I would just like to see him and everyone else on this forum in a situation they feel good in and stop putting off their good times to appease other people.

I think its a sign of your integrity that you're conflicted about the situation,which says a lot about you..I think a lot of guys in your situation would follow the money ,which I assume is better.

I can't even begin to tell you what to do,since I don't nor do I want to know your financial and family situation.I feel very strongly about comittment,yet there are times when you have to take that leap of faith,and follow your gut,loyalty be damned.If your other band are your friends,they may be pissed at first,but they will come around,and stand with you.Treu friends stand with you,while all others run away.You can't take care of others unless you take care of you once in a while.I learned that the hard way.Good luck.

Steve B

larryace said:

I'll cut right to the chase and spare the details.
Would you cancel an already booked bar gig (with at least 4 weeks notice) if you got an opportunity to play a gig that is a few cuts above the bar gig with a much higher echelon of players?

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With 4 weeks notice finding a sub should be easy. Do you know a good player who can cover your gig?

I would tell the guys in the band that this is a tremendous opportunity for growth and will help your drumming. With 4 weeks notice they'd be a bit unreasonable not to allow it. be careful not to search for reasons not to do it.

larryace said:

I'm not sure if he would even like his name mentioned here. You would think that the more exposure the better right, but he never acts like I would expect him too. The reason I say that is because one time I gave recordings of him and I and 2 others, to one of the 2 others. He was not happy. I asked him why he wasn't happy. I said but dude, you play so effing hot, what is the issue? He said that's not how he wants to be remembered. Whatever that means. It was for this other guys personal use.

He's one of these guys who makes you think like your a kid and he's all grown up. He's not easy to infiltrate, you have to be a good player, or he will silently (and sometimes not so silently) look down on you. He's an education for sure and I mean that completely in a musically and intellectually respectful way.
Timm, I will post a sampling of this particular 3 piece in a later thread.
Thanks for listening.

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I get why, after saying some not-so-flattering things about him here in your above post, that you'd be hesitant to say his name, but I'd asked who he was before you posted this...! (And I know you weren't trying to slam him, just saying your take on his personality within your working relationship with him.)

I just wanna look up his work. Other than your post above, if he's a performing/recording artist, why wouldn't he want someone who's interested to look into his work? It's not the same as a demo recording- I wanna check out official releases, if he has any.

Can you PM me his info so I can listen to his tunes?

Dilemma yes, but in a good way. Being that I have been doing this for quite some time now and I know my time is limitied and approaching way too fast I would have to go with taking the better gig or actually the gig that you feel would better suit you or please you. Some opportunities only come around once in a lifetime and you have to jump on that train. I guess you need to ask your bandmates what would they do if they were in your shoes and they had a similar opportunity. It would appear that this would not be an on going situation or occurence. So you have to cancel a gig at a smaller venue, find a sub for yourself or find a sub band. Some things just cannot be helped and it sounds like this is a good opportunity for you. If you and your current band have a good rep in the area and if you have a good working relationship with your band it should not even be an issue. Good luck, just know for your own piece of mind that whatever decision you make that it is in fact the right decision...