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  #1  
Old 04-04-2018, 07:34 PM
MasterBlaster
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Default MB's Random Question Thread

As a guitar player who's always loved percussion but never really had a kit before until now, I have a lot to learn and many questions. Before I ask I always search first but I don't always find an answer.

When that happens I'd rather just ask in this thread instead of derailing another or starting a new thread. I hope that's OK.

My first question is about cymbal packs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
Does anyone have any thoughts on that Bonham cymbal pack?
Am I crazy for wanting that? Is it overkill for a hobbyist like myself? Should I be more reserved and get something like this instead?

Oh, and I'm a serious hobbiest... money isn't really (so to speak) a problem and I plan to build my kit over time.
  #2  
Old 04-04-2018, 07:45 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

If you're doing zepp cover band work then I'd say sure.

Otherwise I'd say don't be lazy and put together a cymbal set based on your own personal experience with each cymbal you demoed yourself. Keep your mind open but do also a bit of research on the different types of cymbals and the sorts of sounds you want to go for.

If someone is really gung ho about buying a set of cymbals, I usually recommend the literal middle of the road standard A's. They'll work for the most ranges of stuff and nobody will dislike the sounds.
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  #3  
Old 04-04-2018, 07:53 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

It can be a long, long journey hunting for cymbals. If I were to start again, I would start with a good complementary set of hats and ride - the heart of your setup.
Cymbal packs seem a great deal, but you may find yourself confined to one sound with all the "matchy-ness" of them, or one of the cymbals doesn't work for you.
If money is no object, then you could get either set and sell them on if your tastes change.
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  #4  
Old 04-04-2018, 08:02 PM
MasterBlaster
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Believe me, I have no problem selling what I'm not happy with. I'm already on my 2nd kit, and I'm already ready to sell it so I can upgrade again.

I was just hoping a nice (read expensive) pack would be a quick way to satisfy my immediate needs. I didn't realize I was being lazy.

So the Bonham pack is just for huge sound? I can't use a deft touch when necessary?
  #5  
Old 04-04-2018, 08:27 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

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Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
So the Bonham pack is just for huge sound? I can't use a deft touch when necessary?
IMO, the bright, big 2002s work well for Zeppelin because of the way the kit was recorded, and the aggressive guitar sounds. It's just too bright a cymbal sound for anything but heavy rock (Zeppelin, 80s hair metal, Tool, etc.). More recently, heavy rock and metal drummers are favoring a somewhat darker, trashier, more complex cymbal sound.

What sort of music will you be playing in the next couple of years? What is instrumentation and sonic palate of the bands? Answer those questions, and the sort of cymbals you should buy becomes clearer.
  #6  
Old 04-04-2018, 08:32 PM
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As of now I only play with myself - no plans of ever being in a band other than jamming with friends at my house.

But I want the best.

I actually don't know WHAT type of cymbal sound I want. I just want it to sound AWESOME.

I guess I like rock, a lot of country.... and jazz? Not sure yet...
  #7  
Old 04-04-2018, 08:52 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
I actually don't know WHAT type of cymbal sound I want. I just want it to sound AWESOME.
Great answer! I dont think this is lazy at all. That cymbal pack is definitely going to sound Awesome. I would play Paistes if I could, but I tend to break them more than others, so I play other cymbals I like instead. I am really a fan of the Paiste Sigs, but the 2002's are killer. I think a cymbal pack is an excellent way to start. You can build on it from there and find what works and doesnt work for you. Plenty of non-rock drummers play Paistes, and they work well with a hard of soft touch. Its up to you to play them appropriately.

I will say that is a lot of scratch for a set of cymbals, but if you have it to spend you might as well get the best.
  #8  
Old 04-04-2018, 08:59 PM
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I do NOT plan to die with a ton of money in the bank.

I want it in my living room.
  #9  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:00 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
As of now I only play with myself - no plans of ever being in a band other than jamming with friends at my house.

But I want the best.

I actually don't know WHAT type of cymbal sound I want. I just want it to sound AWESOME.

I guess I like rock, a lot of country.... and jazz? Not sure yet...
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...yABEgLcc_D_BwE

These might be more up your alley! A darker, more modern sound, with larger sizes. You might not dig the 20" Crash Ride, but you can use it as a large crash and add a different ride, or sell it and replace the cymbal with something more your style.
  #10  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:05 PM
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Default Interesting

What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
  #11  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:07 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

If the Bonham cymbal pack floats your boat, go for it.

I went through many cymbals after I first started but couldn't find anything that floated said boat. Then one day I came across an 18" Giant Beat. Wow! I built the rest of my cymbals around that. Now it's Paiste 18 & 20 Giant Beats with Paiste 2002 20" ride and 15" Sound Edge hi-hats. Pretty Bonhamesque but they work for a lot of different music.
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  #12  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:12 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmulcahy1 View Post
If the Bonham cymbal pack floats your boat, go for it.

I went through many cymbals after I first started but couldn't find anything that floated said boat. Then one day I came across an 18" Giant Beat. Wow! I built the rest of my cymbals around that. Now it's Paiste 18 & 20 Giant Beats with Paiste 2002 20" ride and 15" Sound Edge hi-hats. Pretty Bonhamesque but they work for a lot of different music.
I did the same with the 20" AAXplosion. It is the basis of my entire cymbal setup and everything else is bought to complement its sound.
  #13  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:13 PM
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Default Re: Interesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
If you use it for country.

In all seriousness, probably a modern sounding bright cymbal in the rock vein.
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  #14  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:14 PM
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Default Re: Interesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
It's in line with what the Nashville guys are playing these days. Which means, not a heavy, pingy hunk of metal -- something thinner and lighter with more "wash".

A thinner ride would also lend itself well to jazz, if you decide to travel that trail.
  #15  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:17 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

The Paiste 2002 line of cymbals are great. They are very bright and perfect for rock. A little more expensive than other cymbal packs but well worth the extra money. I've been using them for the past couple of years and love em.
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  #16  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:18 PM
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When I want to tax myself, I'll attempt to play along to some jazz.

It's not very pretty.
  #17  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:19 PM
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Default Re: Interesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
Along the same lines. What do you call a rock drummer with a gig?

A country drummer. ;)
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  #18  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:20 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Freddy View Post
The Paiste 2002 line of cymbals are great.
Wait - so, on top of everything else, I have to concern myself over when they were made? Really???



Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Freddy View Post
Along the same lines. What do you call a rock drummer with a gig?

A country drummer. ;)
My buddy feels the same way. He's a rocker, but country pays the bills.
  #19  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:24 PM
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Default Re: Interesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
The pitch, amount of wash, and note duration/decay.

When you think of country, you have bass, guitar, banjo, fiddle, pedal steel, and two vocals working 3rds and 4ths. In theory, the country pack is made to avoid stepping on the parts of the spectrum occupied by these other instruments. In reality, it's just a bunch of guesswork to make the cymbals fit into the most common use cases of the genre.

So it's basically a marketing label with a halfhearted, but well intentioned, implementation.
  #20  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:30 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
Wait - so, on top of everything else, I have to concern myself over when they were made? Really???
What do you mean "when they were made?" I don't understand.
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  #21  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:33 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
Wait - so, on top of everything else, I have to concern myself over when they were made? Really???
No no no. Bonham played 2002s back in the 70s. Paiste has made them all this time, and Paiste is known for its consistency.

Quote:
But I want the best.
All the cymbal companies make entry-level crap, and all the companies make professional, top-tier models. 2002s are certainly in the professional level, although other Paiste models are more expensive. But the difference is subjective at this point.

Is there really nowhere you can go to try out some these cymbals? The difference between 2002s and Zildjian K's is pretty stark.
  #22  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:34 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
Wait - so, on top of everything else, I have to concern myself over when they were made? Really???
Yeah, better get the Paiste 2018's, not the 2002's-just kidding.
  #23  
Old 04-04-2018, 09:41 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
As a guitar player who's always loved percussion but never really had a kit before until now, I have a lot to learn and many questions. Before I ask I always search first but I don't always find an answer.

When that happens I'd rather just ask in this thread instead of derailing another or starting a new thread. I hope that's OK.

My first question is about cymbal packs.




Am I crazy for wanting that? Is it overkill for a hobbyist like myself? Should I be more reserved and get something like this instead?

Oh, and I'm a serious hobbiest... money isn't really (so to speak) a problem and I plan to build my kit over time.



Flip it, some drummer tells you they're a hobbiest, they want a guitar, they're considering a Randy Rhoads model.










Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
As of now I only play with myself - no plans of ever being in a band other than jamming with friends at my house.

But I want the best.

I actually don't know WHAT type of cymbal sound I want. I just want it to sound AWESOME.

I guess I like rock, a lot of country.... and jazz? Not sure yet...



Youtube cymbals, listen, go to stores. Cymbals are also a 'feel' like guitar strings.

Heavy= louder, longer to respond, harder on the hands, takes more effort, not recommended for the living room.


If I were to just throw out advice on a cymbal set for a living room hobbiest money no object, I'd have no problem suggesting ZILDJIAN K SWEET crashes and rides and HH


Just like a guitar, think about resale. Would a first time guitar player have an easy time recouping their investment on a RRoads guitar?
  #24  
Old 04-04-2018, 10:34 PM
MasterBlaster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmulcahy1 View Post
What do you mean "when they were made?" I don't understand.
This.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Freddy View Post
The Paiste 2002 line of cymbals are great.
What's special about that year?
  #25  
Old 04-04-2018, 10:40 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
This.

What's special about that year?
Only that it's the best year of cymbal production in the last five centuries!!

Like fine wine, for example a bottle of 1945 Mouton Rothschild. Only now, is it ready to enjoy.







;-)
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  #26  
Old 04-04-2018, 11:00 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
This.



What's special about that year?
Gotta be trolling at this point, which I'm all for. If not, 2002 is the brand label of that line and it has nothing to do with a date.
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  #27  
Old 04-04-2018, 11:28 PM
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A Pioneer Member trolling? Really?
  #28  
Old 04-04-2018, 11:45 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

A "Country" cymbal?

(Bwhahahahahahaha)

Excuse me?
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  #29  
Old 04-05-2018, 01:01 AM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

http://www.paiste.com/e/cymbalsoverv...ily&menuid=255
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  #30  
Old 04-05-2018, 02:14 AM
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So it's just the name of a series? Ha, cool.
  #31  
Old 04-05-2018, 06:45 AM
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Well as much as I want to get the primo pack, I think I might go ahead and settle on this pack instead. If I got that I wouldn't have to wait near as long.

Does anyone have anything good or bad to say about this cheaper line? Are they too cheap and sound like crap? From what I've gleaned the A lines are supposed to be OK cymbals.
  #32  
Old 04-05-2018, 08:26 AM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

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Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
From what I've gleaned the A lines are supposed to be OK cymbals.
Both the Zildjian A's and the A Customs are extremely popular. And Watso mentioned them (A's), in his first post, so there's that.
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  #33  
Old 04-05-2018, 03:49 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

I started with the Paiste 2002 Medium crashes, but ended up gravitating to the Paiste 2002 Thin crashes
  #34  
Old 04-05-2018, 04:19 PM
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So basically, the thicker the cymbal, the louder it is???
  #35  
Old 04-05-2018, 04:42 PM
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Default Re: Interesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
What makes a cymbal a "country" cymbal???
The same thing that makes Gospel Cymbals, gospel cymbals. Marketing and people gullible enough to fall for it.
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  #36  
Old 04-05-2018, 04:56 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

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Originally Posted by MasterBlaster View Post
So basically, the thicker the cymbal, the louder it is???
Sounds like someone's never played a cymbal...
  #37  
Old 04-05-2018, 05:09 PM
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What's your point, brother?

The only two cymbals I've ever really played are the two crappy ones my friend loaned me.

So yes - you are correct - I'm no expert. Thanks for pointing that out!

Last edited by MasterBlaster; 04-05-2018 at 05:32 PM.
  #38  
Old 04-05-2018, 05:15 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

The Zildjian A's will be great cymbals for you. I seriously doubt that you won't like them. Probably at least half the drummers in the world have these cymbals... and for good reason.
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  #39  
Old 04-05-2018, 05:36 PM
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Thanks, Mitch. I'm gonna go ahead and order those so I can move on to my next purchases - a rack and 2 more toms.

Then I'll move on to those specialty cymbals!
  #40  
Old 04-05-2018, 05:43 PM
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Default Re: MB's Random Question Thread

You may want to order medium weight cymbals or lighter as the others will take a lot to open up in your home.
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