Recording Kit vs Live Kit?

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Most of the time it's just for practical reasons.

A touring drummer's kit is in cases, in the bands truck/warehouse, ready for the next show, Diverting the truck, unpacking everything, and such often isn't worth it if the drummer has a 2nd kit that can be used.

Guys who do a lot of sessions and live work, like Kenny Arnoff, have drum kits in different cities ready to record, and other kits in road cases ready for the next tour. It's easier to fly him to his various drum kits than it is to ship said drum kits all around the country.

If the recording session is to take place in a particular out of town studio, it might be easier to rent a kit there than ship a drum kit to that location.

Certain producers are used to working with particular drum kits, and will insist the drummer use the set the producer wants over their own.

Now that studio work is more leaning toward guys who have their own studios, they just leave a kit in their studio, mic-ed up and ready to record, and have a 2nd kit of live work. It saves a lot of time not having to re-set up the studio for every session.

Outside of the practical matters, when recording, the concept is to get the best drum sound for that song, which may mean switching up drum kits. While live, the concept is to get the best drum sound that works for the entire show.
 
I have a DW kit that's my "recording kit". Quite frankly, the reason is because 2 of the engineers I work for have been blinded by the DW marketing light. Even if I think that a different kit would work better for a particular session, they always insist that I bring my DWs.
 
What if you were to put a DW front head on a Ludwig bass drum? Would that fool them??
 
What if you were to put a DW front head on a Ludwig bass drum? Would that fool them??

Hee hee...probably! And, they'd say, "Wow! I like THIS kit better than your old DW kit..."


Why is it that sometimes one kit is played to record with, and a different model kit is used to play live with?

Probably the main reason is because when you play live you want drums that project, and when you record, you often don't want drums that project in the studio (it causes additional bleedover in the other mics).
 
Outside of the practical matters, when recording, the concept is to get the best drum sound for that song, which may mean switching up drum kits. While live, the concept is to get the best drum sound that works for the entire show.

Along those lines, playing in the studio is usually different than performing live, and many drums react differently, some being better suited for particular volume ranges. For example, my new Keystones are great drums for hitting hard in concert, but wouldn't really be suited for a gentle pop song. Just like my Legacies sound sweet at quiet-moderate volume, but really don't work as well when being hit hard.

I have a DW kit that's my "recording kit". Quite frankly, the reason is because 2 of the engineers I work for have been blinded by the DW marketing light. Even if I think that a different kit would work better for a particular session, they always insist that I bring my DWs.

Funny, I've never been asked "do you have a DW kit?" or "can you get a DW kit?" or "would you mind using our DW kit?"

Bermuda
 
Why is it ... one kit is played to record with... and a different kit to play live with?
Bonham, probably one of the most famous of "those" guys .... he liked the sound of his Luddy 3 ply kit, for studio use ... but of course ... went on to make most famous the Amber Vistalite kit, and then later, the Stainless kit ....​
Especially, I think, with the "arena rock gawd kits" it happened/happens a lot. All one really has to do is look at a guy like Ross Garfield - Drum Doctors, legendary for studio drum sound ....​
 
My experimental kit is developed specifically for work under microphones. The design concentrates on shell tone and a resolved near field sound. It has full wooden hoops to accentuate the overall effect, & will spend most of it's life fitted with coated batter heads. It's also set up differently. There's no cymbals over the toms. This allows meaningful overhead involvement in the tom sound. My gigging kit has clear heads, & is set up for projection, sustain & attack. The physical layout is designed for speed of setup/breakdown, ease of close micing, & minimal stage footprint.
 
No, he was right, I've heard plenty of ppl prefer DW to record with

I'm sure Caddywumpus is right, on the other hand Bermuda is a professional recording and touring drummer with nearly thirty years experience, so it's entirely possible that the engineers Caddywumpus has worked with aren't half as good as those Bermuda has worked with.
 
I'm sure Caddywumpus is right, on the other hand Bermuda is a professional recording and touring drummer with nearly thirty years experience, so it's entirely possible that the engineers Caddywumpus has worked with aren't half as good as those Bermuda has worked with.

Let's not forget that many engineers and drummers hear with their eyes. They see a DW badge or logo on the head, and suddenly the drums are better. For some it's Ludwig, or Gretsch, or Yamaha, etc., but perceptions carry tremendous weight.

And that's how the drum companies want it. DW in particular has gone to great lengths to place that logo in as many performing situations as possible, and it's worked.

I'm not saying that engineers can't tell the difference between one drum and another, or that DW's don't sound good. But many have those two initials so ingrained in their psyche, that it's easiest and least-confrontational for them to know there's a DW kit to work with.

As for me working with better engineers, I think it's more about me working in Los Angeles for those 35+ years, half of that prior to DW becoming widely known. Those engineers have heard a lot of drums and aren't locked-into one brand. Of course a few of the older guys are, they love the early '70s Ludwig drums. So maybe it's not so different?

Bermuda
 
Let's not forget that many engineers and drummers hear with their eyes. They see a DW badge or logo on the head, and suddenly the drums are better. For some it's Ludwig, or Gretsch, or Yamaha, etc., but perceptions carry tremendous weight.

And that's how the drum companies want it. DW in particular has gone to great lengths to place that logo in as many performing situations as possible, and it's worked.

I'm not saying that engineers can't tell the difference between one drum and another, or that DW's don't sound good. But many have those two initials so ingrained in their psyche, that it's easiest and least-confrontational for them to know there's a DW kit to work with.

As for me working with better engineers, I think it's more about me working in Los Angeles for those 35+ years, half of that prior to DW becoming widely known. Those engineers have heard a lot of drums and aren't locked-into one brand. Of course a few of the older guys are, they love the early '70s Ludwig drums. So maybe it's not so different?

Bermuda

I think you're probably absolutely right. I know which kits I like and which I don't and I'm full of biases myself. With that said, you'd hope that the very best engineers really were using their ears and not their eyes.

With that said, it's very rare that a kit isn't capable of excelling in both roles as both a live kit and a recorded kit. Some kits are better suited to recording and sound better on record, but a good set of drums is a good set of drums. The best approach for anybody without the disposable income or professional contact is to buy the best kit they can afford and then tweak the set to specific situations, rather than trying to buy a kit with a specific function in mind. Above a certain level and you end up with diminishing returns and the difference in absolute terms between a top-level kit designed for recording and one designed for live use (at least in the mainstream) is relatively small. I'm sure your Keystones do sound good on record, Bermuda, but you have other options too.

When you get to Andy's level of specialism, it's a different ball game. That kit is designed for one thing and one thing only and I expect it to sound stellar.
 
When you get to Andy's level of specialism, it's a different ball game. That kit is designed for one thing and one thing only and I expect it to sound stellar.
Not so sure about that Ducan. The development has thrown a few curved balls, but you should expect that when pushing the boundries. I'm recording with it this coming week. I've had to make a lot of temporary modifications, so it's not going to be at optimum performace. Actually, far from it. Add to that, it's a cheapo local demo studio & limited time, I may well be setting myself up for a fall. Both tracks require a fat sound too, so that won't be to everyone's liking.

Perhaps I should just use a DW, lol!
 
I have faith, Andy! Faith! I'm not a man of faith...
 
it's entirely possible that the engineers Caddywumpus has worked with aren't half as good as those Bermuda has worked with.

I've managed to remain anonymous on this forum, so I'll go ahead and verify this statement to be true without fear of it hurting anyone's reputation/business. Yes, they aren't the most experienced engineers in the world, and I usually teach them a thing or three while I do sessions for them. The money is good, though, and the projects turn out okay, so I don't mind.

Let's not forget that many engineers and drummers hear with their eyes. They see a DW badge or logo on the head, and suddenly the drums are better. For some it's Ludwig, or Gretsch, or Yamaha, etc., but perceptions carry tremendous weight.

And that's how the drum companies want it. DW in particular has gone to great lengths to place that logo in as many performing situations as possible, and it's worked.

I'm not saying that engineers can't tell the difference between one drum and another, or that DW's don't sound good. But many have those two initials so ingrained in their psyche, that it's easiest and least-confrontational for them to know there's a DW kit to work with.

As for me working with better engineers, I think it's more about me working in Los Angeles for those 35+ years, half of that prior to DW becoming widely known. Those engineers have heard a lot of drums and aren't locked-into one brand. Of course a few of the older guys are, they love the early '70s Ludwig drums. So maybe it's not so different?

Bermuda

Bingo. My whole point is that basically the same...the engineers/producers I work with are blinded by the DW hype as well. Unfortunate, but true. When I've tried to convince them to let me bring in a different kit because it would sound better for the project (like, say, bringing in my vintage Ludwigs for a classic rock session...), they. just. want. the. DWs. It's been an ongoing joke between me and a couple of friends that they are actually hiring my kit and graciously allowing me to cart them/set them up/play them. Like I've said before, the whole situation is silly, but the money is good, and despite the obvious flaw in the engineers' mindsets, they are a great group of people to work with--really nice, positive, easy to get along with and great to work with...
 
Hm. I'm a HUGE fan of DW, but I certainly wouldn't limit anyone to using them only.

I can def see why players would use diff kits to record & perform with though now.
 
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