Jeremy Bender
Platinum Member
What type of music do you want to play? That will have a great bearing on the road you need to follow. Until you determine that answer, you might just be pissing up a rope.
Play as much as you can, anyplace you can. And charge for your services!! Don't do anything for free...
What type of music do you want to play? That will have a great bearing on the road you need to follow. Until you determine that answer, you might just be pissing up a rope.
Nick - if you actually launched your career follow that last bit of advice - you will be the first I've ever heard of.
My take on this - The Three Rules
Three things can happen when you play out -
1. You make money
2. You play some music that's challenging, worthwhile to your growth as a player, or because it's truly important/enjoyable to you.
3. You'll be getting the opportunity to meet, and expose to your playing, people/players that can helpful to furthering your career.
Put simpler -
1. Money
2. Art
3. Networking
When starting out, try to make every time you venture out to play meet one of the rules.
As your schedule fills up (and this can awhile), start going for two at a time.
IMO it is impossible to do this long term without feeding all three of these.
And an important hint - starting out #1 is by far the least important.
David
Unless playing music is your source of income.
Mike
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So it really doesn't matter how much one wants or needs music to be the source of their income or believes it should be, or thinks its just a matter of deciding or demanding that it be that way - without a large amount of investment in networking, getting exposure, and making contacts, it ain't gonna happen.
David
Definitely agree with you on this point. However, the argument you martialed was aimed at putting art before income. Art versus income will always be inversely proportional and I can name several well-known drummers who did put income before art and are now able to pretty much take the projects that they want - Gregg Bissonette for one. He went for the DLR gig and it pretty much gave him the opportunity to showcase that he was for real! And even that album, as trite as some people think of it kicks butt musically.
Kenny Aronoff is another as well as Terry Bozzio (Missing Persons) and Vinnie Colauita (Sting). Steve Smith is yet another - did he have any success after Journey. Sure, but it was the playing in Journey which gave him the finances to go on after Journey and let the drumming world know that he didn't need Journey. What a great place to be!
So my point is, that by being the so-called sell-out, these guys did very well for themselves and did indeed, eventually get to create art down the road. So many musicians don't get this - when you are starting out, you generally do have to make compromises until you get a reputation established as being easy to work with and pliable enough to do it someone's else's way.
Case in point - the song "She's Too Good For Me" by Sting on the Ten Summoners' Tales disc. Vinnie said that the way the band initially played this song was far different than what was to become that song. The band played in a fusion style and the producer said no. The song was to be a rockabily style. Did Vinnie get pissed off and say "Well, I didn't get to throw in all of my Gospel/R&B chops and put my "I'm try to sound like Carter Beauford" stamp on it?
No.
He handled it like a professional and completed the project, went on tour with Sting and eventually had the finances to put out his very own material, one which Sting also played!
Mike
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Mike -
But Mike, you took the short form version of #2 on my list of three things - "Art" - instead of the full version written above it, which was -
"#2 - You play some music that's challenging, worthwhile to your growth as a player, or because it's truly important/enjoyable to you."
Plus you seem to be saying that ART equals Fusion, jazz, busy-chops-type-music - and not pop, country, ballads, etc. which is not what I'm saying at all. When I wrote "music that's challenging and worthwhile to your playing" - I meant any and all music, styles and genres that fits that description, for each particular player.
My point was that going out to play purely for the sake of your musical growth and experience is an important and worthwhile endeavor regardless of whether it pays money or not. And I would say "particularly when you're starting out", but honestly I've found it to be pretty important throughout my career.
But starting out - it is essential - as I spoke to in my last post. If the best blues guys in town get together on Sunday nights to blow and they need a drummer, any drummer starting out that was free on that Sunday would be a fool to hesitate about showing up for that simply because it was a "freebie". That's what I mean by going out to work on the "Art". I'm talking about going out to work on, gain experience at and get better at the Art of Drumming... and I mean the Art of Drumming as a whole.
So no, my point wasn't that Money vs. Art is the equivalent of commercial vs. non-commercial. Not at all. And it certainly has nothing to do with what constitutes being a sell out. Which quite honestly is a concept I've never subscribed to in any way, shape or form.
I simply don't subscribe to the notion that Art = Non-commercial. Or vice versa.
Anyway, I hope that explains things better. Sorry for the confusion.
David
Points well made, David. Many musicians term "ART" as being jazz, fusion and look down their noses at the meat and potatoes mainstream areas. And you quite correctly stated that a young, inexperienced drummer should go out and play - he can study books all he wants and practice by himself but that drummer needs to go out and get the dirt on his playing. Jam nights tend to be a good area do just that but are poorly frequented by young players.
No problem - I see where you are coming from!
Mike
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To be fair, DED, it seems like he's a bit burnt out by formal education. I've not been to music school but formal education does has a knack for turning the most fascinating things into a chore. The approach they take is logical - give people the technical stuff they need and not impose on the subjective side (ie. the fun stuff) - but it's a real drag for kinaesthetic learners.