Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensitive??

Keystone

Member
Can someone spell this out for me what is the difference? I was leaning towards a Supra Phonic, due to it being the most recorded snare ever and that's what I would use it for.
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

Technically, "supraphonic" is really the type of snares and strainer on the drum. But, most of the time when someone refers to a "supraphonic", they're usually talking about the ludaloy/aluminum 400 or 402 version. They do come in brass and bronze versions though. The supersensitive ones have the really complicated snare mechanisms with the extended snares, and are quite a bit more expensive than the regular supraphonics. Unless you're playing concert snare, or really light jazz, I would just stay with the supra. The black beauties are a black anodized seamless brass shell, although some of the vintage ones were bronze.
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

Thats the kind of spelling out I was looking for.....Awesome!
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

Ludwigs 400 series, the best snares available, IMHO.
Supraphonic refers to a seamless spun, beaded shell, with round bearing edges, and deep wide snare beds. This combination of specs, makes them unique in sound, very easy to tune, the snare wire adjustment is a very straight forward process, and its the snare drum design almost every other company have tried to copy or imitate, in one way or another.

The Ludwig 404, is the infamous Acrolite, once marketed as a student snare drum, capable of outperform drums hundreds and thousands of dollars more expensive.
It has a wider tuning range, due to the fact that it sports 8 lugs instead of 10, and the less contact with the shell, makes a more open resonant sound, preferred by many, including myself, a more organic sound with more ring, and more space to breathe.
They were ionized ,with an unpainted unrestricted shell, and thinner hoops from 1963 to 1980, what gave them a unique tone, and openness, that many are after. In 1980, they added thicker hoops and in 1984 they went with a powder coating paint in gray finish, which compared with the ionized ones, plus the thicker hoops, gave them a more chocked, less resonant sound.
The newer ones are Black Galaxy finished, their hardware is imported and sound different from the old ones, not worst, just different.

The Supraphonic 400 and 402, are the same shell as the Acro, but with 10 lugs, thicker hoops and chrome plated, factors that gives them a more bright, controlled ,less ringy, wetter sound, they are the Main snare for many of the Greatest of all time, including Ringo, Bonzo, Joe Morello, Gadd, to mention a few. the 400 is 5 deep, the 402 is 6.5.

Those are the most recorded, most used snare drums in music history. Their versatility and sound are legendary.
Its the classic snare sound we carry in our heads as the perfect snare drum sound. There is a chance that , the tune you are listening in the radio right now, that snare sound comes from a Ludwig from the 400's series.

Ludwig has been making snares since 1909, and they all were Brass, rolled and welded, but in 1963 they went with this Ludaloy, which is a mix of Aluminum and Zinc, for economic reasons, it turned out the Ludaloy sounded great, and those snares ruled studios and stages for decades. They went seamless also by that time, and the Supraphonic was borne.

Aluminum does not like to be chromed, it will react with the chrome and the pitting and flaking will start, its not a matter of if, its a matter of when. To see a pitted Supra is very common, and their sound remains one of the best sounding drums ever, no matter the look.
There are Brass editions, and those are labeled over the tone control with a B, or a BR if Bronze.

Those are the materials used in the 400 series, Aluminum or Ludaloy, Brass and Bronze. there has been never ever, a steel Supraphonic, never.
The Supraphonics are the ones with a P-83 or P-85 standard strainers, and the Supersensitives use a more complex strainer system, in which each strand can be tensioned individually and the wires extend through the whole wide of the drum, with no clips touching the reso head. Other than that, the specs are the same as the regular Supras.

The Black Beauty, is a Brass Seamless shell, with the same beaded shell and deep beds, but it sports a Black nickel finish, that gives them a very unique look and tone.
Some prefer the Brass tone, some prefer the Ludaloy, many of the Greats, having the chance to own any of them, have chosen the Ludaloy Supra over the Brass, because their versatility and tone.
The Brass in more warm and more ringy, the Ludaloy is more Dry, less resonant, more controlled, perfect for studio work, the most recorded.

Here is some info on the Acro, history, specs and changes over time:

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showpost.php?p=348219&postcount=1

As the Acrolite can go more open than the Supra, but still shares the same seamless ludaloy shell, they are considered by many, the most versatile snare drum ever made, they are readily available for 120.00 average, because they were marketed by most, if not all, the Music schools in the Country, as the perfect student snare drum. But it is no student snare drum by any means, is a drum that will outperform in versatility, tone, articulation and sensitivity, many more expensive snare drums, by far.

The specs in the 400s have changed a bit over time, their hardware is now imported, their hoops are no longer pressed in house by Ludwig, they are imported, their shell suppliers have changed, making a smaller diameter shell, but the lug design and die, have remained the same, creating a little gap that can be found between the bead of the shell and the lug casing.
The same reason, and the fact that their hoops are no longer made by Ludwig to perfectly fit their shells, create a spline in the tension rods, more noticeably in the deeper 402 and 417, 6.5 deep Ludaloy and Brass shells.
The newer Supras and Acros still sound good, but thinner, not the same deepness as the old Keystone and Black Olive badge ones.
They are a legend, and every drummer should own one.

Hope this helps, and Good Luck!

The Ryctor!
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

rather than make a similar thread.

what is the difference between black beauty, and brass on brass black beauty? is it just the gold coloured lugs? does brass on brass still have the same metal composition as the black beauty? are they both the same quality/model of drum?
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

Wow awesome responses, I really want one now!!
 
Re: Ludwig ..Whats the difference between Black Beauty, Supraphonic and Super Sensiti

rather than make a similar thread.

what is the difference between black beauty, and brass on brass black beauty? is it just the gold coloured lugs? does brass on brass still have the same metal composition as the black beauty? are they both the same quality/model of drum?

Yep, the shell is the same. The only difference is the gold color of the hardware; oh and the price is also alot higher.
 
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