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  #1  
Old 08-18-2018, 10:39 AM
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Default Making the jump to two bass drums!

It started out innocently enough. I got a new Pearl Masters BCX kit from headquarters, configured with 18x22 bass, 9x12, 10x13, and 16x16 floor tom. And then thought it would neat to have a matching snare. Got that. Then I wondered what it would be like to have a 8x10 tom added to the rack toms a la Jeff Porcaro.

Since these are discontinued drums, I'd have to wait months for Pearl to make the extra drums, and spend an awful lot of money. Thankfully, headquarters had more of these kits boxed and ready to go, so I picked up another Masters BCX kit that came with 8x10 and 9x12 rack toms. Since the price was right, I just picked up an entire shell pack, and since my doctor says I should exercise more, what better way than to have two bass drums to learn how to use, coincidentally running laps?

Yes, I know the two bass drum front heads don't match. I have another black logo head coming in. But I am really happy I didn't need to get a rack to mount everything on
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Old 08-18-2018, 12:36 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Absolutely beautiful kit Bo. You have just opened up a huge can of worms. I think you're gonna like said can.

Alternating 2s, 3s, and 4s between hands and feet are not only a blast for fills but also good for learning to control your feet.

Starting and stopping will do more for you than just running control wise. I know it isn't your thing, but check out "Dying" by Obituary. The first half of the song is loaded with this. https://youtu.be/p5XAYRsVft0

Do I detect a possible How do I do a Blast Beat thread in the future? Haha I joke, but seriously have fun and welcome to the two foot club!
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:36 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Congrats! Moving all of that will certainly be exercise. Peace and goodwill.
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Old 08-18-2018, 03:42 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Beautiful looking drums and I bet sound fantastic, have fun with it and hire a drum tech :-)
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Old 08-18-2018, 04:20 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Congrats on the 2nd bass. Once I made that move, there was no going back for me. There is something about laying into two bass drums that can't be beat.
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Old 08-18-2018, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
It started out innocently enough. I got a new Pearl Masters BCX kit from headquarters, configured with 18x22 bass, 9x12, 10x13, and 16x16 floor tom. And then thought it would neat to have a matching snare. Got that. Then I wondered what it would be like to have a 8x10 tom added to the rack toms a la Jeff Porcaro.

Since these are discontinued drums, I'd have to wait months for Pearl to make the extra drums, and spend an awful lot of money. Thankfully, headquarters had more of these kits boxed and ready to go, so I picked up another Masters BCX kit that came with 8x10 and 9x12 rack toms. Since the price was right, I just picked up an entire shell pack, and since my doctor says I should exercise more, what better way than to have two bass drums to learn how to use, coincidentally running laps?

Yes, I know the two bass drum front heads don't match. I have another black logo head coming in. But I am really happy I didn't need to get a rack to mount everything on

It looks good on you! Awesome!!

I've always wanted to set up two bass drums........
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:10 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Congrats on the 2nd bass. Once I made that move, there was no going back for me. There is something about laying into two bass drums that can't be beat.
The weirdest thing so far is now being centered between the two drums after years centering behind one bass drum and snare. Unlike playing with just a double pedal, the shift in body position is very different. Maybe as I just goof around on this for a while Iíll get used it. Exciting! Something new to learn how to do!
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:12 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

2 bass drums, OK. You've lived your whole life without 2 bass drums. The songs you play don't use double bass drum. I can't help wondering how you justify 2 bass drums.

Will you gig with them or are they stay at home drums?

You do look good behind the kit.
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:12 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Beautiful looking drums and I bet sound fantastic, have fun with it and hire a drum tech :-)
Fortunately I still have my Ludwig Ringo kit, which will be used for regular gigs as I get the hang of the monster. Then Iíll eventually make like Simon Phillips and just bring the big kit everywhere. Itíll be like making a statement ;)
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:18 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
The weirdest thing so far is now being centered between the two drums after years centering behind one bass drum and snare. Unlike playing with just a double pedal, the shift in body position is very different. Maybe as I just goof around on this for a while Iíll get used it. Exciting! Something new to learn how to do!
This is actually better for your body. No strange twisting as you are seated. It's more like sitting in a chair, and that's a good thing. We don't sit at the kitchen table twisted, why do we do it at the drums?
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:27 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Did you consider the double pedal route?
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Old 08-18-2018, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Fortunately I still have my Ludwig Ringo kit, which will be used for regular gigs as I get the hang of the monster.
The Session kit isn't gone already, is it?
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Old 08-18-2018, 06:03 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Way cool. Very old school, not using a rack. Gorgeous color.
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Old 08-18-2018, 06:54 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Did you consider the double pedal route?
The cost of a quality double pedal thatís then upgraded with the Canopus extension arm actually costs more than the additional shell pack does. So I thought Iíd like to give a completely different way of playing a chance for a while.
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Old 08-18-2018, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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The Session kit isn't gone already, is it?
The Sessions were exchanged for the additional Masters shells. I liked the ďless physical workĒ involved, but the bottom end left a little to be desired. I like girth.
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Old 08-18-2018, 07:31 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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The Sessions were exchanged for the additional Masters shells. I liked the ďless physical workĒ involved, but the bottom end left a little to be desired. I like girth.
Gotcha. Are those coated G2s on the toms? How are you liking them?
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Old 08-18-2018, 09:15 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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The cost of a quality double pedal that’s then upgraded with the Canopus extension arm actually costs more than the additional shell pack does. So I thought I’d like to give a completely different way of playing a chance for a while.
Good choice Bo. Constant source of entertainment, that's what you are :)

A completely different way of playing is a breath of fresh air.
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Old 08-18-2018, 10:06 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

I'm really looking forward to seeing (from afar) and hearing about this little journey/evolution... beautiful kit!!

CJ
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Old 08-19-2018, 12:45 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Gotcha. Are those coated G2s on the toms? How are you liking them?
Not sure if I like them on these drums. These drums respond really well with the clear ambassadors they came with. I may go back to those. But G2s are ok, but the 10Ē tom sounds like itís too thick for the diameter.
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Old 08-19-2018, 12:46 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Good choice Bo. Constant source of entertainment, that's what you are :)

A completely different way of playing is a breath of fresh air.
It does feel really different to me after decades of playing the way I do. It could only help, right?
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Old 08-19-2018, 12:48 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Not sure if I like them on these drums. These drums respond really well with the clear ambassadors they came with. I may go back to those. But G2s are ok, but the 10” tom sounds like it’s too thick for the diameter.
Thick as in how? Too deep, too flat, too muffled? Please expand on thick, I'm curious.
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Old 08-19-2018, 01:16 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
The weirdest thing so far is now being centered between the two drums after years centering behind one bass drum and snare. Unlike playing with just a double pedal, the shift in body position is very different. Maybe as I just goof around on this for a while Iíll get used it. Exciting! Something new to learn how to do!
It shouldn't be much different at all. That probably means you were setting up a bit off-kilter when you used one bass drum. Your position shouldn't have to change much at all going to two bass drums. The only thing that will change is the distance between the pedals, but even that should be almost identical if you've got everything setup as compactly as is practical, with a proper hi-hat attachment.

Maintaining a consistent setup with two bass drums requires regular measuring or spiking a riser or carpet. A small change in the angle of the bass drums can really throw things off.

You're also liable to piss off whomever is mixing the band. Having an open mic on the extra bass drum is bound to elicit "Do you play that one or is it for looks?" on a regular basis.
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Old 08-19-2018, 02:33 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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It shouldn't be much different at all. That probably means you were setting up a bit off-kilter when you used one bass drum. Your position shouldn't have to change much at all going to two bass drums. The only thing that will change is the distance between the pedals, but even that should be almost identical if you've got everything setup as compactly as is practical, with a proper hi-hat attachment.

Maintaining a consistent setup with two bass drums requires regular measuring or spiking a riser or carpet. A small change in the angle of the bass drums can really throw things off.

You're also liable to piss off whomever is mixing the band. Having an open mic on the extra bass drum is bound to elicit "Do you play that one or is it for looks?" on a regular basis.
Haha I had the opposite happen at a gig. It was a medical marijuana benefit. Tons of hippie bands. We were the only metal band. When we set up, the sound guy asked me "do you really use that?" I kindly asked him "do you not know who we are?" as it was a local show and we were a bit of a big deal at the time. He said no, and placed his only kick mic between my two drums. Show went well, but I have no idea how it sounded.

As far as consistency of setup, single kick folks have a tendency to parallely align themselves with the one kick and are off kilter as far as centering between their feet.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:29 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

[quote=Bo Eder;1576583]The weirdest thing so far is now being centered between the two drums after years centering behind one bass drum and snare. Unlike playing with just a double pedal, the shift in body position is very different. {QUOTE]

Not true. The right bass drum in a double pedal setup should be exactly where it would be in a double bass drum setup. Bass drum does NOT face the audience directly

I’ve been playing double kicks at a recording and touring level for over 25 years. Not to be a jerk but I know what I’m about on this topic
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:30 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

ROFLMAO-let me see if I remember the "sensible Bo thread". You slay me man-send the love back at ya. I just love reading your threads and I'm glad to see the two kicks-rather than that silly sensible crap-glad to see Bo is back. You definitely need more cymbals ;) Oh the gold sparkle just begs for "large kit"-more toms, more toms. I heard it echoing-like Jumanji the drums beckon. More toms-more toms. But two kicks-should be both 24 in kicks-just a matter of time.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:33 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by MrInsanePolack View Post
Thick as in how? Too deep, too flat, too muffled? Please expand on thick, I'm curious.
It sounds a little choked with a double-ply coated head. It rings like a timbale with the clear ambassadors on it.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:36 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

[quote=Jeff Almeyda;1576663]
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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
The weirdest thing so far is now being centered between the two drums after years centering behind one bass drum and snare. Unlike playing with just a double pedal, the shift in body position is very different. {QUOTE]

Not true. The right bass drum in a double pedal setup should be exactly where it would be in a double bass drum setup. Bass drum does NOT face the audience directly

Iíve been playing double kicks at a recording and touring level for over 25 years. Not to be a jerk but I know what Iím about on this topic
Maybe this is what I meant. Yes. with one bass drum, I normally have the bass drum facing the audience, and my body is actually shifted facing slightly right. With two bass drums, now my body is facing directly forward, and the bass drums are at angles. This is what I need to get used to.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:39 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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ROFLMAO-let me see if I remember the "sensible Bo thread". You slay me man-send the love back at ya. I just love reading your threads and I'm glad to see the two kicks-rather than that silly sensible crap-glad to see Bo is back. You definitely need more cymbals ;) Oh the gold sparkle just begs for "large kit"-more toms, more toms. I heard it echoing-like Jumanji the drums beckon. More toms-more toms. But two kicks-should be both 24 in kicks-just a matter of time.
I have a line on an 8x7, and may add that so I have four rack toms: 8-10-12-13.

Actually, a slightly bigger dilemma, is deciding if I want to get a rack for everything, or just install tom mounts and use L-arms.

The mounts/arms option is definitely cheaper, but it requires precise drilling so I can get my tom angles. The rack makes it all easy, but then, I have to deal with a rack.
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:51 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

That is smokin'!

Wicked setup! Smashing finish!
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Old 08-19-2018, 03:56 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Very nice. The holy grails of Pearls for me are that model (Masters in birch) as well as the Prestige session select (in teal mist) (from being a young kid and dreaming through American Musical Supply catalogue). Beautiful kit and canít wait for a ďshow us your monsterĒ thread. ďBetter have your wood screws in cause all that birch is gonna blow your doors offĒ :)
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Old 08-19-2018, 04:32 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
I have a line on an 8x7, and may add that so I have four rack toms: 8-10-12-13.

Actually, a slightly bigger dilemma, is deciding if I want to get a rack for everything, or just install tom mounts and use L-arms.

The mounts/arms option is definitely cheaper, but it requires precise drilling so I can get my tom angles. The rack makes it all easy, but then, I have to deal with a rack.
If you go all-out with the drums you have to rack it. I'm all about tom mounts on bass drums, but you may as well take it all the way.
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Old 08-19-2018, 10:30 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

I think I almost got it right in the other thread, when I said you'd be back with a 40" kick.

I've been using two kicks since about '93-94, and now double pedals are weird to use.

If I were you, I'd figure out if I'm ever going to use the kit out of the house, and if so would I be taking all of it, or just some of it? If you can have both options of rack or stands that would be the best situation, because the hardware used up can change based on what you're taking you the gig. Noone wants to see a 4 piece on a rack

What would be the most sensible, and rational, thing to do at this point would be to get a
drumframe, a bunch more cymbals, a gong, and a rack with an upper level so you can mount the cymbals hanging down from the upper level. The gong should be hung off the rack too.

On the bay area/SF CL there's a double bass drumframe for sale (it's not mine and I'm not associated with it in any way), they are hard to find.
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Old 08-19-2018, 11:05 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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I think I almost got it right in the other thread, when I said you'd be back with a 40" kick.

I've been using two kicks since about '93-94, and now double pedals are weird to use.

If I were you, I'd figure out if I'm ever going to use the kit out of the house, and if so would I be taking all of it, or just some of it? If you can have both options of rack or stands that would be the best situation, because the hardware used up can change based on what you're taking you the gig. Noone wants to see a 4 piece on a rack

What would be the most sensible, and rational, thing to do at this point would be to get a
drumframe, a bunch more cymbals, a gong, and a rack with an upper level so you can mount the cymbals hanging down from the upper level. The gong should be hung off the rack too.

On the bay area/SF CL there's a double bass drumframe for sale (it's not mine and I'm not associated with it in any way), they are hard to find.
My original plan was to just add the 10Ē to my existing 5-piece and then use the remaining 12/16/22 as itís own kit with my flat based hardware, and the bigger kit gets the heavier hardware.

Then I thought Iíd try combining the two and so far itís a lot of fun. But when I get called for a gig, Iíll take the 4-piece - just because I know Iíll be shoe-horned into an impossibly small space anyway and my bread and butter is my groove - so I wouldnít need all ten drums anyway.

If I get really fluent in this big kit, I may bring it out, but Iím sure itíll take a while for me to get good on it. Iíve been going over that simple double bass stuff in Rod Morgansteins ancient video from the 80s.
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Old 08-19-2018, 11:33 PM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

It is more than time for big kits to make a comeback !

I have no use for 2 kicks whatsoever, but it does bring back memories.
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Old 08-20-2018, 12:36 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Originally Posted by Bo Eder View Post
I have a line on an 8x7, and may add that so I have four rack toms: 8-10-12-13......

I see 4 rack toms in the 3rd picture of the first post - one tom is on the floor in the corner.
Is that a double of one of the sizes or something?
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Old 08-20-2018, 02:29 AM
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I see 4 rack toms in the 3rd picture of the first post - one tom is on the floor in the corner.
Is that a double of one of the sizes or something?
Yeah, I have an extra 12x9, which goes with the 4-piece. I could add it in. Still debating getting a rack system.
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Old 08-20-2018, 02:39 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

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Yeah, I have an extra 12x9, which goes with the 4-piece. I could add it in. Still debating getting a rack system.
If I was a betting man, or had any money for that matter, I'd say we will be seeing one soon.
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Old 08-20-2018, 03:17 AM
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Cool kit, but I prefer the white bass drum head over the black one - much more of a classic look with the sparkle.

And forget about a rack - it looks great the way you have it set up now.

I see you have a clamp attached to your hi-hat stand. What's it being used for?
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Old 08-20-2018, 03:30 AM
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SYMBOLIC DEATH SYMBOLIC DEATH is offline
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

What ever you do, don't get a pearl rack. They look like bleacher seats, and are fugly.

I realize you have a connection with Pearl, and I would suggest getting one of their racks and trade it in with Pro drum and get a Gibraltar rack. There isn't any slippage with Gibraltar racks, as long as you use the memory locks. You can have the rack bars across the front of the kit level, with a center post. I don't think you can do with Pearl, and thats why their double bass racks have 2 center bars. Gibraltar's curved rack bars are actually curved, while Pearl curved rack bars are slightly bowed. You can also easily trim Gibraltar rack bars to customize your rack.

I'm biased towards Gibraltar racks, as you can see, and have had mine since 98.
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Old 08-20-2018, 04:46 AM
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MrInsanePolack MrInsanePolack is online now
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Default Re: Making the jump to two bass drums!

Maybe if he was able to get his hands on one of the older DR-110 racks. Their design is pretty straightforward, no having to figure out how to position all the bars. I realize this would be un-Bo like, but if sticking with Pearl was an issue this is another option.

On a side note, they fold up incredibly compact for travel and only have one height they can be set to. The simplicity of the rack is quite pleasant if you aren't too keen on dealing with the complexity of other rack systems.

Again, this would be very un-Bo like.
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