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  #1  
Old 01-04-2012, 01:02 PM
Yfgchris22 Yfgchris22 is offline
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Default Cymbal problem

Ok... I have a little problem that maybe some of y'all guys can help with. First I play in a hardcore metal band. So you know I use my crash's a lot and hit pretty hard. Ive now gone through AAX series from sabian and A custom from Zilj. Both of them have cracked on me after about 5 months of use. Am I playing wrong or do I need to invest in a heavier more durable cymbal? Please any advice will help. Thank you!
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  #2  
Old 01-04-2012, 01:07 PM
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Naigewron Naigewron is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

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Originally Posted by Yfgchris22 View Post
Am I playing wrong or do I need to invest in a heavier more durable cymbal?
Perhaps both? Hitting hard will obviously put more stress on a cymbal, but if you add that to hitting it incorrectly it will definitely break a lot faster. That said, there are (as you imply) cymbals out there that are specifically designed for hard hitters and loud music, such as Zildjian Z Custom, Meinl MB20 and Paiste Alpha. Maybe you should look into those?

Also: Look into how your stick strikes the cymbal (it should be somewhat parallell with the surface of the cymbal, and not edge-on), and also try to control your stroke. It's fully possible to play with a lot of energy and big movements and still control your stroke enough to avoid breaking stuff, but it's not always easy when you're getting into the music and feeling the energy (especially if you're playing hard and heavy music).

I'm a hard hitter myself, and I go through a fair amount of cymbals. I'm always working on restraining my caveman technique, but I don't want to lose the energy of my playing. I really enjoy playing in an animated way and having a powerful stroke, so for me it's about finding a balance and trying to find a stroke that allows me to "feel" the energy of my own playing but not break my sticks and cymbals so damn quickly.
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  #3  
Old 01-04-2012, 01:11 PM
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Messerschmitt Messerschmitt is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

In my opinion, 5 months is waaay under the lifespan of ANY cymbal.

You sould check your cymbal placement. Make sure they are slightly tilted towards you so you don`t cut through them, but not angled that much so that you hit the bow of the cymbal. Also, make sure the cymbals are not overtightened on the stand. Let them vibrate freely.
If these don`t fix it, try reviewing your technique.

As a matter of fact, I play neoclassical metal, and i`ve never cracked any cymbal (and i`ve played on paper thin cymbals as well ! )
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  #4  
Old 01-04-2012, 01:34 PM
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HoM3R HoM3R is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

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Originally Posted by Yfgchris22 View Post
a heavier more durable cymbal?
I feel like there is no such thing as a more durable cymbal atleast not if you want to go above AAX and A's. The cheaper lines of cymbal might be less durable because they dont move aswell as the higher price ranges (my first set of planet Z cymbals less then 4 weeks).

Also heavier doesnt mean more durable maybe even less because your moving alot more weight and need to put more power into the cymbal to get it moving. A thin K cymbal will last you alot longer then a A custom (if your hitting them right) I feel. You also see alot more broken A custom cymbals then K's but maybe this has to do more with the kinda drummers that play them.

I myself recently broke my first 2 cymbals after 4 years of use (17 K hybrid and 19 K thin dark) with very small cracks in the middle of the cymbals with the groove. Drummers told me that if you take care of your cymbals but like to play hard and put some rage into your drumming this happens because the metal gets tired.

My solution was getting bigger crashes (rides) because it always felt my sticks were going straight through the 17 and 19 inch cymbals. With a 21 ride it feels like im really hitting something. Might not be the right choice for music but for me 50% drumming is releasing alot of my energy.
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  #5  
Old 01-04-2012, 02:23 PM
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Kg_lee Kg_lee is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yfgchris22 View Post
Ok... I have a little problem that maybe some of y'all guys can help with. First I play in a hardcore metal band. So you know I use my crash's a lot and hit pretty hard. Ive now gone through AAX series from sabian and A custom from Zilj. Both of them have cracked on me after about 5 months of use. Am I playing wrong or do I need to invest in a heavier more durable cymbal? Please any advice will help. Thank you!
People like to pride themselves on using high end gear but I say use what works.

I use to play in a hard rock band for a living and would spend about 5k a year due to breaking cymbals. I have had extremely good luck with low end Paiste both 802 series (discontinued) and now PST5's. These cymbals to me sound just as good as any 2002, Zildjian or Sabian. I would suggest using medium weight cymbals they give more.

Give the PST5's a shot..I'm sure they'll work for you.
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  #6  
Old 01-04-2012, 04:01 PM
sticks4drums
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

Turn up your monitor, and get more power for your mains. You are hitting too hard. Cymbals are only meant to be so loud. After that you are just abusing them.
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  #7  
Old 01-04-2012, 04:28 PM
dwdrummerky dwdrummerky is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

I would also suggest to buy cymbals that fit the genre. A customs are nice but fairly thin. Try some of these..
-Paiste Rude
-Zildjian Z3 or A series rock/medium crashes
-Paiste 2oo2 Power crashes
-Sabian AA rock crashes
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  #8  
Old 01-04-2012, 04:36 PM
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Zickos Zickos is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

Play softer and turn up the volume.
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  #9  
Old 01-04-2012, 04:42 PM
sticks4drums
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

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Originally Posted by dwdrummerky View Post
I would also suggest to buy cymbals that fit the genre. A customs are nice but fairly thin. Try some of these..
-Paiste Rude
-Zildjian Z3 or A series rock/medium crashes
-Paiste 2oo2 Power crashes
-Sabian AA rock crashes
What he said. Another good choice would be Sabian Paragons, if you can afford them, or find them used. They are medium cymbals that were made for volume.
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  #10  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:09 PM
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moontheloon moontheloon is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

most of the time when this happens its the angle of your cymbal when the stick strikes

you ultimately want the throat of the stick to meet the body of the cymbal as apposed to the edge....

check out some slow motion clips of a cymbal being struck in different spots and you will understand why this happens

when playing heavy material cymbals are bound to break.....but you can make it less frequent by angling your cymbals, keeping your wing nuts very loose, and just not bashing as hard.

I had this problem when playing in hardcore bands back in the day .....I changed to Zildjian Z series rock 19" crashes ......I sacrificed some sound quality for durability but it worked for me

plus while playing that loud you dont have to have amazing sounding cymbals ....for live situations anyway
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  #11  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:33 PM
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bigiainw bigiainw is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

I would be wary of going for heavier cymbals- if your technique or set up is to blame, then you'll only make the situation worse by adding inertia to the equation. I have, for the past 6 years had 2 A customs, a 19" and 17" crash which I use as a primary and secondary respectively. The primary gets much more use than the secondary, but the secondary recently began to crack on the edge. The issue I have always had with it was that I could never get the hardware and the positioning right, and consequently I was hitting it straight on rather than with glancing blows. With a heavier cymbal, I'm sure it would have cracked even sooner due to the greater mass and inertia in the thicker cymbal. The solution was to modify my set up slightly, so that I wasn't hitting the cymbal in the same way. It might well work for you too.

Or not!
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  #12  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:46 PM
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Bull Bull is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

I have always had better luck with medium thin weights. I was also the singer in an extreme (ish)metal band for years. That drummer had better luck with medium thin weights too. My suggestion is to use 18"s and larger,angle them slightly,and don't play "through" them.
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  #13  
Old 01-04-2012, 07:32 PM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Cymbal problem

The object is not to hit as hard as you can.The object is to hit hard enough,using a glancing blow.As long as you lay directly into a cymbal...I don't care who makes it,or how thick it is...its going to crack.I am pretty sure technique is to blame here.

Hitting a cymbal or a drum that hard will cause it to choke.At that point all you're getting is noise,and no musicallity at all.You have exceeded its ability to produce musical frequencies.

Hitting hard is ok,but it also involves technique.I would consult a teacher here,and have that person observe your playing style,and ctitique your approach to the kit.I'm not going to recomend a cymbal here,because I would wager that that would not correct the problem.

Steve B
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