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  #41  
Old 10-19-2018, 06:51 PM
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philrudd philrudd is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoIsTony? View Post
when I was first getting into doing a lot of session work in the mid to late 90s I would always heavily prepare as I still do ...

but I would always get into the studio and every take I would be removing things from the drum part that I had prepared ... not because it sounded horrible or was out of time or anything but because it felt unnecessary in context

and when the final product was finished I always ended up loving this really bare bones drum take that just felt really good ... duh

but it definitely was a learning process for me

I was new to the game and making a name ... I wanted people to call me because they wanted what I offered

it took me a little time to realize that there was no point in offerfing unnecessary notes... or crashes... or accents ... or whatever ...

I mean ... it's not like I was blowing out musically inappropriate fills all over a song ... these were tiny unnecessary things ... like crashes for example since we are on that topic

it was a wonderful learning process because once you learn that you save a ton of time ... and back then you saved tape

I like to use this song as a reference with my students who are interested in becoming what I call "song drummers" ... it's sad that I even have to even decipher between that and something else ... but as we all know there is that "something else"

but I always reference this song because I think it is the perfect example of song drumming ...

subtle ... feels great... plays basically one fill over and over in the entire tune and no one has ever cared for one second... also ... NOT ONE CRASH in the entire song ... again ... no one has ever cared

you really get a sense that he is playing the song and not playing a drum beat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOFCTFXn6xE
Another great post, WIT. And a great song example. I have to admit, I've heard that song about a thousand times but never really paid much attention to how reserved the drums are. If you asked me to play it off the cuff, I would swear there was more going and play it all wrong...great lesson there.
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  #42  
Old 10-19-2018, 07:04 PM
Mustion Mustion is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

When you need to:

1. Ask the teacher a question
2. Do some lopsided stretches
3. Air out a sweaty armpit

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Old 10-19-2018, 07:49 PM
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  #43  
Old 10-19-2018, 08:00 PM
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WhoIsTony? WhoIsTony? is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

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Originally Posted by Mustion View Post
When you need to:

1. Ask the teacher a question
2. Do some lopsided stretches
3. Air out a sweaty armpit

cool photo of John
.........................
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  #44  
Old 10-19-2018, 09:10 PM
Otto Otto is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

I don't think we 'know' when.

I think our style gives us a range of options to select from.

From there, you must simply ask, "What is my playing style'

I don't mean that as in music genre, but how you play in general ...within or between different music genres.
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  #45  
Old 10-19-2018, 09:30 PM
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oldskoolsoul oldskoolsoul is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Or just leave your crashes home the next time you have a gig and only bring a nice crashable ride..

Then make a recording from the whole evening and listen this back the next day at home..

Then decide if you miss any crashes or not..

Then, if still not convinced, start listening a lot to Steely Dan albums..

Regarding the 'punkband-drummer', in that case you just bring 1 (cheap!) crash each show that you completely smash to death before the end of the evening..

Meaning, you end each gig anyway without the sound of a crash..

Every other 'punkband-drummer', is not really a 'punkband-drummer', but only playing safe..
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  #46  
Old 10-19-2018, 10:01 PM
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MrInsanePolack MrInsanePolack is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

I do want to interject another thought on this. Coming from a death metal band, there were tons of times where the guitar players actually asked for crashes in certain areas because it would accentuate their guitar parts. The crashes were used to help create the mood, not just punctuate the end of a section, fill, etc. Catching crashes to accentuate a stop or allow notes to ring out are wonderful things also.
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  #47  
Old 10-19-2018, 10:03 PM
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

I like oldschools suggestion to remove the crashes from your practice kit for a while. It will force you to not crash automatically, and think about it more since the crash-rides are usually more big and overbearing you'll end up thinking more actively about how and when you use a crash voice. I was going to suggest the same thing before he already did. I just did this the other night at a rehearsal where I couldn't find a sleeve for the crash stand and decided to just go without.
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  #48  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:33 PM
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Davo-London Davo-London is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Hi

I never crash. Never. I have to be reminded that the cymbal is there.

There again I play mostly worship and it only rarely seems appropriate.

I think it's a very good question. Reggae seems to have crashes on the 4 &, which gives it a lovely feel.

I'm a massive Copeland fan and he liked to embellish the third bar rather than the fourth bar, which is really unique and musical.

There's a lot of pop songs with no crashes at all so trial and error is all I can suggest!

Regards
Davo
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  #49  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:49 PM
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trickg trickg is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

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Originally Posted by Davo-London View Post
Hi

I never crash. Never. I have to be reminded that the cymbal is there.

There again I play mostly worship and it only rarely seems appropriate.

Regards
Davo
90% of what I play is Worship, and I crash all the time. For some songs, I'm riding the crash. We must be playing different worship music.
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  #50  
Old 10-25-2018, 04:34 PM
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Davo-London Davo-London is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Dude, I'm so jealous.

You must be playing upbeat worship. The vast majority of modern Hillsong-esque tunes seem to be rather slow and low energy.

It could of course be ME. But I'm holding back before I decide I'm a dunce.

Regards
Davo
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  #51  
Old 10-25-2018, 04:36 PM
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trickg trickg is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

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Originally Posted by Davo-London View Post
Dude, I'm so jealous.

You must be playing upbeat worship. The vast majority of modern Hillsong-esque tunes seem to be rather slow and low energy.

It could of course be ME. But I'm holding back before I decide I'm a dunce.

Regards
Davo
I do a lot of Hillsong, and we follow the recordings pretty closely - I don't know which ones you are doing, but the tunes I do typically have some very high energy builds and choruses toward the end.
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  #52  
Old 10-25-2018, 06:03 PM
Drumolator Drumolator is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

I play twice a week at church and crash quite often. Peace and goodwill.
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  #53  
Old 10-25-2018, 10:20 PM
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JustJames JustJames is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Please guys, let's keep religious differences out of this discussion.
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  #54  
Old 10-26-2018, 12:06 AM
bud7h4 bud7h4 is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

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Originally Posted by JustJames View Post
Please guys, let's keep religious differences out of this discussion.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ooooookay?

Edit. Never mind, I get it lol.
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  #55  
Old 10-26-2018, 01:40 AM
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

I'm thinking that lots of musical styles were built on unconventional ideas. So while it is important to follow some when-to-play-crash-cymbal-rules, it may also be useful to change those rules when developing a new style of music.
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  #56  
Old 10-26-2018, 11:06 PM
BruceW BruceW is offline
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Default Re: How do you know when to crash?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJames View Post
...and then there's how to crash.

There are songs which my band plays (classic rock stuff), where sometimes I will play a crash so that it lies beneath the surface of the music, rather than breaking all over the top of it.
This is why I have 16's and 18's... the 16's fit in very nicely, the 18's have the emphasis
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