Used and Abused.

Hey! I went to York (about a million years ago)! I have a BFA (visual arts). What's it like up there nowadays? Does Rob Bowman still teach there? Is the Absinthe Pub still open?

Anyway, sorry to hear about your rotten classmate.
 
And no, you can't claim any copyright on drum parts. There was a thread on this topic recently, but for the most part, copywrites cover lyrics, melody and harmony, but not drums. And if drums could be copywritten, everyone here would be in massive financial debt to Cozy Cole, Gene Krupa, Ringo Star, et all, for playing beats and fills that have been played by someone before.


I don't think the issue here is one of copyrighting a specific part - the royalty issue is to do with writing credit, which would normally be decided before release. In a fair world, you'd be given a percentage of the writing credit for each track depending on your contribution. You should also be given a portion of the mechanical royalty for each sale even without writing credit.
That said, unless this group are going to be selling hundreds of thousands of records it's best chalked up to experience.
 
Hey! I went to York (about a million years ago)! I have a BFA (visual arts). What's it like up there nowadays? Does Rob Bowman still teach there? Is the Absinthe Pub still open?

Anyway, sorry to hear about your rotten classmate.

I have no idea, I'm not really involved in the visual arts program. The Absinthe is still open, though! I don't know if the ferrets were around when you went there, but one of them passed away due to cancer. They had funerals and everything, it was really upsetting! I play there with my jazz group and my acoustic pop group every so often for giggles. It's good times :)

As to my classmate, apparently they're legitimate and are looking at serious radio airplay. He's manipulative enough to get the band on the air as well. I haven't talked to the lawyer yet, but will sometime this week.
 
I'm going to post on their FB. muahahaa

haha i did that too, read what i said...

i couldn't believe people could be this disrespectful...i really don't know what i would do in this situation, i would be so dam angry. I hope you get this resolved soon cause this stuff breaks my heart.
 
I know that this is the probably the toughest thing to do and also the easiest thing to say coming from someone like me who has no investment in the situation. But seriously, walk away, move on and don't look back. One of the best things you can do for yourself is to make these difficult decisions and do it with grace and tact.

Trust me, you'll be much better off writing this person off at least for the moment. On top of that you don't want to burn any bridges with anyone else in the group. You never know when someone that you've worked with in the past perhaps affiliated with this situation with think of you for a future project.
 
Yeah, but the deal is man, they're all in on this.

The singer is the jerk's sister, and the bassist and him were in on this plan together as well. They didn't want to pay a drummer, so they offer one a spot on the band roster until the recordings were done, then they dumped the sucker. The sucker being me.

It's not about the money, the tracks, or even the credit (although all of that would be really nice.) It's about principle. The guy deserves a swift kick in the nads and the shins for doing this. He needs to learn that he can't go around using people to get shit done. Cause I'm not the only person he's done something like this, too. The way he sees things, is that everyone is around to do service for him, whether it's help on our transcription assignments, recording for his band, or transposing charts for his jazz combo. He's a user and an abuser and he needs to learn that he can't get away with this stuff all the time. In simple terms; he's just a bully.

I'm pissed because I would never do anything like this to anyone. Your name and reputation is the end-all and be-all in the music industry. I treat everyone I've ever played with with respect, care, and compassion because that's what they deserve. He lies, cheats, and deceives everyone he plays with. Obviously he's not the only one who does this, but I can't stand by knowing that he's going to do this to someone else, and is doing this to someone else. I'm sure you can all empathize with that feeling.

I just wanted to thank everyone for their support in this matter. Unfortunately, the lawyer states that there isn't much I can do, because I don't have any hard proof that I did anything, and the only way I could get anything would be if the jerk admitted that I played for him, which isn't going to happen. All I can do is spread the word that the guy is a jerk who no one should deal with or trust.

The sad part is, this experience has really affected my relationships with others negatively. I now feel like I have to be on my guard, waiting to be stabbed in the back by my friends. I put a lot of trust in this guy, and he abused it. I don't want that to happen again. He's also a good friend with one of my good friends, and I feel as though what happened with him is going to ruin that friendship as well.

We shall see. Again, thanks for your support guys, it means a lot.
 
It's bad karma. What goes around comes around.

Take the high road while trying to get your satisfaction and then move on.

Good advice from D&B.
 
Bad boys, bad boys, watcha gonna do? Watcha gonna do when they come for you?
A little Inner Circle to set the mood.
 
You're at university? This seems a little immature for people of college age. Tell him what you think of him and why, leave it at that, and take comfort in the fact there's almost no chance their band will go anywhere.
 
I have no idea, I'm not really involved in the visual arts program. The Absinthe is still open, though! I don't know if the ferrets were around when you went there, but one of them passed away due to cancer. They had funerals and everything, it was really upsetting! I play there with my jazz group and my acoustic pop group every so often for giggles. It's good times :)

As to my classmate, apparently they're legitimate and are looking at serious radio airplay. He's manipulative enough to get the band on the air as well. I haven't talked to the lawyer yet, but will sometime this week.


HA! Ferrets...I think the same manager is there! If Rob Bowman still teaches up there you HAVE to take a class with him. The class I took with him was Music and Society (basically a history of popular music). His depth of knowledge is insane and he is a super generous and fantastic guy. He won a Grammy for the liner notes he wrote for the Stax boxet when I was at York.

Are you at Winter's college? I remember some of the crazy jazz geeks I hung out with (quite a few wacky drummers)! I had a great time at York. I hear it is all corporate now, though.
 
I'm winters college, but don't live in residence, so I don't really associate too much with the college aside from wearing the pin on my bag, lol. Unfortunately, I have NO room for spare classes, hard as that is to believe. I'm already at my credit cap, between private lessons and the mandatory courses, I have no room for anything else. Plus, I have to start my double major next year, and finish my general education (Natural Science, Social Science, Humanities). A lot of the mandatory stuff I feel is a little unnecessary, such as Fine Arts and Cultures as well as Music and Cultures. But the professors are all geniuses and I'm really learning a lot at this school, both from my teachers and my peers. I couldn't have made a better decision when it came to picking York. :)
 
This happened to me a while ago, and I probably should've posted it when it happened, but it's been festering and now I'm pissed.

Basically, a couple months ago, one of my fellow students approached me and asked if I wanted to join his band. He told me that time was an issue, that they had to get stuff done, but everything was legitimate, everyone was talented, shows would be done, and people would be paid. He asked me if I could come over to his place for a couple weeks to track some drums for the bands upcoming album. Told me I would be a permanent member of the band.

Sounds good right?

WELL. Here's how it went down. He called me everyday, 4 or 5 times a day, any time from 5 in the morning to 11 or 12 at night. Keep in mind I'm a university student and my classes are at 8 30 in the morning, so I need my beauty sleep. He kept trying to get me to reassure him that I wasn't going to bail on the project, that they were going places, that he needed me to stay. It was frustrating, but I stuck with it. Whatever, he just wants everything to turn out great. I can empathize with that.

I spent two weeks in his studio after school for hours and hours, sometimes til 11 at night recording. I got 5 songs done the first week, and 2 more the second. Keep in mind I was making the parts up on the spot, and hadn't heard the tracks beforehand. Pretty good, I would say. After the recordings are done, he tells me I did a fantastic job, and that he'll send me the masters when they're done. Sweet deal.

I recorded this stuff the third and fourth weeks of September. The masters were due in the end of October. I ask for the masters October 31st. I get nothing from him. He tells me there's a photoshoot scheduled for the band on Thursday (the day he tells me this is Wednesday) I tell him I have my commencement, but I can do the photoshoot from anytime before 4, because I have to be at a my highschool commencement for 7. He says it's fine.

So, on the day of the photoshoot, he calls me at 5 in the morning telling me he cancelled it. I say that's fine, it gives me time to relax before my commencement. I check the band's facebook page the next day. Guess what I see? The photoshoot pictures. I'm pissed off, of course, so I call him up and he tells me he wants to talk about upcoming shows, etc. I'm telling him times I can do, he agrees, says he'll get back to me on when we can meet up. Never calls me back. The guy went from calling me more times in a day than my girlfriend does in a year to no calls at all.

I send him a few emails/facebook messages. No replies. So I stop, maybe he's stressed about the upcoming album release. Didn't hear from him for a while. When I check the band's facebook page about a month later, my name has been replaced with another name. I've been kicked out of the band and he didn't have the balls to tell me, after everything I did for him.

Oh yeah, and he's using my drum tracks on the album. And not giving me credit. And I don't get the mastered copies either, or the pay he promised me. I was stupid and should've got a contract written up so I have proof so I could take it to court.

Is there anything I can do, legally? The only proof I have are witnesses who can testify that I was at his house. He also told some people that I was recording for him. Do I have a case against him to get ANYTHING from him? I want compensation for my time, since he wanted to go and treat me like S@$&.

I'm so pissed about this. I really need some advice on what I can do.
There's no legal recourse, as there's nothing in writing. I suggest you beat him up.
 
I'm sorry to read this, but not surprised. This happens all the time in this business. It is unfortunate, but I think it is a good lesson. It is something I had to deal with also. I'm owed for an album and tour. My problem was I did not treat the situation in a professional manner. I did not have a personal manager, I took people at their word and had no written contract.

The lesson here is to begin thinking of all aspects of your drumming as a business. You are in business, it matters not how small or large this business is. In business people are sold commodities, your drumming is one such commodity. No roofer works for free, nor does a plumber or lawyer. Why should it be different simply because we are playing music?

By all means find out legally what you can do. But next time someone asks you to perform, arrange it properly. Get a personal manager and pay him or her the 15%. In the long run it's worth it.

Good luck.
 
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