The legendary Steve Gadd

Stu_Strib said:
This is STEVE FREAKIN' GADD we are talking about. If the name alone doesn't inspire awe, then I guess you just don't get it.

I guess I don't know what I'm talking about then, but give me a little credit. I've been playng since the 4th grade, nearly 30 years now, I have played with at least 10 bands, I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd until a few months ago when I joined this forum.

So call me ignorant if you must, that's OK because I am done with this topic. I guess in my brief 40 years I have grown wise enough to know when an argument has become futile.

So you win, Steve Gadd is the finest drummer in the world. Now if you will excuse me, my 5 year old is trying to kill the cat!
 
Womble said:
Yes. You don't say anything I disagree with. In fact, it's precisely because I agree that Gadd's licks are not the most important part of his playing that I get frustated when I see clinic clips, and all he seems to do is roll out his licks, again....and again....and again. Now as Nutha suggests, and I hinted at, maybe that's because the audience is always full of people who want to hear those licks. Maybe it's because Steve has assumed that's what people want to hear. Who knows....I just think it would be fascinating to see him come out of his comfort zone, don't you?
Most of the clinic videos I see make me zone out after a minute or so, and don't even get me started about non-drummers.... Gadd is a differnet story, though. He plays stuff that is both technically perfect and groovy like anything. It is just incredibly pleasing to listen to, and I admire him for holding his own against the onslaught of super chops that in my opinion have limited musical value. DPS
 
YES GADD HAS HIS LICKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SHEEESH!

What irks me is that people think this is ALL he has. Just look at the long list of songs on here that people have posted that are specifically GADD lick free is all I'm saying. Just because Bernhard posted some of his more known licks, and there are several DVDs highlighting his licks, doesn't mean this is all he plays.

Nutha has it right. I'm trying to maybe open people's eyes to the fact there is more to Gadd than 32nd note doubles and linear snare-hi-hat-kick licks. We all have our individual styles. What makes Gadd great, is people know right away "That's Gadd". I have my own style. People don't go "That's Stu".

And Womble, you'll note I took your name out of the quote, so as not to make it personal. I was just highlighting some of the 'lowlight' comments; the ones that best demonstrate that people just don't get Gadd. 50 Ways has to be one of the most perfect and most identifiable riffs to a song ever. I think DogBreath said it best. 50 ways is a song that revolves around the drum riff. It is quite simply, the perfect part for that song. I would bet that every producer and song writer in that room nearly died when they heard Steve lay down that groove.

Even if you don't think it fits, you should still analyze the riff to see there are a lot of bad imitations of it. There are so many subtle things going on in a seemingly simple fill....it's vintage Gadd.

The cool thing about Gadd is he is one of the drummers I don't envy because of chops. Frankly, the stuff he plays isn't technically difficult. It is simply pure genius. Like Bernhard said, you can see the notes, he'll show you the notes, he'll show you how to play the notes, and you STILL can't play it right.

I could only WISH to have a lick someday that people immediately identify as being STU.

STU-isms would be cool.

But, I suck, so one can dream.


I have nothing left to say on this issue. This is like trying to convince Bud Light drinkers the virtues of fine wine, or comic book readers about nuances of fine art. You get it, or you don't.
 
DrPowerStroke said:
Most of the clinic videos I see make me zone out after a minute or so, and don't even get me started about non-drummers.... Gadd is a differnet story, though. He plays stuff that is both technically perfect and groovy like anything. It is just incredibly pleasing to listen to, and I admire him for holding his own against the onslaught of super chops that in my opinion have limited musical value. DPS

I know what you mean. In a way, though, I think it's cooler to see a really young groove-minded guy holding his own against the chops monsters (that 14 minute Keith Carlock clinic vid game me more pleasure than from any I have seen in a long time). It would certainly be more of a psychological challenge to a a younger, less famous drummer. Gadd knows by now that he could play whatever the hell he wanted and people would still worship him like a God. That's why I think it would be interesting to see him try new things.
 
jpekarek said:
.......... I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd ........
!


Ok - I understand: you are a formula 1 racer (not a go-car Racer beware!!!) and never heard the name Ferrari.

That's ok, but so perhabs better discussing about lawn-mowers , not race-cars - there lies the misunderstanding

( just a question: Buddy Rich - ever heard? - was also a quite good drummer -won no championships, never practiced, but anyway...)

Bernhard
 
jpekarek said:
I guess I don't know what I'm talking about then, but give me a little credit. I've been playng since the 4th grade, nearly 30 years now, I have played with at least 10 bands, I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd until a few months ago when I joined this forum.

So call me ignorant if you must, that's OK because I am done with this topic. I guess in my brief 40 years I have grown wise enough to know when an argument has become futile.

So you win, Steve Gadd is the finest drummer in the world. Now if you will excuse me, my 5 year old is trying to kill the cat!

Hi Jpekarek,

You make my point for me: ignorant simply means "unaware of". At LEAST you didn't come in here saying Steve Gadd only has one lick and is overrated.

I share your sentiments, and trust me, nothing I said was directed at you or your participation in this thread. We are the same age, have the same issues (namely children killing family pets), the same credentials (Oregon States here, vs. Washington for you, I gather). I knew people would get reactionary to the word ignorant. I have no problem with your comments because you quite frankly don't know of Gadd, so therefore you didn't say anything really really ignorant about it.

Another great thing about Gadd: you may have never heard of him, but there is no way you have never heard his playing, given how much he has recorded, and your extensive experience in drumming. I assure you, with your track record, you've played something that was recorded by Gadd.

Ask Deen. I'm sure he'll tell you all about Gadd. Deen is great, and should be talked about more on DW ;-) I worshiped Deen when I was a Freshman. I think he was running the snare line at the Salem Argonauts when I tried out....man that guy was intimidating.
 
Lol Stu, how does removing my name from my quotation make it less personal to me, when you then label it a 'lowlight' comment that shows I don't 'get Gadd'!? Anyway, I'm not seriously getting up-tight about this, I'd just like the record to state, as I think it should, that my failing to worship one single but very popular Gadd groove does not cast doubt on my Gadd-loving (and 'getting'!) credentials.

Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.
 
Stu_Strib said:
Hi Jpekarek,

You make my point for me: ignorant simply means "unaware of". At LEAST you didn't come in here saying Steve Gadd only has one lick and is overrated.

I share your sentiments, and trust me, nothing I said was directed at you or your participation in this thread. We are the same age, have the same issues (namely children killing family pets), the same credentials (Oregon States here, vs. Washington for you, I gather). I knew people would get reactionary to the word ignorant. I have no problem with your comments because you quite frankly don't know of Gadd, so therefore you didn't say anything really really ignorant about it.

Another great thing about Gadd: you may have never heard of him, but there is no way you have never heard his playing, given how much he has recorded, and your extensive experience in drumming. I assure you, with your track record, you've played something that was recorded by Gadd.

Ask Deen. I'm sure he'll tell you all about Gadd. Deen is great, and should be talked about more on DW ;-) I worshiped Deen when I was a Freshman. I think he was running the snare line at the Salem Argonauts when I tried out....man that guy was intimidating.

Well I'll tell you what I am doing. I am searching the internet for downloads of Steve Gadd's music and videos clips. Looking through old S&G recordings and listening to the "Clap". The passionate string of conversation here has intrigued me to say the least, the least I can do is learn more about the man!
 
Womble said:
Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.

Paul Simon wrote the song around the groove. Steve was warming up, doing independence exercises, with left hand on hi-hat and closing the hi-hat foot on different beats, while playing this New Orleans funk pattern. Paul loved what he was playing and built the song over top of this groove.
 
Womble said:
Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.

According to Paul Simon, the song was done, and Gadd made it up during the session. It blew everyone away, and then the song was retweaked to fit the pattern even better. So finally, a drummer other than Neil Peart, having a profound effect on song writing!

DogBreath stated it much better than I, as he probably didn't drink a bottle of wine while on night time cold medicine, like myself, ;-)


Edit: I found more:

According to Simon -
The big discovery on this song was Steve Gadd's drum part. It's probably what made it a hit. When Steve used to be in the studio, he used to practice these little marching-band patterns. It was like a little exercise for him. So I guess that's what it was. It's tricky; I've watched a lot of drummers try to play that. They never quite get it. It's very tricky. The song has a real casualness to the verses and a sense of humor to it, and the choruses are funny and catchy. And everybody seemed to like that one, young people and old people. The choruses were from a rhyming game I used to play with my son Harper when he was about four. I think it came off unusually well as a record. I like the chords.

AND according to GADD --
Interviewer : Can you explain, did the song come first or did the groove come first, did he ( Paul Simon ) write the song around the groove or vice-versa ?

Steve Gadd : the song came first and we tried a few different ways and ended up with that feel.
I would just sit at the drums sometimes and instead of playing the hi-hat with my right hand, I would play with my left hand, and from playing be-bop, the hi-hat here is like if you play in 4 or you would play at different places. I was more free than just 2 and 4, so Fifty Ways is the result of using the hi-hat at different places : using the left hand and the hi-hat.


AND....

from anonymous post on the internet:
It occurs to me Gadd's beat in (50 ways) is perhaps metaphorical but resonant with even a naive listener; that is, it's glib but very slightly drags—the glibness expressing the songs lyrics, but the slight drag expressing the hidden reluctance (or fear) to leave.

So this guy gets away with "naive" instead of "ignorant". So I change my post. You are all naive, hehe.
 
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jpekarek said:
Well I'll tell you what I am doing. I am searching the internet for downloads of Steve Gadd's music and videos clips. Looking through old S&G recordings and listening to the "Clap". The passionate string of conversation here has intrigued me to say the least, the least I can do is learn more about the man!

I spent probably an hour today on iTunes, sampling stuff from his discography. I'm 'only' 36, so a lot of his prime was when I was very young. I think I only got up to 1976 in an hour!

I particularly like the stuff with Bonnie Raitt, ca. 1974 (forget the album title and year, but it is in his discography).

I don't think you'll find any studio recordings of Simon & Garfunkel with Gadd on drums. He seems to only have drummed Live in Central Park for that duo.
 
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And I annoyingly post three in a row....


but this one is classic!

Did you notice, if you just type Steve Gadd in your browser window, it defaults to Bernhard's page on Steve Gadd!?? That's some influence, Bernie!

Stu
 
Ok i stand corrected, thanx Stu. I do remember that story from the Gadd video, i knew he was doing his independece exercise thing with the left hand and foot, but i forgot that it was the song first then the groove...got them mixed up... oops (its been a while since i seen that) this is quite embarrassing since i consider myself almost a Gadd historian :)
 
Stu_Strib said:
According to Paul Simon, the song was done, and Gadd made it up during the session. It blew everyone away, and then the song was retweaked to fit the pattern even better. So finally, a drummer other than Neil Peart, having a profound effect on song writing!

I think there's plenty who do. Danny Carey is clearly a big influence on Tool's songwriting, likewise most prog drummers. Similarly, "Take Five" was originally written as a solo showpiece for Joe Morello, and Tony Williams and Elvin Jones had clear and obvious influence on the ways that Miles and Trane approached relating to the rhythm section.... I think the list could be virtually endless. It would be hard to be in a band with somebody as amazing as most of the people on Drummerworld and fail to be influenced in some way by their playing, IMHO.
 
Well, finn, I used Peart only because that is the one people usually like to bring up. I think Stewart Copeland had a huge influence, and thus the power struggle and eventual breakup of the Police.

Too many to name, but still the sign of a great drummer is the impact to the entire song process (not just the drum beat).
 
jpekarek said:
IMO, Steve Gadd is an excellent drummer and also very accomplished. But (IMO) if you take away that one lightning fast lick he does all the time, there isn't anything very impressive left. It seems like most of his stuff is based on it. He throws it in everywhere and it gets a little old.

Great drummer, great chops, I just can't find anything to get impressed about.

You are kidding right?

The lick isn't impressive. The feel in his grooves is.
 
Stu_Strib said:
And I annoyingly post three in a row....


but this one is classic!

Did you notice, if you just type Steve Gadd in your browser window, it defaults to Bernhard's page on Steve Gadd!?? That's some influence, Bernie!

Stu

Yes , thanks, true - but I think I should come second - when the official Dr. Steve Gadd Site will be up a bit more longer.

But for the most drummers we come second - after their official pages - that's great for us:
Buddy Rich, Dave Weckl, Vinnie Colaiuta and and and....

Bernhard
 
Stu_Strib said:
I spent probably an hour today on iTunes, sampling stuff from his discography. I'm 'only' 36, so a lot of his prime was when I was very young. I think I only got up to 1976 in an hour!

I particularly like the stuff with Bonnie Raitt, ca. 1974 (forget the album title and year, but it is in his discography).

I don't think you'll find any studio recordings of Simon & Garfunkel with Gadd on drums. He seems to only have drummed Live in Central Park for that duo.

Yes he does have an extensive discography. I used to run Gaddporium (an online all Gadd radio station) Steve performing with various artists from the last 5 decades from various musical genres.
At that time i had about 1500 songs on the go, which is only a small percentage of work he recorded.
 
Wow. I'd pay money for that. Was it the low quality streaming radio crap that most of them are?
 
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