Mastering the single stroke roll

Just work with the endurance exercises in Gary Chaffee's Technique Patterns book. Works for me
Or like Dr. Watson alluded to, Sticking Patterns and the accented singles (3s, 4s, 5s, 6s, 7s etc), exercises etc., bring awareness to the musicality and application. Rather than just playing for endurance without much musical context. Plus you can build ostinatos underneath with your feet and make it part of your entire drum-kit practice or warmup routine. (My personal favorite)
 
One of my favorite tricks (if you will) is groupings of 5. If I want something faster than 16th notes when 32nds would either sound too busy or beyond my reach, 16th note quintuplets (I think that's what they are - 5 evenly spaced strokes over the span of 4 16ths) give the illusion of ridiculous speed even though it isn't necessarily. I heard a drummer do that a long time ago and have been hooked on the idea ever since; they become really fun when the spacing is just right and when it's comfortable.

A lot of players seem to skip this grouping opting to go from 16ths, 16th trips (?? ... 6 over 4 - aren't these 16th sextuplets?), then to 32nds. Five is an odd grouping but can sound bitchin when nailed. I'm sure 7 could be cool too as the last stop before hitting 32nds, though not as distinct from 32nds as 5s are from 16ths.

I know this isn't strictly in accordance with the thread title, but single strokes in the context of time is really what we're after (right?), and keeping the quintuples evenly spaced while maintaining a smooth quarter note pulse is not easy - it's not like playing 16ths accented every 5th hit since that's just playing 16ths in 5/16. Interestingly, since the speed is only a fractional notch faster than straight 16ths, the dragon to slay here is all in your head. The physical part isn't as much of a stretch once the muscle memory is obtained.

The drummer I first heard do this was Carmine Appice (on a Blue Murder record from '86-ish), but I think it's also what Jimmy Chamberlain used for those blazing fast snare singles on the 1st Smashing Pumpkins record, though I'm not positive.

Any one know where else I can hear someone play these?
 
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Great exercise in the grade 8 book. Singles from quarter notes up to groups of 10 at 65 BPM. Hard but fun!
 
Rudiments...Rudiments...and more Rudiments.....Paradiddle-diddle..

Like.

Question: what BPM is a single stroke roll considered by some?

Admittedly, I haven't 'worked' on anything in the last 10 years..., except for surviving practice with band members.

All of this reading makes me want to go home and just wail away at my kit for hours. I don't think I've done that in decades.
 
Like.

Question: what BPM is a single stroke roll considered by some?

Admittedly, I haven't 'worked' on anything in the last 10 years..., except for surviving practice with band members.

All of this reading makes me want to go home and just wail away at my kit for hours. I don't think I've done that in decades.

A SSR is a SSR at any tempo. If you are asking at what tempo should you strive for to get a nice smooth sounding SSR, I'd say shoot for 900 BPM, or 15 hits a second. It's a high goal. The world record used to be somewhere near 900 when they first started measuring that stuff. SSR start sounding creamy somewhere around 700 BPM, if I recall correctly. Start at a tempo you can do them cleanly, even if it's low like 400 BPM. Really. Cleanliness is THE most important element, aside from even-ness. If you can't do them clean, pull back to a tempo you can do them clean and work that until you feel you can bump it up a BPM or 2.
 
I've never heard of Vic Firth logs, but i'm assuming they are just larger sticks... If that's the case, I think that's a good way to start. Since I started with marching, I practice all of my rudiments with marching sticks (or 2Bs, but they are considerably thinner) and work with a practice pad.

Start out low and slow, with all of your rudiments, and then slow increase both tempo and volume unitl you max out, then just stay until you're tired, and then back it down gradually. There aren't really any shortcuts, it's like lifting weights, you just have to put the time and work in to ge the results. Also, if you really want to build control, try playing on a pillow or cushion rather than a practice pad so that you don't have any bounce, that will really enhance your ability to control the sticks when playing your rudiments.
 
Question: what BPM is a single stroke roll considered by some?

It depends entirely on the instrument. You can make a long tone or tremolo playing at a pretty low rate of speed on a large timpani, a concert bass drum, or a cymbal. On a woodblock or xylophone, which have a dry sound, you have to go pretty fast. I think generally most listeners perceive a fairly low rate of speed as a tremolo on whatever instrument. Super-fast continuous singles are kind of an overrated skill, in my book.
 
It depends entirely on the instrument. You can make a long tone or tremolo playing at a pretty low rate of speed on a large timpani, a concert bass drum, or a cymbal. On a woodblock or xylophone, which have a dry sound, you have to go pretty fast. I think generally most listeners perceive a fairly low rate of speed as a tremolo on whatever instrument. Super-fast continuous singles are kind of an overrated skill, in my book.

Yup.

And as time has gone on I've shifted heavily into the "practice the SSR as various subdivisions" school of thought. If you're knocking out groups of 12 at 80 BPM, say, you've probably got enough gas in the tank to go wherever you need to go in a musical setting. Hell, probably less than that.

I also then recommend practicing and measuring your top speed(s) in short bursts, because the likelihood of needing a blistering fast SSR for more than a few bars at any given tempo is pretty low.

But, that's me. Some guys like to do stuff for the thrillz. If you're planning to enter a WFD, your approach might be different. There are guys around here who can help with that - or at least there used to be.
 
Super-fast continuous singles are kind of an overrated skill, in my book.

This statement is like the antithesis of my whole endeavor Todd lol. Just goes to show that there are infinite ways to approach an instrument.

I want mad SSR skills, I don't want them to blow SSRs everywhere. I will admit they are nice to pull out on endings, and certain high points. Lopsided rolls bother me. I want creamy like buttah.

But for me, it's more of a thing where the reason I want a really blazing SSR, is so I can nail any obscure subdivision I want to hit... with friggin pinpoint accuracy.... That's the real reason. Quick clean hands are razor sharp. Accurate.

Another reason is the faster my capabilities, the less I have to work onstage. I'm basically very lazy, and I'd rather spend years developing the small muscles than be swinging my arms and lifting my legs at every gig I play. In a word, headroom. I don't like to flail about as I play. Working hard is good, working too hard is counter productive.

The word mastering always makes me cringe. Attempting to master is more my speed.
 
Just accept that you're slow and be groovy :)
 
A SSR is a SSR at any tempo. If you are asking at what tempo should you strive for to get a nice smooth sounding SSR, I'd say shoot for 900 BPM, or 15 hits a second. It's a high goal. The world record used to be somewhere near 900 when they first started measuring that stuff. SSR start sounding creamy somewhere around 700 BPM, if I recall correctly. Start at a tempo you can do them cleanly, even if it's low like 400 BPM. Really. Cleanliness is THE most important element, aside from even-ness. If you can't do them clean, pull back to a tempo you can do them clean and work that until you feel you can bump it up a BPM or 2.

Roger. Yeah, I normally go for around 960BPM (actually 240 1/4 notes on metronome). That seems to be my upper limit for any sustained period of time.

What I've found, is that the tighter my snare, the slower I seem. I like a tight snare, but often find myself feeling slower (because I hear distinct hits, instead of a buzz type sound). I pride myself with accuracy, so more often I like the ability to count through a 32nd/64th notes (time signature permitting).

But years ago, I'd loosen my snare, to cover up my lack of speed. Though the only person that probably noticed all of this nonsense was me anyway.
 
Roger. Yeah, I normally go for around 960BPM (actually 240 1/4 notes on metronome). That seems to be my upper limit for any sustained period of time.

What I've found, is that the tighter my snare, the slower I seem. I like a tight snare, but often find myself feeling slower (because I hear distinct hits, instead of a buzz type sound). I pride myself with accuracy, so more often I like the ability to count through a 32nd/64th notes (time signature permitting).

But years ago, I'd loosen my snare, to cover up my lack of speed. Though the only person that probably noticed all of this nonsense was me anyway.

Sixteenth notes at 240 BPM is a pretty good benchmark and musically useful. I make sure my students work on short bursts - i.e. 3s, 5s, 7s, 9s, 11s, 13s, 17s - at those upper range tempos because you're more likely to run into the need for that sort of thing than a sustained roll. At least I can't remember the last time I had a part that required a SSR sustained at 240 for more than a bar. But, I don't do a lot a blast-beating or that sort of thing.

Todd Bishop is - rightly - always on about paring down precious practice time to what's most useful to you in whatever kind of musical expression you choose. It's sound advice. I think more than too many players spend days and days and days on stuff that they may never get a chance to use.

There's a time and place to push boundaries just to create some technical headroom, but then there's also going on a fool's errand. It's really important to always keep the ends in mind. If you (collective) have a conception of what you might do with a 1000-strokes-a-minute sustained SSR, then get to it. I just don't hear that in my head, and haven't seen it in the repertoire I play, so I don't work on it.
 
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1) Have a target tempo. How fast are the songs you want to the single stroke for? If you don't have a target tempo, how can you ever succeed? No matter how fast you go, it will never be enough.

2) Short bursts. Play some 5-stroke-roll exercises, but replace the two double strokes with four singles. If you get the 5-stroke burst up to speed... Success! You have something you can use. Then work on the 9-stroke, then the 17.

3) After that, stop trying to play the roll quicker, and start trying to play it better.

I'm on step 3, and it's the hardest step.
 
I had taken a couple lessons from an amazing instructor. He had me playing rudiments open close open. This version of open close open was to play said rudiment starting out at a very slow tempo, making sure the sticks rebound, start speeding up very slowly making sure your right and left hand are producing an even sound. speed up very slowly until you reach your max speed. your max speed is just before you tense up and things start to fall apart, hold it there and very slowly start to reduce your speed in small increments being in control the whole time Bring it back down to very slow. it should take about 3 to 4 minutes to do. Do this on your snare drum as much as you can. its a very methodical deliberate exercise. I have been doing this for a couple months. It is paying off huge. Slow methodical deliberate practice can be boring and takes patience. It seems to be very effective for me.
 
For some reason, I've been lucky in that I have fairly mastered the double stroke roll. Way back when I used to take drum lessons, my insttructors insisted early on I learn the rudiments. I've found the singe stroke roll the most difficult - to start very slow, then slowly getting faster, then rolling, then coming out of it until I'm back where I started.

Looking at the great drummers of old, like Buddy Rich, Gene Krupa and those guys to Danny Seraphine, I've noticed they all had fantastic single stroke rolls.

So my plan? I have a good double-sided practice pad and I bought the Vic Firth logs - the wrist builders. I'm timing myself by started off at 30 seconds at a slow speed, then working up in 30 second or minute intervals and playing at a faster speed each time until I'm at my fastest. Then I spend a few mintues coming back down at slower speeds. I'm gradually increasing the amount of time I play, so I can build up endurance in my wrists without killing my wrists.

Is this a good way to approach this, or I am missing a better way? This seems to work, but not sure this is the most efficient.

Any ideas? Thanks!

that actually sounds like a good plan already! I'll use this idea to practice my strokes, thanks!
 
Get both hands as even as possible in regards to not just speed and power, but technique also. It'll make your single stroke roll flow a lot easier.
 
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