How should a band practice?

Duck Tape

Platinum Member
This stems from my 'buzz kill' thread. Bit of a long thread but it's one of those things that need detail.If that kills your buzz then click the back button!

I'm in a band with 2 perfectionist type characters who like to stop mid song to tell each other 'you played a wrong note' or to tell me 'use the ride in that part/play a beat more like the one that we've written on the midi file'.

They want to record a song as we practice and then sit and listen back to it straight away, or sit and listen to the original midi file. We only have about 2 hours practice each week and I'm surprised that they would want to sit and talk so much (this was a problem with a bass player in the rock band I left last year).

I know there are days where you're just not feeling it but they never show up to practice itching to jam, bust out a riff or a cool bass line, it's all pretty mechanical, and they don't seem to react to music as positively as other guys I play with.

By the end of practice the bassist always wants to get going in a hurry and I'm left thinking 'is that all you're willing to do?'

The icing on the cake - I want to go out and play some casual gigs to stay in touch with playing live but that's not a good idea because the bassist says we're not tight enough yet.

I've watched all of this happen and now I've hit a breaking point, voiced my opinion on all of these things and met a little opposition (from the bass player especially), which leads me to ask drummerworld the question - how should a band practice?

I think a band should play through songs in their entirety and repeatedly (until they're almost sick of hearing them), not get 30 seconds in and stop the other band members they missed the f#, I don't think that sort of disjointed practice will prepare you for live performances. And personally, I learn how to play something by playing it, not talking about it.

And what about all this 'constructive criticism' that couldn't wait until the end of the song? I think it's a real downer, it makes people feel constricted and they play like crap and look miserable like a school kid sent to the naughty chair. I think we all know when we've made a mistake and it raises a flag for the next time we play through. I'm a perfectionist too but I know when to shut up.

I'm sure you're all with me on allowing the drummer to write his own parts... a big reason I'm in any band is to have the freedom to express myself, and I don't like a guitarist telling me to play the beat he wrote in the midi file, or use the ride in that section. I think making those choices make me feel like part of the band and I shouldn't be deprived of them.

The discussion about these things was civil enough. But I'm feeling like I've been here before (in the last rock band) and wonder if it's the beginning of the end. I think the main reason I'm making this thread is to ask 'hey, am I crazy?'

Bloody bass players.
 
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Never been in a band, or gigged, but have jammed a little bit.

I have to say I've done those things, and not done those criticism things.

I agree with you completely though, finish the song. There's no point in stopping from a little insignificant mistake, and especially if you're playing it live! I wonder if there's a saying or two, but a huge part of being decent and learning musicians is how to react on the spot. If you mess up live, you can't stop it and bicker. I know for a fact that people make mistakes especially live but do you really hear or notice, hopefully not!
 
You are probably half crazy!

It does sound like your rehearsals are a little too structured. I've been in a band where jamming was a major part of songwriting and been in one where we didn't jam at all.

Maybe you could suggest that if the guitarists need to discuss missed F#'s then they get together seperately to analyse their parts and say that its more beneficial for you that you play the song all the way through each time.

It doesn't hurt to loop short sections over and over, but it does sound like one of your guitarists has taken the "leader" role. Bands are all about the different personalities involved, so managing him could be delicate/tricky!

It also sounds to me like the guitarist agonises over song writing whilst at home sat in front of his computer. Which to be honest is great. He probably feels like he spends more time than everyone else on songwriting (rightly or wrongly) which can lead to the kind of behaviour you are describing.

If I was you, get involved at that stage to ensure you get creative control and input into your drum parts. Either head on over to his house and suggest drum parts for sections and programme them in together. Or, and this would be my preferred approach. Get hold of cubase or whatever he uses, mimic his drum vst set up and swap files between you. That way you can have direct input into the drum parts whilst away from your usual practices.
 
Yes you're right, the guitarist did write everything, but I think when you bring musicians into a project you've written you should surrender some control, unless they're session muso's you're paying for. He's mostly cool, and agreed with this. I just said I'd make more of an effort to listen to the midi's so that I had a better understanding of the original intent. I would have previously but I just don't enjoy listening to midi's! I would rather learn by doing (as in play through them with the band and assert my own musical personality).
 
Sounds like a drag! You play drums to have fun, not to be debased in an enclosed area. Learning tunes a specific way is to some people a goal but with anything, you have to have proper seasoning. Play the tune down a few times, but record it. Take it home, absorb what you played. Next practice make changes to suit the composer.

I've been in situations like that before. Doesn't take me long to find the door and several of those folks are still looking for a drummer.

Being able to nail someone's specific song ideas is one thing but sometimes for some folks the band room is the only place they can "assume control" over anything and sometimes that "low man on the totem pole" turns out to be the drummer because our part in the music is so foundational.

Seriously, the bassist could be out of tune and because it does not sound right, the drummer gets the blame... :D
 
well there a a few ways to see it,
1. wen you get payed to play[in a studio]or band ,then the producer or bandleader,ask you to play they want to here it,but there is alway room for ideas,to see it a other way,to make it even beter.
2. playing in a cover band,then you should be able to play songs well,but there must be always room for solving some problems, .
3.when you make your own songs ,you need to have a basic idea how the song has to sound,
After that there must be room to for jamming and look for new ideas to make the song beter.

if there is a part that have is problem, we work on that part until we have a solution for that part.but it always depend on the skills of the players to get it smart.

But always keep you members of a band motivated and have fun,because thats wy we want to play to have FUN.It has to be relaxed wen you play in band or studio.
If there is any form of pressure you will not preform as good as you want.
And if there a some things above your skill ,just say it,but always try to have a alternative for a problem.
 
I agree with the above posts about not stopping part way through a song, unless it becomes a complete train wreck that is.
In my old band we had a few songs where we would play a section on loop (bridge-chorus-bridge-chorus etc) to get it right but none of the bands I've ever been in have been adamant that everything is note perfect all the time. It's a practice, it's better to get something wrong there than at a live gig.
My current band are all fairly competent musicians and we all work on our parts individually between our rehearsals so they aren't too structured beyond playing through the songs. This doesn't always work in our favour since we practice at the guitarists house and after a bit we have 'a break' and end up playing Mario Kart instead. (I don't mind the hanging out too much since we are all good friends outside of the band too)
We are looking to expand the band and upgrade the sound to full kit/electric guitars etc so hopefully we'll be away from any distractions and play more in a proper rehearsal room.
 
If you are a full member of a band surely you are there for what you bring to the music. Even if someone is the sole songwriter it can make a song by how the others interpret it.

If the songwriter has a very fixed idea of how a particular song has to be played because its crucial to the sound, fair enough. If the composer has a fixed idea of how "every" instrument in every song has to be then they needs session musicians, not band members.
 
Yes you're right, the guitarist did write everything, but I think when you bring musicians into a project you've written you should surrender some control, unless they're session muso's you're paying for. He's mostly cool, and agreed with this. I just said I'd make more of an effort to listen to the midi's so that I had a better understanding of the original intent. I would have previously but I just don't enjoy listening to midi's! I would rather learn by doing (as in play through them with the band and assert my own musical personality).

Quickest way to see if he will surrender some control is to have the "percentage split" talk!

Even if the band never makes any money at all, its always worth having this talk as you find out pretty early on whats going on in each band members mind!
 
Quickest way to see if he will surrender some control is to have the "percentage split" talk!

Even if the band never makes any money at all, its always worth having this talk as you find out pretty early on whats going on in each band members mind!

hahaha yes thats a good one.I like that.will work indeed!!!
 
There really is no right or wrong answer here. A band should practise how the members feel comfortable practicing. I am in two bands with two completely different work ethics, two completely different song writing techniques, and I have very different roles in each one. Communication is the key to any kind of relationship. you need to keep voicing you opinion despite any resistance you may meet. Make the other members give their opinion in an open forum, it is the only way to ensure everybody is on the same page.

You need to be flexible to deal with the different personalities in a band, but you should also demand that flexibility from the other members. If one songwriter is unwaivering and wants total control everybody else needs to know that before it blows up and causes real friction within the band.

Good luck man, follow your heart.
 
With enthusiasm and fun. With alcohol and groupies.
 
Hello. I wanted to chime in.

If you are doing all originals and are an unsigned band, then whoever writes the song really does have the control. They should take input but the decision is up to them. They simply want to hear what they want to hear.

As far as 'not being ready' to go out on stage, that really is subjective. But I am sure you know that the worst thing you can do is go out before you really are ready. If you are tight on beginning and ends and know the structure, breaks, changes, timings, etc, and you can do all your sets (with life) then you could be there. One suggestion is to find a place (someones yard, rent a small hall, or something) and have a party and have a friendly trial and play your material in front of people. You will know if you are ready for more after that, as well as if the band truly meshes.

There are a few things in you post that you may want to consider. You said 'We only have about 2 hours practice each week'. Unless everyone is a studio musician or their only job is playing, it will be very hard to get tight on enough tunes for playing clubs. You also said 'I know there are days where you're just not feeling it'. I've only ever seen this happen when someone is unhappy with the band, and that is not healthy for any band. The fact that you say 'By the end of practice the bassist always wants to get going in a hurry' leads me to believe he may be frustrated or have a different agenda.

As for poetic license, it does not matter if you are playing 7 nights a week or 2 hours a week. You need to have fun. If you're not having fun it will show up in your material. But I do believe that in originals, whomever wrote the song is the arranger and you will need to play around what they want. In cover bands it is a lot different.

What I have seen over many years in numerous bands - both original and covers - is pretty much the same as what you wrote. Stopping in the middle to fix something is common. I am sure if you don't like what you hear you yourself will stop the song to get it fixed. Recording and playback during a 2 hour per week window is not conducive if you are planning to go out on stage any time soon though.

If you are happy with the band and the material and want to stick it out, that is great. But consider what you want to play, and then make the choice to stay or move on.

Hope this helps.
 
It all depends on what your goals are. It sounds like to me that you each have conflicting goals.

I don't play in an all originals band anymore because I am not fond of the studio, and I like performing live at the local watering holes and community events. Everyone in "my" band is on the same page. We are all old friends, married with children, have homes, jobs, taxes to pay, etc. etc...

When we formed the band, we made sure that everything was laid out on the table: how many gigs we are going to play each month, what type of music we are going to play, who is the "front man" (still working on that one, nobody wants the job), how many practices we have each week, who is bringing the beer, what we do with the money we make on gigs...

It took me a long time to realize that going in with the same goal is the key to any successful long term relationship.

Unless a song is a total train wreck, I never, ever, ever stop playing. That was one of the first rules that I learned as a performing musician. If the band is learning a song, and is having trouble with a particular part; we push through, and critique it after the song is over. We may go back and play the entire song, or we may practice the part that we are having trouble with AND THEN play the entire song again until we get it right. If we are learning a song, and it sounds okay; we play it over and over until we all feel it is right. The question that is always asked before we move on is, "everyone good with that?"
 
This stems from my 'buzz kill' thread. Bit of a long thread but it's one of those things that need detail.If that kills your buzz then click the back button!

I'm in a band with 2 perfectionist type characters who like to stop mid song to tell each other 'you played a wrong note' or to tell me 'use the ride in that part/play a beat more like the one that we've written on the midi file'.

They want to record a song as we practice and then sit and listen back to it straight away, or sit and listen to the original midi file. We only have about 2 hours practice each week and I'm surprised that they would want to sit and talk so much (this was a problem with a bass player in the rock band I left last year).

I know there are days where you're just not feeling it but they never show up to practice itching to jam, bust out a riff or a cool bass line, it's all pretty mechanical, and they don't seem to react to music as positively as other guys I play with.

By the end of practice the bassist always wants to get going in a hurry and I'm left thinking 'is that all you're willing to do?'

The icing on the cake - I want to go out and play some casual gigs to stay in touch with playing live but that's not a good idea because the bassist says we're not tight enough yet.

I've watched all of this happen and now I've hit a breaking point, voiced my opinion on all of these things and met a little opposition (from the bass player especially), which leads me to ask drummerworld the question - how should a band practice?

I think a band should play through songs in their entirety and repeatedly (until they're almost sick of hearing them), not get 30 seconds in and stop the other band members they missed the f#, I don't think that sort of disjointed practice will prepare you for live performances. And personally, I learn how to play something by playing it, not talking about it.

And what about all this 'constructive criticism' that couldn't wait until the end of the song? I think it's a real downer, it makes people feel constricted and they play like crap and look miserable like a school kid sent to the naughty chair. I think we all know when we've made a mistake and it raises a flag for the next time we play through. I'm a perfectionist too but I know when to shut up.

I'm sure you're all with me on allowing the drummer to write his own parts... a big reason I'm in any band is to have the freedom to express myself, and I don't like a guitarist telling me to play the beat he wrote in the midi file, or use the ride in that section. I think making those choices make me feel like part of the band and I shouldn't be deprived of them.

The discussion about these things was civil enough. But I'm feeling like I've been here before (in the last rock band) and wonder if it's the beginning of the end. I think the main reason I'm making this thread is to ask 'hey, am I crazy?'

Bloody bass players.

This was my experience with my last project. The "leader" didn't want to gig, only record and release music online. He wanted to record every practice. We rarely made it through an entire song at any practice. I never felt comfortable with any songs we had. He also kept changing the names of all the songs so often that I had no clue what we were playing. This went on for a year before I finally gave up. I actually like the guy, but I am so glad it's over... I don't think you are crazy.
 
I'm in a band with 2 perfectionist type characters who like to stop mid song to tell each other 'you played a wrong note' or to tell me 'use the ride in that part/play a beat more like the one that we've written on the midi file'.

If that happens each and every song I would first state that it sucks to practice this way. If they insisted this is THE WAY, then I'd be gone.

That sounds like absolutely no fun.... the piano teacher rapping everybody's knuckles when they deviate from stated music score.
 
We always play through a number, mistakes or no. The one exception is if someone misses a transition or a change gets screwed up... That's hard to recover from, and then we all need to discuss the song structure and agree.

Often if there's an issue with one part of the song, instead of stopping the rehearsal of the song, at the end, we go back and just practice the one part we had trouble with, and the goal is to immediately play it through and correct.
 
I generally think a band should play though the songs entirely.

But.... there are times, usually in the first few times thru, when something should be addressed at the moment because It can be difficult to remember what/when the issue was. Did someone just hit a bad note or are they playing a wrong note.

Once you know the song, just play thru like you'd do it live, it no matter what happens.

I also think that the players need to learn their parts on their own time.

If someone has a drum part suggestion, I'm always open.However, I don't ever remember anyone suggesting anything. If I'm playing some's song and they seem to have a specific part they need to have played, I suppose I should play it that way. It's just never come up before.

Re: listening to recordings, ...that's something to do on your own time also. Everybody should listen to it a bunch, develop some thoughts and then discuss them and cme to a consensus.
 
Doesnt sound crazy to me just sounds like you are fustrated beyond belief. If you want to gig and they dont I would look elsewhere. Good luck lad.
 
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