pixelbreaker
Member
Hey Gavin,
Yes, I did mean 2 and 4... sorry, it was really early in the morning... lol... thanks for the reply....
Yes, I did mean 2 and 4... sorry, it was really early in the morning... lol... thanks for the reply....
CareyCopelandCameron
Member
Hi CareyCopelandCameron
I that rug really tied the room together,didnt it?
sorry - you lost me there.
Sorry Gavin,I was just joking
That was just some quotation of "The Big Lebowski"...
Wish you a nice day!
Chris
Hello again Gavin! I'm trying to figure out what the best interface between Logic and the drum mics would be. I've had Logic Pro 8 for over a year now, however, I never tried recording drums with it. I have this old KORG D1600mkII that's served me well, so ideally I'd like to be able to record on both simultaneously, if that is possible. I just don't know what a good investment would be for signal routers. Any input is greatly appreciated.
As always, an honor to converse with you. =)
-mp
As always, an honor to converse with you. =)
-mp
Gavin Harrison
DRUMMERWORLD PRO DRUMMER
Hi Abhishek
could you recommend a really trash china from the Zildjian line? Really like what you use during gigs.
It depends how big you want it. I really like the Zildjian Oriental China Trash line. I use a 16" and a 12".
Hi Mike Machine
Could you tell us what you use to mount your EV N/D 408's? are they pearl mic booms?
Yes on my setup at home I still have the old Pearl mic boom arms. With PT I just use the top of an old mic stand that's been cut down and mount it off the rack with the PCX200 clamp.
Hi Mauriesje
In the MD issue of jan 09 with the GH cover story, on pp 49 it can be seen that his setup is built on a puzzle-piece-like carpet (or whatever it is)...Anyone any idea what it is, and if so, where it can be purchased?!?
It's a home gym exercise floor mat. You can find them in sports shops or department stores.
Hi osi.3
I'm trying to figure out what the best interface between Logic and the drum mics would be. I've had Logic Pro 8 for over a year now, however, I never tried recording drums with it.
There's a lot available that do just that. It depends on your budget really and how many mics you want to plug into it. I'm using two Apogee Rosetta 800s so I can record 16 channels of drums - but it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them - and a PCI card. Some of the interfaces you can plug the mics directly into them. If you don't need something as big as that you could try the MOTU 828.
cheers
Gavin
could you recommend a really trash china from the Zildjian line? Really like what you use during gigs.
It depends how big you want it. I really like the Zildjian Oriental China Trash line. I use a 16" and a 12".
Hi Mike Machine
Could you tell us what you use to mount your EV N/D 408's? are they pearl mic booms?
Yes on my setup at home I still have the old Pearl mic boom arms. With PT I just use the top of an old mic stand that's been cut down and mount it off the rack with the PCX200 clamp.
Hi Mauriesje
In the MD issue of jan 09 with the GH cover story, on pp 49 it can be seen that his setup is built on a puzzle-piece-like carpet (or whatever it is)...Anyone any idea what it is, and if so, where it can be purchased?!?
It's a home gym exercise floor mat. You can find them in sports shops or department stores.
Hi osi.3
I'm trying to figure out what the best interface between Logic and the drum mics would be. I've had Logic Pro 8 for over a year now, however, I never tried recording drums with it.
There's a lot available that do just that. It depends on your budget really and how many mics you want to plug into it. I'm using two Apogee Rosetta 800s so I can record 16 channels of drums - but it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them - and a PCI card. Some of the interfaces you can plug the mics directly into them. If you don't need something as big as that you could try the MOTU 828.
cheers
Gavin
Thanks for the information! The Apogee Ensemble is exactly what I'm looking for. -mp
edit: What do you mean when you say "it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them" (meaning the Rosetta 800s)? I suppose there's another piece of equipment involved?
edit: What do you mean when you say "it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them" (meaning the Rosetta 800s)? I suppose there's another piece of equipment involved?
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Heitor
Junior Member
Hi Gavin!
How much dampening do you use recently, especially on the snare? For an example, on the Rhythmic Designs DVD. You talk about the zero rings but throughout the DVD I don't see them in action. Or in a Porcupine Tree situation (studio or live), how do you deal with the harmonic ringing on the snare? Do you ALWAYS use the zero rings or gaffer tape or something like that? Because no matter how much careful I am with tuning the snare drum, when it comes the time to record something, it always rings too much and I have to use some dampening, especially Moongels.
Second, do you have any plans of doing something like the latest book/DVD package but with Porcupine Tree songs? Perhaps showing how to approach drum parts and fills in a more straight setting like rock, progressive, metal or pop...
Thanks for the everlasting inspiration you work gives me!
Heitor.
How much dampening do you use recently, especially on the snare? For an example, on the Rhythmic Designs DVD. You talk about the zero rings but throughout the DVD I don't see them in action. Or in a Porcupine Tree situation (studio or live), how do you deal with the harmonic ringing on the snare? Do you ALWAYS use the zero rings or gaffer tape or something like that? Because no matter how much careful I am with tuning the snare drum, when it comes the time to record something, it always rings too much and I have to use some dampening, especially Moongels.
Second, do you have any plans of doing something like the latest book/DVD package but with Porcupine Tree songs? Perhaps showing how to approach drum parts and fills in a more straight setting like rock, progressive, metal or pop...
Thanks for the everlasting inspiration you work gives me!
Heitor.
Hey Gavin,
I have two questions.
1. How do you get your ghost n grace notes heard at a live venue so clearly. At my gigs I don't think they can be heard to well. It sounds more like a fuzz/buzz. What factors do I have to look at in order to achieve clear articulation on my snare in a live environment.
2. When the band or Steve introduces a new song to you, what is usually the first step you take in putting your name on it, drum wise. What approach works best for you on most occasions when contributing your drum parts to a song?
Faithfully,
Dane.
I have two questions.
1. How do you get your ghost n grace notes heard at a live venue so clearly. At my gigs I don't think they can be heard to well. It sounds more like a fuzz/buzz. What factors do I have to look at in order to achieve clear articulation on my snare in a live environment.
2. When the band or Steve introduces a new song to you, what is usually the first step you take in putting your name on it, drum wise. What approach works best for you on most occasions when contributing your drum parts to a song?
Faithfully,
Dane.
Padman77
Junior Member
Hi Gavin,
I have a question about your great new DVD: In the section Discussions - Bass Drum you talk about a piece of wood at the front head. I understand the function of the wood, but I can not imagine how it looks like and how you anchor it inside the bass drum.
Also I have two general questions: Do you think that the sticks you are playing at the moment are the perfect sticks for you, or if you could create your own stick, would you change something, maybe weight, tip or else? And how do you know at which size do you have to cut down your broken cymbals, so that they fit together, or do you just try it out?
Thank you very much for answering, I really appreciate it!
(I apologise for my English, but it is not my first language)
I have a question about your great new DVD: In the section Discussions - Bass Drum you talk about a piece of wood at the front head. I understand the function of the wood, but I can not imagine how it looks like and how you anchor it inside the bass drum.
Also I have two general questions: Do you think that the sticks you are playing at the moment are the perfect sticks for you, or if you could create your own stick, would you change something, maybe weight, tip or else? And how do you know at which size do you have to cut down your broken cymbals, so that they fit together, or do you just try it out?
Thank you very much for answering, I really appreciate it!
(I apologise for my English, but it is not my first language)
Gavin Harrison
DRUMMERWORLD PRO DRUMMER
Hi osi.3
What do you mean when you say "it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them" (meaning the Rosetta 800s)? I suppose there's another piece of equipment involved?
There are no direct mic inputs on the back of the Rosettas. Only a "D" connector which you plug a multi core into. The mics need to go through amps first and then be passed on down the multi core to the Apogees.
Hi Heitor
How much dampening do you use recently, especially on the snare? For an example, on the Rhythmic Designs DVD. You talk about the zero rings but throughout the DVD I don't see them in action. Or in a Porcupine Tree situation (studio or live), how do you deal with the harmonic ringing on the snare? Do you ALWAYS use the zero rings or gaffer tape or something like that?
With my 14" snare drums I always use a zero ring or two. The 12" snares I tend to just place a tiny loop of gaffa tape on.
Second, do you have any plans of doing something like the latest book/DVD package but with Porcupine Tree songs?
Not at the moment - but it is in the back of my mind.
Hi Dane777
1. How do you get your ghost n grace notes heard at a live venue so clearly. At my gigs I don't think they can be heard to well. It sounds more like a fuzz/buzz. What factors do I have to look at in order to achieve clear articulation on my snare in a live environment.
I use Puresound snare wires cut down to just 8 strands in the middle - and they are on pretty tight. There's also a mic underneath the snare drum for picking up that detail.
2. When the band or Steve introduces a new song to you, what is usually the first step you take in putting your name on it, drum wise. What approach works best for you on most occasions when contributing your drum parts to a song?
I just jam along with it at home until I start to find something that I like.
Hi Padman77
I have a question about your great new DVD: In the section Discussions - Bass Drum you talk about a piece of wood at the front head. I understand the function of the wood, but I can not imagine how it looks like and how you anchor it inside the bass drum.
Velcro - or as I believe they call it in the States "Hook and Loop". There's some black "loop" stuck on the drum shell - and then some white "hook" on the ends of the piece of wood.
Do you think that the sticks you are playing at the moment are the perfect sticks for you, or if you could create your own stick, would you change something, maybe weight, tip or else?
I'm pretty happy with the way they are now. I haven't messed around with the possibilities of designing a stick - I couldn't really do that on my own. To be honest nobody has ever asked me.
And how do you know at which size do you have to cut down your broken cymbals, so that they fit together, or do you just try it out?
With the ones that I've cut - they've usually sounded good straight away. If they don't - I just cut them smaller until they do.
cheers
Gavin
What do you mean when you say "it requires a desk to handle the mics and pass on the signal to them" (meaning the Rosetta 800s)? I suppose there's another piece of equipment involved?
There are no direct mic inputs on the back of the Rosettas. Only a "D" connector which you plug a multi core into. The mics need to go through amps first and then be passed on down the multi core to the Apogees.
Hi Heitor
How much dampening do you use recently, especially on the snare? For an example, on the Rhythmic Designs DVD. You talk about the zero rings but throughout the DVD I don't see them in action. Or in a Porcupine Tree situation (studio or live), how do you deal with the harmonic ringing on the snare? Do you ALWAYS use the zero rings or gaffer tape or something like that?
With my 14" snare drums I always use a zero ring or two. The 12" snares I tend to just place a tiny loop of gaffa tape on.
Second, do you have any plans of doing something like the latest book/DVD package but with Porcupine Tree songs?
Not at the moment - but it is in the back of my mind.
Hi Dane777
1. How do you get your ghost n grace notes heard at a live venue so clearly. At my gigs I don't think they can be heard to well. It sounds more like a fuzz/buzz. What factors do I have to look at in order to achieve clear articulation on my snare in a live environment.
I use Puresound snare wires cut down to just 8 strands in the middle - and they are on pretty tight. There's also a mic underneath the snare drum for picking up that detail.
2. When the band or Steve introduces a new song to you, what is usually the first step you take in putting your name on it, drum wise. What approach works best for you on most occasions when contributing your drum parts to a song?
I just jam along with it at home until I start to find something that I like.
Hi Padman77
I have a question about your great new DVD: In the section Discussions - Bass Drum you talk about a piece of wood at the front head. I understand the function of the wood, but I can not imagine how it looks like and how you anchor it inside the bass drum.
Velcro - or as I believe they call it in the States "Hook and Loop". There's some black "loop" stuck on the drum shell - and then some white "hook" on the ends of the piece of wood.
Do you think that the sticks you are playing at the moment are the perfect sticks for you, or if you could create your own stick, would you change something, maybe weight, tip or else?
I'm pretty happy with the way they are now. I haven't messed around with the possibilities of designing a stick - I couldn't really do that on my own. To be honest nobody has ever asked me.
And how do you know at which size do you have to cut down your broken cymbals, so that they fit together, or do you just try it out?
With the ones that I've cut - they've usually sounded good straight away. If they don't - I just cut them smaller until they do.
cheers
Gavin
Phil Brodermann
Member
Hi Gavin, Why is the interior of your kit black?
I thought I noticed on the DVD, but I thought it might be a reflection on the head.
Thanks
I thought I noticed on the DVD, but I thought it might be a reflection on the head.
Thanks
Thanks for replying! I'm in the process of building a rehearsal room. Do you know much about sound proofing? I'm curious first if it hinders recordings if there's too much of it on the walls etc., and second, how much surface area of the walls I'm sound proofing will need to be covered, maybe a percentage estimate?
Much appreciation,
mp
Much appreciation,
mp
ChrisGau
Junior Member
If I am allowed to jump in... I just took something similar to this (I think it´s called side cutter) to cut them off...
... and something similar to that (a file?)...
... in order to not allow the cut off strand to damage your thin resonant head. As I like Gavin's focussed snare sounds, I was pretty happy with the result. It really helped me reducing the snare buzz. Don´t know whether it´s fits to your Piccolo Snare... I applied it to a 14x5 Sonor Delite Snare.
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SantiBanks
Senior Member
To elaborate a bit more in this;
The apogee ensemble has 4 preamps of its own which means that you can connect 4 mics simoultanously. You also have the option for ADAT which means that you can expand the ensemble with any ADAT convertor.
That can give you a total of 4 (ensemble) + 8 (external convertor) mic preamps.
As interfaces are concerned, I personally used my presonus firestudio 26 for a long time. It has 8 preamps and it's cheaper then the ensemble (and sounds smilar I think). Echo Audio just released their long anticipated Audiofire Pre8. Wonderful soundquality, top conversion and 8 very good preamps for under 700.
If you are on a mac, try to find yourself the Metric Halo 2882. Those have 8 preamps (don't be fooled, 4 have mic connectors, the other ones have fantom over jack so that means you need an xlr to stereo jack cable) and the 2882 is one of the best sounding units in its priceclass (and the class higher too) and they should cost the same or less then the ensemble (but give much more options like on board effects and even the option to record right from the interface with the 2D card which is installed in the unit that is shown in the link)
If you want an interface and a separate ADAT convertor, try Presonus or Mackie Onyx 800. They both have great preamps and don't break the bank (Mackie is what Gavin uses). Advantage of the Mackie is that it already has 192 khz options in case you are interested in that.
Focusrite just announced their new octopre MK2 which costs less then 400 dollars. Not sure how it sounds but that doesn't break the bank either… And of course there are other convertors/preamp combinations as well in all price ranges.
Another option I just thought about are mixingdesks with usb/firewire options. Mackie has a serie that can do it. I believe that soundcraft also has these. I couldn't find the Mackie's anymore at thomann but you might want to check their website.
If I can be a bit of advice, it is wise to invest in good convertors and good mics. The preamps will not make that huge significance in sound. Good quality microphones and the setup define your drumsound and quality of the recording the most.
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ItalianRicky
Member
Hi gavin.
I saw on the photos taken for the newest dvd, that you put on your toms and floor toms the S-hoops.
WHY?
I already know that on the snare they're helpful, they help to save sticks, and keep rings in their place.
How this hoops can affect the drums sound to you?
My pearl drumkit have Die cast hoops on every tom and FT, but i really cannot understand the use of s-hoops on every drum.
I hope that i'm not bothering you.
I wish a good weekend to you.
Cheers from Italy
Riccardo
I saw on the photos taken for the newest dvd, that you put on your toms and floor toms the S-hoops.
WHY?
I already know that on the snare they're helpful, they help to save sticks, and keep rings in their place.
How this hoops can affect the drums sound to you?
My pearl drumkit have Die cast hoops on every tom and FT, but i really cannot understand the use of s-hoops on every drum.
I hope that i'm not bothering you.
I wish a good weekend to you.
Cheers from Italy
Riccardo
Thanks for all the excellent ideas SantiBanks. Certainly not making any hasty decisions here.
Do you think the "fully-integrated with Logic" quality of the Ensemble would give advantage over the Audiofire, though? I'm using an Audix DP 5A 5-piece drum mic package in addition to 2 AKG overhead condensers, not top of the line mics, but worthy of my current setup.
From this: "That can give you a total of 4 (ensemble) + 8 (external convertor) mic preamps" do you mean it's possible to record 12 tracks at once? That would be extremely useful for group sessions.
Sincerely
mp
Do you think the "fully-integrated with Logic" quality of the Ensemble would give advantage over the Audiofire, though? I'm using an Audix DP 5A 5-piece drum mic package in addition to 2 AKG overhead condensers, not top of the line mics, but worthy of my current setup.
From this: "That can give you a total of 4 (ensemble) + 8 (external convertor) mic preamps" do you mean it's possible to record 12 tracks at once? That would be extremely useful for group sessions.
Sincerely
mp
ahector
Senior Member
Gavin,
When you record at home, do you hire an engineer or do you do everything yourself? If you do it yourself, how does that work (i.e. do you have a laptop next to the drum kit or something like that)?
I do a lot of home (or rented rehearsal space that is) recording of myself and I hate having to be my own engineer. I would love to have the luxury to focus on playing the instrument and not to have to deal with the technical aspect of recording at the same time!
When you record at home, do you hire an engineer or do you do everything yourself? If you do it yourself, how does that work (i.e. do you have a laptop next to the drum kit or something like that)?
I do a lot of home (or rented rehearsal space that is) recording of myself and I hate having to be my own engineer. I would love to have the luxury to focus on playing the instrument and not to have to deal with the technical aspect of recording at the same time!
Hello Gavin,
I first heard about you from my drumming instructor Brad Schuelter at the Drum Pad in IL, and he had me listen to Blackest Eyes back in 2007 (which was RIGHT after you guys came in town) and since then I was mesmorized by your playing. Me and my older brother saw you guys in Chicago in September, and both agree, you guys were just amazing. Thank you very much for being such a great inspiration, and I look forward to the many years I will be working with your books and DVD's (yes, it will be years).
If I could ask one question of you, and if it has been asked I appoligize, but there is a fill in Mellotron Scratch at 4:56 that I also heard in the live version of Hatesong in "Arriving Somewhere..." I don't suppose you could explain that, could you?
I look forward to seeing you in Chicago on the 30th of April, and again on the 2nd of May in Detroit. I will be right up front!
I first heard about you from my drumming instructor Brad Schuelter at the Drum Pad in IL, and he had me listen to Blackest Eyes back in 2007 (which was RIGHT after you guys came in town) and since then I was mesmorized by your playing. Me and my older brother saw you guys in Chicago in September, and both agree, you guys were just amazing. Thank you very much for being such a great inspiration, and I look forward to the many years I will be working with your books and DVD's (yes, it will be years).
If I could ask one question of you, and if it has been asked I appoligize, but there is a fill in Mellotron Scratch at 4:56 that I also heard in the live version of Hatesong in "Arriving Somewhere..." I don't suppose you could explain that, could you?
I look forward to seeing you in Chicago on the 30th of April, and again on the 2nd of May in Detroit. I will be right up front!
SantiBanks
Senior Member
That is a very good decision
Hasty decisions are usually not the right ones…"fully integrated with Logic" is nothing fancy. It only means that you can open up some panels in Logic that give access to parameters in the Ensemble (or duet, or one or mio for that matter). It's the same as opening up the configuration panel or the audio-midi setup. Its just some fancy screens with the same functionality and a picture of the apogee in logic.
In my opinion, not really a very unique sellingpoint.
As your mics are concerned, it's not really about the quality of the mic. Sure it's a factor but I can bet that I can make the most expensive mics in the world sound like crap.
I did a lot of research on soundcards and their convertor and preamp quality. Its a very difficult topic. There is difference in audio quality between manufactors. Thats one thing that is sure. However, these can be minime.
Echo and Apogee use good components. The thing with Apogee however is that they are much longer in the ballpark and have a high reputation (which they earned with their dithering technique btw.)
You can't go wrong with an apogee. But on the other hand, you can't go wrong with the Audiofire 8, AudioPre 8 or Audiofire 12 from Echo. They have top notch convertors and good preamps too.
The difference in price is large (ensemble is maybe twice as much) but keep in mind that the audio quality isn't twice as good. For a bit better audio performance, prices are usually exponentially higher.
If you are willing to pay the price for an Apogee, then I really suggest looking at Metric Halo. You get a lot more functionality (which is useful functionality), dsp and 8 preamps instead of 4 for a similar price and the audio quality is on par or even better then the Apogee Ensemble.
If you want to do some research yourself, then I'll recommend the gearslutz forum
If you buy a separate adat convertor, then you can record 12 tracks at once yes. If you buy something like the presonus and have 2 adat convertors, then you can record 26 channels at once.
Mackie did release the Onyx 1200F some years ago. It has 12 preamps I believe and is a 2 rackunit firewire soundcard. I have the small onyx, the mackie preamps are good stuff. If you want 12 channels in a box, then I'll suggest that one. However, check the mackie forums for driver support. The only thing I dislike about mackie is their support for their units. Drivers are usually not updated (my onyx is wonky now I use snow leopard…)