Question about threads being closed?

B

Bonzobilly

Senior Member
So why would the "chops vs. groove" thread get closed? I say let people discuss. I don't understand why the hammer gets thrown so quickly sometimes. I also think that if a long timer posted that, things may have transpired differently? The guy with 30 posts? Not so much. I'm not trying to be a pain. Just an observation of this situation that reminds me of others. Do we need more liberals around here? ;)
 
Because it was an absolutely useless thread that has been discussed ad nauseum. There is nothing to learn from rehashing that subject. Do a quick search and you'll find plenty to read on that subject. Things like that can't be locked quick enough for me.
 
Bonzobilly said:
.... "chops vs. groove" thread get closed?
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Topics like that really never do much more than bring out the worst in some people. Big kit vs. small kit is another topic that has played out badly, in the past.​
 
Bonzobilly said:
So why would the "chops vs. groove" thread get closed? I say let people discuss. I don't understand why the hammer gets thrown so quickly sometimes. I also think that if a long timer posted that, things may have transpired differently? The guy with 30 posts? Not so much. I'm not trying to be a pain. Just an observation of this situation that reminds me of others. Do we need more liberals around here? ;)
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Chops vs groove has been beaten to death, both in steady, deep-pocketed rhythmic beating and flurries of busy argumentation. They follow a pattern and then people tire of the topic. I am glad to see the thread closed.

In exchange for policing against trolls, spammers and drunken loudmouths hopping on the pool table and waving a broken beer bottle, we give the mods power to shut down any conversation and banish any person and they don't need to justify their reasons. I've had some threads locked too when I first started here. We all know what the terms of service are and in my nearly 7 years here and a half-dozen moderators, I have seen them tolerate abuse, act bravely, change diapers and get their share of appreciation, but I have yet to see the mods act outside of the boundaries.
 
Bonzobilly said:
So why would the "chops vs. groove" thread get closed? I say let people discuss. I don't understand why the hammer gets thrown so quickly sometimes. I also think that if a long timer posted that, things may have transpired differently? The guy with 30 posts? Not so much. I'm not trying to be a pain. Just an observation of this situation that reminds me of others. Do we need more liberals around here? ;)
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Fair point, Bonzo. There's some history on this forum (and other forums) where chops v groove and chops v feel threads have gotten very heated. People get offended for some reason. My take on the way the threads go is :

1 "More technique" does not equal "better musician"
2.... though it very often does
3 and you need chops to groove
4 And chops need groove
5 Not necessarily
6 and Bonzo didn't have lessons
7 Here we go. Darn good-for-nothing lazy faux musicians thinking they can avoid the hard work of building technique - Bonzo's one in a million, kid.
8 Darn snooty by-the-book closed-minded puritan sanctimonious arsehole ...
9 Post modernist!
10 Slave of Mammon!

At #11 the mods step in.
 
Bonzobilly said:
Do we need more liberals around here? ;)
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Dunno mate. But I sure as hell know for certain we don't need another chops vs groove thread........ever. That's like saying we need another Chernobyl.

In this case it's less about stifling debate and more to do with preserving sanity and common sense for all. :)
 
I just figured the thread starter was looking for another angle to pimp his website/company/online magazine, whatever it is that he's trying to do. Every post I've seen of his turns back towards his enterprise. Commercialism is typically frowned upon in community forums. There are manufacturers, reps and endorsers on this board, but they contribute as drummers first. Occasionally they will defend their company or answer questions. But their focus is on the drumming community as a whole.
 
I didn't agree that the thread should have been closed. It is a heated subject because so many drummers have an opinion on it. Isn't a forum a place where we can exchange our points of view as long as they are done respectfully?

I know chops vs groove is a potential blood bath in the making but at least give us a chance before you just shut the whole thread down. When it was shut down I was kinda shocked and felt like "ohhh this is not the sort of forum I thought it was". As in, open and free as long as we are respectful.

In a nutshell if the moderators feel like there is no other way I can except it and move on but hopefully we can have heated discussions here and be respectful. Maybe the members have disrespected each other and hit below the belt so much that the moderators just won't put up with it so I guess I can understand that as well. Who knows.

For the record it ALL matters. Chops, groove etc. If you want to be a well rounded drummer never be close minded :)
 
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I suppose I see people's points. I too have seen many heated arguments over seemingly nothing. I guess personally I'd rather see that than have a tight around the collar sort of feeling as I surf through the boards. But hey, I'm a guest. I get it.
 
Anon La Ply said:
Fair point, Bonzo. There's some history on this forum (and other forums) where chops v groove and chops v feel threads have gotten very heated. People get offended for some reason. My take on the way the threads go is :

1 "More technique" does not equal "better musician"
2.... though it very often does
3 and you need chops to groove
4 And chops need groove
5 Not necessarily
6 and Bonzo didn't have lessons
7 Here we go. Darn good-for-nothing lazy faux musicians thinking they can avoid the hard work of building technique - Bonzo's one in a million, kid.
8 Darn snooty by-the-book closed-minded puritan sanctimonious arsehole ...
9 Post modernist!
10 Slave of Mammon!

At #11 the mods step in.
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Yup, this is pretty much how that thread would have panned out, the only variable being how long it would take to get to stage 11.

Perhaps we could have a "popcorn" rating in addition to a star rating ;)
 
Does anyone else think Pol may be wound too tight?? hahaha good post
 
Hmmm, didn't even notice it was gone... but I didn't close it.

It should be noted that the OP is able to close a thread that they've started, so it's possible he may have done it, not a mod. I don't agree with allowing that, as posters are in a position to kill their thread if it no longer suits them. But, they should have thought about that up front. It's fine if a poster deletes their own post (which BTW the mods can still see, and restore if they like!) but I don't think it's fair for one member to essentially shutdown the resulting conversation between other members.

I do agree that the topic has been discussed to death, and a search would have been a better alternative to starting the thread in the first place.

Bermuda
 
Just for info - I didn't close it either.
Basically I like threads to remain open and allow further discussion. But... (haven't been around this forum for the time some other users have) I can imagine that some topics get discussed on a regular basis and if the results on certain topics have already proved to end in an unpleasant way then I can fully understand why to close them.
 
Its one of the reasons why i stopped being a mod. Casual posters have no idea how much work can be involved in policing this forum - imagine having to read that whole thread. ugghh! i'm loving being a normal poster these days and am very grateful to the new cadre for taking up what can be a thankless and boring job. lots of fun too sometimes though.
j

ps: A vs B threads - can be very annoying unless the A and B are the exact right things and it is useful knowing their pros and cons
 
The Old Hyde said:
Does anyone else think Pol may be wound too tight?? hahaha good post
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keep it simple said:
She's certainly a coiled spring :)
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Haha - true, it's pretty lively in here!

Hyde, the post was born of experience, often frustrating and fractious. These threads usually stem from irritation with showoffy drummers who trample and muddy arrangements so as to make a drumtastic impression. You think "Yeah, they have the chops but the music doesn't sound so great".

In the old days it was possible for pretty raw drummers to get ahead if they had an appealing style and role within a commercial band. The standard is higher now - less toleration of hedonistic dabbling drummers ... from what I've seen most gigging players are educated and have decent chops and they all grooved pretty well too.

The playing standards are pretty good but there's not much imaginative and unusual live music out there that's not deafening.
 
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Thread closing censorship make no sense to me. New things appear all the time on You-tube and elsewhere and it takes a lot of eyes to point them out. If you start closing threads, even those that have been discussed to death, then you will never attract new members. Hundreds of threads here could be closed before they even started and those that were left would be 2 years old and unfollowed. Face it, most of this stuff has been discussed, but it seems hypocritical to take one thread and single it out as too controversial or too over done. What about the rest of them? This is a great forum and the mods do a fine job. I trust them.

But, I did notice immediate and uncalled for hostility towards Jay's posts and thread but I have learned better to ignore "those people" and stay positive. If you really don't like a thread just add a little humor or better yet just click off. It's just that easy. (As they say, min-rant over :)
 
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