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  #1  
Old 03-30-2011, 12:57 AM
Monsieur Monsieur is offline
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Default Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

This summer I will be mowing my neighbors lawn and making a decent amount of cash. Enough to buy a Gretsch Catalina Maple.. or a Sony Alpha A33 DSLR SLT camera.

The reason i'm considering a new kit is because i am currently unhappy with the quality and sound of my Ludwig accent kit. I hate it in every way possible.

I'm considering a camera because in the coming years i will be doing a lot of high school trips and family vacations where i would like to have an amazing camera.

I do have one obstacle to overcome. Should i spend or save for next year when i turn 16 and purchase my first car? I haven't discussed this with my parents. however i can tell you that m parents have the means to buy me a decent 10k car. They probably wont though.
So i was wondering save or spend?

BTW i am aware that i can get high end kits on eBay for the same cash. the kit i mentioned is only an example

I think that's it. Any suggestions would be much appreciated:)
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  #2  
Old 03-30-2011, 01:08 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Hmmmmmmmmm.....if you were my kid I wouldn't buy you a 10K car either. But that's another story. Which do you want more??? Are you in a band? or do you just jam to CD's (records)? The camera is cool if that's where your head is. The drums are too. Cars are always cool for teens to have. Do you have a j.o.b.? What to do....?! Good luck.
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  #3  
Old 03-30-2011, 01:38 AM
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Homeularis Homeularis is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBadd View Post
Hmmmmmmmmm.....if you were my kid I wouldn't buy you a 10K car either.
WTF!...Thats a real nice thing to say. :/

I dont know you but you sound like an ok kid to me, what with the hole family vaca's and school trips with nice photos and all.
$10,000 is not exactly a ton of dough for a car these days but they could get you something used in good condition for less.

Anyway, about the whole kit vs camera thing?. I dont know anything about Ludwig Accents but if youre gonna get a different kit, it needs to be much better or you wont be happy,so pick the right one.
Gretsch Cat Maples are good sounding, good quality (for mid grade kits) but I dont know if they are any better than your Luddies.

If it were me, I would buy a decent camera and a good kit. JMO though. :)
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Old 03-30-2011, 01:52 AM
tamadrm tamadrm is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

The sound of your accent kit can vastly be improved with proper heads and tuning;I know having done some work to my nephews kit,and was amazed in the difference in sound

I am also into photography,so I understand about a better camera an lenses.

So ,being in a band ,and giging is a critical issue here,and that could help you justify getting a new/different kit,or buying that camera.Having said that..at 15 , the kit you have is all the kit you need.Like I said,its tuning,proper heads and THE DRUMMER,who makes the drums sound good.Steve Gadd could make Tupperware sound good.So practice as much as you can,and you will understand what I mean.

I also believe in buying your own first car,and paying for your own car insurance,although I can understand helping out with repairs,as long as thay are not the result of miss use.Just putting gas in the tank and changing the oil can get pretty expensive,so that money you make cutting grass,may not cover those things.Nothing is worse that owning a car and not having the money to put gas in it.Driving a car and getting a license to do so is a priviledge ,not an entitlement.Weigh your options carefully,and make an informed decision based on whats most important to YOU.

Steve B
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  #5  
Old 03-30-2011, 01:59 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

I bought a Sony Alpha A200 for 500.00 and it takes great pics. Another 600 for the Catalina. How much do you think you will make doing the lawn, and could you add another lawn or two.. Three months summer vacation x 4 mowings is only 12 mowings. How much can you earn??
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  #6  
Old 03-30-2011, 02:23 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

10k is a lot of coin for a 15 yr old who can't quite afford a camera or a new kit (don't for get the cymbals).
Borrow your folks car for the gigs and the girls and ride yer bike for everything else (and you can stay in shape). Now you can buy the camera and the new kit.
I have teens in the house, it's what I would tell them.
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  #7  
Old 03-30-2011, 02:35 AM
karmadharma karmadharma is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsieur View Post
a lot of high school trips
not sure how high school trips are in your neck of the woods but the last thing I'd have done when going on trips with my classmates would've been to bring anything expensive/fragile... also most of the best pics from trips with people are impromptu snapshots which usually are better captured with a P&S.

What about a high quality (much cheaper) non-DSLR P&S like a canon G12 or (even better) a 2nd hand G10 etc.?
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  #8  
Old 03-30-2011, 02:38 AM
Zeus Mutation Zeus Mutation is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

My 2 Cents...

Save all your money until summer is over... Don't worry about what your buy with it just yet, make that money first!

If your parents get you a car I'm sure you will want to do something to it, be it tinting the windows or putting in a stereo. Do you have a cell phone, if not maybe at 16... ther's your camera... not the greatest but at least you've captured the moment right.

Are you social, do you have a ton of friends, do you play sports... I think these things end up directing your path and sometimes without your knowledge its happening. If you want more than anything to be the greatist drummer ever (and why not your 16) then think about commiting to it and after the summer get yourself a nice used kit... if you have many interests, make your current kit sound as good as possible, bank that money, get a car... go meet lots of girls and don't get married until after your 30 lol
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  #9  
Old 03-30-2011, 02:52 AM
Monsieur Monsieur is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

thanks for the responses!
i liked the idea of getting a cheaper camera and spending more on a better kit... but i really want to pursue photography and a dslr would allow me easier manual control over m photos.. whatever..
the drums.
i did indeed tune m drums with a drumdial and i slaped new heads top and bottom on everything. i played with the tunings but im still not feeling it. i wonder if it would be worth it to get a new kit seeing as i dont play to go to college for percussion and i not in a band. The main reason for a new kit would be smaller sizes especially a smaller bass, and better spund.
Also on the car front. after second thought im pretty sure my parents would NEVER buy me a 10k car. ever. even if they could. so ignore that figure.
thanks for the help any more guidance would be very apprieciated:)
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  #10  
Old 03-30-2011, 03:12 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

I have the Sony Alpha A330 great camera for beginners to DSLR and beyond, I would highly recommend it for anyone wanting to take better pics you will not get from any point and shoot. Tough call for you though, good luck!
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  #11  
Old 03-30-2011, 03:48 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

How about a used Catalina and an perfectly great though non-sparkly new camera? The Nikon D40 is great, if a little out of date- you should be able to find one used or refurbished for not too much money. If the megapixel count is too scarily low for you, you can read on that same site why that doesn't matter. It's a true DSLR and it's great for travel and it rocks.

If you've got the guts, you can get pro 35mm film rigs for next to nothing. The Nikon N90s was only used to get 90% of the images in National Geographic in the 1990's, and costs less than a hundred bucks for a used body. Black and white film is dirt cheap from Freestyle, and developing it is a fun, easy hobby, and as a kid you should be doing cool stuff like that. It's old and it's film and it's kind of heavy, but it absolutely rocks. Nikon's metering system is virtually foolproof- you won't miss the review option digital gives you. In fact, you won't waste hours of your travel time checking to see if the picture you just took is any good. Drop me a line if you go crazy and decide to go that route, and I can give you more info.

You can also go the dirt cheap artist route and get a plastic Holga for like $20, plus a brick of 120 film for another hundred and get the most incredible pictures of all. And with the money you make exhibiting and selling your Holga prints, you can buy yourself that new drumset and digital rig.
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  #12  
Old 03-30-2011, 03:51 AM
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Deathmetalconga Deathmetalconga is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

The camera will become obsolete when a newer, better, less expensive one comes along, which will take 5 minutes, if it hasn't already happened.

A drum set will never, ever become obsolete.
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  #13  
Old 03-30-2011, 12:57 PM
johanisu johanisu is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

You've already got a kit!! We've been socially conditioned in western society to always want more. Why does that feeling you had when you first got your kit not last that long? Because society tells you to buy something newer and better. But it is possible to maintain that feeling indefinitely?

If you're unhappy with the sound play around with the tuning. Really experiment. Are you recording high-end studio albums where the minutia of your kit's sound are important? If not keep the kit and cherish it.

Drums are not about commercialism. A friend of mine has been pro all his life and has never bought a new kit.
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2011, 01:10 PM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsieur View Post
thanks for the responses!
i liked the idea of getting a cheaper camera and spending more on a better kit... but i really want to pursue photography and a dslr would allow me easier manual control over m photos.. whatever..
the drums.
i did indeed tune m drums with a drumdial and i slaped new heads top and bottom on everything. i played with the tunings but im still not feeling it. i wonder if it would be worth it to get a new kit seeing as i dont play to go to college for percussion and i not in a band. The main reason for a new kit would be smaller sizes especially a smaller bass, and better spund.
Also on the car front. after second thought im pretty sure my parents would NEVER buy me a 10k car. ever. even if they could. so ignore that figure.
thanks for the help any more guidance would be very apprieciated:)

I've been a professional photographer for 16 years and I can tell you the landscape of the business has changed dramatically and for the professional photographer digital technology is really hurting the business and is honestly killing the industry. With the DSlr's becoming more affordable and cost of editing software like PS Elements being so affordable more and more people are doing it themselves and not calling on a professional. Just something to keep in mine. I lost my job after 16 years with the same photography studio because the business has declined so much. Also like someone else said taking an Slr on a school trip is a risky move to me.

If it's me and you are looking DSlr I'd be looking Canon or Nikon where there will always be more options for lenses as those are the big dogs in photography. That way in 5 years if you want to upgrade cameras you are pretty well guaranteed you'll be able to use all your lenses with the new camera, not sure the same would be true with sony.
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  #15  
Old 03-30-2011, 05:09 PM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

I'd wait until you've properly out-grown your kit. Having said that, I've no idea how good a drummer you are. The advice about tom heads and tuning is spot on - it can make a world of difference. Maybe just get a better snare drum that you'll keep forever?

You tend to find that when you go to practise with bands or play gigs, you rarely use your own kit except for snare and cymbals.

My Premier XPK isn't the best kit in the world and is 15 years old (I've owned it since new), but I won't upgrade it until I think I need to, or until I think I deserve it. I do however have a Maple Signia Snare drum which I love, and Paiste Signature cymbals - but they go out gigging with me.

And just as a side note - having been in debt for over 10 years (though nearly out of it now), whatever you do, avoid it - debt is horrible, it chains you down. Always save up. Sorry don't mean to sound like I'm lecturing - it's just I've been there and wouldn't wish it on anybody.

I'm also into photography and have done a little professionally here and there. I'd go for a second hand camera (maybe a Canon or Nikon - they'll hold their value well). You might be able to pick up a Canon 5D and lens pretty cheap these days off of eBay. Gorgeous camera that - I've done back up photography at a wedding using it and they preferred my pics :-)

Good luck. PS - you're a very lucky person if your parents buy a car for you! Hope you get it.
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Old 03-30-2011, 07:15 PM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by johanisu View Post
You've already got a kit!! We've been socially conditioned in western society to always want more. Why does that feeling you had when you first got your kit not last that long? Because society tells you to buy something newer and better. But it is possible to maintain that feeling indefinitely?

If you're unhappy with the sound play around with the tuning. Really experiment. Are you recording high-end studio albums where the minutia of your kit's sound are important? If not keep the kit and cherish it.

Drums are not about commercialism. A friend of mine has been pro all his life and has never bought a new kit.
I suspect you are from Europe to dislike Western society like that! Wanting stuff happens in many other places, even non-Western societies.

Maybe he will never set foot in a studio, maybe he will never even play with anyone else, maybe he will never be "pro" or do any of the things you imagine him doing. Maybe he is content doing what he is doing and simply wants a kit that sounds better to his own ears. As long as he goes about getting a new kit responsibly - and it sounds like he is - there is nothing wrong with that.

Someone, somewhere, will be able to put food on the table for her family for a day because someone else bought a drum set she made or sold. That's just a side issue, but it shouldn't be overlooked.
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  #17  
Old 03-30-2011, 07:29 PM
ddrumman2004 ddrumman2004 is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

I commend you for working and saving your money to buy what you want. Most kids now days want and want it now. Kudos to you!

I know a guy right now that gigs on a regular basis with a Ludwig Accent kit. He's a real big fella and hits hard and his kit has held up to him! The sound good as well.
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  #18  
Old 03-30-2011, 08:10 PM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by toddbishop View Post
How about a used Catalina and an perfectly great though non-sparkly new camera? The Nikon D40 is great, if a little out of date- you should be able to find one used or refurbished for not too much money. If the megapixel count is too scarily low for you, you can read on that same site why that doesn't matter. It's a true DSLR and it's great for travel and it rocks.

If you've got the guts, you can get pro 35mm film rigs for next to nothing. The Nikon N90s was only used to get 90% of the images in National Geographic in the 1990's, and costs less than a hundred bucks for a used body. Black and white film is dirt cheap from Freestyle, and developing it is a fun, easy hobby, and as a kid you should be doing cool stuff like that. It's old and it's film and it's kind of heavy, but it absolutely rocks. Nikon's metering system is virtually foolproof- you won't miss the review option digital gives you. In fact, you won't waste hours of your travel time checking to see if the picture you just took is any good. Drop me a line if you go crazy and decide to go that route, and I can give you more info.

You can also go the dirt cheap artist route and get a plastic Holga for like $20, plus a brick of 120 film for another hundred and get the most incredible pictures of all. And with the money you make exhibiting and selling your Holga prints, you can buy yourself that new drumset and digital rig.
Not to go a little off-topic, and I do admit Ken Rockwell says some good things, but keep in mind this is the internet and he's said some really crazy things as well. As a semi-professional photographer, I went through this whole craze of trying to stick with film, and in the end, I couldn't. Just like I can't go back to listening to records and making cassettes. It's a great exercise in nostalgia, but it's not very practical anymore. I got a chance to hear the great pro photog Joe McNally speak at a seminar not too long ago (he's been there and done that for LIFE, National Geographic, Sports Illustrated) and I'm aware that these conventions are basically ways to promote new equipment, but in reality on the digital vs film debate, my attitude is, "well you could, but why would you want to?" The whole idea is to be able to get the image your mind sees faster and with less hassle. If you're only choice was to use film, this wouldn't be an argument, but film is not your only choice and the computer is basically a standard home appliance now, so why go to the trouble of buying film, shooting it, developing it, and then scanning it so you can get it into the computer?

Even if you do the 35mm route and decide to find a lab to do the developing cheap (like a Sams Club or a Costco) well, it's declined so much that alot of these cheap minilabs don't develop film anymore. That's how you know it's done. We, as photogs have always known that film is cool, but we didn't say it with our wallets, nor is the general public anymore. If that was indeed the case, then minilabs would still exist!

I know a couple of wedding photogs who still shoot exclusively film, but pro labs are not cheap and it still takes days to get them the film that they scan so you can sell prints online from their websites. The whole process has become so anachronistic. No wonder nobody shoots on glass plates anymore. Photography has evolved, just how we make and consume music has evolved.

So the argument isn't really "is digital better than film?", it's "is film good enough to keep going through this process?". For about 90% of the world's public, film isn't. Sad, but true. I loved shooting with my ancient 1980s Hasselblad as much as the next guy who spent $5,000 on one of those things. I also used to love playing PacMan on one of those old console tables at the old pizza parlor too. Both of which never happen anymore :(
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:39 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

It's my belief that you should get new heads, top and bottom for your Ludwig kit, you'd be surprised at the results when they are properly tuned. I too was a pro photographer. I actually started making money in high school shooting local sports for the local newspapers and a bit later I started shooting weddings. So I began quite early making money with a camera. When getting out of school I began working for a commercial/portrait studio using medium and large format cameras using up to 11x 14" sheet film producing images of rooms of furniture down to tiny bottles of perfume. This was years ago, but I still have some 4 x 5, medium format and 35mm equipment and a fully equipped dark room. I got interested in both drums and photography at the same time and was pulled in opposite directions at a very young age.

As someone already mentioned, it would probably be in your best interest to buy a good point and shoot camera. I own a Canon Powershot G9 and take it places where I wouldn't take a more expensive SLR. An SLR can get quite weighty and bulky when taking photographs for leisure, especially when you want to add additional lenses and flash equipment. If you were making the photographs for money, that's a different story and that would be called a job.

Just the way I see it.
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  #20  
Old 03-31-2011, 02:46 AM
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HUdrummer HUdrummer is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Well maybe you could get both! have you considered selling your old Ludwig??? Try eBay, or Craigslist... don't take it to a pawn shop or anything. I'm not exactly sure how much the camera your wanting is worth but maybe you can also sell your old camera too! "Buy as much stuff that you want before you can only buy stuff you need" So basically what that means is spend your money on what you want now so later because one day you will have to spend all your money paying bills, and other stuff. so enjoy your money while you can.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:36 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Sorry Homey, but no 15 yr old deserves a 10K car. ; ) I'm sure you have a 15 yr old around....go buy one for em.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Homeularis View Post
WTF!...Thats a real nice thing to say. :/

I dont know you but you sound like an ok kid to me, what with the hole family vaca's and school trips with nice photos and all.
$10,000 is not exactly a ton of dough for a car these days but they could get you something used in good condition for less.

Anyway, about the whole kit vs camera thing?. I dont know anything about Ludwig Accents but if youre gonna get a different kit, it needs to be much better or you wont be happy,so pick the right one.
Gretsch Cat Maples are good sounding, good quality (for mid grade kits) but I dont know if they are any better than your Luddies.

If it were me, I would buy a decent camera and a good kit. JMO though. :)
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  #22  
Old 04-02-2011, 11:57 PM
oneida1 oneida1 is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

ASK YOU PARENTS IF AND HOW MUCH THEY MIGHT SPEND ON A CAR FOR YOU AND IF IT IS NEAR 10K, ASK THEM IF YOU COULD GET A DECENT 5K CAR, TAKE THE REMAINING CASH AND WHATEVER YOU CAN ACCUMULATE PLUS WHATEVER YOU CAN GET FOR YOUR CURRENT KIT AND CUSTOM ORDER A KIT TO YOUR LIKING. YOU COULD GET A BOMB KIT FOR 5K. EVEN A BETTER SET UP FOR ANOTHER 2K IF THATS WHAT YOU CAN SAVE. THE CAMERA IS SOMETHING THAT IS NEW TODAY AND OUTDATED TOMORROW. NEXT YEAR YOU'LL BE ABLE TO GO TO SAM'S CLUB AND GET A CANON 35000D WITH 650 MEGAPIXELS FOR $399.
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  #23  
Old 04-03-2011, 12:49 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

If you want a camera here is my 2 cents as a long time photo enthusiast: DONT invest money in camera bodys. Invest money in lenses. Bodys will be outdated real soon (sooner than you like). A great lense will stay a great lense forever.

I say: Used Nikon D80 something similar + plus used 50mm f1,8 or used 35mm f1,8 is all you'll need.

Ok, I am a big time Nikon fan (because I can't afford Leica, hehe) but I'm sure that Sony offers something similar. The difference might be, that with Nikon there is a huge market for used lenses that are still great.

I just scored a Nikkor 80-200 f2.8 from 1988 for a few bucks which still takes great pics.

Never forget - just as with drums: The camera and the lenses or the drumset matter 1%, the guy behind the camera or drumset 99%.

Therefore: You have a drumset, make the best out of it. You don't have a camera. Easy decision.
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Old 04-03-2011, 12:59 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga View Post
I suspect you are from Europe to dislike Western society like that! Wanting stuff happens in many other places, even non-Western societies.
So what the heck does that have to do with being a european? Is that the prejudice that americans have about europeans? That we don't like western society? Why do you mention this? Does that help this thread?

You know.... we also have some prejudices about americans I guess, but if you ask me, I think we would all be better off, to leave this kind of stuff out of this forum.

Edit: @Bo Eder: never forget that Ken Rockwell is the Chuck Norris of photography, so he can NEVER be wrong. Ken Rockwell can hold his camera so steady, he can shoot a 600mm lense at night and f22 without using a tripod. He can also get more DOF out that same lense at f4 than you and I could get get out of a 14mm Lense at f22.

2nd Edit: Ken Rockwell once went to Nikon, asked for an L-Lense and got one.
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  #25  
Old 04-03-2011, 01:08 AM
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Homeularis Homeularis is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBadd View Post
Sorry Homey, but no 15 yr old deserves a 10K car. ; ) I'm sure you have a 15 yr old around....go buy one for em.
My 16 year old does (now 18). Maybe yours doesnt.
And I already have bought him a $12,000 car.

I'm glad I dont think like you. : )
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  #26  
Old 04-03-2011, 07:07 PM
karmadharma karmadharma is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

might want to hold on on that a33...

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/03/s...-birthday-cak/

rumours abound a new one is coming out soon
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  #27  
Old 04-03-2011, 07:35 PM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

that sucks, mine is a A330 and I have never had any problems with it.
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  #28  
Old 04-04-2011, 01:15 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

First off, I'm glad there are young folks still willing to do yard work. The last question you asked was whether to save or spend, so that's what I'll address. I would recommend saving. Its a skill that will benefit you the rest of your life. You will need to learn to save and budget for buying houses, cars, and other necessities. Anyone can spend, many don't learn to save. The current economy here in the States attests to that.

That said, you didn't mention if you currently are taking pictures as a hobby. If you go the spend route and get a camera, consider a cheap used camera, or ask someone who trust you to lend you a camera for a spell. Specialty items (cameras, bikes, golf clubs, telescopes, pool tables, etc) have a way being purchased, used for a short spell, and then sitting unused. I'd be hesitant to spend a lot on my first camera.

I'd talk to my parents about what their expectations are about you driving, and then buying a car. That's not something my parents allowed me when I was 16 :-(. And dont' forget, driving is the act that keeps on giving/taking: Insurance every month, gas every week, planned and unplanned maintenance and so on.
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Old 04-04-2011, 02:38 AM
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KBadd KBadd is offline
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Homey, so I guess this is a pissing contest now. Well, piss away. My "kids" are 29 and 28. I DID get them both cars.....actually more than one each, beeotch. I simply said "NOT A 10 K CAR". Enjoy your kids......they are gone before you know it. Don't keep pissing.

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My 16 year old does (now 18). Maybe yours doesnt.
And I already have bought him a $12,000 car.

I'm glad I dont think like you. : )
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Old 04-04-2011, 09:26 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

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Homey, so I guess this is a pissing contest now. Well, piss away , beeotch. Don't keep pissing.
LOL...Who's pissing now "KBadd"?.

Bottom line...Your response in post #2 was sarcastic, disrespectful and unnesessary.

Look in the mirror "KBadd".

Yeah, I could get with the PG13 rock slinging too...(beeotch?...Really?)...lol...but I think I'll pass.

Take care now.
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Old 04-05-2011, 02:49 AM
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Default Re: Decision Time: New Kit or Camera

Gee, sorry homes! Don't wanna ruin yer day. Peace.
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