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  #1  
Old 03-02-2011, 03:38 PM
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Default Confused with Reso heads

Hey!
This has confused me for a while but can you use batter heads as reso heads? or is it a case of the resonant head needing to be thinner?

Same goes for the bass drum, would having a batter head front and back affect the sound?

A noob question I know, but if you don't ask you'll never find out haha!

Thanks
TM
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Old 03-02-2011, 03:50 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

In short yes.

Single ply batters like a Remo Ambassador (Evans G1) or a Diplomat, are used commonly. I don't know if I would put a Powerstroke or Pinstripe on there though, which would probably kill the sound.

Same goes with the bass drum.

It is a noob question.....that I would have probably asked about a week ago. :)

Heads are confusing.
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Old 03-02-2011, 03:59 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Geez, you've got that right heads are so confusing! haha

Thanks for the quick reply!

Also would it work having a Clear batter (Or White or whatever?) on the bass drum and then a coated head as a reso? or would it be best the other way around?

Cheers!
TM
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Old 03-02-2011, 03:59 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Single-ply heads are the most commonly used reso heads. Some people like a thin reso (7mil such as the Evans Resonant glass) which produce a shorter sustain. Some people like a medium reso (10mil such as the G1). Others prefer a thicker reso (12mil such as the G Plus) which will increase the overall body of the sound and resonant quality. More and more people seem to be experimenting with coated resos now for a slightly warmer tone. I've heard of several people using 2-ply (typically a reso head no-no) heads on much larger drums (14/16/18" toms) with great success.

Best of luck and be sure to let me know if you have any questions about drumheads. I'll do my best to demystify them!

Cheers!
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:04 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

This is a very good question. I have always believed that the reso head was supposed to be a very thin head. Recently I watched a Bob Gatzen video where he explained the physics behind reso heads and I was surprised to discover that a thicker head actually works better (in conjuction with a thicker batter head). The way he explained it was quite simple, If you have a thicker batter head and a thicker reso head the two head will vibrate at the same frequency (or speed).
I recently tried this combo on my Classic maple toms and was surprised at how well the drums responded. I didnt loose any resonance but was able to get a far more focused tone out of the drums throughout the tuning spectrum.
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:08 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

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Originally Posted by TableMuncher View Post
Also would it work having a Clear batter (Or White or whatever?) on the bass drum and then a coated head as a reso?
I run an Evans EQ2 batter with a stock Gretsch coated reso and it sounds good.
Either way would work. The more you learn about drums and heads the more you realize that there aren't any rules really. Hell, most of the time I play I use an old suitcase as the bass drum and it sounds fine.

One thing I would suggest is that when you tune the bass, try tuning higher than you would be naturally inclined to. The prevailing wisdom is that you want to get the bass at the lowest pitch possible, however I find that it just sounds muddy like that. But that's me. To each their own.
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

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Originally Posted by vindrums View Post
Recently I watched a Bob Gatzen video where he explained the physics behind reso heads and I was surprised to discover that a thicker head actually works better (in conjuction with a thicker batter head).
Yeah Bob Gatzen is awesome. Best drum tips channel on Youtube IMO.

Hey, now that we have an Evans guy on this thread I'm wondering something. Does Evans make a Diplomat weight batter head?
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  #8  
Old 03-02-2011, 04:18 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Thanks for the replies! this is all very helpfull!

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvansSpecialist View Post
Single-ply heads are the most commonly used reso heads. Some people like a thin reso (7mil such as the Evans Resonant glass) which produce a shorter sustain. Some people like a medium reso (10mil such as the G1). Others prefer a thicker reso (12mil such as the G Plus) which will increase the overall body of the sound and resonant quality. More and more people seem to be experimenting with coated resos now for a slightly warmer tone. I've heard of several people using 2-ply (typically a reso head no-no) heads on much larger drums (14/16/18" toms) with great success.

Best of luck and be sure to let me know if you have any questions about drumheads. I'll do my best to demystify them!

Cheers!
At the moment I'm into the whole deep tom sound, with not much sustain just a nice fat tone (If that makes sense?) I have sort of acheived this with replacing old stock batter heads with coated Remo Ambassadors or Emperors? I can't quite remember which I bought now, I'm thinking its Emperors!

I still have the stock resonant heads which are very thin and cheap heads, what would be the best type of head to get that 'fat' sound? I'm guessing a thicker head? but still single ply?

after writing that I've got myself confused again! haha

Cheers!
TM
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:22 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

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Originally Posted by DSCRAPRE View Post
Yeah Bob Gatzen is awesome. Best drum tips channel on Youtube IMO.

Hey, now that we have an Evans guy on this thread I'm wondering something. Does Evans make a Diplomat weight batter head?
We don't specifically make a 7.5mil batter, though if you absolutely wanted something that thin (though I wouldn't recommend that thin for a batter head) you could use the resonant glass heads. They won't resonate as long as a medium weight batter though and they'll be more likely to dent quicker. I would only recommend a head that thin for the reso side, assuming you want to shorten the sustain of the drum.
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:24 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

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Originally Posted by DSCRAPRE View Post
One thing I would suggest is that when you tune the bass, try tuning higher than you would be naturally inclined to. The prevailing wisdom is that you want to get the bass at the lowest pitch possible, however I find that it just sounds muddy like that. But that's me. To each their own.
I actually did this 2 days ago! I went through my stock Bass drum batter head, so I ran home and grabbed the head off the Bass player in my band's drum kit, A clear Ambasedor(Sp?) chucked it on my Bass drum and tuned it tighter than normal, and now it sounds great! it's much clearer in the mix of everything during Band Practice, It's no longer lost in the sea of bass from the Bass player haha!

Actually, Putting a hole in my bass drum head started this whole head question! damn thing! :P

Cheers
TM
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Old 03-02-2011, 04:50 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Thanks Evans. Just curious.
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  #12  
Old 03-02-2011, 05:07 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

I've always matched the top and bottom heads with the exception of Pinstripes where i would use an Ambassador on the reso side.

Ambassador with an Ambassador (coated with coated, clear with clear).
Emperor with Emperor (coated,coated / clear,clear).

It's always worked for me and keeps it simple. Seems like any drum shop i would go into had the right amount of matched heads but if i wanted to buy two different heads of the same size they would be short in stock.

Of course, your mileage may vary.......void where prohibited.
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Old 03-02-2011, 07:38 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Hi there man, well, there's not much to add actually.. A lot of great advice here.

Heads can be tricky to understand, but after you get how they're constructed and how that translates in sound, it's quite easy to "imagine" how they're gonna sound and therefore which one you should pick.

About the main question "can you use batter heads as reso heads?": Well, yes, of course. All heads are basically the same, a mylar film with a metal collar, so really the term "resonant" and "batter" is purely for guidance and marketing purposes. Which really matters is the amount of plies, the thickness of the film and if it has or hasn't any dampening.

With this in mind, most common reso heads are:

Single-ply / With no dampening / 7,5, 10 or 12 mil thick.

Examples:
* 10 mil single ply = Remo Ambassador, Evans G1
* 7,5 mil single ply = Remo Diplomat, Evans Resonant Glass
* 12 single ply = Ambassador X, Evans G Plus

The thicker the head, the more it resonates. So, a 12 mil head will be more resonant than a 7,5 mil.

Commonly, most drummers use clear resonant heads, but a lot of us also use coated ones.

Personally, I run Coated Emperors over Coated Ambassadors and I love it. I'm sorry for the long post but I hope it helps a bit.

Cheers.
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Old 03-02-2011, 09:23 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by TableMuncher View Post
I actually did this 2 days ago! I went through my stock Bass drum batter head, so I ran home and grabbed the head off the Bass player in my band's drum kit, A clear Ambasedor(Sp?) chucked it on my Bass drum and tuned it tighter than normal, and now it sounds great! it's much clearer in the mix of everything during Band Practice, It's no longer lost in the sea of bass from the Bass player haha!

Actually, Putting a hole in my bass drum head started this whole head question! damn thing! :P

Cheers
TM
I did this same bit. watched the bob gatzen vids and tuned my bass drum PERFECT to what he said. got to the gig, got miked up and it sounded like someone kicking a watermelon. tightened up the reso head and it went THUMP THUMP THUMP! it works. :)
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Old 03-03-2011, 01:59 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by diegobxr View Post
Hi there man, well, there's not much to add actually.. A lot of great advice here.

Heads can be tricky to understand, but after you get how they're constructed and how that translates in sound, it's quite easy to "imagine" how they're gonna sound and therefore which one you should pick.

About the main question "can you use batter heads as reso heads?": Well, yes, of course. All heads are basically the same, a mylar film with a metal collar, so really the term "resonant" and "batter" is purely for guidance and marketing purposes. Which really matters is the amount of plies, the thickness of the film and if it has or hasn't any dampening.

With this in mind, most common reso heads are:

Single-ply / With no dampening / 7,5, 10 or 12 mil thick.

Examples:
* 10 mil single ply = Remo Ambassador, Evans G1
* 7,5 mil single ply = Remo Diplomat, Evans Resonant Glass
* 12 single ply = Ambassador X, Evans G Plus

The thicker the head, the more it resonates. So, a 12 mil head will be more resonant than a 7,5 mil.

Commonly, most drummers use clear resonant heads, but a lot of us also use coated ones.

Personally, I run Coated Emperors over Coated Ambassadors and I love it. I'm sorry for the long post but I hope it helps a bit.

Cheers.
Thanks! very usefull information from everyone!

Cheers Guys!
TM
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  #16  
Old 03-03-2011, 05:07 PM
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Default Re: Confused with Reso heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by diegobxr View Post
All heads are basically the same, a mylar film with a metal collar, so really the term "resonant" and "batter" is purely for guidance and marketing purposes.
This isn't quite accurate. There are a multitude of types of film out there, each with very different characteristics. We spend lots of time testing and experimenting with prototypes involving different film combinations (both thickness and specific brand/model) in order to achieve the perfect drumhead for a given application.

The hoop design plays a huge role in the strength of the drumhead. Ours is designed specifically to prevent pulling, maximize glue hold and offer the highest of overall quality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diegobxr View Post
Examples:
* 10 mil single ply = Remo Ambassador, Evans G1
* 7,5 mil single ply = Remo Diplomat, Evans Resonant Glass
* 12 single ply = Ambassador X, Evans G Plus
You are correct in the way that ply thickness affects resonance but I just wanted to clear up that the Resonant Glass/Black heads are actually 7mil thick, not 7.5.

Cheers!
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